FAQ only mentions panda

[shadowcat-mst]

Should we be mentioning zef as well/instead ?

[ahalbert]

In modules.pod6 it says in the Future, the plan is too get zef up to speed. Is it considered mature enough to use over panda?

[jonathanstowe]

They are fairly at the same level, however some modules may not be tested and, for various reasons, may not install well with zef.

[zoffixznet]

In modules.pod6 it says in the Future, the plan is too get zef up to speed. Is it considered mature enough to use over panda?

It's more mature, as it also allows module uninstallation, cpan, and is pluggable. Panda's author also said zef is more actively developed and using it as standard installer would make sense

[stmuk]

panda now allows uninstallation of modules.

The main issue with zef is that the search only does exact matches rather
than sub-strings (or did last time I tried it)

S

On 11 September 2016 at 04:53, Zoffix Znet notifications@github.com wrote:

In modules.pod6 it says in the Future, the plan is too get zef up to
speed. Is it considered mature enough to use over panda?

It's more mature, as it also allows module uninstallation, cpan, and is
pluggable. Panda's author also said zef is more actively developed and
using it as standard installer would make sense
http://irclog.perlgeek.de/perl6/2016-06-21#i_12704273

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4096R/EA75174B Steve Mynott steve.mynott@gmail.com

[ugexe]

There are many problems zef has solved of which many can't be added to panda without a significant rewrite:

• Proper handling of identities - Zef will properly handle a request for Some::Module:ver('1.*') even if its in depends or provides (as well as working via zef install "Some::Module:ver('1.*')
• Handling multiple content storages - not just for using them individually but using them together
• Configuration of default install location (you can have a system rakudo with zef that installs to a non-system default for instance)
• No dependencies (even if you're behind a proxy) - No bootstrapping required. No installation needed.
• Better handling of proxies - all the included fetchers (git, wget, curl, etc) have ways of using a system configured proxy. If you are behind a proxy and were able to download zef chances are that same backend is already configured to use your proxy
• Can work in a completely gitless environment - For instance: change the github links in the p6c package list to point at github .tar.gz files instead of the .git repo and everything will just work
• zef is compatible with more Build.pm files than panda (even the poorly written ones)

[shadowcat-mst]

Not sure from where I'm standing "encourages the proliferation of Build.pm by making it even easier to perpetrate" is a reason for adding zef, but otherwise agree with all of this.

Yo @tadzik I think people are being nice because they don't want to kick your puppy. Do I remember correctly that in this case you basically want the puppy to be kicked, and if raccoon and zef manage to replace panda entirely you'll re-file panda under "worked exactly as well as Devel::Declare" and be happy?

[tadzik]

I'd never get behind getting puppies kicked :­) But as far as software goes, I'd never like my sentiments and fond memories of times of my actual community involvement get in the way of today's user experience.

In those rare ould times when I do use Perl 6 this days I still use panda because it does work for me, but it's undeniable that zef gets much more design, development and attention, is much more likely to get bugs fixed and features implemented and should be the recommended installer for new users. If there are indeed modules that for various reasons don't install in zef, that's even more of a reason to promote it and force module maintainers to fix their stuff: having only one (and unspecced!) working module installer will never do us any good.

tl;dr: yes, at least mention zef as well, imho it's not a bad idea to recommend it for everyone.

[azawawi]

👍