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Adding rendering for public_transport=platform [WIP] #3232

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@kocio-pl
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kocio-pl commented May 13, 2018

Fixes #435

Changes proposed in this pull request:

  • Adding rendering for public_transport=platform

Initial code renders public_transport=platform+bus=yes the same as highway_bus_stop. It should be decided how to render platforms for multiple types of transport - for example bus+tram.

@pnorman

This review is on the technical aspects of the PR.

I'm not a particular fan of public_transport=platform and don't want to do something that would encourage people to use it over the established tagging.

'power_' || CASE WHEN power IN ('generator') THEN power ELSE NULL END,
'tourism_' || CASE WHEN tourism IN ('viewpoint') THEN tourism ELSE NULL END
) AS feature,
access,
religion,
tags->'denomination' as denomination,
tags->'generator:source' as "generator:source",
tags->'bus' as bus,

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@pnorman

pnorman May 13, 2018

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Does this blow up the XML with a combinatorial explosion?

@@ -1663,6 +1666,8 @@ Layer:
OR tags->'memorial' IN ('plaque')
OR military IN ('bunker')
OR highway IN ('bus_stop', 'elevator', 'traffic_signals')
OR tags->'public_transport' IN ('platform')
OR tags->'bus' IN ('yes')

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@pnorman

pnorman May 13, 2018

Collaborator

Not needed, we don't render bus=yes without public_transport=platform

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@kocio-pl

kocio-pl May 14, 2018

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What would you propose to do instead?

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@pnorman

pnorman May 28, 2018

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Remove the line. You could further restrict the public_transport condition to only get those with bus=yes, but that makes no difference to the rendering

@@ -1795,6 +1803,8 @@ Layer:
OR military IN ('bunker')
OR tags @> 'emergency=>phone'
OR highway IN ('bus_stop', 'elevator', 'traffic_signals')
OR tags->'public_transport' IN ('platform')
OR tags->'bus' IN ('yes')

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@pnorman

pnorman May 13, 2018

Collaborator

as above

@@ -1764,6 +1770,8 @@ Layer:
tags->'tower:construction' as "tower:construction",
tags->'tower:type' as "tower:type",
tags->'castle_type' as castle_type,
tags->'public_transport' as public_transport,
tags->'bus' as bus,

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@pnorman

pnorman May 13, 2018

Collaborator

as above

@@ -2416,6 +2435,8 @@ Layer:
OR historic IN ('memorial', 'monument', 'archaeological_site', 'wayside_cross', 'fort', 'wayside_shrine', 'castle', 'manor')
OR tags->'memorial' IN ('plaque')
OR highway IN ('bus_stop', 'services', 'rest_area', 'elevator')
OR tags->'public_transport' IN ('platform')
OR tags->'bus' IN ('yes')

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@pnorman

pnorman May 13, 2018

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as above

@kocio-pl

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kocio-pl commented May 13, 2018

Public transport is mature, more flexible and more coherent standard, so it's a good example to talk about handling such cases. Some are less obvious, like amenity=social_facility, which covers some other amenity schemes, some are similar, like healthcare=* (see #2938).

@kocio-pl

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kocio-pl commented May 13, 2018

General chart to show the comparison of the old and new scheme - it's not accurate, since only ~500k of the new one is combined with bus=yes, yet this is good illustration of the problem:

taghistory 20

So the old one is clear winner, however both numbers are very high and the ratio is just 4:1 (the same order of magnitude).

The question is when should we change rendering? When ratio will be 1:1? How should we avoid fragmentation - when the new scheme will have n+1 uses should we drop n uses of the old one? If not - how long should we keep both? And when we could start showing the new one if both could be rendered?

@dieterdreist

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dieterdreist commented May 13, 2018

@sommerluk

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sommerluk commented May 13, 2018

By the way: Is it intentional that we render currently highway=bus_stop on areas? The wiki describes it as only for nodes (at difference from public_transport=platform, which is not only for nodes). Following taginfo, for highway=bus_stop we have 2 046 215 nodes and only 6 053 ways.

@dieterdreist

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dieterdreist commented May 13, 2018

@sommerluk

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sommerluk commented May 13, 2018

IMHO the wiki might be wrong.

Given that also the wiki describes describes it also as “Its position may be marked by a shelter, pole, bus lay-by, or road markings.” at least for bus lay-by and shelter, using an area sounds reasonable.

@geozeisig

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geozeisig commented May 13, 2018

I think that also fits on this topic: why do we render highway=platform? The Wiki has no status and at the top you can read: This feature has been replaced by public_transport=platform. The behavior causes this tag to be used as a replacement.

@kocio-pl

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kocio-pl commented Jun 19, 2018

Looks like the revolution is long over and public_transport=platform won both on wiki and by numbers, so I think we could remove highway=platform soon (after announcing and discussing on Tagging list, of course):

taghistory 21

@PolyglotOpenstreetmap

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PolyglotOpenstreetmap commented Jun 19, 2018

@dieterdreist expecting people to map according to the "new" scheme exclusively without their stops getting renderd is ludicrous. I've tried that many many years ago, then resorted to double tagging the whole lot. In the present, I don't really care anymore. The point has become moot. We tag highway=bus_stop to get them rendered and p_t=platform/stop_position to please those who like the new scheme.

@Marc-marc-marc

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Marc-marc-marc commented Jun 19, 2018

for info the supremacy of public_transport=platform over highway=platform is even clearer if we take into account the duplicate tag
900k for public_transport=platform without (highway=platform or railway=platform)
84k highway=platform + public_transport=platform
only 9k highway=platform without public_transport=platform

@BjornRasmussen

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BjornRasmussen commented Aug 11, 2018

I see no reason why the new public_transport=platform should not be rendered. Not rendering it is causing a large amount of bus stops to have both public_transport=platform and highway=bus_stop, which should not be necessary.

@BjornRasmussen

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BjornRasmussen commented Aug 26, 2018

The point of not rendering public_transport=platform was to stop people from using the new system. This is not working, however, and the result is just redundant tags on all bus stops. This should be merged.

@AgusQui

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AgusQui commented Oct 12, 2018

Many we use highway=platform to represent the physical platform, and highway=bus_stop for the point of that platform where the bus stops, this is an example of platform with several stops inside https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/114037316#map=19/-34.60004/-58.38183, how do you propose to differentiate this if highway=bus_stop and highway=platform becomes the same as public_transport=platform?

@SilentSpike

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SilentSpike commented Oct 13, 2018

Many we use highway=platform to represent the physical platform, and highway=bus_stop for the point of that platform where the bus stops, this is an example of platform with several stops inside https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/114037316#map=19/-34.60004/-58.38183, how do you propose to differentiate this if highway=bus_stop and highway=platform becomes the same as public_transport=platform?

As far as I know PTv2 has appropriate tags for both of these cases:
public_transport=platform
public_transport=stop_position

Edit: Sorry, I see what you're saying in regards to differentiating the rendering, forgot I was reading the carto issues. However, wouldn't this be an uncommon use of highway=bus_stop and therefore shouldn't really be considered for the purposes of rendering decisions?

@AgusQui

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AgusQui commented Oct 13, 2018

@AgusQui

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AgusQui commented Oct 13, 2018

Edit: Sorry, I see what you're saying in regards to differentiating the rendering, forgot I was reading the carto issues.

Of course, how do you think representing physical platforms? Now they have a gray color like the train platforms, while highway=bus_stop has the symbol of a blue bus, are now both a blue bus?

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