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Sort out non-English lang versions #88

Closed
necolas opened this Issue · 14 comments

8 participants

@necolas
Owner

Most of them are hugely out of date and we don't have the resources to maintain them.

We need to do one of these ASAP:

  1. Remove the non-en versions and redirect their URLs to the main site. People can rely on Google Translate. We can tidy up any language patterns that are a problem for Google translate.

  2. Paul mentioned some other alternative using the Google Translate API or something.

Either way, there have been quite a few tweets about the spanish version (which is still showing 1.0 and has broken download links). So this current state of affairs isn't good.

Related #77

@paulirish
Owner

There is a google translator widget in limited release.

You can see it at the bottom of html5please.com , the top of http://www.oregon.gov/ , http://www.sierratradingpost.com/?showlocalization=True and somewhere on http://www.w3schools.com/ (i hear.)

Basically I believe I'll have to do the configuration as it seems to be Googlers only.

also cc @alrra

@paulirish
Owner

here is visitors by configured browser language

here is visitors by localized site

@nimbupani
Owner

FWIW it is no longer in HTML5 Please :)) In any case, I think it made sense at one time to have multiple languages but I think the #1 would be a better solution. Maintaining language strings unfortunately is still a nightmare.

@alrra
Owner

Remove the non-English versions and redirect their URLs to the main site

+1 on that

People can rely on Google Translate. We can tidy up any language patterns that are a problem for Google translate.
Paul mentioned some other alternative using the Google Translate API or something.

Personally I'm not fond of using any machine translation services (at this moment at least). I find it irritating when sites offer me an automatically translated page, so -1 on that and also -1 or putting any widgets into the page, mostly because the translation resulted from using them can be more the confusing or misleading :(

@drublic
Owner

Tonight I asked on Twitter if someone from the german community wants to help me translating the current page. There were some people responding.
Sadly I haven't recognized this issue. Which is my fault, as I should have checked it.

From the stats we can see that there is a German community using the site. I think it's possible to keep up the maintained sites (which is in fact only one, atm), and remove the others. If there are people who try to maintain the page I don't think it's perfect to shut it down, even if I think nearly everyone using HTML5 Boilerplate speaks english.

I think we don't need to do anything tomorrow if we don't have a decision yet.
So if anyone thinks it's a good idea to keep the maintained pages up, let me know. Otherwise I'll cancel the thing for tomorrow :)

Thanks to @alrra for pointing me here.

@shichuan

I think if we are switching to Google Translate by default, we should still offer a link for the archived human translation; vice versa, if we use human translation by default, there should be an option to view Google translated version.

So it's kind of like a A/B testing, from here, in a few months, we can have a better idea on which version most people prefer.
And also it serves the purpose that we honor translators' effort.

@necolas
Owner

Personally I'm not fond of using any machine translation services

But since you were +1 on removing the non-English versions, those people who need translations are going to have to rely on machine translations in some form. I'm not in favour of doing anything explicit.

@distilledhype

Howdy, heavy h5bp-fan and user from the first day out of the DE. I'd like to help. I think it would be sad to have the lingo-pages gone. As @drublic already said, we'd be able to maintain the DE version of the page. Since it is the second most trafficed one it would make sense no?

I guess it would take one person per lingo to be assigned as the "official" manager for that lingo-page, she should feel responsible for the updates to be made and manage the translation team.
Maybe they could wear a sick H5BP Translation Cartel badge everyday and everywhere to let the world know they need to bow in fear in front of thy H5BP TRANSLATION CARTEL.

I am kidding about the badge.

How is the decision to shut down the pages going to be made?

Also maybe the lang-versions of the page should just get the en-version after an update until translated so that at least it is up to date. Wrong links and outdated info is worse than having a lang-page in english temporarily no?

Actually wrong links and outdated info is like waaaaaaay more worse...maybe a trillion times.

Anyway if the lingo-pages get shut down. I heard some rumour about the documentation that needs to be kept up to date.

I'd be glad to help out there too. Anybody who can point me to the right directions here? :)

@distilledhype

Ah yes and machine translation: -1. The translations coming out of that are absolutely ridiculous and I doubt it will really help people with something technical like the h5bp. It just makes you look careless and maybe even stupid. Trust me its not a good look. I think it is better to only have an english page than have machine translated version.

If it is used there should be a big fat warning on top of the page that informs the user that this page has been translated by a machine and therefore most likely will be useless.

@necolas
Owner

Actually wrong links and outdated info is like waaaaaaay more worse...maybe a trillion times.

Which is why we really need to remove the translated versions. Even the German one is completely out of sync - some of the content and the footer haven't been changed for at least 18 months by the look of it. Putting one person in charge is unlikely to work because the original translators haven't maintained their translations before; it's unlikely to work in the future either.

The machine translation is not going to happen. My intention was always to leave the english version as the default and allow people to choose for themselves whether to use something like Google Translate to get the gist of things if they cannot read english at all.

@distilledhype

Which is why we really need to remove the translated versions. Even the German one is completely out of sync - some of the content and the footer haven't been changed for at least 18 months by the look of it. Putting one person in charge is unlikely to work because the original translators haven't maintained their translations before; it's unlikely to work in the future either.

Yeah, I get that. Concerning the Germany version I would have full confidence that @drublic and crew could handle it though. We are currently maintaining another site in two languages aswell.
But at the end of the day the most important thing is that the info is up to date on all versions and if that can only be guaranteed by killing them off, I guess it has to happen.

The machine translation is not going to happen.

That's good.

@alrra alrra referenced this issue
Merged

Ptbr3.0 #89

@marcoscoelho

I am in favor of offering only the languages ​​that are updated. so to keep them updated is important invite the users to be translators, sometimes a new version of boilerplate goes unnoticed and the translator is not aware of the work to be done, although he can help, as in my case. I am against automated translation, but to the pages of outdated language can be a much better solution than offer old contents and broken links.

@necolas
Owner

Going to need all *.html5boilerplate.com language subdomains to redirect to html5boilerplate.com

@paulirish paulirish was assigned
@alrra
Owner

All language subdomains now redirect to html5boilerplate.com.

@alrra alrra closed this
@alrra alrra referenced this issue in h5bp/html5-boilerplate
Closed

Possible Translations? #1509

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