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Individual project status
- is in-tree, linux 64, inboud on Mac. Next are Windows and Android
- Help on Windows, Android and B2G would be good! Bottleneck is CI.
- 230k executions in telemetry
- necko tests pass
- IDNA support currently being worked on (PR open)
- percent decoding of the hostname is quite different - until recently we didn't do it at all for hostnames, and now we only decode valid hostname characters (bug 412457)
- needed to make rust-url accept other schemes, such as resource:// in order to be able to run the browser, since some schemes also go through the parser (PR pending)
- Have not yet done a full 'try' run, which should flush remaining issues
- Did the build using cargo; still waiting for the rest of the build system integration
What about BMP decoder? (bholley)
- nnethercote just rewrote in C++, but at least with a big test suite
- Isn't the MP4 parser dangerous?
- Have both of them in-tree, run both for now. So still fixing stagefright security problems.
Platform support status - where are we at now? What blockers remain?
Rust 1.5 stable just hit!
- Gives us multi-file crates,
- Dependency generation for incremental builds.
jemalloc (fine to redirect)
- Can now redirect the Rust code to use the standard symbols in Gecko. nfroyd!
work remaining for try builds
- rpath/origin support to avoid LD_LIBRARY_PATH in try
- Official rust binaries don't set LD_LIBRARY_PATH; we build a custom snapshot for the try servers
status for each tier 1 platform
- Rust supports all tier 1 platforms; just need our build system integrations in space there (including OSX10.6, Linux64; Windows, Android, B2G need help. Just have to add more libstds)
- For some platforms like Android that just involves adding new targets to the build system and putting the additional libraries in place. Any volunteers? nfroyd!
Servo style system on stable Rust
- How much work would it take to make just the style system build on stable Rust (not require unstable nightly features)?
- pcwalton: Ms2ger has done work to move us off of non-necessary unstable features. Do you know how much unstable stuff layout is using?
- Ms2ger: Most things in the layout crate could be removed.
- Manishearth: I did an audit (https://gist.github.com/Manishearth/967bc78db5c751c38d03#layout, many of these have stabilized since) a few months ago. Most of the unstable features are left over from pre-1.0 code and we just haven't bothered changing them. Ignoring plugins, it's mostly easy. Plugins could be replaced with codegen.
- pcwalton: Do we even use any plugins in layout?
- (discussion to continue offline)
Code / optimize / debug workflow
How do we handle PGO build interactions (if in LLVM, can be added)
- We do PGO on Win (using MSVC) and Linux (GCC).
- I don't know what it means to do this. We use LLVM codegen across the board. As long as you treat us like other native libraries it should work out.
- The Rust code may not get the full benefit of PGO but it shouldn't cause problems. We currently compile some third-party code like ICU without PGO.
- LLVM has PGO support but we haven't done the legwork to use it.
- PGO is useful for devirtualization which isn't as important in Rust.
- It can also change optimizations based on hot vs. cold paths.
- bz: Once we have a style system in Rust, having PGO for the style system would be nice.
How well does Rust work with the Gecko gdb/lldb/profiling (native and custom)?
- Whatever LLVM supports, we support. I haven't seen any problems with standard tools.
- rr works with Servo.
What about Windows?
- A lot of the Windows stuff is based on LLVM, whose PDB support is relatively immature. We're keeping up to date with LLVM to benefit from new improvements.
- Currently can't inspect local variables; sometimes stack traces are weird.
- vlad: Maybe use the new stuff from MS?
- That uses the Clang front-end but uses MSVC++ for codegen; we can't use that for Rust.
- There are caveats. We emit DWARF and masquerade as C++. The fidelity is low. There are person-years of work to get full mature support.
- But it's good enough in practice for e.g. debugging Servo.
- We should validate all this; not just debugging but also profiling, crash reporting.
- If there are specific areas that need fixing, ask management for resources to do it.
- Rust team's priority right now is developer ergonomics and tooling.
Diagnosing bugs reported "in the wild"
Crash reporting (how do stack traces look; are symbols generated/stored properly)
- We got a reasonable stack trace from a crash report in a test run.
- How do we test the full workflow of crash reporter -> crash-stats.mozilla.com?
- bz: Introduce a crash behind a pref in nightly :-)
How do we make sure bugs are fixed in both engines?
- upstream repo for create; changes land there first?
- Once we have real users, we have less flexibility to change things without regard for impact on them.
- This impacts code like rust-url or Servo layout code that's shared between Gecko and Servo (or other Rust projects)
- We have this problem with a lot of third-party code used in mozilla-central.
- ted: We have a mandatory policy to vendor everything. It makes our life easier in some ways, in others harder.
- Servo uses cargo rather than vendoring things.
- Maybe we can have a "cargo vendor" tool or similar that integrates with cargo to sync in-tree copies with upstream repos.
- Or a more general (not Rust-specific) tool for syncing/diffing m-c directories against their upstream sources.
- Servo has a mach command to do two-way sync between our vendored web-platform-tests and upstream.
- bholley: we need better tooling in general for getting fixes in deeply nested dependencies deployed to downstream code.
- Instead of one repo per crate, we could have one repo with many crates, if that helps.
- acrichto: Idiomatic Rust practice is the opposite of "vendor everything." It's much easier if you can find ways to work the Rust ecosystem way.
- ted: I understand that but I don't think we're going to go all the way there. There may be somewhere halfway.
- gps: People really want bi-directional multi-vcs multi-repository "syncing"
- Rust, Servo, media, ICU, WebRTC, web-platform-tests, /devtools, /browser, ....
- Quilt/MQ like local patches
- gps: devs can pull from crates.io. builders absolutely cannot hit crates.io.
- ms2ger: We want this for devs' local builds too so they don't need to be connected after downloading/cloning m-c.
m-c tree integration
Build one huge crate that builds all the Gecko/Rust code into one world
- Not sure on the compilation model; need to clean it up a test rust-url example set of patches
implicitly trust code review from Servo/Rust code / module policy concerns
- Common to 3rd party code. Rubber-stamp review? e.g., libjpeg... rely on push to try?
- Expect responsive upstream for servo code
- simonsapin: Should we import commit history?
- gps: There are bots on FFOS that do automated commits
- It periodically pulls from upstream, and lands the new revision if it passes tests. So every few hours it's updated to the latest upstream
- ted: chromium does this, too via trybots
- gps: Can't just pull the full commit histroy because it might not be commit-level bisectable. Can roll upstream pushes into commits.
- Both Servo and mozilla-central are "push-level" bisectable but not commit-level. We try, but no automation enforcing that intermediate commits build.
Intent to Implement
- bz: Once we have Servo style code in Gecko we need to have process like "Intent to Ship"
Issues for the rust team
Rust has integer overflow checking in debug builds, disabled in optimized builds. Is there any static proof of no overflow?
- In media we'd like overflow checking enabled all the time.
- Integer math in media is so fast compared to the overall video decoding process, we care much more about correctness than performance.
- You can enable this in optimized builds with a compiler flag.
- Would like to do it at the crate level
- In Rust, even if you get an overflow, it's usually less serious than C++ because it can't cause buffer overrun/underrun or similar safety issues.
- Array bounds checking is always enabled (in debug and release builds).
- Some feedback that rustc's error messages are not good enough.
- steveklabnik: Just recently the @RustLang twitter got two simultaneous messages saying "best error mesages ever!!!" and "terrible error messages! :("
- We'd love specific feedback on any bad error messages. File issues. CC Niko and Manish
- There are lots of tweaks you can do; we're always working on improving the compiler.
- Biggest improvement will be incremental compilation. Lots of active work going on but it'll take a long time (several months) to be landed.
- Our measurements show a steady improvement in compile speed over time, but there may be bad cases still.
- If you have crates with especially bad compile time, send them to us to profile.
- You can improve things by splitting into crates.
- But then you don't get inlining across them (except with functions explicitly marked #[inline])
- Also, your functions are currently round-robined / otherwise arbitrarily divided, so what does get inlined (if it's not #[inline]) can be unpredictable.)
- Servo team feels this pain a lot since we have some very very big crates that take minutes to compile, every time they change.
- incremental builds: expect results maybe by summer 2016
New rust toolchain every 6 weeks?
- 150MB. 400MB uncompressed.
- Not good for places w/o reliable internet.
- There's some discussion about recycling (C++) build artifacts for Gecko, so e.g. frontend developers can build JS changes without needing a C++ compiler.
- Could leverage this for Rust too.
- Of course you'd still need to build X megabytes of pre-built binaries.
- At the beginning, we have little Rust code and frequent changes to the Rust toolchain, so faster to download the build artifacts.
- Later, maybe we'll have more Rust code and more stable toolchain, so trade-off may change.
- But we don't want to force upstream projects (e.g. Servo) to not track the latest Rust
- At this point, benefit of upgrading is usually to get perf improvements. Feature-wise we could be happy with stable Rust.
- Better to download Rust as source?
- No, can add hours to initial build time.
- We can just fedex a DVD with all the code every 6 weeks to contributors on slow networks.
##How long can we keep Rust as an optional dependency?
- Right now it's opt-in; eventually could be opt-out; at some point we'll have code that is Rust-only with no C++ fallback.
- We don't want to ship two URL parsers forever (especially if one is untested and they are diverging)
- This is a policy decision for the Build Config module owner
- Could download partial updates for rustc
- diff between releases currently likely to be quite large, possibly no improvement
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