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Development Meeting (16 June, 2018)

This is the log of Weekly General Development Meeting. It happens every Saturday 4pm UTC in the #development Discord channel.

kubu00 - 06/16/2018
Hi!
limax - 06/16/2018
Hi
EllagramBOT - 06/16/2018
JayGatsbys: Yes
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
@here Dev meeting for this week starts now. :)

One important thing for Community Fund signers: please see @Towd's message on the new outgoing transactions -- either approve them or please voice out if there's something you disagree, or if you think other community members might disagree.
Towd - 06/16/2018
yeah, need 1 more sig to get those transactions approved
Since it is on the agenda, and we need one more signer, I propose we replace CryptoFern with Kubo00 as a signee.  Of all the signee's he has been absent from Discord the longest.  (a little over a month)
DeSVaR - 06/16/2018
I will aprove transaction ASAP... Need to get to PC :frowning:
limax - 06/16/2018
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
@Towd Just want to get everything more clear: how was it determined if some member's absent?
Towd - 06/16/2018
For everyone who signed.  As soon as we get these transactions approved, I'll verify Terra has received the 100 coins then put in an additional transaction for 2041 coins.  This covers his expenses for the Spring Giveaway and in addition will reserve an additional 10 T-shirts and 10 bumper stickers for future giveaways.  Please discuss if you have any questions.
@ellaismer I'm only going by posting activity on Discord.
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
Okay got it.
Towd - 06/16/2018
If we want to use a different method, I'm open.  That's just what I'm using as a rough gauge of community activity.  Not suggesting CryptoFern has permanently left the community.
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
Personally I don't have any preference whether we replace @CryptoFern with @kubu00, or just adding a new signing slot.
Also just wonder whether @CryptoFern happened to be here today.
And I added a new role @Community Fund Signers. Everyone can directly ping this role if there's something you want to mention to signers.
limax - 06/16/2018
If we do some administrative tasks I propose to get discord user groups back
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
@limax What's discord user groups? Do you need any help from my side for that?
limax - 06/16/2018
Is about keeping user list in separated groups like Developers, Bots, Moderators
I know the idea that all users are equal but is not an equality thing, is just to get organized(edited)
We have now a lot of colours on user list without anything to specify the role
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
@limax Just trying to understand: what are the benefits in keeping that list "organized"? I think if users need help from developers or moderators, they can directly ping them @Moderators / @Developers?
Another thing to note is that our developer role is anyone-can-join.

Personally I still think getting the user list back may not be a good idea. That's one particular thing I think caused the split of the old community (FYI, if anyone's still looking for what happened. https://ellaism.org/2018/03/14/post-conflict-debriefing/).
limax - 06/16/2018
Yes, that free to join role is kind of "let get a colour and feel special"
And I think this should be reviewed
But I understand your point, maybe we are not ready yet to assign roles just on activity basis
DeSVaR - 06/16/2018
Developer role should not be handed easily as just typing !join command. Or at least make new group called Ellaism developers
A lot of bad things can come from current system if someone decides to exploit it
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
It's from https://github.com/ellaism/meta/blob/master/github.md
We're still assuming good will for all our active members, at least for now.
GitHub
ellaism/meta
meta - Ellaism Project Management
limax - 06/16/2018
It was just an idea. Call this a bad idea for now
I just feel that people like @kubu00 and @Nulligun deserve more recognition on the developer role based on their activity in the last weeks
DeSVaR - 06/16/2018
Quote from a book I read long ago:

to ASSUME, makes an ASS of yoU and ME
(No bad feelings @ellaismer )
I am for idea that at least developer role is not handed easily
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
@limax @DeSVaR We've had many developers come and go, but most of them at least contributed a small amount.
I think part of this why we can get those contributions is that we give recognitions early.

How about let's start with something less controversial? We can list our current active (core) developers like @kubu00 @Nulligun in #welcome, and in our website team page.
limax - 06/16/2018
@ellaismer No intention from my side to generate any dispute
DeSVaR - 06/16/2018
Same here
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
No, not at all. I totally understand what you meant -- we've indeed need some more "recognition levels" and we indeed lack a team page for our website.
Towd - 06/16/2018
Yes, I'm for inclusiveness and making it easy for people to get involved and feel rewarded for any efforts they put forth.
limax - 06/16/2018
I didn't follow this week too much the activity here (sorry), but do we have any progress on the new website?
We can prepare the team page for that
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
I'm also going to prepare a really simple text-based one tomorrow, using our current template. Just moving this forward.
And I think we should also put our core community members onto the team page, right?

* @Towd: Leading our current marketing efforts, and helping to manage the Twitter accounts.
* @limax: Leading the August hard-fork communications.
* @DeSVaR: Leading the exchange listing effort.

Anyone else we should include in the team page as core community members?
limax - 06/16/2018
I think for most visitors developers will be the real interest
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
Yeah, right.
limax - 06/16/2018
BTW, @Nulligun @kubu00 can you tell us about your current projects? I think here is the place to get everyone know about that
Nulligun - 06/16/2018
iOS Wallet is ready for testing.  As soon as I convert my developer account into an organization apple will approve it for testing so @DeSVaR  can see it.   I bought an android phone today and I'm thinking of forking https://github.com/manuelsc/Lunary-Ethereum-Wallet to put it on Ellaism network.    The open source version of Trust Wallet for Android is a much older version without a Dapp browser.  And since there's no Dapp browser Lunary looks a bit more polished and it's got a couple nice features.
GitHub
manuelsc/Lunary-Ethereum-Wallet
Lunary-Ethereum-Wallet - A beautiful, secure and native Ethereum Wallet for Android
I think the built in Dapp browser in the iOS version will be a really nice feature though :smiley:
limax - 06/16/2018
You'll make Jay happy.
Nulligun - 06/16/2018
It's $10 a month cheaper than my iPhone so i'm already happy(edited)
EllagramBOT - 06/16/2018
JayGatsbys (in reply to @limax):
:sweat_smile:
JayGatsbys: Im so happy
limax - 06/16/2018
@ellaismer should we change the "WebWallet" link on website to a drop-down list? (Jay always ask for that but not on dev meeting :smile: )
EllagramBOT - 06/16/2018
JayGatsbys: :joy:
JayGatsbys: Yes
JayGatsbys: But Ellaismer would change things when he would be near a pc he said
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
Ah yeah.
Nulligun - 06/16/2018
Oh also, I was going to relocate the wiki to different part of the world since @Afex  can't access it from Russia without being on a vpn.
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
Will get this done by tomorrow.
Nulligun - 06/16/2018
but ill make sure he can access the new one before sending new ip to @ellaismer  for dns change
EllagramBOT - 06/16/2018
JayGatsbys: Cool
limax - 06/16/2018
Yeah that ip ban is really a bad thing
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
@here And just to be clear for everyone:
If you want to get listed as "Core Developer" or "Core Community Member", please feel free to ask at any dev meetings!
(And our "developers" / "working group members" roles remain anyone-can join.)
EllagramBOT - 06/16/2018
JayGatsbys: :thinking:
kubu00 - 06/16/2018
I have a piece of my own bot tip code written in python / django. I mainly wanted to use db models from django in my discord bot. - I already have the core of the bot in django. I was most concerned about this because if needed I can add async task to bot using celery and redis and I can easily use db models. we will deal with bot's web interface later (if needed). yesterday I mentioned that I already have a piece of tip bot (registration wallet address for the user discord, checking account balance.) I'm doing "create a transaction" but I do not know where we will go when it comes to transfer ella to tipbot.
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
@kubu00 Just give me a few days, I'll get the contracts ready.
In that case you would only need to manage one private key, and always sending transactions using a single address.
And @here I think we would need to discuss whether (and how) we would want to get @kubu00 to be a community fund signer.
limax - 06/16/2018
I think he deserve the role
And for all signers I hope to realise this is seriuos work not a "special rank" and a signer should be here when is needed
DeSVaR - 06/16/2018
@Community Fund Signers :point_up_2:
Towd - 06/16/2018
We need @kubu00 to set up an address for signing the wallet.  Then we can replace one of the signers with him.  I think Cryptofern is our best option with the addres 0x0B51933c62592c46995d0E01E58cE4571Ab2A05B.
He's owner 9 on the wallet.
psdev - 06/16/2018
+1 for adding a new signer, rather than replacing(edited)
how important is it to keep the total number as-is?
Towd - 06/16/2018
The original idea was for tie-breaking on votes.  So, we're currently running with 11 signers with 6 to approve a transaction.
That was from the suggestion of others when we were setting it up.  I'm not committed to that system if we want to go to 12 signers and 6 to approve funds.
I have nothing against Cryptofern and do not think he is a bad actor.  I just want to keep things tidy and the signers in my opinion should be active community members.
psdev - 06/16/2018
if we want to add 2 and don't have a second person lined up yet, i vote Towd holds the second address until it can be given to someone else later
just throwing out ideas
limax - 06/16/2018
Let just add a new signer for now and see how this will work.
Towd - 06/16/2018
If Cryptofern was to become active again, we have his information and could reinstate him as a signer to replace another member who becomes innactive.
I'm a little hesitant to just grow the list as we need more signers.
In my opinion pruning is important.
limax - 06/16/2018
@Towd I agree with pruning
psdev - 06/16/2018
sounds good
limax - 06/16/2018
Is important for the entire project. And if we talk about activity Fern is missing from another important role, Moderators
Towd - 06/16/2018
Yeah, I know it kind of sounds like I'm targeting Cryptofern who I have nothing against.  :smile:  I think he is a trusted actor.  I'm just trying to keep our list of signees tidy.  :smile:
If it is decided, then I just need an address from @Kubo00 and then I'll put the transaction up on the community wallet to insert him as Owner 9.
DeSVaR - 06/16/2018
Limax mentioned moderators role which remembered me, I am proposing that we add @Nulligun and/or @kubu00 to Moderators role if they want it, because they are active
limax - 06/16/2018
I was just writing almost the same message
plus @Towd
DeSVaR - 06/16/2018
Oh, sorry i forgot about you @Towd :smiley:
kubu00 - 06/16/2018
I want to go back to the tip bot. I am writing a longer statement :yum:
ipsec - 06/16/2018
Yeah kubu is verr cool guy:)
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
Moderator is a hard job -- we need to constantly watch the server and delete any spam messages. Plus it's not really an recognition role. :laughing: 
So let's ask @Towd @kubu00 @Nulligun first. Only if they want to become moderators and then we discuss that.(edited)
And our draft code of conduct, just FYI: https://github.com/ellaism/meta/blob/master/conduct.md
GitHub
ellaism/meta
meta - Ellaism Project Management
ipsec - 06/16/2018
Guys who want to buy honey? :)
For ELLA ofc:)
DeSVaR - 06/16/2018
@ellaismer I propose we add to code of conduct that spamming discord links leads to insta ban. I feel bad for doing this, without community consent(edited)
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
Yeah sure, if that's something we agree. :smiley:
ipsec - 06/16/2018
Happy bee association :)
Bzz
DeSVaR - 06/16/2018
@ipsec please, dont when is developer meeting -for the sake of logs
Edit: use other channel :blush:(edited)
Towd - 06/16/2018
I think that's everything on the agenda unless @Nulligun had anything else to discuss regarding the mobile wallet.
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
And @kubu00 you said there's something you want to say about the tip bot?
limax - 06/16/2018
And "Please update your nodes" from me :rofl:
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
Dev Pool has finished the update today. :smiley:
limax - 06/16/2018
I can confirm that :smile:
6 more weeks to go. @ellaismer do we need other preparations ? (except exchanges and pools/nodes)
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
If pool and exchange nodes are updated, the network will update smoothly. So that's basically what we need for the network upgrade.
But there are indeed other non-essential things to be done, like the wasm development framework, etc.
kubu00 - 06/16/2018
yesterday @JayGatsbys sent me a github link to the tip bot used in redcoin + telegram.
I analyzed the code.
available commands:
"/ hi, / commands, / deposit, / tip, / withdraw, / price, / marketcap or / balance") "
particular attention I returned to / deposit / tip / withdraw / balance
unfortunately in the case of a redcoin tip. all work (dirty work) performs: "/ usr / local / bin / reddcoind"

/ deposit - causes wallet address to be generated locally (or address to contract?) to which the user's telegram can transfer coins. (except telegram - local wallet, web wallet, etc.)
after charging the tip address, you can make deposits for other users who have generated addresses / contracts for telegram user.
if someone wants to withdraw funds from the tip address / contract then use / withdraw + external redcoin address.

that's all. here python is used only to perform local commands on the server(edited)
Do we want to do it in a similar way?
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
@kubu00 Using the contracts it works something like this:

* You create an address A for a user, by calling a specific method on the contract.
* Your bot calls a method on address A to freeze a withdraw address. This address cannot be changed. If users want to change that, they're simply asked to get a new address.
* The user sends non-zero-value transaction to that address to deposit funds.
* The user sends zero-value transaction to that address to withdraw all funds.
* Your bot calls a method on address A to withdraw partial fund.
* To send tips to others, your bot calls a method on address A to another tipping address.

The bot is "delegated" by Community Fund, meaning that if it misbehaves (like if the private key is hacked or something), the community fund has a short window to change the delegation to prevent too much damage.
And if you know nodejs, it would be much easier to get the bot (because web3.js currently has the best contract ABI support).
kubu00 - 06/16/2018
I use web3.py it's practically the same as web3.js
kubu00 - 06/16/2018
https://github.com/ethereum/web3.py(edited)
ellaismer - 06/16/2018
Ah cool! Yeah that also works!
@here Do we have anything else for the dev meeting? Otherwise let's close it. It has been running it for 2 hours. :laughing:
!rsvp set-date 23 June