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Seperate ES-patches #187

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tumGER opened this Issue Feb 17, 2019 · 18 comments

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tumGER commented Feb 17, 2019

Probably just offer 2 zips to download.

You happy now @m4xw? shrek

@tumGER tumGER added the suggestion label Feb 17, 2019

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m4xw commented Feb 17, 2019

Should be filed under "bug" :shrek

@WerWolv WerWolv added Meme and removed Meme labels Feb 17, 2019

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ThatNerdyPikachu commented Feb 17, 2019

aren't those already available..?

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friedkeenan commented Feb 17, 2019

@m4xw Wants them to be opt-in so that RetroNX doesn't have to ban Kosmos

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DarthSerial commented Feb 18, 2019

But then it needs an option in the Kosmos Updater wether you want ES patches or not.

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m4xw commented Feb 19, 2019

That option should only exist if es patches are installed already prior.

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StevenMattera commented Feb 19, 2019

I think the option should always be there, but it can default to On if the user already has them. So it's opt in for new users.

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m4xw commented Feb 19, 2019

The whole point of separating them is exactly to not provide a option in the CFW and have the user opt-in by adding the files manually.
Having them default available via a bundled tool would make it ban-able.
Being a extra download on the same Site is as far I want to go.

Edit: I don't care tho if the user already has them installed

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StevenMattera commented Feb 19, 2019

That is t very user friendly. What I'm saying is by default it will be off, unless you already have es patches installed then it will be turned on. I think this fulfills what you are asking. I'm not going to hide the option as that only leads to confusion to the end user.

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m4xw commented Feb 19, 2019

@StevenMattera Feel free to close the Issue and we just ban it then.
Sad to see this turn into another piracy fw.

You basically propose a Piracy On/Off Switch, sorry I can't accept that if its supplied out of the box, UX is not a argument that holds weight for this discussion.

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tiliarou commented Feb 19, 2019

@m4xw why is it such a problem to offer an option for users to purposely activate the ES patches ? It's not illegal, and nobody's' forcing anyone to actually run backup using ES patches, even though it's their only purpose.
The guns and bullets are not illegal, it's the user than can use them illegally.

"Having them default available via a bundled tool": that's exactly the point. They are not activated by default, their are just offered to someone willing to use them. That's exactly like google API used for different purposes than what they were intended for testing or educational purpose/context (like in QGIS which can be used in commercial environment yet maps API is offered optionaly with a click of a toggle).
Providing option is NOT supporting the misuse of that option.

Don't really understand why so much time is spent on this especially noting that it doesn't affect retroNX in any way.

"The whole point of separating them is exactly to not provide a option in the CFW": the whole point of this issue is to satisfy your point of view which is not to provide a piracy CFW pack.
Making them optional and not bundled is exactly doing what you were asking in the first place.

PS: I'm not talking in the name of Kosmos or AtlasNX.

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m4xw commented Feb 19, 2019

@tiliarou That's where we draw the line and enforce it.
It does affect RetroNX as we have to comply with Rule 1, also you don't need ES patches for real backups, you only use them for piracy.

Making them optional and not bundled is exactly doing what you were asking in the first place.
Honestly thats just evading the Issue for me for "piracy UX"
I am fine if the option exists after users opt-in by manually copying the patches over.

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StevenMattera commented Feb 19, 2019

I'm also not talking for the entire team either. I'm just talking for Kosmos Updater. And seeing as Kosmo Updater is suppose to be user friendly and to make it so the user doesn't have to manually copy files over then that is where I'm coming from.

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m4xw commented Feb 19, 2019

@StevenMattera I would absolutely agree if it was anything other than these patches.

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tiliarou commented Feb 19, 2019

Thanks for taking the time to reply.
So the line is just between manually pressing a button and manually copying a file on the SD ? I'm sorry but I don't humbly see where is the difference. In both case it's entirely user intent to perform a manual action. The fact that it is somehow facilitated by Kosmos updated is still not making that action automatic.

Would an hidden menu with a disclaimer (disclaimer specifically mentioning that it should not be used to load illegal backups) and a sequence of button to press be more acceptable and not crossing the line ?

Yes es has one intent only, but it's not because you provide an open door that the users have to enter and do illegal stuff - even though it might be its only purpose (of ES patches), we can't judge on intent but on actions only.

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StevenMattera commented Feb 19, 2019

I think we came up with a solution I'm okay with. No options in Kosmos Updater. If the user has ES Patches already installed Kosmos Updater will continue to update ES Patches. If the user doesn't already have ES Patches then it won't install/update them.

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m4xw commented Feb 19, 2019

Would an hidden menu with a disclaimer (disclaimer specifically mentioning that it should not be used to load illegal backups) and a sequence of button to press be more acceptable and not crossing the line ?
A Konami code or a file flag would be fine with me too (including disclaimer)
Users should just not be exposed to it out of the box (minus dl page), I mean you can literally call it "Piracy: On/off" else.

@StevenMattera That is acceptable for me. 👍

@AtlasNX AtlasNX deleted a comment from goffrier Feb 19, 2019

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tumGER commented Feb 19, 2019

@goffrier Please don't go off-topic in a github issue - Github is not a social hub.

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WerWolv commented Feb 24, 2019

Implemented in latest release v11.10.0

@AtlasNX AtlasNX deleted a comment from hippydave Feb 25, 2019

@AtlasNX AtlasNX deleted a comment from lunalik2 Feb 25, 2019

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