prostate gland lobes in human and mouse #665

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cmungall opened this Issue Mar 28, 2015 · 7 comments

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PMID:15163300 claims the human prostate lacks lobes. The same claim is also made in PMID:3308446 via:

[Term]
id: MP:0001163
name: abnormal prostate gland anterior lobe morphology
namespace: MPheno.ontology
alt_id: MP:0000663
def: "any structural anomaly of the rodent prostate lobe that appears as a thin tubular structure, attached to the lesser curvature of the paired seminal vesicles" [PMID:12645922, PMID:3308446]
comment: In rodents, the prostate gland consists of three lobes, the anterior prostate (AP; also known as the coagulating gland), the dorsolateral prostate (DLP), and the ventral prostate (VP). These lobes are arranged circumferentially around the urethra and display characteristic patterns of ductal branching and protein secretion (PMID:3308446). In contrast, ***the adult human prostate lacks discernible lobular organization*** and, instead, completely envelops the urethra at the base of the bladder (PMID:3308446).
synonym: "abnormal AP morphology" EXACT []
synonym: "abnormal CG morphology" EXACT []
synonym: "abnormal anterior prostate morphology" EXACT []
synonym: "abnormal coagulating gland morphology" EXACT []
xref: MA:0002422 ! prostate gland anterior lobe
is_a: MP:0001158  ! abnormal prostate gland morphology

(confusingly the term 'lobular' not 'lobar' is used here)

@gkoutos previously checked this (email exchange, 2011) and found it dubious. He checked with Onard and a few anatomists (FMA includes lobes of the prostate). So I think we agree it has lobes.

@cindyJax - should the MP comment be changed?

While we're here, there seems to be some confusion over the AP and the CG in MA/EMAPA

  • MA:0000402 ! coagulating gland [xref: EMAPS:3524528]
    • EMAPA:35245 ! coagulating gland
  • MA:0002422 ! prostate gland anterior lobe [xref: EMAPS:2979428]
    • EMAPA:29794 ! anterior prostate gland

According to MP, these should be merged, what do you think @tfhayamizu?

@tfhayamizu

Recent discussion about this, although I can't recall the details right now. I will revisit this, consulting our GUDMAP colleagues (who have been extensively working on the lower urinary tract and reproductive systems) as well as pathology references. "Comparative Anatomy and Histology: A Mouse and Human Atlas" by Piper M. Treuting and Suzanne M. Dintzis, recommended highly by pathologists I have consulted, has often been a useful resource for mouse vs. human issues..

@RDruzinsky

Human prostate has four lobes.

On 11:32PM, Fri, Mar 27, 2015 tfhayamizu notifications@github.com wrote:

Recent discussion about this, although I can't recall the details right
now. I will revisit this, consulting our GUDMAP colleagues (who have been
extensively working on the lower urinary tract and reproductive systems) as
well as pathology references. "Comparative Anatomy and Histology: A Mouse
and Human Atlas" by Piper M. Treuting and Suzanne M. Dintzis, recommended
highly by pathologists I have consulted, has often been a useful resource
for mouse vs. human issues..


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#665 (comment).

@tfhayamizu

There appears to be some disagreement here.

According to the above-mentioned reference -- CHAPTER 18 – MALE REPRODUCTIVE SYSTEM (written by Sue Knoblaugh, Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center, and Lawrence True, University of Washington School of Medicine):

"The mouse prostate is divided into four distinct lobes: anterior prostate (coagulating gland), dorsal prostate, lateral prostate and ventral prostate" ("Dorsal and lateral lobes are sometimes grouped together as the dorsolateral lobe") and "each lobe is histologically distinct."
"Conversely, the human prostate is a single organ. " "The gross human prostate is a single alobular structure," "divided into three concentric zones" and "organized as histologically similar zones by the pattern of branching of the prostate ducts "

@RDruzinsky

Just heard a talk on the aging genito-urinary system in males at the
American Association of Anatomy annual meeting. Speaker described the 4
lobes. I can find refs.

On 9:09AM, Tue, Mar 31, 2015 tfhayamizu notifications@github.com wrote:

There appears to be some disagreement here. According to the
above-mentioned reference
CHAPTER 18 – MALE REPRODUCTIVE SYSTEM (written by Sue Knoblaugh, Fred
Hutchinson Cancer Research Center, and Lawrence True, University of
Washington School of Medicine):
"The mouse prostate is divided into four distinct lobes: anterior prostate
(coagulating gland), dorsal prostate, lateral prostate and ventral
prostate" ("Dorsal and lateral lobes are sometimes grouped together as the
dorsolateral lobe") and "each lobe is histologically distinct."

"Conversely, the human prostate is a single organ. " "The gross human
prostate is a single alobular structure," "divided into three concentric
zones" and "organized as histologically similar zones by the pattern of
branching of the prostate ducts "


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#665 (comment).

@uberon
uberon commented Apr 2, 2015

To what extent is the disagreement here about the prostate, vs about the
definition of 'lobe'

On 1 Apr 2015, at 21:38, Robert Druzinsky wrote:

Just heard a talk on the aging genito-urinary system in males at the
American Association of Anatomy annual meeting. Speaker described the
4
lobes. I can find refs.

On 9:09AM, Tue, Mar 31, 2015 tfhayamizu notifications@github.com
wrote:

There appears to be some disagreement here. According to the
above-mentioned reference
CHAPTER 18 – MALE REPRODUCTIVE SYSTEM (written by Sue Knoblaugh,
Fred
Hutchinson Cancer Research Center, and Lawrence True, University of
Washington School of Medicine):
"The mouse prostate is divided into four distinct lobes: anterior
prostate
(coagulating gland), dorsal prostate, lateral prostate and ventral
prostate" ("Dorsal and lateral lobes are sometimes grouped together
as the
dorsolateral lobe") and "each lobe is histologically distinct."

"Conversely, the human prostate is a single organ. " "The gross human
prostate is a single alobular structure," "divided into three
concentric
zones" and "organized as histologically similar zones by the pattern
of
branching of the prostate ducts "


Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub
#665 (comment).


Reply to this email directly or view it on GitHub:
#665 (comment)

@tfhayamizu

I concur that there are groups that used the "lobe" terminology; also pointing out that some do not. The WP article summarizes this as: "The "zone" classification is more often used in pathology. [Hence that view is presented in in the pathology reference.] The idea of "zones" was first proposed by McNeal in 1968. McNeal found that the relatively homogeneous cut surface of an adult prostate in no way resembled "lobes" and thus led to the description of "zones." Also, "The "lobe" classification is more often used in anatomy." Finally, it states that the anterior, posterior and lateral lobes "roughly" correspond to parts of the transitional, peripheral and central zones, respectively. The important thing to recognize here is that there doesn't appear to be evidence supporting any developmental or functional correlation between similarly named "lobes" for the mouse and human, at least not that I have been able to find.

@RDruzinsky

Hi,
I agree. After doing some reading, I don't really think that the "zones" of
the prostate, as described by McNeal, are not really lobes at all, although
many clinicians and anatomists describe them as such.

Robert E. Druzinsky, Ph.D.
Clinical Associate Professor
Dept. of Oral Biology
College of Dentistry
University of Illinois at Chicago
801 S. Paulina
Chicago, IL 60612
druzinsk@uic.edu

Office: 312-996-0406
Lab: 312-996-0629
Website: www.peerj.com/RobertDruzinsky

On Thu, Apr 2, 2015 at 6:43 PM, tfhayamizu notifications@github.com wrote:

I concur that there are groups that used the "lobe" terminology; also
pointing out that some do not. The WP article summarizes this as: "The
"zone" classification is more often used in pathology. [Hence that view is
presented in in the pathology reference.] The idea of "zones" was first
proposed by McNeal in 1968. McNeal found that the relatively homogeneous
cut surface of an adult prostate in no way resembled "lobes" and thus led
to the description of "zones." Also, "The "lobe" classification is more
often used in anatomy." Finally, it states that the anterior, posterior and
lateral lobes "roughly" correspond to parts of the transitional, peripheral
and central zones, respectively. The important thing to recognize here is
that there doesn't appear to be evidence supporting any developmental or
functional correlation between similarly named "lobes" for the mouse and
human, at least not that I have been able to find.


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#665 (comment).

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