Uber weapons (and a not-so-uber one)

[Lain-]

Idea here: http://smf.cataclysmdda.com/index.php?topic=5108.0

Uber weapons with uber stats and uber impracticality too. Mainly for flavour and as a ground work, intended as weapon for super mutants and cyborgs (especially NPCs, imagine a huge mutated NPC charging at you and swinging a block buster overhead). And Rule Of Cool too.

The not-so-uber weapon is the flail (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flail_%28weapon%29) aka the sane version of the block buster.

In this RP also is recipes to those aforementioned weapons and some format.
Any feedbacks are welcomed, expecially those about stat.

[EkarusRyndren]

You know what you need? Strongman kit for the M2. Yup...

[MisterFelixFox]

The flail! My favorite weapon! Woohoo!

[EkarusRyndren]

No flags for requiring the 'large' mutation or anything?

[Lain-]

I guess the massive strength required to wield the weapon is sort of a flag already. You can wield vierhander, but with block buster unless you have bionic or strong mutations, it's off-limit.

[Rivet-the-Zombie]

Apparently the largest extant battle sword on record is a fifteenth century Scottish claymore that's seven and a half feet long and weighs twenty-three pounds. That's a little over eight pounds heavier than your double-sword thing, and a heck of a lot longer. The name of the Scottish behemoth that wielded it is lost to history, but your crazy-huge sword does have a historical precedent in the form of a standard, albeit humongous claidheamh mor.

[Rivet-the-Zombie]

Before I check this one for merge, have you actually tried any of these out? Are they feasible to use in the case of a crazy-strong character, or are they too big to be useful even then?

[Lain-]

Just tweaked the blockbuster to a more mundane stat, still very impractical though. Originally I intended the vierhander to be impractical but usable for normal human, while the blockbuster to be the exclusive weapon for mutants and bionic-enhanced characters, to be more precise the "boss" NPCs and monsters only - not something the player can ever mess with (originally a 20 STR character with extremely strong mutation can barely wield it, not counting other items). But on second thought, I decided that players should be able to wield this too so I nerfed it (or buff it, depend on how you look at it).

In short, a character with 16 STR will be able to wield it and with decent melee, bashing skill can do hefty damage with it. It still retain the essence that it's not a practical weapon, taking valuable volume and having a low to-hit stat.

[KA101]

a) volume of a wielded object is irrelevant. Your weapon slot has unlimited volume.

b) I'm not sure why the to-hit on the vierhander is so low. Granted, it is (or at least should be) frickin' slow and unable to parry, but under the to-hit rules (/doc/GAME_BALANCE.txt) you're looking at -2 start, +2 for grip, +2 for length, -1 for edged, -2 (erring against usability) for balance == -1 net to-hit. You could argue that the balance is so bad that it ought to be more inaccurate, but then the length should counter that.

c) I'm skeptical of the blockbuster. It's one thing to winch an engine block out of its vehicle, and another to swing it around as a flail. That's a hella chain and grip you'd need, I think. 10 chain feels light, but I'm not the automotive guy. I'm not seeing a handle there, though. Sorry.

[Lain-]

a) I'm aware of that, my intention was that with this weapon you either have to wield it or drop it, not carry it around in your backpack, which fits the general image of a brutal and mindless mutant.
b) I was thinking that with a big ass sword like that, the size alone would obscure your vision. So I think -2 is reasonable.
c) I'm not sure about the handle, my concept was a mutant holding the chain and flinging the blockbuster around, so I don't think a handle is necessary. This warrants more chain though so I will do that.

[EkarusRyndren]

I'm starting to think these weapons, the engine on some chains at least, are a bit out there, flamesword out there...

shrugs My two cents on the matter.

[dwarfkoala]

I remember the backlash from the flameswords thing. Though I'd love to see
these things in the game, I am also worried about what people are going to
think about it.

That said, the physics behind these weapons are far better than the
flameswords. It's just reallly big weapons, not much more.
How to strength requirements work? Are they hard limits on what you can
wield or do they affect the performance unless you have enough strength to
wield something?
If they just affect the performance, I say we pump the blockbuster's
strength requirement to mutant-cyborg high so if somebody wants to use it
they can, but unless they're more than human, they can't.

[Lain-]

Carry more than you strength allow will overburden you and you will take a severe hit to speed. At the moment the blockbuster take 16 STR to carry/wield without encumber yourself, originally I based the weapon on the V6 engine, but decided to change it to i4 engine, hence the weight.
I think 16 STR is enough? I assumed that few can reach 16 STR without being mutated heavily or having bionics (Hydraulic muscle).

[dwarfkoala]

IIRC it's 10 points from STR 8 to STR 16, so I guess that would be fair.

[KA101]

Some comparative high strengths:
Prime Strength (peak from "stable" mutating, no years of gym work) is 15.
14 is the HIGHSTAT cutoff, where it takes two chargen points per stat point.
Most possible for a default fresh-outta-chargen character to take is 14 with default points and no disads, or 20 with the full 12 points of disadvantages. (Edit: Anything higher than 14 would represent someone pretty bloody devoted to building muscle mass and general health, to the exclusion of other aspects of USian social/cultural development. Powerlifters, NOT bodybuilders. This might be a less-stark version of Extremely Strong)
Changing defaults is possible but I wouldn't worry about balancing for that. (Someone can always change the default More Radically. Designing to them leads to point-spread arms racing. Bad spiral: we all end up snails.)

Mutant strength is generally 1-2 points unless you're going bestial. Insane ST (+7) is the province of post-threshold Cattle and Ursine. (Ursine may lose the ability to wield weapons altogether when I put in for full-blown bear claws.)

Aug strength is +2 stable and/or +20 powered via Hydraulic Muscles. HM can last for a couple minutes with typical power reserves. I wouldn't leave it on long-term.

Hoping this helps.

[Lain-]

I think this is ready to be merged, unless there are possible improvement I'm unaware of? If you have any suggestions please post it here. I'm on a vacation so I can't work on this ATM but I will get to this once I get back.