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Japanese Translation is incorrect (confusing) in Email router document #602

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damedom opened this Issue Aug 13, 2018 · 21 comments

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@damedom

damedom commented Aug 13, 2018

Japanese Translation is incorrect (confusing) in "Important" section.

Title : Integrate (synchronize) your email system
URL(en) : https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/dynamics365/customer-engagement/admin/integrate-synchronize-your-email-system
URL(ja) : https://docs.microsoft.com/ja-jp/dynamics365/customer-engagement/admin/integrate-synchronize-your-email-system

English Version :

Important
In previous versions of Dynamics CRM, you could also use the Email Router to synchronize records. The Email Router has been deprecated as of the Dynamics 365 (online), version 9.0. We strongly recommend that you migrate all email routing functionality to use server-side synchronization.

Japanese Version :

旧バージョンの Dynamics CRM では、レコードの同期に Email Router も使用できました。 Email Router は Dynamics 365 (オンライン) バージョン 9.0 で廃止されました。 すべての電子メールのルーティング機能をサーバー側同期を使用するよう移行することをお勧めします。

Issue Details

The expression "廃止されました" means "has been discontinued". People who read this article may believe that the feature is already deleted. But actually, Email router functionality hasn't been deleteed in V9.0

Title : Dynamics 365 (online), version 9.0 Email Router
URL : https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=56974

This should be "廃止予定です" in Japanese which means "to be deleted soon" or "planned to be deleted soon". So it would be better to write like this:

旧バージョンの Dynamics CRM では、レコードの同期に Email Router も使用できました。 Email Router は Dynamics 365 (オンライン) バージョン 9.0 で廃止予定です。 すべての電子メールのルーティング機能をサーバー側同期を使用するよう移行することをお勧めします。

Similar Issue

There's a same mistranslation here:

Title : Migrate settings from the Email Router to server-side synchronization
URL(en) : https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/dynamics365/customer-engagement/admin/migrate-settings-email-router-server-side-synchronization
URL(ja) : https://docs.microsoft.com/ja-jp/dynamics365/customer-engagement/admin/migrate-settings-email-router-server-side-synchronization

English Version :

Note
The Microsoft Dynamics CRM Email Router has been deprecated and was removed in version 9.0 of Dynamics 365. To prepare for this change, we strongly recommend that you migrate all email routing functionality to use the server-side synchronization feature.

Japanese Version :

注意
Microsoft Dynamics CRM Email Router は廃止され、Dynamics 365 のバージョン 9.0 で削除されました。 この変更に対応するため、すべての電子メールのルーティング機能がサーバー側同期機能を使用するよう移行することをお勧めします。

The expression "削除されました" means "has been deleted". It would be better to write like this:

注意
Microsoft Dynamics CRM Email Router は廃止予定であり、Dynamics 365 のバージョン 9.0 以降削除されることになっています。 この変更に対応するため、すべての電子メールのルーティング機能がサーバー側同期機能を使用するよう移行することをお勧めします。

@yumetodo

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yumetodo commented Aug 13, 2018

image


image

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Powerhelmsman commented Aug 13, 2018

@nokura @SonjaSaltzman Can you fix it?

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SonjaSaltzman commented Aug 13, 2018

This content is from @krisre / @vinceno - could you please follow up?

@vinceno

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vinceno commented Aug 13, 2018

@mhogan73 @SonjaSaltzman - thx Sonja., bring in Marina in Kris' absence.

@mhogan73

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mhogan73 commented Aug 13, 2018

Thx @yumetodo we will look into this issue and update you on when we can address this. Thx

@Powerhelmsman Powerhelmsman assigned mhogan73 and unassigned nokura Aug 13, 2018

@SonjaSaltzman

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SonjaSaltzman commented Nov 14, 2018

@mhogan73 can you please comment and close this if it has been addressed?

@SonjaSaltzman

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SonjaSaltzman commented Nov 14, 2018

Also cc: @krisre

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mhogan73 commented Nov 14, 2018

This has been addressed and is now published live.

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mhogan73 commented Nov 17, 2018

@yumetodo I will recheck the issue asap and update the bug.

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mhogan73 commented Nov 20, 2018

Hi @yumetodo @damedom
Japanese issues.docx

  • Apologies for incorrect information, there was confusion with another bug.

Please see the document attached with feedback from our localization suppliers on the issues logged.

@yumetodo

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yumetodo commented Nov 22, 2018

I quote the feedback from Localization Suppliers for discussion.

The current translation is correct and follows the source, which says the feature "has been deprecated and was removed in version 9.0". However, it´s possible the reviewer knows this is not the case yet and wants the target to mean that this removal hasn´t already happened, therefore prefers to translate Japanese as ""planned to be deleted soon". We don´t recommend implementing this part, but we can change "deprecated" with the approved TS translation as in Issue 1. Please notice that this is Basic content, therefore while we haven´t followed TS, there is no possibility of the user misunderstanding the original concept re deprecated, the current translation is also widely-used and understood to be a synonym.


The current translation is correct and follows the source

NOT CORRECT.

It is already pointed by @damedom that why the current translation is not correct. @DaisukeEda also ponited out same problem at #881 and #882. However, Localization Suppliers does not understand.

So, I point out again. 廃止された means already removed. 削除予定 means remove soon.

wants the target to mean that this removal hasn´t already happened, therefore prefers to translate Japanese as ""planned to be deleted soon".

Wait, wait, wait, wait.

Localization Suppliers are already decided that "already removed" and "remove soon" is same meaning (of course that is not correct), isn't it?

It is surprising that Localization Suppliers is planning to change the translation to まもなく削除される予定("planned to be deleted soon").

It's may be related issue that Bing translate says that deprecated means 廃止. If Localization Suppliers use Bing translate to understand this issue, DO NOT USE Bing translate. Bing translate is broken, and we should deprecate to use Bing translate.

To avoid misunderstanding, I quote wiktionary(from 03:28, 25 July 2018 version):
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/deprecated

(computing) Obsolescent; said of a construct in a computing language considered old, and planned to be phased out, but still available for use.

Can you see "still available for use"? That is exactly this issue pointed out.

By the way, まもなく削除される予定("planned to be deleted soon") is too wordy translation(I think 非推奨 is better).


Please re-open this issue, search deprecated on wiktionary.

@mhogan73

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mhogan73 commented Nov 22, 2018

Hi @yumetodo I am discussing this issue again with our localization suppliers. Pls note they do not use Bing Translate as part of the translation process. The office here is closed today and tomorrow so I will update you on Monday. Thx

@mhogan73

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mhogan73 commented Nov 27, 2018

I have reviewed this issue again with the localization suppliers and some internal Japanese speakers and they have all agreed that the translation online is correct. The Organization Data Service was deprecated in CRM 2016 (version 8.x) and this has been reflected in the translation.

Please note the current translation is following the source correctly. " 廃止され" means "has been deprecated" , while the suggested translation of "廃止予定となり​” means "planned to be deprecated".

@blackwingcat

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blackwingcat commented Nov 28, 2018

Hi, mhogan73

I think you misunderstand "廃止"

"廃止" means "deleted" in Japan.

"廃止" means "you can not use function."
"廃止予定" means "you can use function but worse"
"非推奨" means "you can use function but worse"
"非推奨予定" means "it is official function now"

"has been deprecated" means "has been not recommended" = "非推奨になった"
"planned to be deprecated " means "planned to be not recommended" = "非推奨予定"

for example
https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_enterprise_linux/7/html/7.5_release_notes/chap-red_hat_enterprise_linux-7.5_release_notes-deprecated_functionality

Python 2 has been deprecated "Python 2 は非推奨になった"
"We can still use Python 2"

Sincerely.

@SonjaSaltzman

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SonjaSaltzman commented Nov 28, 2018

@mhogan73 reopening - could you please follow up?

@SonjaSaltzman SonjaSaltzman reopened this Nov 28, 2018

@yumetodo

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yumetodo commented Nov 29, 2018

from #881

Link to article:
Title: Organization data service
URL(en) : https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/dynamics365/customer-engagement/developer/developer-resources-page#organization-data-service
URL(jp) : https://docs.microsoft.com/ja-jp/dynamics365/customer-engagement/developer/developer-resources-page#organization-data-service

English Version :
The Organization Data service has been deprecated and replaced by the Web API. For more information about the Web API see Use the Dynamics 365 Web API.

Japanese Version :
組織のサービスは、廃止され、Web API に置き換えられました。 Web API の詳細については、Dynamics 365 Web API の使用 を参照してください。

Problem:
The expression " 廃止され" means "has been removed". People who read this article believe that the feature is already removed. "Deprecated" should transrate to "廃止予定" in Japanese. So that please change it as below.

組織のサービスは、廃止予定となり、Web API に置き換えられました。 Web API の詳細については、Dynamics 365 Web API の使用 を参照してください。

from #882

Link to article:
Title: Organization data service
URL(en) : https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/dynamics365/customer-engagement/developer/use-microsoft-dynamics-365-web-services#organization-data-service
URL(jp) : https://docs.microsoft.com/ja-jp/dynamics365/customer-engagement/developer/use-microsoft-dynamics-365-web-services#organization-data-service

English Version :
While this service will continue to be available as-is for years to come, we are deprecating it with Dynamics 365 (online).

Japanese Version :
このサービスは、Dynamics 365 (online) を廃止する予定の年までは引き続き利用可能となります。

Problem:
The transration of "we are deprecating it with Dynamics 365 (online)." is definitely incorrect.
"このサービスは、Dynamics 365 (online) を廃止する予定の年までは引き続き利用可能となります。"
means that we can use it until the year when Dynamics 365 (online) is end of service. So please correct as below.

The expression " 廃止され" means "has been removed". People who read this article believe that the feature is already removed. "Deprecated" should transrate to "廃止予定" in Japanese. So that please change it as below.

このサービスは、Dynamics 365 (online) にて廃止予定となっておりますが、利用可能となります。

@Powerhelmsman Powerhelmsman removed the resolved label Nov 29, 2018

@mhogan73

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mhogan73 commented Dec 4, 2018

We are revisiting this translation issue reported and hope to update this issue and also #881 and #882 tomorrow with a resolution. Thx.

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mhogan73 commented Dec 5, 2018

@yumetodo We are making a change to the topic, this should be published live soon. I will update you when the topic is Live. Thanks.

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mhogan73 commented Dec 10, 2018

@yumetodo Please note the updated topic should now be Live, can you please review ? Thanks.

https://docs.microsoft.com/ja-jp/dynamics365/customer-engagement/developer/developer-resources-page#organization-data-service

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yumetodo commented Dec 12, 2018

@mhogan73 Perfect! Thank you.

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