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Rename this fork and use less confusing versioning #2

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probonopd opened this Issue Apr 5, 2015 · 389 comments

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probonopd commented Apr 5, 2015

This fork of the Arduino IDE should be renamed something else to avoid confusion, and a version number should be chosen that does not suggest that this fork is "ahead of" the original Arduino IDE when in fact it is not. Naming open source projects should follow community best practices.

As for "arduino-org", one can read on https://github.com/arduino-org that "This organization has no public members. You must be a member to see who's a part of this organization". This is quite telling. The real Arduino team is at https://github.com/orgs/arduino/people as everyone can clearly see.

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richrad commented Apr 6, 2015

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fmendez commented Apr 7, 2015

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Chris--A Apr 7, 2015

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Chris--A commented Apr 7, 2015

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azide0x37 commented Apr 7, 2015

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ipapadop Apr 7, 2015

What are the reasons for this fork? What is the new functionality that you are offering? What issues is it solving and why isn't it just a pull request?

How about you just grow up and actually contribute something instead of confusing developers?

ipapadop commented Apr 7, 2015

What are the reasons for this fork? What is the new functionality that you are offering? What issues is it solving and why isn't it just a pull request?

How about you just grow up and actually contribute something instead of confusing developers?

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myself248 commented Apr 7, 2015

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raster commented Apr 7, 2015

1f44d

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Aeva commented Apr 7, 2015

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agonzalez-kanteron commented Apr 7, 2015

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twitchyliquid64 Apr 7, 2015

Agreed. Its fine that you want to fork it and do what you want, but please dont frustrate and drive away your users with annoying differences in versioning and operation of otherwise practically-identical IDEs.

twitchyliquid64 commented Apr 7, 2015

Agreed. Its fine that you want to fork it and do what you want, but please dont frustrate and drive away your users with annoying differences in versioning and operation of otherwise practically-identical IDEs.

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will127534 commented Apr 7, 2015

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AbstractBeliefs commented Apr 7, 2015

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arjanwiegel Apr 7, 2015

Please do so. Not doing so might degrade the value of the whole Arduino "family"

arjanwiegel commented Apr 7, 2015

Please do so. Not doing so might degrade the value of the whole Arduino "family"

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homelinen commented Apr 7, 2015

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pwillard Apr 7, 2015

Creating ambiguity will not hide reality. I support this comment.

pwillard commented Apr 7, 2015

Creating ambiguity will not hide reality. I support this comment.

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vamc19 commented Apr 7, 2015

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ghost commented Apr 7, 2015

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roppert commented Apr 7, 2015

+1

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simonmorley commented Apr 7, 2015

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extrapixel Dec 18, 2015

+1
@arduino-org-team Rename. Rebrand. Regain honor.

extrapixel commented Dec 18, 2015

+1
@arduino-org-team Rename. Rebrand. Regain honor.

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Isaac96 Jan 6, 2016

^^^
What he said

Isaac96 commented Jan 6, 2016

^^^
What he said

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pwillard Jan 6, 2016

RE: "Rename. Rebrand. Regain honor." Until then, stop lying to
rationalize poor social behavior. Yes, yes... this is just business...
we hear that... but this not your normal business "community" who doesn't
notice things.

On Tue, Jan 5, 2016 at 9:46 PM, Isaac notifications@github.com wrote:

^^^
What he said


Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub
#2 (comment).

pwillard commented Jan 6, 2016

RE: "Rename. Rebrand. Regain honor." Until then, stop lying to
rationalize poor social behavior. Yes, yes... this is just business...
we hear that... but this not your normal business "community" who doesn't
notice things.

On Tue, Jan 5, 2016 at 9:46 PM, Isaac notifications@github.com wrote:

^^^
What he said


Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub
#2 (comment).

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probonopd Mar 5, 2016

To add some perspective on who is the "real Arduino", this narrative might contain some surprising aspects: http://arduinohistory.github.io

In it, Hernando Barragán, a former student at the Interaction Design Institute Ivrea in Italy, explains how he started Wiring, and created the language definition for Wiring, including
pinMode(), digitalRead(), digitalWrite(), analogRead(), analogWrite(), delay(), millis(), etc.

He then goes on to explain the different printed circuit boards he had been using and how Arduino was formed as a fork of his work without him being invited to be part of the team.

Definitely an interesting read, although it looks like every writeup on the history of Arduino needs to be fact-checked, as Barragán points out in the last section.

probonopd commented Mar 5, 2016

To add some perspective on who is the "real Arduino", this narrative might contain some surprising aspects: http://arduinohistory.github.io

In it, Hernando Barragán, a former student at the Interaction Design Institute Ivrea in Italy, explains how he started Wiring, and created the language definition for Wiring, including
pinMode(), digitalRead(), digitalWrite(), analogRead(), analogWrite(), delay(), millis(), etc.

He then goes on to explain the different printed circuit boards he had been using and how Arduino was formed as a fork of his work without him being invited to be part of the team.

Definitely an interesting read, although it looks like every writeup on the history of Arduino needs to be fact-checked, as Barragán points out in the last section.

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Testato Mar 5, 2016

+1
Wiring is the real revolution, Arduino is a copy of it

Testato commented Mar 5, 2016

+1
Wiring is the real revolution, Arduino is a copy of it

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curtiszimmerman commented Mar 5, 2016

And of course, the comments.

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astronomer80 Mar 7, 2016

Arduino is a revolutionary system based on the revolutionary Wiring project that is based on a revolutionary project that is Processing and on the revolution of the bootloader that was not available without the revolution of development of the MCUs.

astronomer80 commented Mar 7, 2016

Arduino is a revolutionary system based on the revolutionary Wiring project that is based on a revolutionary project that is Processing and on the revolution of the bootloader that was not available without the revolution of development of the MCUs.

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Testato Mar 7, 2016

Wiring is hw and sw, so all the revolution that you named is true untill Wiring

Testato commented Mar 7, 2016

Wiring is hw and sw, so all the revolution that you named is true untill Wiring

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chalkers Mar 10, 2016

What does MCU stand for?

chalkers commented Mar 10, 2016

What does MCU stand for?

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Ernest314 Mar 10, 2016

Microcontroller (unit).

Ernest314 commented Mar 10, 2016

Microcontroller (unit).

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zallesov commented May 15, 2016

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Bikky-kun Jun 9, 2016

The user "probonopd" already mentioned the story of Hernando Barragán (http://arduinohistory.github.io), who as his thesis developed Wiring from which the Arduino IDE has been forked, without invitation or even a notification and with Massimo Banzi claiming, it was all his work anyways.
People are quick to cast blame and to labeling people (also, who wants to be on "the wrong side"... so, neglecting and trolling against "the others" is often a way of reaffirming oneself to be with "the good guys"). Sadly the press seems only to interview Massimo Banzi and takes his word for the truth without any independent verification or fact-checking of any kind (very bad journalism), thus we only get his version of the story over and over again. So at first, I also thought, Gianluca Martino (the arduino.org guy) to a backstabbing crook.
It will also be quite interesting where the lawsuit cc vs. org will go... especially when knowing that much of Banzi's claims (on him being the developer and that "programma" was the origin) are far from the truth (I don't know about the USA, but lying in court, oath or not oath, is a criminal offense in many countries).
And though the way, arduino.org happened to be, is just bad style, I do understand Martino's point. While Banzi wanted to out-source the manufacturing and just collect royalties and be a promoter, Martino's (official) standpoint was to keep manufacturing of Arduino Brand products in Ivrea, Italy. And I also understand his reluctance to pay royalties, when he participated in the development of the boards.
So who is the "real" Arduino? - ALL of them are.
It's Hernando Barragán, because he designed the original IDE and prototype MCUs (the "Wiring" project).
It's also Gianluca Martino, who, despite his bad style in forming arduino.org, heavily contributed in the hardware development and he developed and kicked of the manufacturing process (without which Arduino would have never been produced),
And yes, it's also Massimo Banzi, who supervised/supported Barragán in the development of Wiring and who is a fierce promoter of the Arduino-Idea.
So, what should they do?
Banzi should drop the case, start telling the true history of Arduino and apologize to Barragán and kindly invite him into the project. He should also recognize, that keeping the manufacturing of Arduino Branded Boards should stay in Italy and really try to reconcile with Martino.
Martino on the other hand should acknowledge his bad style in forming arduino.org and really make an effort to mend the ties to arduino.cc.
And Barragán? Well he did already everything he could in telling his side of the story and not taking any sides.
Well that is my opinion. I also think the "community" should try to get all the sides of this story and not only the convenient bits and do some fact checking to verify or disapprove the information. And please stop these hateful comments, they don't strengthen your point or Banzi's or Martino's... they are just a prove of stupidity and an inability to check facts before forming an opinion.

Bikky-kun commented Jun 9, 2016

The user "probonopd" already mentioned the story of Hernando Barragán (http://arduinohistory.github.io), who as his thesis developed Wiring from which the Arduino IDE has been forked, without invitation or even a notification and with Massimo Banzi claiming, it was all his work anyways.
People are quick to cast blame and to labeling people (also, who wants to be on "the wrong side"... so, neglecting and trolling against "the others" is often a way of reaffirming oneself to be with "the good guys"). Sadly the press seems only to interview Massimo Banzi and takes his word for the truth without any independent verification or fact-checking of any kind (very bad journalism), thus we only get his version of the story over and over again. So at first, I also thought, Gianluca Martino (the arduino.org guy) to a backstabbing crook.
It will also be quite interesting where the lawsuit cc vs. org will go... especially when knowing that much of Banzi's claims (on him being the developer and that "programma" was the origin) are far from the truth (I don't know about the USA, but lying in court, oath or not oath, is a criminal offense in many countries).
And though the way, arduino.org happened to be, is just bad style, I do understand Martino's point. While Banzi wanted to out-source the manufacturing and just collect royalties and be a promoter, Martino's (official) standpoint was to keep manufacturing of Arduino Brand products in Ivrea, Italy. And I also understand his reluctance to pay royalties, when he participated in the development of the boards.
So who is the "real" Arduino? - ALL of them are.
It's Hernando Barragán, because he designed the original IDE and prototype MCUs (the "Wiring" project).
It's also Gianluca Martino, who, despite his bad style in forming arduino.org, heavily contributed in the hardware development and he developed and kicked of the manufacturing process (without which Arduino would have never been produced),
And yes, it's also Massimo Banzi, who supervised/supported Barragán in the development of Wiring and who is a fierce promoter of the Arduino-Idea.
So, what should they do?
Banzi should drop the case, start telling the true history of Arduino and apologize to Barragán and kindly invite him into the project. He should also recognize, that keeping the manufacturing of Arduino Branded Boards should stay in Italy and really try to reconcile with Martino.
Martino on the other hand should acknowledge his bad style in forming arduino.org and really make an effort to mend the ties to arduino.cc.
And Barragán? Well he did already everything he could in telling his side of the story and not taking any sides.
Well that is my opinion. I also think the "community" should try to get all the sides of this story and not only the convenient bits and do some fact checking to verify or disapprove the information. And please stop these hateful comments, they don't strengthen your point or Banzi's or Martino's... they are just a prove of stupidity and an inability to check facts before forming an opinion.

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chalkers Jun 9, 2016

It feels like the Arduino brand has been damaged beyond repair. All this squabbling, messy legal stuff really flies in the face of the learner, the beginner. Try and explain this when you tell them that they downloaded an IDE from either of the website and it's not compatible with the board that they have. It's just a mess.

chalkers commented Jun 9, 2016

It feels like the Arduino brand has been damaged beyond repair. All this squabbling, messy legal stuff really flies in the face of the learner, the beginner. Try and explain this when you tell them that they downloaded an IDE from either of the website and it's not compatible with the board that they have. It's just a mess.

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mdezem Jun 29, 2016

Love to see the community's response here. I was looking to know better what was really happening and I came across this: https://arduinohistory.github.io/
It makes me sad to know that Banzi's version is not much faithful to the reality either. Sure Arduino SRL don't give a f**c for the community formed around Arduino and they shouldn't receive our support whatsoever. However it seems Gianlucca's role was not of a mere "hardware consultant". It was him who designed the board as we know it today, because Banzi's design was terrible and much more pricey.
It makes me even more sad to know that Wiring original developer's name was basically forgot by both sides of the dispute. I guess both Banzi and Gianlucca are not that interested in the community but solely on their own fame [and money] after all.
I guess the right thing to do is to buy only clones and to use Wiring IDE instead of the Arduino's one(s), since it continues to be actively in development AND being merged into Arduino IDE repo WITHOUT being given the due recognition by the Arduino's Team.

mdezem commented Jun 29, 2016

Love to see the community's response here. I was looking to know better what was really happening and I came across this: https://arduinohistory.github.io/
It makes me sad to know that Banzi's version is not much faithful to the reality either. Sure Arduino SRL don't give a f**c for the community formed around Arduino and they shouldn't receive our support whatsoever. However it seems Gianlucca's role was not of a mere "hardware consultant". It was him who designed the board as we know it today, because Banzi's design was terrible and much more pricey.
It makes me even more sad to know that Wiring original developer's name was basically forgot by both sides of the dispute. I guess both Banzi and Gianlucca are not that interested in the community but solely on their own fame [and money] after all.
I guess the right thing to do is to buy only clones and to use Wiring IDE instead of the Arduino's one(s), since it continues to be actively in development AND being merged into Arduino IDE repo WITHOUT being given the due recognition by the Arduino's Team.

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DRSDavidSoft Jul 5, 2016

:(

It's a shame that something as great as the Arduino/Wiring and its branding could go wrong just by some of the member's childish actions.

DRSDavidSoft commented Jul 5, 2016

:(

It's a shame that something as great as the Arduino/Wiring and its branding could go wrong just by some of the member's childish actions.

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IrregularShed Jul 5, 2016

We've got way off topic. The issue originally brought up 15 months ago revolves around the versioning that arduino.org introduced with this fork, as it goes against the semver standard that we all take for granted. That still stands.

Organisations that don't abide by semver make life complicated for everyone. It's one of the reasons I'm not a Sitecore developer any more (they introduced a whole load of breaking changes in a patch-level release). The reason semver has become standard is because it works, and is simple to understand.

So, can we stop the he-said-she-said taking of sides one way or the other, both Arduino camps hang up their egos and agree on facts:

  • This fork has deviated from semantic versioning standards
  • We have standards for a reason
  • This fork, as it is the derivative of the original Arduino IDE project, should change its naming/versioning to reflect this as transparently as possible

Anything else just continues to hurt the community - for both sides of the Arduino story. Having just been through the cutting-off-your-nose-to-spite-your-face Brexit vote in the UK, I'd prefer not to see the same happening in my hobby.

IrregularShed commented Jul 5, 2016

We've got way off topic. The issue originally brought up 15 months ago revolves around the versioning that arduino.org introduced with this fork, as it goes against the semver standard that we all take for granted. That still stands.

Organisations that don't abide by semver make life complicated for everyone. It's one of the reasons I'm not a Sitecore developer any more (they introduced a whole load of breaking changes in a patch-level release). The reason semver has become standard is because it works, and is simple to understand.

So, can we stop the he-said-she-said taking of sides one way or the other, both Arduino camps hang up their egos and agree on facts:

  • This fork has deviated from semantic versioning standards
  • We have standards for a reason
  • This fork, as it is the derivative of the original Arduino IDE project, should change its naming/versioning to reflect this as transparently as possible

Anything else just continues to hurt the community - for both sides of the Arduino story. Having just been through the cutting-off-your-nose-to-spite-your-face Brexit vote in the UK, I'd prefer not to see the same happening in my hobby.

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thinkyhead Sep 21, 2016

Marlin Firmware will not build using this toolchain due to its use of a different (older?) gcc. We will simply explain this on the marlinfw.org website for users who may have downloaded arduio.org by mistake.

thinkyhead commented Sep 21, 2016

Marlin Firmware will not build using this toolchain due to its use of a different (older?) gcc. We will simply explain this on the marlinfw.org website for users who may have downloaded arduio.org by mistake.

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probonopd Oct 1, 2016

https://blog.arduino.cc/2016/10/01/two-arduinos-become-one-2/

Arduino, the world’s leading open-source ecosystem for Educators, Makers and IoT developers of all ages, today announced that Arduino LLC (aka Arduino.cc) and Arduino srl (aka Arduino.org) have settled their differences and signed a Settlement agreement. (...) At the end of 2016, the newly created “Arduino Holding” will become the single point of contact for the wholesale distribution of all current and future products, and will continue to bring tremendous innovations to the market. In addition, Arduino will form a not-for-profit “Arduino Foundation” responsible for maintaining the open source Arduino desktop IDE (...) Massimo Banzi, Co-Founder of Arduino LLC, commented, “Today is one of the best days in Arduino history."

probonopd commented Oct 1, 2016

https://blog.arduino.cc/2016/10/01/two-arduinos-become-one-2/

Arduino, the world’s leading open-source ecosystem for Educators, Makers and IoT developers of all ages, today announced that Arduino LLC (aka Arduino.cc) and Arduino srl (aka Arduino.org) have settled their differences and signed a Settlement agreement. (...) At the end of 2016, the newly created “Arduino Holding” will become the single point of contact for the wholesale distribution of all current and future products, and will continue to bring tremendous innovations to the market. In addition, Arduino will form a not-for-profit “Arduino Foundation” responsible for maintaining the open source Arduino desktop IDE (...) Massimo Banzi, Co-Founder of Arduino LLC, commented, “Today is one of the best days in Arduino history."

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Chris--A Oct 2, 2016

Contributor

So does this mean the Arduino.org IDE is out?
It'd be a shame to stop development on the CC version, it has a promising future.

Might as well move the focus to the CC IDE and power ahead.

Contributor

Chris--A commented Oct 2, 2016

So does this mean the Arduino.org IDE is out?
It'd be a shame to stop development on the CC version, it has a promising future.

Might as well move the focus to the CC IDE and power ahead.

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Isaac96 Oct 6, 2016

It seems that the org IDE is basically the same thing, but didn't incorporate the latest changes. So not much diff.
Time to close this issue!

Isaac96 commented Oct 6, 2016

It seems that the org IDE is basically the same thing, but didn't incorporate the latest changes. So not much diff.
Time to close this issue!

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DouglasBair Nov 22, 2016

I love it!

I notice that the .org site is up and down at irregular times, I thought
that once they agreed about the business
that they would be one company.

The products and support from .org suck!

What can we do to support the original (.cc) company?

Douglas Bair
Longmont,Colorado
USA


From: Laurent-Jongbeys [mailto:notifications@github.com]
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2016 6:23 AM
To: arduino-org/Arduino
Subject: Re: [arduino-org/Arduino] Rename this fork and use less confusing
versioning (#2)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCncupnwYDQ

You are receiving this because you are subscribed to this thread.
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DouglasBair commented Nov 22, 2016

I love it!

I notice that the .org site is up and down at irregular times, I thought
that once they agreed about the business
that they would be one company.

The products and support from .org suck!

What can we do to support the original (.cc) company?

Douglas Bair
Longmont,Colorado
USA


From: Laurent-Jongbeys [mailto:notifications@github.com]
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2016 6:23 AM
To: arduino-org/Arduino
Subject: Re: [arduino-org/Arduino] Rename this fork and use less confusing
versioning (#2)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCncupnwYDQ

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Testato Nov 22, 2016

For support the .cc the simplest way is buy from it official store
https://store.arduino.cc

Testato commented Nov 22, 2016

For support the .cc the simplest way is buy from it official store
https://store.arduino.cc

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Chris--A Nov 23, 2016

Contributor

Can also throw money at them here: https://www.arduino.cc/en/Main/Donate

Contributor

Chris--A commented Nov 23, 2016

Can also throw money at them here: https://www.arduino.cc/en/Main/Donate

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giandolf Nov 24, 2016

https://blog.arduino.cc/2016/10/01/two-arduinos-become-one-2/
http://www.arduino.org/blog/two-arduinos-become-one

SEPTEMBER 30, 2016 - Arduino LLC (aka Arduino.cc) and Arduino srl (aka Arduino.org) will rejoin to become one Company. Massimo Banzi and Federico Musto took the stage at the New York Maker Faire to announce the good news.

arduinoceo

giandolf commented Nov 24, 2016

https://blog.arduino.cc/2016/10/01/two-arduinos-become-one-2/
http://www.arduino.org/blog/two-arduinos-become-one

SEPTEMBER 30, 2016 - Arduino LLC (aka Arduino.cc) and Arduino srl (aka Arduino.org) will rejoin to become one Company. Massimo Banzi and Federico Musto took the stage at the New York Maker Faire to announce the good news.

arduinoceo

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Laurent-Jongbeys Nov 24, 2016

@DouglasBair : I suggest you do not include previous email content when you reply to a post in a comment feed. Especially when the included comment was deleted instantly to avoid making a fool of myself because i didn't read the news ;-)
For your question, i agree with the above. Simply order from .cc, at least from time to time if you also like to use cheap clones.

Laurent-Jongbeys commented Nov 24, 2016

@DouglasBair : I suggest you do not include previous email content when you reply to a post in a comment feed. Especially when the included comment was deleted instantly to avoid making a fool of myself because i didn't read the news ;-)
For your question, i agree with the above. Simply order from .cc, at least from time to time if you also like to use cheap clones.

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DouglasBair Nov 24, 2016

DouglasBair commented Nov 24, 2016

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probonopd Dec 24, 2016

The latest arduino.cc IDE adds support for the .org boards, hence making this fork unnecessary:
https://www.arduino.cc/en/Main/ReleaseNotes:

Arduino Software Release Notes
ARDUINO 1.8.0 - 2016.12.20
(...)

[core]

  • Added Arduino.org boards
    (...)

Merry Christmas!

probonopd commented Dec 24, 2016

The latest arduino.cc IDE adds support for the .org boards, hence making this fork unnecessary:
https://www.arduino.cc/en/Main/ReleaseNotes:

Arduino Software Release Notes
ARDUINO 1.8.0 - 2016.12.20
(...)

[core]

  • Added Arduino.org boards
    (...)

Merry Christmas!

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DRSDavidSoft Feb 16, 2018

Should this issue be closed now since the two Arduinos became one? Or is there more code to be merged back into the .cc branch?

DRSDavidSoft commented Feb 16, 2018

Should this issue be closed now since the two Arduinos became one? Or is there more code to be merged back into the .cc branch?

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probonopd Feb 16, 2018

Given that the latest commit in this repository, 4f0efcc, dates back to Sep 20, 2016, I think we can assume this repository to be deprecated by now. Which is a good thing.

probonopd commented Feb 16, 2018

Given that the latest commit in this repository, 4f0efcc, dates back to Sep 20, 2016, I think we can assume this repository to be deprecated by now. Which is a good thing.

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