Seele - Due diligence #58
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please update: Wei Bi mentioned Seele Tech in linkedin |
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https://seele.pro/index/statement.html?lang=en-us |
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As UCL staff, I have to tell everyone that: Donald Lawrence is just a visiting professor in UCL. He only have a Bsc degree, and he is under UCL investigation right now. His bank experiences are totally not true. He is not Dean of Alan Turing Institution, he is not the professor in Blockchain. He doesn't even know the concept of bitcoin. He claims he do trading, but he doesn't know what is order book. Also, according to the news https://news.bitcoin.com/seele-ico-sets-emergency-response-team-1-8m-fraud/ , this Seele project is SCAM. The team create a set of fake profile. |
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Thanks for the info Evidence-Chain! |
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evidence-chain, the last point of your analysis seems a little inaccurate. How do you know that the scammers had an agreement with the team? It appears the scammers social engineered their way into the circle of telegram admins. Could you please clarify where it was claimed that Donald Lawrence is the Dean of the Alan Turing Institute? This info was never in their website, I've also just checked the Wayback Machine. I found this page for Lawrence on the UCL website http://blockchain.cs.ucl.ac.uk/donald-lawrence/ They have made one change to their team page however. Gong Hui was listed as "Dr. Gong Hui" in the beginning and they have since removed his title and lowered his position in the page. It was always pretty obvious from his Linkedin profile that he was a PhD candidate and not doctor yet. Regarding the other claims on his wesite being false, that is certainly more concerning. Could you add some more evidence? |
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Nick Smith's LinkedIn is no longer working... |
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YEs confirm NIck SMith linkedin is off again |
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Nick Smith's Linkedin works just fine for me |
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@lisaal Hi, Thanks for your reply! In terms of the first question. There is a similar problem happened on last year. Some Chinese entrepreneurs sent email to deans of ATI and senior managing team in UCL about Donald Lawrence use fake background to cheat money. However, there is not any follow-up from university side. I had two screenshots from one of UCL managing team members.
This is very similar, we believe, Donald Lawrence and Hui Gong do the same thing again. Donald Lawrence listed him as a professor in UCL in Chinese version. You can see the screenshot here: In terms of the "dean of ATI", this information is revealed in a Chinese Weibo (https://weibo.com/3937289658), there are a lot of UCL students are complaining about Donald Lawrence and Hui Gong, and they already collected many evidences. Donald Lawrence is currently under UCL investigation. I think some days later, there will be some announcements. For Hui Gong, in one of his ICOs (Themis), he also mentioned him as Oxford University postdoc and UCL CBT researcher. However, you cannot find any information from UCL and Oxford officially.
BTW, Danish A.Alvi in Themis ICO is a 3rd year undergraduate student in CS. How can he be a senior expert in UCL Centre for Blockchain Technologies (CBT)! |
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Just got off the phone with UCL CBT. They're not partners and are very concerned. DYOR, but I'm out! |
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@Pzipzi |
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I suggest the people who is doubt about the information can email head of ucl cs department, head of ucl CBT blockchain center: j.shawe-taylor@ucl.ac.uk |
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The google drive URL was already present in the homepage's source code. What it means is that anyone could already access the drive url long before the start. |
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Thank you @evidence-chain, that is something to certainly consider. I have dropped a line to UCL CBT myself, and will update here if they reply. Am I right in assuming that you are the claimant and the author of the email that you posted? The level of English and the style appear to be the same in your posts and in the email. If that is the case, perhaps you could explain what happened with Mr. Lawrence in more detail. |
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@shideneyu the fact that they have chosen to use a Google form for the whitelist is indeed disappointing |
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@evidence-chain Thanks for the info. I personally think that university partnerships are mostly not 'proper' ones, but rather mentioned because they have the professors in the team or advisors that are teaching there (or somehow connected to them) - which is quite misleading. Looking just at the blockchain/IT specialists the team looks really solid, which is (and should) be the most important factor in what they are aiming to achieve. Given that Hui Gong looked suspicious and full of himself the first time I checked Seele, I am really not surprised seeing he presented himself as a post-doc already. Putting him and Prof. Lawrence aside, as I said before, the team looks really solid overall. On the other hand, they tried to use GoogleDocs for KYC yesterday, which apparently has a limit of 200 people filling a spreadsheet. This really makes their competency questionable. |
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@shideneyu They are delaying the whitelist because of these problems
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This guy is very mysterious...why digital currency expert, better ICO expert. :-)
the most of this registered sites are blank...
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something goes wrong here...maybe the parnter are going abrupt away. Why this? We started with 10!! |
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Just as I thought. REBECCA is the key to this whole thing. She gave every admin the instructions to tell people to message Seelesupport. |
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@nihao69 1 is much less than 8! |
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It is still there actually. We'll see where this goes lol |
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@evidence-chain is entirely right when he mentioned that my modest credentials have been falsely inflated without my consent (and I had been writing numerous times to Themis Network to at least correct my credentials if they won't remove it despite my continuous insistence). It is absolutely true that I am ONLY a BSc Computer Science at University College London, and NOT a 'senior expert' by any means. I had only helped the CBT organise a few events (not any official association and employment), and that is where I was introduced to Hugo. I was persuaded by the Themis team to give their project a positive review, and wish them the best in their venture, however I have absolutely no association with their team, other than giving them a positive review on persuasion. |
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@evidence-chain I received your reply. Can you please email me at leonelas1989@outlook.com. Thank you. |
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@evidence-chain people that have been investigating this have been tracking that address. They have sent ETH to multiple ICO's . please email me. |
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@evidence-chain you can also message me on telegram. @leonelas . Your help would be amazing. thanks |
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@DanishAmjadAlvi I suggest you can make a formal complaint to UCL. |
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@evidence-chain "This is one [ETH address] of Hui Gong's ETH wallet address (from his personal website)" |
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is it just me or does anyone else also get the feeling that some individuals here are really reaching in their efforts to show seele as a scam? |
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@voldemarz Just because the information is still under investigation. Our team members decide to delete it. |
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Agreed @apchir . Although I will not participate in the ico, the tone of the comments on this page has long started to be petty, personal and bordering on ridiculous. |
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@lisaal What is ridiculous is that Seele claimed to have an agreement with UCL Blockchain Centre, proven to be false. Claimed that Seele co-founder Hui Gong has a PhD and is Dr Hui Gong, also proven false. In fact, nothing that has been said has been disproved. That a former graduate came on here and stated unequivocally that another member of Seele used his research. Your statements are not helpful and just sounds like you are part of Seele. It sounds like you are discouraging others from reporting their experiences that could be pertinent to the us potentially investing in Seele. |
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@Jingguo100 Where was the UCL-CBT agreement proven to be wrong? They never replied on Twitter to Seele (see post of zakharaya). As for Seele claiming Hui Gong has a PhD, they explicitly do not in recent communications: https://twitter.com/SeeleTech/status/968793680973766656 "Dr. Bi Wei and Gong Hui attended...". I also want to see the FUD cleared. Especially the Telegram scam is shady. Hui Gong is shady. Donald Lawrence is shady. Hope that the bounty hunt is not a farce. The benebit scam shows that it is possible to track down scammers. |
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Yea i'm SO part of Seele @Jingguo100. I am so part of it that I stated very clearly that I am not interested in their ico. But that does not take away the fact that it has been evident for a while to anyone who has a pair of eyes that some people here seem to be moved solely by pettiness and are attempting to smear the personal reputation of some individuals -with whom they evidently have some beef- rather than just warn investors of potential issues with the Seele project. There was literally a post here, then deleted -cause you guys keep posting stuff and then delete it- that said something along the lines of "I hope Hui Gong will finally be fired from UCL". I should have taken a screenshot. That was surprisingly personal, and that was the moment I decided that what is being said here is not worthy of any consideration. Not that it matters though, cause I had long crossed out Seele off my list anyway. But you are making yourself ridiculous in the eyes of the readers, just so you know. |
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My spider sense is tingling when I read the Seele white paper. They claim to have developed a consensus algo (Ch 4) that is far superior to state-of-the-art. They describe the expected attributes but they completely fail to describe the actual algorithm. Sentences such as "Parallel consensus will be to improve the operating efficiency of asynchronous They also demonstrate a lack of basic knowledge of TCP/IP it seems. They propose to rewrite their own transport protocol. Without understanding their reasoning I am sure TCP will not be the limiting factor to their success. I could go on and on. Some of it could be a translation issue. Some of it can be clear ideas that are poorly communicated. However I get the feeling that there is no solid technical substance to this. Just my opinion, form your own and invest with care. |
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It is super ridiculous that, even though there are so many Seele frauds, a few people in this channel still try to protect and defend for Seele. I notice that they are not regular contributors or seem to have some selfish interest. Let us run through the facts of the Seele:
It looks like those people who are trying to re-direct the topic of discussion here. Making complaint on the individuals/organisations, who spent tons of time on investigation. They just saw investigators deleted the post, they ignored their partners also deleted the post. They are lenient with themselves only! |
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We should just follow the money and ask the ICOs where the ETH goes to to cooperate. The addresses that the scammer transferred money to have to either be his or from people who have more information on him. |
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