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#22667 replaced occurrences of master/slave terminology with leader/follower #2692

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merged 1 commit into from May 20, 2014

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@fcurella
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fcurella commented May 20, 2014

The docs and some tests contain references to a master/slave db configuration.
While this terminology has been used for a long time, those terms may carry racially charged meanings to users.
This patch replaces all occurrences of master and slave with 'leader' and 'follower'

alex added a commit that referenced this pull request May 20, 2014
#22667 replaced occurrences of master/slave terminology with leader/follower
@alex alex merged commit 8a95b4f into django:master May 20, 2014
@alex
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alex commented May 20, 2014

Thanks for taking the time to do this!

@punkeel
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punkeel commented May 26, 2014

Are you serious ?
The meaning of a word is defined by its use, by the context.
In this case, master/slave is used by every database server, in every documentation (redis, mysql …)

NB: I don't say I'm against this change. Just that I don't see the point of changing two words with two others just because they have been used somewhere else.
For example, your avatar is red. Red, like communism. You should use a black and white color. Oh no, that's linked to racism too. Well. Let's remove colors, too, then ? ;)

@kamilogorek
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kamilogorek commented May 26, 2014

Is that a real life?

@evildmp
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evildmp commented May 26, 2014

As you can see from beec056 the terminology we have actually used is "primary/replica". So thank you for your interest, but there's nothing to see here and you can move along now.

@jonathan3
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jonathan3 commented May 26, 2014

Before the flood of white male HN dwellers truly kicks off and obliterates all reasonable discussion, I'd like to thank the Django team for taking the time to do this.

@wodim
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wodim commented May 26, 2014

i'm just here for the laughs. is IT becoming too stupid? has science gone too far?

@jleclanche
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jleclanche commented May 26, 2014

Discussion on the ticket: https://code.djangoproject.com/ticket/22667
"Primary" and "Replica" aren't especially bad choices, but they're also wrong. The correct terms are master and slave. They've been used in databases, hardware setups, server setups and god knows what else for god knows how long.

I cannot f_ing believe this PR made it through and was given actual man hours when there are massive outstanding PRs and patches on trac that need real attention. And don't be surprised that this does make it on HN and probably later on the usual slashdot/phoronix and what not. This is stupid *and_ controversial which is exactly what tech media loves.

And to the HN/whatever crowd, don't post stupid memes here. This isn't the place.

Help yourselves and revert this, guys. Django docs, or docs in general are not the place to make up new terms for stuff that already exists.

PS: Quick heads up: This made it to 4chan and various other troll places. Do not be surprised if there's suddenly an influx of .. weird comments.

@jardaroh
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jardaroh commented May 26, 2014

This is silly.
Next we will remove all mention og objects because some people might feel objectified.
Or classes, because of the poor people that feels they are being discriminated against.

Sure, I understand that the use of words can hurt, but words themselves carry no meaning outside of it's use. Saying a car is yellow and calling a person yellow are two very different statements. We seem to have a new round of book burnings going on today...

@Gwildor
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Gwildor commented May 26, 2014

Guys, just ignore this. These are bots who do this automatically for projects, which have been circling around on Github lately. There are also ones about feminism etc. The Linux kernel also had a PR like this a few months ago with a massive amount of responses on it.

Don't feed the trolls, and just continue to use master and slave.

@ajgon
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ajgon commented May 26, 2014

Faith in humanity restored. Thank you guys. I just want to add, that this will also be bad for django itself, since almost every developer who is no aware of this will be confused, and trust me - he will be expecting that this is some bizarre django thing, not the well known pattern. Peace.

@lynncyrin
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lynncyrin commented May 26, 2014

Thanks so much Django for doing this thing! <3

@ghost
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ghost commented May 26, 2014

Good move. Thank you.

@Thesoro
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Thesoro commented May 26, 2014

Excellent stuff. Thanks for doing that.

@lynncyrin
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lynncyrin commented May 26, 2014

I'm very glad for this change because as a PoC I felt very uncomfortable seeing and using this terminology in my code

@Ragzouken
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Ragzouken commented May 26, 2014

glad to see big projects taking this seriously

@kittenpies
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kittenpies commented May 26, 2014

Thanks Django for making this important change to be more welcoming and inclusive to more members of the tech community. <3

@northofnormal
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northofnormal commented May 26, 2014

"they've always been called that" is a dumb reason to keep doing something, especially something that is hurtful or alienating. Kudos to Django for making this change!

@dstaley
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dstaley commented May 26, 2014

The use of the terms master and slave in relation to databases (and hardware configurations) has always made me uncomfortable. I think the terms leader and follower are much more appropriate, and are actually more expressive. ❤️ to the Django team for making this change!

@tingley
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tingley commented May 26, 2014

These terms have been in use forever, but that doesn't make them good. Fixing them has to start somewhere; good for Django for taking the lead.

@copumpkin
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copumpkin commented May 26, 2014

👍

@RobotDisco
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RobotDisco commented May 26, 2014

Wow, this is awesome! Thanks!

@gesa
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gesa commented May 26, 2014

👍
Great job @fcurella, thank you @alex & Django.

@selenamarie
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selenamarie commented May 26, 2014

Thanks @fcurella!

@maban
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maban commented May 26, 2014

Thank you! :)

@joliss
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joliss commented May 26, 2014

Awesome change, thanks @fcurella! "Primary/replica" sounds much better.

@ghost
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ghost commented May 26, 2014

Excellent.

@clundie
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clundie commented May 26, 2014

Good. The old terminology should be made obsolete.

@d1ffuz0r
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d1ffuz0r commented May 29, 2014

@mannol1 >While the terms leader/followers are more politically correct
Absolutely incorrect for Europe. Such double standards

@karlht
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karlht commented May 29, 2014

Thank you to the Django developers -- leader/follower reads with much less baggage attached for me.

@eliziario
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eliziario commented May 29, 2014

I really don't care. Call it sun/earth, smurgasbordnic/flatuvalicxlkt, remove the feature, delete the documentation. I don't care, but please, just stop. All conceivable POVs have already been exposed ad nauseam.

@ghost
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ghost commented May 29, 2014

If only this sort of interest formed around more meaningful issues. Development should be free from political and social obligations and as such this is not much more than an end-user confusing step. On the other hand why not, if it pleases someone - it's just syntax.

@lukecarbis
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lukecarbis commented May 30, 2014

Should I make a PR for this, too? https://github.com/lukecarbis/django/compare/patch-1

@andr0s
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andr0s commented May 30, 2014

Do you guys know why this silly commit got so many negative comments? I
will tell you why.

Because people tired of propaganda. Politicians tell us what we should and
should not do, how we should think about some things and should not. They
promote craziest fanatics on media which claim that, say, "men" sounds
discriminative and should be banned. If you guys are white Americans
(French\Spanish\whoever) then why the f_ck you should be responsible for
what your grand-grand-grand-parents did? Even worse - if your parents moved
to the US after the slavery had been destroyed then why the f_ck you should
feel any kind of blame? You have all just been brainwashed. You are judged
for the crime you did not commit. And the worst thing is that you agreed
with that.

And it all turns into such a stupid thing as this commit.

Do you know who are real slaves now? You. Those who say 'okaaay' when some
sly people tell you what you should think and do.

Don't be sissy, fight for your freedom!

2014-05-30 7:48 GMT+07:00 Luke Carbis notifications@github.com:

Should I make a PR for this?
https://github.com/lukecarbis/django/compare/patch-1

Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub
#2692 (comment).

@isotopp
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isotopp commented May 30, 2014

I think we need to reform Python and its use of WHITEspace. This is all wrong.

@Dundee
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Dundee commented May 30, 2014

I think you should rename Django to something less offensive, because it can reffer to movie "Django Unchained" which contains slaves and violence!

You should take example from http://www.vislab.uq.edu.au/nb/jokes/computers/pc_unix.html and take this seriously.

@MattWindsor91
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MattWindsor91 commented May 30, 2014

I don't see how preferring the original terms is fallacious. In terms of documentation, it is genuinely confusing for documentation users to use terminology different from that which they're used to.

One could argue that some people here have been using the appeal to novelty =p

@haasip-satang
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haasip-satang commented May 30, 2014

Don't you think this also reads a lil funny then: "Let's remove the terminology master and slave and merge our changes into django:M A S T E R" ;) Maybe you should change the branch name too (or is that ok because there are no slave branches ;-P ? )

@canweriotnow
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canweriotnow commented May 30, 2014

Please. It is a valuable contribution.
On May 29, 2014 8:48 PM, "Luke Carbis" notifications@github.com wrote:

Should I make a PR for this?
https://github.com/lukecarbis/django/compare/patch-1


Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub
#2692 (comment).

@lemontooth
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lemontooth commented May 30, 2014

@CaptainHayashi

In terms of documentation, it is genuinely confusing for documentation users to use terminology different from that which they're used to.

Oh come on. How is that going to confuse anyone? People that dense won't make it through the tutorial anyway, let alone using multiple databases. If anything, the change makes the documentation more descriptive. And for "no one will be able to discover this", google "django master slave" and look at the first hit. Just the snippet provides you with enough information. Also this.

@zerkms

to be honest - replica term (from my perspective) means that something is identical to something else.

And that is what it describes, literally, in the context of this change (not accounting for lag/sync problems).

@haasip-satang

"Let's remove the terminology master and slave and merge our changes into django:M A S T E R" ;) Maybe you should change the branch name too (or is that ok because there are no slave branches

How original. But yes, you are correct, this was about the compound "master-slave" only.

@GrueMaster
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GrueMaster commented May 30, 2014

Oddly, the term is used in a lot of industries to describe a controller/dummy relationship. The railroad industry has used them for as long as they used multiple locomotives to move cargo.

If we are going to be eliminating the term Master, what will replace the title of the college degree beyond Bachelor, but before Doctorate? How about the title of a higher ranked chess player or the head of a college?

How about the phrase "he's a slave to his work" often meaning that he lets his work come before his personal life? What about remote control systems? Will we be renaming these communication links too?

And lets not forget the religious implications. People that are devout are considered slaved to their master (God).

Interesting responses on stackoverflow.com regarding this topic. One poster suggests using "pimp/ho".

This entire topic is rubbish, and I find it offensive.

@canweriotnow
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canweriotnow commented May 30, 2014

@GrueMaster

This entire topic is rubbish, and I find it offensive.

👍

@gngeal
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gngeal commented May 30, 2014

It is incredibly US-centric to assume that "master/slave" are "racially charged terms". There have been many societies where slaves and freemen were not separated along racial or ethnic lines, for example, the Roman Empire. Witness the cultural imperialism face of the PC movement at its finest!

@lemontooth
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lemontooth commented May 30, 2014

@GrueMaster:

If we are going to be eliminating the term Master
[yadda yadda about how it is impossible to nuke "master" from the english language]

Fine, but this PR wasn't about any of that. It was very specifically about replacing "master/slave" with "primary/secondary" in the Django documentation on Multiple Databases, terms that are more descriptive and widely used. "Master" is still used in other contexts than database replication in the documentation. Nobody expressed a desire to change the term for higher ranked chess players.

Interesting responses on stackoverflow.com regarding this topic. One poster suggests using "pimp/ho".
This entire topic is rubbish, and I find it offensive.

Yes, very interesting. Thanks for sharing. Much constructive.

@gngeal

Witness the cultural imperialism face of the PC movement at its finest!

Now that is some kind of fresh madness.

@tamamoe
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tamamoe commented May 31, 2014

What's going on here?

@Frogging101
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Frogging101 commented May 31, 2014

Ugh, this is bullshit. Why should anyone give a damn about the terminology? Keep your feels out of computing.

@Frogging101
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Frogging101 commented May 31, 2014

Also, when did the social justice army invade GitHub? Nowhere is safe anymore.

@minexew
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minexew commented May 31, 2014

@Frogging101 Running around the Internet spouting incoherent subjective arguments to make oneself feel beneficial to the society is easier than writing good code.
As if you forgot to realize how stupid the average person is and that half of the population is by definition dumber than that. GitHub has no access barriers, making it very susceptible to attacks from SJW and their sheep. Try the same on LKML and you'll get blown out in minutes.

@wlipa
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wlipa commented May 31, 2014

The true master here is a kind of linguistic puritanism to which, unfortunately, many are slavishly devoted.

@conatus
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conatus commented Jun 1, 2014

👍

@distransient
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distransient commented Jun 2, 2014

Forget all the openly bigoted opinions ITT; this is a great PR!

@Tak
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Tak commented Jun 2, 2014

👍

@6079-Smith-W
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6079-Smith-W commented Jun 2, 2014

"master/slave" is ungood crimethinkful oldspeak. plusgood rectify unword.
Is Minitrue doubleplusgoodwork truthwise. chocorat anyone?

@celber
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celber commented Jun 9, 2014

Hi, i feel personally offended by racist name of this repo while it associates with tragic story of one american slave. I demand changing its name to "My Web Pony".

@django django locked and limited conversation to collaborators Jun 9, 2014
@django django locked and limited conversation to collaborators Jun 9, 2014
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