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added links to the new build list #6

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ivanov commented Feb 23, 2012

As discussed on the mailing list - here are changes which include links to the new build mailing list which will be auto-populated by our CI server

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takluyver commented Feb 23, 2012

Thanks, Paul. I think we'll leave merging this until we know it's working.

If no-one breaks the build, I'll use a test branch in the next couple of days to run a broken build.

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fperez commented Feb 23, 2012

Great @takluyver, I'll leave this one in your hands since you're keeping track of the SP setup. Thanks to both!

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takluyver commented Feb 26, 2012

OK, I've got the address whitelisted, so we'll get emails when the tests fail.

I don't think this list needs space in the sidebar, though - it's only really useful for core developers. Interested users have already got a link to the ShiningPanda web interface.

That developer info page is on the wiki now, but I think it should be kept for the most important information new developers need - where to get the code, how to run the tests, and so on. I think we should note this list somewhere in the developer docs, and on ShiningPanda itself, and leave it at that.

As such, I'm going to close this PR - I don't think the list needs to be mentioned on the main website. Reopen if you want to convince me otherwise ;-)

@takluyver takluyver closed this Feb 26, 2012

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ivanov commented Feb 28, 2012

As such, I'm going to close this PR - I don't think the list
needs to be mentioned on the main website. Reopen if you want
to convince me otherwise ;-)

I somewhat disagree, because I just feel like this is an
opportunity to provide yet another entry point into developing
for ipython - why would we want to limit it to core developers
only? We want as many eyes as possible on these test failures,
and as quickly as possible, so as to increase the bus factor and
potentially lighten the load from the core handful of developers.

The existence of this list is itself a statement about the
maturity of both IPython and the development process - why would
we not want to advertise it widely?

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ivanov commented Feb 28, 2012

(I don't have permission to reopen this, but would like you to reconsider)

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takluyver commented Feb 28, 2012

I'm open to reconsidering, but I'm not convinced.

I think the home page is beginning to look quite cluttered - I count 16 links in the sidebar, and I feel we need quite a strong justification to add more. Showing too many links is distracting and confusing. You need to be fairly committed to a project before you sign up to be notified of nightly test failures, so it's not of much interest to newcomers. Also, "build" isn't very descriptive, and "notifications of failing nightly tests" wouldn't fit.

Put briefly: with a project this awesome, there's plenty to advertise, and this list just doesn't make the cut, IMHO. We already have a 'Recent test results' link to the SP web interface, which is more newcomer-friendly than the mailing list.

For the developer info page, similarly, there's a lot of info we can give developers, and I think we need to limit the wiki page to the essentials a new developer needs to start contributing. And this can't really be considered essential information.

Of course, you can argue that it's only one little link more. But clutter is like performance - if you care about it, you have to be strict about small things, or it will suffer death by a thousand cuts.

So I still don't think it should be featured in the sidebar, or in the wiki 'developer info' page. I'll add links to it on these pages, and I think it should go in the developer docs. If you still disagree and feel we've reached an impasse, we can ask @fperez to use his casting vote. ;-)

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fperez commented Feb 28, 2012

On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 2:52 AM, Thomas
reply@reply.github.com
wrote:

So I still don't think it should be featured in the sidebar, or in the wiki 'developer info' page. I'll add links to it on these pages, and I think it should go in the developer docs. If you still disagree and feel we've reached an impasse, we can ask @fperez to use his casting vote. ;-)

How about a suggestion instead of a vote: I think I'm with @takluyver
on the front page issue, but it seems to me that the main developer
page is fair game for very developer-oriented info like this. So that
could be a compromise: put it on the dev page, but not on the main
front page... Thoughts?

Owner

takluyver commented Feb 28, 2012

I'm not convinced it's important enough for the main developer info page, but I'm willing to compromise. That's on the Wiki, so @ivanov , go ahead and add it there.

Owner

ivanov commented Feb 29, 2012

so the only reason I did this PR was based on Fernando's email to the list:

I'd appreciate it if someone can update the main page with a link to
this list, as well as putting a mention of it in the dev guide part of
the docs.

I've updated the wiki. Should I create a PR to delete developer.rst if this has fully moved to the wiki? The wiki also repeatedly makes references to development section of the ipython docs, but those have no references to any of the mailing lists - I think this would be another potential non-coding but useful contribution that could be made

Owner

fperez commented Feb 29, 2012

On Tue, Feb 28, 2012 at 10:57 PM, Paul Ivanov
reply@reply.github.com
wrote:

so the only reason I did this PR was based on Fernando's email to the list:

Yup, though I've agreed upon hearing Thomas arguments about the
link-busyness of the main page.

I hereby reserve the right to change my mind again on ideas in the
future, upon hearing compelling arguments ;)

Thanks for your work, @ivanov, and sorry if this caused a bit of
wasted effort. It helped at least me think more about where we put
dev info, so it wasn't totally wasted...

Owner

takluyver commented Feb 29, 2012

Thanks, all. @ivanov , yes, I think the developer.rst page can be deleted (although please check that I haven't overlooked somewhere where it is referenced).

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