What are pnpm’s preferences for Node.js distribution?

[GeoffreyBooth]

Forgive me if this was asked elsewhere; I’ve been looking and I can’t seem to find it. There’s an open PR for Node to include a pnpm binary in its distribution which would be a runtime to Corepack, to tell Corepack to download and manage pnpm. Is this something that the pnpm project wants?

As I see it, there are three broad options:

1. Node.js doesn’t distribute pnpm at all: neither the pnpm tool itself nor a way to download it on demand. Users would need to download and install pnpm directly via one of the methods that pnpm recommends.
2. When users install Node, along with creating node and npm and npx binaries/symlinks, the installation creates a pnpm symlink to Corepack. When users run pnpm for the first time after Node installation, Corepack downloads and version-manages pnpm.
3. When users install Node, it creates a pnpm binary or script that does something else, like npm install --global pnpm or whatever installation method the pnpm team prefers.

Which of the above is the preference of the pnpm project? cc @zkochan

[trivikr]

Is this something that the pnpm project wants?

pnpm recommends using corepack in their Getting Started page, as the first option after standalone scripts, and before npm.

[GeoffreyBooth]

So are you saying that you prefer option 2 or option 3?

For option 3 I meant npm install as an example. It could be any command, like it could be whatever standalone scripts command the pnpm team suggests.

[trivikr]

I primarily use yarn with corepack, and landed on this discussion from nodejs/node#51886 (comment)

I quickly looked at pnpm Getting Started wiki, and highlighted that they also recommend corepack.

[GeoffreyBooth]

Well it’s one of 14 or so options, depending how you count, and there’s no text for any of them saying that any in particular are recommended or disfavored.

Regardless of how pnpm recommends their software be installed or if they have a recommendation, the question is what the pnpm project’s preference is for what Node should do. Should Node’s installation write a /usr/bin/local/pnpm binary, and if so, what should that binary do (symlink to Corepack or run some other command).

[zkochan]

I personally prefer to install pnpm with the standalone script. This way pnpm can install node.js and manage node.js versions. The executable version of pnpm is also slightly faster.

I created a poll to see what the users prefer: https://twitter.com/pnpmjs/status/1764788568398897439

I personally don't want to be involved in the corepack discussions anymore. They are too heated.

[MylesBorins]

I'd say there are other options

1. pnpm ships directly in node.js (vendor like npm)
2. pnpm works with Node.js team on streamlined bootstrap process that isn't based on corepack

I'd be willing to spend some time to help navigate this (or have someone from the npm team pair on it). If pnpm wants to find a path to shipping in Node.js without corepack they is possible, and it is possible without undermining the goals of the yarn team imho.

[GeoffreyBooth]

Myles’ option 2 is proposed here: nodejs/node#51931.

We just ruled out option 1 in nodejs/node#51918, though of course we can always change prior decisions.

[zkochan]

I have created another poll: https://twitter.com/pnpmjs/status/1764951109469098185

[GeoffreyBooth]

In the new poll, if the non-Corepack option was meant to suggest nodejs/node#51931, that proposal wasn’t to have Node include a fixed version of pnpm. I was thinking we would download either the latest or the latest major version of pnpm.

Also for nodejs/node#51931, I would expect pnpm to tell us what command they want to be used for installation. I used npm install in my experiment because that’s what I’m familiar with, but that was just to prove that the concept could work. I’m happy to change it to something else, provided that whatever pnpm suggests works in all the platforms that Node supports. We can also change it to use Corepack to install pnpm if pnpm wants to be managed by Corepack via this method.

[GeoffreyBooth]

Hi, it looks like the polls are complete.

I’m not really sure what to make of the second one, since “a script to download the latest version” wasn’t an option; and based on the first poll that might very well have been preferred by people?

Or is what I should infer out of this that you don’t have a strong preference and you’re fine with the Node team deciding?