same shortcut names (different in paths) = confusion

[TNTBOMBOM]

there some shortcuts names in the shortcuts list have identical names but not the same paths, like:-

"Help" 

there r two of them

first one:-

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/yelp.desktop

second one:-

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/kde4/Help.desktop

"imageMagic (display Q16)"

first one:-

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/display-img6.desktop

and the second one is:-

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/display-img6.q16.desktop

"Tor Browser"

first one:-

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/anondist-torbrowser.desktop

second one:-

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/janondisttorbrowser.desktop

Note:- debian share one issues of the above , which is:-

  "imageMagic (display Q16)"

first one:-

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/display-img6.desktop

and the second one is:-

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/display-img6.q16.desktop

[marmarek]

"imageMagic (display Q16)"
qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/display-img6.desktop

This one is from imagemagick package

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/display-img6.q16.desktop

This one - from imagemagick-6.q16
imagemagick depends on imagemagick-6.q16. Some Qubes tools (PDF converter, icon updater) depends on imagemagick, mostly for having /usr/bin/convert tool. Should it be changed to depend on imagemagick-6.q16? It apparently also ships convert tool - selectable via alternatives mechanism.

"Help"

Those are two different packages:

• yelp - "Help browser for GNOME" (have OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Unity;)
• khelpcenter - "The KDE Help Center" (have OnlyShowIn=KDE;)

But since there is no such thing as "desktop environment" in VM, OnlyShowIn isn't respected. Maybe it should be? But with what value? Having something global like "the same as in dom0" isn't good, because for example Gnome Terminal would not be visible. Also one may want to use different applications for different things, from different desktop suites (for example Gnome Terminal and kwrite). Maybe simply only one of those packages should be installed?

Hmm, where did you found this? I've just checked that default Whonix Workstation template has only khelpcenter installed, but default Debian 8 template - yelp. Neither of them have both packages at the same time (by default).

[marmarek]

"imageMagic (display Q16)"
qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/display-img6.desktop

This one is from imagemagick package

qubes-desktop-run /usr/share/applications/display-img6.q16.desktop

This one - from imagemagick-6.q16
imagemagick depends on imagemagick-6.q16. Some Qubes tools (PDF converter, icon updater) depends on imagemagick, mostly for having /usr/bin/convert tool. Should it be changed to depend on imagemagick-6.q16? It apparently also ships convert tool - selectable via alternatives mechanism.

"Help"

Those are two different packages:

• yelp - "Help browser for GNOME" (have OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Unity;)
• khelpcenter - "The KDE Help Center" (have OnlyShowIn=KDE;)

But since there is no such thing as "desktop environment" in VM, OnlyShowIn isn't respected. Maybe it should be? But with what value? Having something global like "the same as in dom0" isn't good, because for example Gnome Terminal would not be visible. Also one may want to use different applications for different things, from different desktop suites (for example Gnome Terminal and kwrite). Maybe simply only one of those packages should be installed?

Hmm, where did you found this? I've just checked that default Whonix Workstation template has only khelpcenter installed, but default Debian 8 template - yelp. Neither of them have both packages at the same time (by default).

[TNTBOMBOM]

Hmm, where did you found this? I've just checked that default Whonix Workstation template has only khelpcenter installed, but default Debian 8 template - yelp. Neither of them have both packages at the same time (by default).

Whonix Workstation:-

Debian:-

im using Qubes + KDE (dolphin)

[TNTBOMBOM]

Hmm, where did you found this? I've just checked that default Whonix Workstation template has only khelpcenter installed, but default Debian 8 template - yelp. Neither of them have both packages at the same time (by default).

Whonix Workstation:-

Debian:-

im using Qubes + KDE (dolphin)

[adrelanos]

Marek Marczykowski-Górecki:

Those are two different packages: - yelp - "Help browser for GNOME"
(have OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Unity;) - khelpcenter - "The KDE Help
Center" (have OnlyShowIn=KDE;)

But since there is no such thing as "desktop environment" in VM,
OnlyShowIn isn't respected. Maybe it should be? But with what
value?

Interesting idea.

I guess there would be an issue with detecting the "desktop environment"
"in VM" with run time of desktop environment vs run time of update qubes
menu. And for other purposes perhaps not great.

Having something global like "the same as in dom0" isn't good,
because for example Gnome Terminal would not be visible.

Yes.

cd /usr/share/applications

grep -r -i OnlyShowIn

gnome-terminal.desktop:OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Unity;
mate-notification-properties.desktop:OnlyShowIn=MATE;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
kde4/systemsettings.desktop:OnlyShowIn=KDE;
kde4/klipper.desktop:OnlyShowIn=KDE;
kde4/knetattach.desktop:OnlyShowIn=KDE;
yelp.desktop:OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Unity;
nautilus-classic.desktop:OnlyShowIn=GNOME;

I would miss shutter then if let's suppose it was set to dom0 gnome for
example.

grep -r -i NotShowIn

gpk-prefs.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
org.gnome.baobab.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
nm-connection-editor.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
kde4/kdesystemsettings.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
gpk-application.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
gpk-update-viewer.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
nm-applet.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE

I would miss baobab then if let's suppose it was set to dom0 gnome for
example.

Also one may
want to use different applications for different things, from
different desktop suites (for example Gnome Terminal and kwrite).
Maybe simply only one of those packages should be installed?

Yes. [We should be doing this already anyhow.]

And I have another suggestion.

Showing only the 'Name=' field may be to little because of various
'.desktop' files having the same 'Name=' field. Maybe contents from
'GenericName=' and/or 'Comment=' [as fallback] should be also used?

Also displaying the icon there would help with usability.

Perhaps each entry should take up two lines? And then have a thin
separator line?

Wondering what @bnvk thinks about 'Add more shortcuts...' menu improvements.

[adrelanos]

Marek Marczykowski-Górecki:

Those are two different packages: - yelp - "Help browser for GNOME"
(have OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Unity;) - khelpcenter - "The KDE Help
Center" (have OnlyShowIn=KDE;)

But since there is no such thing as "desktop environment" in VM,
OnlyShowIn isn't respected. Maybe it should be? But with what
value?

Interesting idea.

I guess there would be an issue with detecting the "desktop environment"
"in VM" with run time of desktop environment vs run time of update qubes
menu. And for other purposes perhaps not great.

Having something global like "the same as in dom0" isn't good,
because for example Gnome Terminal would not be visible.

Yes.

cd /usr/share/applications

grep -r -i OnlyShowIn

gnome-terminal.desktop:OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Unity;
mate-notification-properties.desktop:OnlyShowIn=MATE;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
shutter.desktop:OnlyShowIn=Unity;
kde4/systemsettings.desktop:OnlyShowIn=KDE;
kde4/klipper.desktop:OnlyShowIn=KDE;
kde4/knetattach.desktop:OnlyShowIn=KDE;
yelp.desktop:OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Unity;
nautilus-classic.desktop:OnlyShowIn=GNOME;

I would miss shutter then if let's suppose it was set to dom0 gnome for
example.

grep -r -i NotShowIn

gpk-prefs.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
org.gnome.baobab.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
nm-connection-editor.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
kde4/kdesystemsettings.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
gpk-application.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
gpk-update-viewer.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE;
nm-applet.desktop:NotShowIn=KDE

I would miss baobab then if let's suppose it was set to dom0 gnome for
example.

Also one may
want to use different applications for different things, from
different desktop suites (for example Gnome Terminal and kwrite).
Maybe simply only one of those packages should be installed?

Yes. [We should be doing this already anyhow.]

And I have another suggestion.

Showing only the 'Name=' field may be to little because of various
'.desktop' files having the same 'Name=' field. Maybe contents from
'GenericName=' and/or 'Comment=' [as fallback] should be also used?

Also displaying the icon there would help with usability.

Perhaps each entry should take up two lines? And then have a thin
separator line?

Wondering what @bnvk thinks about 'Add more shortcuts...' menu improvements.

[marmarek]

And I have another suggestion.

Showing only the 'Name=' field may be to little because of various
'.desktop' files having the same 'Name=' field. Maybe contents from
'GenericName=' and/or 'Comment=' [as fallback] should be also used?

If Name= is the same, GenericName= probably will also be the same,
or very similar. But comment may be a good idea. Not sure where - the
same line? Tooltip?

Also displaying the icon there would help with usability.

That's IMO pretty good idea.

Perhaps each entry should take up two lines? And then have a thin
separator line?

IMO it would make it less usable (more scrolling). But I'm not an expert
in usability area...

Best Regards,
Marek Marczykowski-Górecki
Invisible Things Lab
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?

[marmarek]

And I have another suggestion.

Showing only the 'Name=' field may be to little because of various
'.desktop' files having the same 'Name=' field. Maybe contents from
'GenericName=' and/or 'Comment=' [as fallback] should be also used?

If Name= is the same, GenericName= probably will also be the same,
or very similar. But comment may be a good idea. Not sure where - the
same line? Tooltip?

Also displaying the icon there would help with usability.

That's IMO pretty good idea.

Perhaps each entry should take up two lines? And then have a thin
separator line?

IMO it would make it less usable (more scrolling). But I'm not an expert
in usability area...

Best Regards,
Marek Marczykowski-Górecki
Invisible Things Lab
A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text.
Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing?

[adrelanos]

Marek Marczykowski-Górecki:

And I have another suggestion.

Showing only the 'Name=' field may be to little because of various
'.desktop' files having the same 'Name=' field. Maybe contents from
'GenericName=' and/or 'Comment=' [as fallback] should be also used?

If Name= is the same, GenericName= probably will also be the same,
or very similar.

Right.

But comment may be a good idea. Not sure where - the
same line? Tooltip?

Tooltip no, that would still cause a usability issue as in this thread.
In the same line.

Also displaying the icon there would help with usability.

That's IMO pretty good idea.

Perhaps each entry should take up two lines? And then have a thin
separator line?

IMO it would make it less usable (more scrolling).

Right. I could imagine that an [almost] full-screen by default might
also be useful. And perhaps a non-lined approach. Perhaps just the icons
with subtext next to each other. Or perhaps getting rid of the whole
thing. And rather in Qubes start menu, showing at the top or so:

• show all
• not show all
  Once you click one of these, the menu will not vanish put persist. And
  you have some [smaller / grayer] plus / minus buttons next to each item.
  Where,
• plus would mean, always show
• minus would mean, only show if not show all has been clicked.
  (Clicking plus or minus may not make the menu vanish.)
  (Vanish means, usually when you click something in the menu to start an
  application, then the menu vanishes. This is fine for starting it but
  not great for configuring it.)

But indeed. Someone who really knows something about usability should
design this thing. I could be far off.

[adrelanos]

Marek Marczykowski-Górecki:

And I have another suggestion.

Showing only the 'Name=' field may be to little because of various
'.desktop' files having the same 'Name=' field. Maybe contents from
'GenericName=' and/or 'Comment=' [as fallback] should be also used?

If Name= is the same, GenericName= probably will also be the same,
or very similar.

Right.

But comment may be a good idea. Not sure where - the
same line? Tooltip?

Tooltip no, that would still cause a usability issue as in this thread.
In the same line.

Also displaying the icon there would help with usability.

That's IMO pretty good idea.

Perhaps each entry should take up two lines? And then have a thin
separator line?

IMO it would make it less usable (more scrolling).

Right. I could imagine that an [almost] full-screen by default might
also be useful. And perhaps a non-lined approach. Perhaps just the icons
with subtext next to each other. Or perhaps getting rid of the whole
thing. And rather in Qubes start menu, showing at the top or so:

• show all
• not show all
  Once you click one of these, the menu will not vanish put persist. And
  you have some [smaller / grayer] plus / minus buttons next to each item.
  Where,
• plus would mean, always show
• minus would mean, only show if not show all has been clicked.
  (Clicking plus or minus may not make the menu vanish.)
  (Vanish means, usually when you click something in the menu to start an
  application, then the menu vanishes. This is fine for starting it but
  not great for configuring it.)

But indeed. Someone who really knows something about usability should
design this thing. I could be far off.