Window Manager update for Dom0

[marmarek]

Reported by joanna on 24 Jan 2011 12:13 UTC
None

Migrated-From: https://wiki.qubes-os.org/ticket/84

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 24 Jan 2011 12:14 UTC

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 24 Jan 2011 12:14 UTC

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 21 Mar 2011 21:42 UTC

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 21 Mar 2011 21:42 UTC

[marmarek]

Comment by joanna on 28 Mar 2011 11:46 UTC
Perhaps we should switch to something more lightweight in Dom0 (after all we're not gonna use most of the KDE features, such as file indexing, web browsers, etc. anyway). Perhaps to Xfce4? Just need to ensure we have proper decoration for Qubes (and also Expose effect).

[marmarek]

Comment by joanna on 28 Mar 2011 11:46 UTC
Perhaps we should switch to something more lightweight in Dom0 (after all we're not gonna use most of the KDE features, such as file indexing, web browsers, etc. anyway). Perhaps to Xfce4? Just need to ensure we have proper decoration for Qubes (and also Expose effect).

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 1 Apr 2011 10:23 UTC

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 1 Apr 2011 10:23 UTC

[marmarek]

Comment by smoku on 5 Apr 2011 09:16 UTC
Did we consider using Compiz in Dom0?
Compiz is independent of the desktop and supports its own window decorators.
Modern computers able to run Qubes should run Compiz just fine.

[marmarek]

Comment by smoku on 5 Apr 2011 09:16 UTC
Did we consider using Compiz in Dom0?
Compiz is independent of the desktop and supports its own window decorators.
Modern computers able to run Qubes should run Compiz just fine.

[marmarek]

Comment by joanna on 5 Apr 2011 09:22 UTC
When choosing the Dom0 Window/Desktop manager, we should look at the following features/properties:

• Support for composition and modern window management via Expose-like effect
• Convenient menus and ability to create short cuts/favourites (perhaps in a form of a Mac-like dock)
• Small&lightweight, build from components that we can easily throw away (example of components we don't need in Dom0: file management/searching/indexing, email/web integration, etc)
• It must support well external video output (for presentations)
• Should offer a screen saver + desktop locking

[marmarek]

Comment by joanna on 5 Apr 2011 09:22 UTC
When choosing the Dom0 Window/Desktop manager, we should look at the following features/properties:

• Support for composition and modern window management via Expose-like effect
• Convenient menus and ability to create short cuts/favourites (perhaps in a form of a Mac-like dock)
• Small&lightweight, build from components that we can easily throw away (example of components we don't need in Dom0: file management/searching/indexing, email/web integration, etc)
• It must support well external video output (for presentations)
• Should offer a screen saver + desktop locking

[marmarek]

Comment by smoku on 5 Apr 2011 09:39 UTC
Compiz:

• Composition: checked
• Exspose: Compiz plugin "Scale"
• Menus/Shortcuts: depends on the underlying desktop (Compiz is Window Manager only)
• Small&lightweight: Compiz is fully plugins based. We can enable only minimal set of plugins we want
• External video output: there is a Compiz plugin specifically for cloning a desktop to external screen (with proper scaling)
• screen saver + locking: it's XScreenSaver job

Additional bonus - when changing underlying desktop, but staying with Compiz as WM we still have Compiz decorations. And Compiz is able to use GNOME or KDE decorators, so we could reuse our KWin decorator.

[marmarek]

Comment by smoku on 5 Apr 2011 09:39 UTC
Compiz:

• Composition: checked
• Exspose: Compiz plugin "Scale"
• Menus/Shortcuts: depends on the underlying desktop (Compiz is Window Manager only)
• Small&lightweight: Compiz is fully plugins based. We can enable only minimal set of plugins we want
• External video output: there is a Compiz plugin specifically for cloning a desktop to external screen (with proper scaling)
• screen saver + locking: it's XScreenSaver job

Additional bonus - when changing underlying desktop, but staying with Compiz as WM we still have Compiz decorations. And Compiz is able to use GNOME or KDE decorators, so we could reuse our KWin decorator.

[marmarek]

Comment by smoku on 12 Apr 2011 12:08 UTC
Consider also GNOME3 Shell and Ubuntu Unity.

[marmarek]

Comment by smoku on 12 Apr 2011 12:08 UTC
Consider also GNOME3 Shell and Ubuntu Unity.

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 19 Apr 2011 20:28 UTC

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 19 Apr 2011 20:28 UTC

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 28 May 2011 09:14 UTC

[marmarek]

Modified by joanna on 28 May 2011 09:14 UTC

[marmarek]

Comment by joanna on 3 Sep 2011 11:59 UTC
Perhaps we should stay with what we have and tested so far (KDE) instead of changing this in the last moment. So, I think we should release Qubes 1.0 with current Dom0 WM, and get back to consider another WM only in post Qubes 1.0.

[marmarek]

Comment by joanna on 3 Sep 2011 11:59 UTC
Perhaps we should stay with what we have and tested so far (KDE) instead of changing this in the last moment. So, I think we should release Qubes 1.0 with current Dom0 WM, and get back to consider another WM only in post Qubes 1.0.

[tlaurion]

Were there any compiz PoC?

[tlaurion]

Were there any compiz PoC?

[ShalokShalom]

I know this is already decided.

In order to make some things clear:

About the resource consumption:

This counts until you load all apps. Comparing naked desktops makes less sense, imho.
Plus, its also a question how the distro configured the ISO, which services are loaded and so on.

Stability:

Fedora and Debian are fully GTK oriented, so all their packaging is focused on that toolkit and its environments. This includes that all the versions of gcc, libs and so on are ALL completly focused on another DE and Toolkit. They also mix KDE SC 4 with the new stack, which is already known since years as not working fine.

So, blame distros for choosing a way, that cannot work. Or blame KDE, for ignoring that part, since they are distro fanatics on their own. And spend KaOS a try, who solved it already more than 2 years ago, to bring a superb Plasma5 on the table, a year before all the others.

[ShalokShalom]

I know this is already decided.

In order to make some things clear:

About the resource consumption:

This counts until you load all apps. Comparing naked desktops makes less sense, imho.
Plus, its also a question how the distro configured the ISO, which services are loaded and so on.

Stability:

Fedora and Debian are fully GTK oriented, so all their packaging is focused on that toolkit and its environments. This includes that all the versions of gcc, libs and so on are ALL completly focused on another DE and Toolkit. They also mix KDE SC 4 with the new stack, which is already known since years as not working fine.

So, blame distros for choosing a way, that cannot work. Or blame KDE, for ignoring that part, since they are distro fanatics on their own. And spend KaOS a try, who solved it already more than 2 years ago, to bring a superb Plasma5 on the table, a year before all the others.