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Cease and Desist of Facebook and Instagram - Barinsta #2

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fire-bot opened this issue Jul 26, 2021 · 158 comments
Open

Cease and Desist of Facebook and Instagram - Barinsta #2

fire-bot opened this issue Jul 26, 2021 · 158 comments

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@fire-bot
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fire-bot commented Jul 26, 2021

Sent by Gallego, Gabriella (Perkins Coie) (GGallego@perkinscoie.com). Created by fire.


Dear Mr. Huang,

Please open, read, and respond to the attached letter on behalf of Facebook, Inc.

Thank you.

Gabriella Gallego | Perkins Coie LLP

ASSOCIATE

3150 Porter Drive

Palo Alto, CA 94304-1212

D. +1.650.838.4815

F. +1.650.838.4350

E. GGallego@perkinscoie.com


NOTICE: This communication may contain privileged or other confidential information. If you have received it in error, please advise the sender by reply email and immediately delete the message and any attachments without copying or disclosing the contents. Thank you.


Attachments:

  1. Barinsta_-_C26D.pdf
@Androz2091
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How to fuck one year of work in 10 minutes.

@austinhuang0131 austinhuang0131 transferred this issue from another repository Jul 26, 2021
@Rexogamer
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Anonymous access? I though Barinsta required an account, unless they're referring to the privacy features 🤔

@brianrobt
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brianrobt commented Jul 27, 2021

Aside from the list of demands being harsh, hypocritical, and unreasonable, in the end, if the claims are true, it sounds like Barinsta did violate FB's ToS.

@heiwiper
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This is really sad, I feel devastated and I haven't even contributed to this project, I really hope you get over this...
I would like to ask if it would hurt if I keep using the installed app ? Although I am considering leaving the platform at this point, it's just not worth it anymore.

@mubashir-rehman
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then why is https://github.com/harismuneer/Ultimate-Facebook-Scraper still alive?

@mubashir-rehman
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and how the fuck public data is Facebook's property?

@lonewolf24
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Facebook is the one who should be banned.
Lets sign a petition on change.org against facebook.

@brianrobt
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and how the fuck public data is Facebook's property?

The data may be displayed publicly but that doesn't mean it's free domain. A general rule to follow is that if it's on their platform, they own it.

@FrenchGithubUser
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Then removing the anonymous access from barinsta and making the use of an account mandatory would be fine according to facebook's concerns ?

@ghost
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ghost commented Jul 27, 2021

@mubashir-rehman

and how the fuck public data is Facebook's property?

https://research.mit.edu/integrity-and-compliance/export-control/information-documents/publicly-available-public-domain-open
Public domain is not the same as public (publicly available) information.

@eocow
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eocow commented Jul 27, 2021

@ThomasTraineau idea of removing the anon feature would work. That's is their main demand. Also a counter argument that stories can be screenshotted and screen recorded on nearly all OSs that use instagram.

@tentacleuno
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I'm sorry, Austin. Here's hoping someone totally anonymous takes over and keeps the project going.

@joepie91
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joepie91 commented Jul 27, 2021

For the record: this is an intimidation letter, they're pretty common unfortunately. While it may be a valid cease-and-desist, that doesn't mean that you need to comply with the long list of demands listed in the letter, certainly not within the 48 hours stated there. In fact, providing the demanded information can weaken your legal position.

Talk to a lawyer first, and follow their advice!

@jfwerner
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Agree with @joepie91.

Especially the "tell us all domains you own" is proabably 100% bs. (though IANAL).

All that aside, is anyone surprised? Of course Facebook won't like it that you can watch stories from people without the read marker

@lonewolf24
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#banfacebookinc

@lonewolf24
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For comparison
Twitter, Reddit, Google, Youtube and couple of other companies never did this.
#banfacebook

@Arcanorum
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r/opensource sent me

@SamantazFox
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SamantazFox commented Jul 27, 2021

For example, you cannot use a name that is similar to or includes “Instagram,” “IG,” “Insta,” or “gram,”

cough, Tell them about SI units of weight, and install scripts :P

Along with Your response, You must provide the following information:

  • A complete list of each and every product you created that targets Facebook users and/or interacts with Facebook or Instagram services;
  • A detailed description of the methods used to automate Facebook and Instagram functionality and provide Instagram or Facebook related services, including a full list of all apps or APIs that you utilized or developed;
  • A detailed description of the methods You used to obtain data from Facebook, Instagram,
    or any of its affiliate companies;

"We want you to give us pointers on how to fill the holes in our system"

@marek-lach
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marek-lach commented Jul 27, 2021

Please adopt the Pixelfed API for this app! It’s an ethical, free, open-source software.

@lonewolf24
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Let's switch to Mastodon

@austinhuang0131
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Owner

Thank you for your continued support. Several things to keep in mind:

  • Please do not intimidate the attorney. They have a job to do.
  • Let's keep things respectful.

@ma-gh
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ma-gh commented Jul 27, 2021

@austinhuang0131 Thanks for your great work. It wasn't wasted. This is an awesome app and has improved my LIFE dramatically by allowing me to keep in touch w/ ppl on insta and casually browse insta without falling into their algo mind trap.

@nourkagha
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nourkagha commented Jul 27, 2021

This is just sad. Barinsta was an amazing app and it's a shame to see all of the work and effort put into making it a great experience suddenly gone.

This doesn't necessarily have to be the end of the road. As already mentioned, I'd love to see you take all of your work and instead put it towards the Pixelfed API, which is a much better, open source, federated and ethical alternative to Instagram.

Pixelfed currently suffers from a lack of decent or functional mobile apps. There is PixelDroid, but it's still in very early stages and more options are always nice.

Thank you for all of your hard work.

@d-513
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d-513 commented Jul 27, 2021

This is sad. I still have hope this project gets revived like YouTube-DL did. Facebook is cancer

@ghost
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ghost commented Jul 27, 2021

@dada513
youtube-dl was only revived because the RIAA abused the DMCA system and GitHub found the RIAA in the wrong, hence reinstating it. This, in the end, has some parts which violated Facebook's TOS.

But it is very likely with a lawyer, the project can come back if the project removes the parts that Facebook mentions or implies are the main causes of TOS violations, as the project itself is fine but there seems to be some features/functionality that do violate TOS.

Remember, though, the legal system is not cheap. Huang can get a lawyer, but that doesn't mean they will because of legal expenses.

@iammarxg
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and how the fuck public data is Facebook's property?

Most apps say that they own everything you post (Snapchat too iirc) in their ToS.

@neobenedict
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Ironic how the letter says "may not access the Facebook or Instagram websites, mobile applications, Platforms, services, or networks for any reason whatsoever" and "See Facebook Terms of Service, https://www.facebook.com/terms" in the same letter. Isn't that a contradiction?

@KOLANICH
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Lets sign a petition on change.org against facebook.

Printing it on a toilet paper would likely be of the same efficiency.

@r-a-y
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r-a-y commented Jul 27, 2021

I'm not a lawyer, but it feels like the downloading of user's stories and posts is the main problem here.

Specifically, your app enables users to anonymously view and download other users’ Stories and posts.

Remove those features and probably Barinsta can survive?

@dm17
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dm17 commented Oct 8, 2022

Can we please organize and fight back? I want to be able to download videos my friends send me on instagram. Instagram purposefully makes this hard. This isn't wasting instagram's bandwidth or something - actually it reduces it because you don't have to re-stream it every time you want to watch it.

@Kungergely
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Kungergely commented Oct 16, 2022

@dm17 I mean you can always try and turn to the press, but it's dubious whether the story would be juicy enough for them to pick it up. Another option is making the program "somehow" (e.g. using the method described above) keep working/work again. Just make sure you clear your tracks well if you do that because if some psychopathic manager over at Meta decides to pursue the case one day they could really try and trace the activity back to you.

@Rexogamer
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then why is https://github.com/harismuneer/Ultimate-Facebook-Scraper still alive?

This thing is obscenely priced, the README is... eugh, and it just feels morally weird - if they're going to go after anyone, they should target things like this instead

@natsuneel
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natsuneel commented Jan 5, 2023

@sonivaibhav27

I also got notice. I stopped all my services for downloading videos . Can it escalates futher? Please help @austinhuang0131

I also got notice today. Did you replied or what should do ?

@sonivaibhav27
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I did reply. I suggest you to reply and get this solved.

@natsuneel
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@sonivaibhav27

I did reply. I suggest you to reply and get this solved.

Could you help what should i reply (Really appreciated)
I removed the Insta image downloading app from playstore (for that only cease email)

@sonivaibhav27
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Remove all the app you have built that violates Meta services.
And they will send you agreement letter , sign it as well. otherwise they will mail you very often

@natsuneel
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natsuneel commented Jan 5, 2023

@sonivaibhav27

Remove all the app you have built that violates Meta services. And they will send you agreement letter , sign it as well. otherwise they will mail you very often

I have removed all the app from all places.
And replied the email that i have removed bla bla...

@sonivaibhav27
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Just wait and enjoy the process . Spoiler alert Nothing will happen if you have adhere their policy further.

@natsuneel
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Just wait and enjoy the process . Spoiler alert Nothing will happen if you have adhere their policy further.

Facebook is worst
Check out this https://github.com/awesome-letters-from-facebook/

@Kungergely
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Check out this https://github.com/awesome-letters-from-facebook/

Wow, this is a pretty nice list actually. Perhaps some of the items from it could be added to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook#Criticisms_and_controversies somewhere. Although the list is pretty long already, it never hurts to let more people know of what's basically niche stuff affecting mostly developers.

@natsuneel
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Just wait and enjoy the process . Spoiler alert Nothing will happen if you have adhere their policy further.

Did you get your account unbanned later?

Both Insta & FB account is permanent ban. If you want those accounts you have to go by lawyers.
Create a new one with different email.

@Kungergely
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Did you get your account unbanned later?

Both Insta & FB account is permanent ban. If you want those accounts you have to go by lawyers. Create a new one with different email.

Yep, "incidents" like these are prime examples of why the DSA is such a welcome development and has been long overdue too. It's a bit unfortunate that its creation was prompted by politics (specifically US politics ironically), but is still a big milestone which will hopefully curb the US tech corporations' almost infinite arrogance and mafia-like reflexes a bit and might serve as an example for other countries as well.

@sonivaibhav27
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Just wait and enjoy the process . Spoiler alert Nothing will happen if you have adhere their policy further.

Did you get your account unbanned later?

Both Insta & FB account is permanent ban. If you want those accounts you have to go by lawyers. Create a new one with different email.

No. You can get your accounts back. We can request them from 6 month of signing the agreement and they will restore it back.To be on Safer side, Don't logged in or Sign up in facebook and instagram website till it get fully cleared from their side.

@austinhuang0131
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Owner

austinhuang0131 commented Jan 7, 2023

@sonivaibhav27 You should never sign anything without a lawyer present (same if you got stopped by police for any reason: don't say anything without an attorney, as you very well can incriminate yourself). Also, how often they send you emails really depends on who's assigned to your case (I'm aware of a wide range of frequencies), but they only email you for 6 months

@natsuneel https://austinhuang.me/barinsta.html middle section

@natsuneel
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natsuneel commented Jan 9, 2023

Just wait and enjoy the process . Spoiler alert Nothing will happen if you have adhere their policy further.

Did you get your account unbanned later?

Both Insta & FB account is permanent ban. If you want those accounts you have to go by lawyers. Create a new one with different email.

Hi Guys,
So Shit Meta blocked all my accounts Facebook, Instagram and today WhatsApp.
Simply saying violated terms of service.

@1alessandro1
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Time to move to telegram I'd say

@groovenectar
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groovenectar commented May 4, 2023

Time to move to https://pixelfed.org

@dm17
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dm17 commented May 4, 2023

Time to move to https://pixelfed.org

Or similar, great idea!

@KOLANICH
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KOLANICH commented May 4, 2023

Javascript is required to view this website, enable it to properly view this website.

Junk.

@RokeJulianLockhart
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@Kungergely, regarding #2 (comment), you could add the link as a citation somewhere if you don't want to put much effort into it.

#2 (comment):

Check out this @awesome-letters-from-facebook

Wow, this is a pretty nice list actually. Perhaps some of the items from it could be added to en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook#Criticisms_and_controversies somewhere. Although the list is pretty long already, it never hurts to let more people know of what's basically niche stuff affecting mostly developers.

@groovenectar
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groovenectar commented May 20, 2023

Javascript is required to view this website, enable it to properly view this website.

Junk.

So what that it makes use of one of the most prolific programming languages in existence? That immediately categorizes it as "junk"? Care to elaborate?

Further in the context of JavaScript, Pixelfed has a focus on safety:

image

There's a screenshot from uBlock. Do you really never use JavaScript at all? I can see cases to keep it off though it seems rather extreme.

I'm hoping to point people to Pixelfed from Instalution ( my little catharsis at https://github.com/instalution/frontend ). The two main reasons that used Next.js was to lower the barrier of entry to anyone who would want to take it to another level, and also the irony of FB having produced React.

From my perspective Pixelfed seems promising. There are a few frontends available for various device types, if anyone insists on avoiding JavaScript somehow there are other mechanisms for using it.

@KOLANICH
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So what that it makes use of one of the most prolific programming languages in existence? That immediately categorizes it as "junk"? Care to elaborate?

JS is Turing-complete, and so dangerous, especially taking into account the dangerous API browsers provide and the overall complexity of browsers' engines making it likely they have vulnrs. For a user-respecting website if a task can be done in pure HTTP + HTML + CSS + server-side logic, then it should be done this way. It doesn't exclude using JS for improvements, but using JS should be an option, not being mandatory.

From a replacement of Instagram I expect the flaws of Instagram being fixed, like mandatory JS.

Do you really never use JavaScript at all?

I use it somewhen. For example on GitHub (unfortunately, and I tnink that eventual,y I'll have to move out of here to something gitea-based, M$ is spoiling GH, more and more essential functionality of it require JS, anyway GH is far more user-friendly than GitLab, that is completely unusable without JS and also gitlab.com has browser-fingerprinting scripts, including Cloudflare Picasso-based fingerprinting on the login page).

@Kungergely
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@Kungergely, regarding #2 (comment), you could add the link as a citation somewhere if you don't want to put much effort into it.

#2 (comment):

Check out this @awesome-letters-from-facebook

Wow, this is a pretty nice list actually. Perhaps some of the items from it could be added to en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Facebook#Criticisms_and_controversies somewhere. Although the list is pretty long already, it never hurts to let more people know of what's basically niche stuff affecting mostly developers.

I think that a well-researched description of the whole thing would look a lot better and attract a lot more attention too.

@groovenectar
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and how the fuck public data is Facebook's property?

The data may be displayed publicly but that doesn't mean it's free domain. A general rule to follow is that if it's on their platform, they own it.

This is not a general rule. This is made up and fantasy very far from any kind of rule or reality.

@Kungergely
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This is not a general rule. This is made up and fantasy very far from any kind of rule or reality.

No, it isn't made up. It's definitely THE rule in countries with complete lack of privacy rights like the US and others. In countries which don't allow indiscriminate and limitless data collection by corporations it also means that you can't just go ahead and scrape all the personal data of everyone off of FB et al, even if their data is visible to you (after logging into Facebook), especially if the data is visible only to a limited group of people.

@groovenectar
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This is not a general rule. This is made up and fantasy very far from any kind of rule or reality.

No, it isn't made up.

Yeah well I didn't make this up either: Your fly is open

@groovenectar
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Especially if the data is visible only to a limited group of people.

Are you remotely suggesting that we should pat Facebook on the back for a job-well-done in this context regardless of where they have gotten everyone else but themselves?

@TruncatedDinoSour
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@spookyahell
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There should be proper rules set by the governments in place: Large tech companies should have to provide public APIs that don't have (m)any restrictions.

For a small/low price or... maybe...

Advertise for each user to get an API key of their own and use it as they see fit.

Tell the users they must spend more than half their time in the original app.

Punish users who abuse rules, have a warning system or temporarily disable access to third party use.

I mean — we still don't have an API for Apple Message or any other Apple product, officially.

Individuals shouldn't be forced to work in gray or illegal areas when working for the greater public good of any app or service.

This goes for all private companies using data essentially provided by the collective public.
Or even private companies generating significant amounts of public data.

Like, take Netflix for example. The execs will know what show or movie did the best.
They've killed classic TV a good deal. And other media companies joined in. Quite late.
They waited for the technologies to be better.
Netflix started out with Silverlight... Actually... way before that with a DVD service that recently went defunct. —

And did they give us any real viewership numbers for either of their services?

When there's more than a few million people using your services,
how hard is it to release some data? Like...

  • How many small shows did they make that failed?
  • How many successful big hits have they had?
  • What was the average viewing time for this specific episode X?
  • How many people clicked "Skip intro" on this episode?
  • How many views for episode or movie X?
  • On licensed content: How much invested for licensing rights(*)?

(*) something both studios and Netflix would never want people to know

Also: (Some might know towards what platform this is targeted)
If you have a rating system and you allow for positive ratings. (Heart or such like)
You should be required to allow at least one opportunity to rate negatively or neutral.

The internet used to be fun. A lot of that is now gone. But some of it is still here.

Thanks to the people, btw.

Not the companies hosting the content. - They frequently suck.

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