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Create trademark usage policy #12

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ellisonbg opened this Issue Jan 9, 2016 · 18 comments

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ellisonbg commented Jan 9, 2016

We need to have an official policy that clarifies how 3rd parties can use our jupyter tradmarks (name and logos).

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ellisonbg commented Jan 9, 2016

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fperez Jan 10, 2016

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Yup, the PSF ones should be our starting point. The logo page is also useful, it's complementary (and refers to the above for trademark details).

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fperez commented Jan 10, 2016

Yup, the PSF ones should be our starting point. The logo page is also useful, it's complementary (and refers to the above for trademark details).

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williamstein Jun 14, 2016

Here's a concrete question to clarify your policy. In the Python rules, it says

For the python rules they want to copy: ‘Any commercial use of the PSF trademarks in product or company names must be approved first by the PSF. Some uses, like calling a company “The Python Company,” or a product “Python Language” or “Python IDE” will be refused. This is because they are overly broad, or confusing as to whether the Python programming language is open source or commercial, or whether your product or organization is affiliated with or sponsored by PSF.’

If I would like to make a version of SageMathCloud that has a strong Jupyter preference (so the default is Jupyter rather than Sagews, etc.,) and has the domain name like awesomejupyternotebooks.com (say), would you guys say "yes" or "no" to my request?

Here's a concrete question to clarify your policy. In the Python rules, it says

For the python rules they want to copy: ‘Any commercial use of the PSF trademarks in product or company names must be approved first by the PSF. Some uses, like calling a company “The Python Company,” or a product “Python Language” or “Python IDE” will be refused. This is because they are overly broad, or confusing as to whether the Python programming language is open source or commercial, or whether your product or organization is affiliated with or sponsored by PSF.’

If I would like to make a version of SageMathCloud that has a strong Jupyter preference (so the default is Jupyter rather than Sagews, etc.,) and has the domain name like awesomejupyternotebooks.com (say), would you guys say "yes" or "no" to my request?

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fperez Jun 14, 2016

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Mmh, that sounds very similar to the examples the PSF gives for uses that would be likely refused...

Honestly, we're not trademark lawyers, so we'd probably need advice from one. I really want our policy to be as inclusive as possible, while letting us defend the trademarks from abuse (which is a right you lose if you don't defend it). For example, there are companies like pythonanywhere.com or laclinux.com that use the Python/Linux trademarks but are independent from the PSF/Linux Foundation. So evidently certain uses are acceptable.

We are working right now on some trademark-related issues, so hopefully soon we'll have more clarity on this. Is this a specific request or only hypothetical? If it's specific, feel free to ping us via email (since I imagine you wouldn't want to divulge the name in public) and we can perhaps provide better guidance and figure out a way to get legal advice on it.

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fperez commented Jun 14, 2016

Mmh, that sounds very similar to the examples the PSF gives for uses that would be likely refused...

Honestly, we're not trademark lawyers, so we'd probably need advice from one. I really want our policy to be as inclusive as possible, while letting us defend the trademarks from abuse (which is a right you lose if you don't defend it). For example, there are companies like pythonanywhere.com or laclinux.com that use the Python/Linux trademarks but are independent from the PSF/Linux Foundation. So evidently certain uses are acceptable.

We are working right now on some trademark-related issues, so hopefully soon we'll have more clarity on this. Is this a specific request or only hypothetical? If it's specific, feel free to ping us via email (since I imagine you wouldn't want to divulge the name in public) and we can perhaps provide better guidance and figure out a way to get legal advice on it.

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williamstein Jul 27, 2016

It's been pointed out to me by many people that using a domain name like foojupyterbar.com could easily be very confusing to users. However, using a subdomain like jupyter.sagemath.com, or even just a url schema starting with jupyter, e.g., sagemath.com/jupyter/... would prevent confusion and clarify the connection with SageMath. So I would also like to ask the steering committee about those two additional types of use.

It's been pointed out to me by many people that using a domain name like foojupyterbar.com could easily be very confusing to users. However, using a subdomain like jupyter.sagemath.com, or even just a url schema starting with jupyter, e.g., sagemath.com/jupyter/... would prevent confusion and clarify the connection with SageMath. So I would also like to ask the steering committee about those two additional types of use.

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I can see how sagemath.com/jupyter/... might be annoying for some implementation, in particular if you want to refer to an absolute resource, and many website treat the subdomain differetly (like hackernew used to show everything as "just" github.com), but it's true that it can be a usefull first step.

I also just realised that despite this being posted here, I never got notifications so never saw this thread, and this repository was not on my watch list. Likely a mistake from my part, so apologies. This is now corrected, I'm watching this repository, and will ask the council if they've seen this thread [as well as forward the request about subdomain]

Thanks !

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Carreau commented Jul 27, 2016

I can see how sagemath.com/jupyter/... might be annoying for some implementation, in particular if you want to refer to an absolute resource, and many website treat the subdomain differetly (like hackernew used to show everything as "just" github.com), but it's true that it can be a usefull first step.

I also just realised that despite this being posted here, I never got notifications so never saw this thread, and this repository was not on my watch list. Likely a mistake from my part, so apologies. This is now corrected, I'm watching this repository, and will ask the council if they've seen this thread [as well as forward the request about subdomain]

Thanks !

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jasongrout Jul 27, 2016

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@williamstein forwarded a list of 14 domains that have "jupyter" in the domain name (including, of course, jupyter.org). I didn't see any that seemed to create confusion with Project Jupyter, though.

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jasongrout commented Jul 27, 2016

@williamstein forwarded a list of 14 domains that have "jupyter" in the domain name (including, of course, jupyter.org). I didn't see any that seemed to create confusion with Project Jupyter, though.

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minrk Jul 28, 2016

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I would think that subdomain/sub-path would be sufficient signal that it's "Jupyter provided by sagemath", etc. The gist seems to me to be that if it's clear that Jupyter refers to the Jupyter parts being served, and not the service provider itself, things are okay.

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minrk commented Jul 28, 2016

I would think that subdomain/sub-path would be sufficient signal that it's "Jupyter provided by sagemath", etc. The gist seems to me to be that if it's clear that Jupyter refers to the Jupyter parts being served, and not the service provider itself, things are okay.

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williamstein Jul 28, 2016

Another name we're looking at: https://jupyter.CoCalc.com Here "CoCalc" is supposed to mean "Collaborative Calculation" and the point is that we would be a place that you can use Jupyter collaboratively online to do calculations. But as you say, it's clearer from this name that this is part of the CoCalc project, not Jupyter itself. I think this discussion is really productive.

Another name we're looking at: https://jupyter.CoCalc.com Here "CoCalc" is supposed to mean "Collaborative Calculation" and the point is that we would be a place that you can use Jupyter collaboratively online to do calculations. But as you say, it's clearer from this name that this is part of the CoCalc project, not Jupyter itself. I think this discussion is really productive.

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Carreau Jul 28, 2016

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@williamstein did you already registered this one ? [just to be sure no-one grab it from you].

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Carreau commented Jul 28, 2016

@williamstein did you already registered this one ? [just to be sure no-one grab it from you].

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williamstein Jul 28, 2016

@Carreau -- yep; thanks for your concern.

@Carreau -- yep; thanks for your concern.

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@Carreau -- yep; thanks for your concern.

Ok, great.

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Carreau commented Jul 28, 2016

@Carreau -- yep; thanks for your concern.

Ok, great.

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@williamstein - an update - your current request using jupyter in a subdomain or path is under discussion on the steering council list.

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jasongrout commented Jul 29, 2016

@williamstein - an update - your current request using jupyter in a subdomain or path is under discussion on the steering council list.

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oschuett Jul 14, 2017

I was wondering if there is now an official policy on using jupyter as a subdomain?

I was wondering if there is now an official policy on using jupyter as a subdomain?

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minrk Jul 14, 2017

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Using jupyter in a subdomain or url path is explicitly allowed in the draft trademark policy: https://github.com/jupyter/governance/blob/12311010f08b08ff93ce6cefd01a5704cae6f458/trademarks.md#examples

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minrk commented Jul 14, 2017

Using jupyter in a subdomain or url path is explicitly allowed in the draft trademark policy: https://github.com/jupyter/governance/blob/12311010f08b08ff93ce6cefd01a5704cae6f458/trademarks.md#examples

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oschuett Jul 14, 2017

Great! Thanks for the quick reply.

Great! Thanks for the quick reply.

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damianavila Jul 17, 2017

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I just merged #22, closing this one now.

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damianavila commented Jul 17, 2017

I just merged #22, closing this one now.

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