(1) Dialectal checked tones and (2) new zhuyin positioning images

[r12a]

3.3.3.3 Positioning of the Tones in Zhuyin Symbols, bullet 2
http://w3c.github.io/clreq/#h-h-positioning_tones_in_zhuyin

It is not explained in the document what dialectal checked tones are, when they are used, nor how they are constructed. At least, with the previous diagrams showing real examples, it was possible to get an clue of what this was about, but the new diagrams now make things harder to understand. (compare with http://www.w3.org/TR/2015/WD-clreq-20150723/#h-positioning_tones_in_zhuyin)

Can we perhaps reintroduce the images showing real examples in addition to the new charts? I think that for many of the target audience of this document, having the real examples is also very helpful to understand what the section is talking about, not just wrt dialectal checked tones.

I think, however, we need some additional textual description of what dialectal checked tones are and how they function. Also the previous images showed two marks involved in dialectal checked tones. What code points are used for those marks? What rule govern the display of those marks?

Also, the new diagrams show the tone marks as being the same size as the phonetic characters, whereas the real examples showed them as much smaller. What's that about?

Finally, there is chinese text in the new images. Can we indicate the meaning of that text, either by a note in the caption or text or by an english version of the graphic?

[ethantw]

Also, the new diagrams show the tone marks as being the same size as the phonetic characters, whereas the real examples showed them as much smaller. What's that about?

I had a meeting with @bobbytung and But Ko, and we decided not to follow the ratios from the Handbook of MPS entirely, which are quirky, way too strict and hard to implement. Instead we chose the 25% size of that of the base character for both phonetic symbols and tone marks, and changed the positioning a little.

IOO, not even the textbooks in Taiwan follow those rules entirely, and the way we describe in the newer version are more flexible and adaptive.

Can we perhaps reintroduce the images showing real examples in addition to the new charts? I think that for many of the target audience of this document, having the real examples is also very helpful to understand what the section is talking about, not just wrt dialectal checked tones.

I was thinking about adding a small section that contains such Zhuyin examples just like how you mentioned about the older version. I even re-designed the figures to match the new descriptions (https://github.com/w3c-html-ig-zh/clreq-fig/blob/master/ruby/zhuyin-3-3-three-symbol-tioh.svg, etc). The only reason I missed out the section, is that I had little time before the FPWD, and perhaps we need more discussions about this.

It is not explained in the document what dialectal checked tones are, when they are used, nor how they are constructed.

I’ll trynna explain the tone marks in the glossary later.

Finally, there is chinese text in the new images. Can we indicate the meaning of that text, either by a note in the caption or text or by an english version of the graphic?

Hǎode, a.k.a. sure!

[ethantw]

Fixed over 514dbad and closing.