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From Dash's developer #1

Closed
Kapeli opened this Issue · 16 comments

4 participants

@Kapeli

Let me know if you need any help :+1:

@jkozera
Owner

Thanks! I'll keep you in mind. :) I'm waiting for feature requests and more feedback from users to decide which direction I should move in. Currently Zeal mostly satisfies my own Linux-Dash-clone needs, so unless people ask for something, I'm not sure I'm going to do much.

@jkozera
Owner

What do you think of allowing Zeal's users to use your Dash's docsets? I wasn't sure about licensing in the beginning, so decided to create my own format and docsets. I guess I should have asked first, my bad. Anyway, if Dash's content can be reused, I could switch my focus to supporting it instead.

I'm probably going to implement some automatic docsets downloading as per #4. I think fetching what's available at http://code.google.com/p/dash-docsets/downloads/list might be a good start - would it be ok for you?

@Kapeli

No, please don't use the actual docsets that I have made for Dash. It is fine to use the docset format as per Dash or Xcode, but in terms of grabbing the actual docsets please don't do it. The docsets I made for Dash are the result of 1 year's work and whenever a Dash user pays for Dash, it is mainly to support that that repository of docsets is kept up to date and that new docsets are added.

Furthermore, some docsets have been contributed by users and I have no idea if they would be alright with the docsets being used in any other app but Dash (I am quite sure most would be alright with it though).

My recommendation would be to do this:
1. Have Zeal use the same docset format as Dash, or I'll change Dash to also support Zeal docsets (whichever you like).
2. Agree on a "docset exchange programme" between us. In a nutshell, this would work this way: you generate a docset that Dash does not have and in return you also get access to a docset that Dash has and Zeal doesn't. I hope this makes sense.

@jkozera
Owner

OK, thanks for clarifying. I'm not sure how to prevent users from downloading your docsets manually though - any ideas?

As for docsets format, TBH I'm also not sure what's the best way to go. Zeal's format is kind of in between Dash's and Xcode's. Essentially, when compared to Dash's format, it just has additional node parent information, without having as much tables in schema as Xcode. Parent information really can be just added in name using 'parent.child' dot-separated format, so I'm not too determined it's necessary. My Python and Qt docsets already work well, so I'm not too keen to convert them, as you have equivalents already, but maybe it's best to use Dash's format for future docsets, as it's the simplest one.

I think Zeal's docsets should be free to use by anyone, because the project is open source. And Python + Qt, at least for now, is enough for me, so I'll probably leave the final decision about format up to people implementing other docsets (it might be me at some point in future). I've added description of formats to README, recommending to use Dash's format. Also linked to your post above about the exchange programme.

@Kapeli

You shouldn't try to prevent users from downloading and using the docsets manually. I'm just asking not to add Dash's docsets to Zeal by default or offer them for download as per #4.

Regarding the format, you could just merge the Zeal format into the current Dash format. This means you would use the exact same format as Dash's and add the extra column you need, or any other columns you need and Dash will ignore them.

@yourilima

Maybe there could come a collaborative list of docsets that needs generating/creating. or if it already exists where is it?

@Kapeli

There isn't. The reasoning was that a list would have only benefited me and @jkozera (users that want to generate a docset themselves already know which docset they want and don't need a list). Also, setting up a list that would allow voting by users would have been a bit too hard to set up to prevent fake votes.

So... not really sure how to best approach this. How do you see a collaborative list working? What would it allow?

@yourilima

As I understand you are using a part of your time on updating the docsets to the latest version right?

I dont know how much time this takes to create or update a docset. But the list could be just a list of both existing and requested docsets and then some info of the current version the latest version available of the documentation etc. and then the possibility to send in an updated docset. Ofcourse especially in the start its only you and @jkozera to benefit most but as the community grows others will want to supply. Maybe the list should be a bit less collaborative but just maintained by the two of you to prevent spam. As I saw you already have a request a docset page right? Something in the style of that. But that users can also send in docsets.

@Kapeli

Collaborative updates: The problem is that generating some docsets is not trivial at all (sometimes the documentation changes and the generation script fails). Letting someone else post docset updates is a big no-no from my point of view.

Listing the existing docsets and their versions: already done within Dash, so I don't see a point in maintaining yet another list for that.

Listing requests would be great, I agree, but I do not really know what features to include. E.g. allow users to request (how do I prevent fake/duplicate requests?), how would @jkozera and I update the list of requests and so on...

@jkozera
Owner

I think @Kapeli is going to receive most docset requests for the time being, as I haven't received any yet. So maybe it could be just a "docsets exchange programme" page listing requests hosted somewhere at http://kapeli.com/ to which I could link from README and http://zealdocs.org/, instead of current links to @Kapeli's comment above? Then users wanting to contribute to Zeal+Dash could prepare requested docsets.

@Hexodus

There're no docsets available any more - the googledocs link shows only a blank page. Does it mean that the cooperation between zeal and dash is over?

@Kapeli

No, the cooperation between Zeal and Dash did not end. I removed the docsets from Google Code because I'm now storing them in a different place (kapeli.com) for better download speeds. Also, some people made tools and apps that used Dash's docsets without giving any credit or anything to Dash, and I was not okay with that.

Unfortunately, I didn't get around to building a index page that lists them all in one place, but you should be able to get them from http://kapeli.com/feeds/.tgz (e.g. http://kapeli.com/feeds/JavaScript.tgz). If you're looking for a specific docset, let me know and I'll give you the link(s).

Sorry for the inconvenience!

@Hexodus

Glad to hear that we can still use the docsets with zeal. Thank you for telling me how to get them! I managed to download some docs by guessing - it's not allways obvious which filename it would be. I can't get Jquery Mobile, JQuery, JQuery UI, Python ... Could you please give me the proper filenames?

@Hexodus

Thanx a lot for that quick help!

@Kapeli

http://kapeli.com/docset_links lists all the docsets available in Dash, for direct download.

@Hexodus

Oh great!

@Kapeli Kapeli closed this
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