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Communism โคโ˜ญโค or Soviet Union ๐Ÿ‡ธ๐Ÿ‡บ Flag emoji #204

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Crissov opened this issue Feb 12, 2017 · 6 comments

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commented Feb 12, 2017

Soviet Union Flag

It would be straightforward to encode the Flag of the Soviet Union as an emoji, because it did have the ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code element SU which is indeterminately reserved and still used as a ccTLD, although the ISO 3166-3 alpha-4 code SUHH has also been defined of course. CLDR has been around before the USSR dissolved in the early 1990s, so it previously also supported SU, but it is now listed as a deprecated code element. As such, support for it is not mandated in the flag emojis section of UTR#51 which describes how to use Unicode Region Indicator Symbol (RIS) letters U+1F1E6โ€“FF.

  • The valid region sequences are specified by Unicode region subtags as defined in [CLDR], with idStatus="regular", "deprecated", or the "macroregion". [โ€ฆ]
  • Deprecated region sequences should not be generated, but may be supported for backward compatibility.
<id type="region" idStatus="deprecated">
  <!--  12 items  -->
  AN BU CS DD FX NT QU SU TP YD YU ZR
</id>
Code Region Replacement(s) ISO 3166-3
๐Ÿ‡ฆ๐Ÿ‡ณ Netherlands Antilles ๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿ‡ถ ๐Ÿ‡จ๐Ÿ‡ผ ๐Ÿ‡ธ๐Ÿ‡ฝ ANHH
๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿ‡บ Burma = Myanmar ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡ฒ BUMM
๐Ÿ‡จ๐Ÿ‡ธ Czechoslovakia ๐Ÿ‡จ๐Ÿ‡ฟ ๐Ÿ‡ธ๐Ÿ‡ฐ CSXX โ†™๏ธ
๐Ÿ‡จ๐Ÿ‡ธ Serbia and Montenegro ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡ช ๐Ÿ‡ท๐Ÿ‡ธ CSHH
๐Ÿ‡ฉ๐Ÿ‡ฉ German Democratic Republic ๐Ÿ‡ฉ๐Ÿ‡ช DDDE
๐Ÿ‡ซ๐Ÿ‡ฝ Metropolitan France ๐Ÿ‡ซ๐Ÿ‡ท FXFR
๐Ÿ‡ณ๐Ÿ‡น Neutral Zone ๐Ÿ‡ฎ๐Ÿ‡ถ ๐Ÿ‡ธ๐Ÿ‡ฆ NTHH
๐Ÿ‡ธ๐Ÿ‡บ Soviet Union ๐Ÿ‡ท๐Ÿ‡บ ๐Ÿ‡ฆ๐Ÿ‡ฒ ๐Ÿ‡ฆ๐Ÿ‡ฟ ๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿ‡พ ๐Ÿ‡ช๐Ÿ‡ช ๐Ÿ‡ฌ๐Ÿ‡ช ๐Ÿ‡ฐ๐Ÿ‡ฟ ๐Ÿ‡ฐ๐Ÿ‡ฌ ๐Ÿ‡ฑ๐Ÿ‡ป ๐Ÿ‡ฑ๐Ÿ‡น ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡ฉ ๐Ÿ‡น๐Ÿ‡ฏ ๐Ÿ‡น๐Ÿ‡ฒ ๐Ÿ‡บ๐Ÿ‡ฆ ๐Ÿ‡บ๐Ÿ‡ฟ SUHH
๐Ÿ‡น๐Ÿ‡ต East Timor = Timor-Leste ๐Ÿ‡น๐Ÿ‡ฑ TPTL
๐Ÿ‡พ๐Ÿ‡ฉ Democratic (South) Yemen ๐Ÿ‡พ๐Ÿ‡ช YDYE
๐Ÿ‡พ๐Ÿ‡บ Yugoslavia ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡ช ๐Ÿ‡ท๐Ÿ‡ธ ๐Ÿ‡ง๐Ÿ‡ฆ ๐Ÿ‡ญ๐Ÿ‡ท ๐Ÿ‡ธ๐Ÿ‡ฎ ๐Ÿ‡ฒ๐Ÿ‡ฐ ๐Ÿ‡ฝ๐Ÿ‡ฐ YUCS
๐Ÿ‡ฟ๐Ÿ‡ท Zaire = Congo ๐Ÿ‡จ๐Ÿ‡ฉ ZRCD

SU is one of the currently 12 codes exceptionally reserved in ISO 3166. CLDR directly includes 6 of them as regular (see #291). EU and UN are covered by macroregion and UK is an alias of GB. EZ does not refer to a real region, but a concept (basically Euro zone). FX is just FR without overseas dependencies. That leaves SU as an exception. It was reserved on behalf of a request of the Foundation for Internet Development (FID), the other requests came either from the countries themselves, from ISO or from one of Universal Postal Union (UPU), International Telecommunication Union (ITU) and World Customs Organization (WCO).

Communism Red Flag

Since the red flag with hammer and sickle symbol has also been used as the international flag of the Communist movement, ๐Ÿ‡ธ๐Ÿ‡บ would be sufficient to encode this as an emoji. (A simple red flag is at least a s common, though, and other yellow symbols like a star also occur.) Nevertheless, the character โ˜ญ U+262D Hammer and Sickle has also been available in Unicode for quite some time now, but not as an emoji. Hence, there could instead be a ZWJ sequence for the flag as established by the Rainbow Flag emoji: ๐Ÿณโ€โ˜ญ๏ธ U+1F3F3[-FE0F]-200D-262D[-FE0F] or ๐Ÿดโ€โ˜ญ๏ธ U+1F3F4-200D-262D[-FE0F]. Even more simple, the emoji variant of that codepoint, once registered, could be rendered as a flag: โ˜ญ๏ธ U+262D-FE0F (VS-16). Alternatively, the sequence could use a Red Heart (or two): โคโ˜ญ๏ธ or โคโ€โ˜ญ๏ธโ€โค U+2764[-FE0F]-200D-262D[-FE0F][-2764[-FE0F]]. Samsung already treats the symbol as an emoji.

white hammer and sickle symbol on yellow background

@Crissov Crissov changed the title Communism / Soviet Union Flag emoji Communism โคโ˜ญโค or Soviet Union ๐Ÿ‡ธ๐Ÿ‡บ Flag emoji Mar 2, 2017

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commented Jun 3, 2017

Mockups

Emojitwo: 1f1f8-1f1fa 262d

@simison

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commented Dec 19, 2017

Just noting here that by adding Soviet flag you would probably get follow up requests to add Nazi Germany (1935โ€”1945) flag:

image
via Wikipedia

While โ˜ญ๏ธ is often considered a symbol of communism (and thus used e.g. by LPRP in Laos), Soviet Union flag represents a country which in many Eastern European countries is considered as a dictatorship and occupier. Just like Nazi Germany is considered so in Western Europe.

So I'm trying to make a neutral comment here, just noting that:

  • Country flag and symbol of communism are two separate (albeit very related) things (re: "Samsung already treats the symbol as an emoji." or "the red flag with hammer and sickle symbol has also been used as the international flag of the Communist movement")
  • Emotionally there is no big difference between Nazi flag and Soviet union flag to many, so be prepared.

โค๏ธ โ˜ฎ๏ธ

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commented Dec 19, 2017

I might have been oversimplifying the relationship between the SU flag and the Hammer and Sickle symbol. The use cases nowadays at the emoji scale would still be quite similar in a way that most people that are requesting one or the other would be satisfied with either one. Some of them are probably not asking for an emoji for communism/socialism to represent themselves, by the way. Anyway, Emojitwo, which is a project I maintain, kinda supports both of them.

The swastika flag is a different issue, especially technically. While the existing Unicode swastika characters could (but never will) be emojified, there is no separate ISO 3166-1 code element for the German state of the 1930s and 1940s, because the ISO standard and its companion UN specification were released years after WW2. There was DD for the GDR (i.e. East Germany), however, alongside DE for FRG (West Germany), which is still used for reunified Germany.

Many countries have had minor or major changes to their flag throughout the ages. Some of them, Mauritania for instance, changed something after country flag emoji had become widely available.

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commented Mar 29, 2018

As simison brings Wikipedia, there's quite a difference from a humanities point of view, as well.

Someone using the communist flag will probably joke about communist folklore, such as the communist manifesto, Kronstadt, and so on. Even communists themselves agree about Stalin being a dictator, and this is not the purpose for which the hammer and sickle flag will be used. As such, feminists can joke about castration but I never heard of a feminist castrating a man. (So far, a rape victim setting her rapist on fire, a beaten wife murdering her husband, and a reality show star stabbing her boyfriend are the only examples of female violence I can think of.)

Someone using the Nazi flag straight wants to murder people. The swastika is a sacred symbol in Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism and has no reason to be turned into a nazi emoji; the use of the swastika in the Nazi flag is the appropriation of the complex relations between various regional cultures and Asian religious sects by Adolf Hitler.

Code is obviously political: if I'm creating an internal frontend for a company, then my relationship with this company will become, because of this code, political. I'll become responsible for their success. If we're creating a Nazi flag, then we're responsible for people being murdered or people being harassed online until they kill themselves โ€“ hence being murdered, ultimately. If not by decency towards the industrial murder of clustered humans clutching their peers after breathing the gas chambers' Zyklonย B, implying that the Nazi ideology doesn't exist anymore is either irresponsible or criminal โ€“ because people will die.

@Crissov Crissov referenced this issue Oct 26, 2018

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@grimcap

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commented Nov 29, 2018

Why we have a Pirete flag? ๐Ÿดโ€โ˜ ๏ธ

@Crissov

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commented Nov 29, 2018

@grimcap Vendors are free to implement custom ZWJ sequences and that is what Twitter did with the Pirate Flag. Unlike Microsoft's custom Ninja Cat emoji sequences, the Pirate Flag was deemed worthy of general support and thus (like the Rainbow Flag before) became RGI: recommended for general interchange.

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