New AI character ideas? #286
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Why would Robin Hood use tunnelers? What part of his lore would suggest that? |
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@Russianstory ideas: Lord Owl (Lord Owl): Lord Bear (Lord Bear): Lord Hare (Lord Hare): Lord Raven: Lord Fox (Lord Fox): And this is the background for bots. |
No. He was an Advisor to the King I think he doesn't need monks. He needs Pikemen and Archers “Lord Woolsack is the “wisest,” as the people call him. In fact, he is a cowardly and indecisive person. Too overestimated the capabilities of the enemy. Perhaps he paid for it (there is an assumption that Woolsac, frightened by the Pig, simply handed him the front and the castle rebuilt by the hero). After torture executed by Pig“. I would give him European Archers and Spearmen, but why should there be a new Rat :D.I think that European Archers and Pikemen him just right.I think that you can give him even spearmen like cannon fodder. :) Lord Woolsak must produce (Bread and Ale) or (Apples and Cheese) or (Ale and Cheese) or (Apples and Bread) or (Cheese and Bread) or (Apples and Ale). He may also have churches. It should have 2-3 stone quary and 4 iron mines. 1-2 oil well. 6-8 sawmill. Popularity should be Positive. I think 1- 2 Apothecary do not interfere . And a couple of wells for the fire protection. I don’t know exactly how much Apple Gardens, Farms, Wheat Fields (mills and bakeries) and Hop fields with (breweries,taverns) need. But I think by trial and error we can choose the best economical scheme. Also, I do not know how much it is necessary (bad and good things) so that there is stability. I also don’t know how much Poleturners and Fletcher Workshops are needed. Well, I think if everything works out, I’ll choose an economic scheme for Lord Woolsack. Russian WIKI https://stronghold.fandom.com/ru/wiki/%D0%9B%D0%BE%D1%80%D0%B4_%D0%92%D1%83%D0%BB%D1%81%D0%B0%D0%BA I will already try to build a Castle for him in the AIV editor. If you wish, lay out your version of Castle for Lord Woolsack. P.S Sorry for the spelling errors... My version Castle for Lord Woolsack.
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@ Lolasik that AIV looks good, thats actually what I was thinking for the shape of Woolsack's castle, like a rectangular but with square bits that stick out. Only thing is I think he should have less square towers than you have, so only 2 at the front, with a mangonel, archers and oil engineer on each, and more small perimeter turrets (about 10 of them in total) around the walls of the castle (protected by an outer wall). No defence turrets are needed really!
OK maybe not monks then. Your spearmen idea one is actually a good one. So pikemen, spearmen and archers for his attacks, sounds good. Archers and spearmen advancing together (protected by a few shields) then the pikemen a bit later. Catapults, rams and a few shields would be good for siege equipment. I don't think he should have a moat though, as it would make him too hard an AI to beat for his character, but certainly oil engineers and archers, and a few wooden traps but not too many.
I don't think he should have bread production, not really in his character to use too complex an economy. Ale plus positive fear factor, religion and apples plus 3 quarries and 3 iron mines would be good enough economically for him. |
I think the fact tunnelers use improvised weapons fits with Robin Hood's character. Yes he had woodland archers who could afford bows, but it is likely some of the people who served him would be peasants (rebelling against the tyrannical rule of the Sheriff) who maybe couldn't afford weapons so would just use improvised weapons stolen from their former workplace under the Sheriff such as mining picks. Tunnelers represent these well, as well as providing Robin Hood with a melee unit more unique than spearmen, and also macemen don't fit with his character I think, too brutal! But I will leave it to you to do your Robin hood character after AICE, ByBurton and I shall concentrate along with Lolasik on Lord Woolsack! Whatever troops you give Robin Hood, I am looking forward to him being in game. :D |
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@PitchNeeded I think we can make Lord Wulsack. By the way, I was able to pull out the Bink files from Stronghold 1 (animation files and communication of the Lords of AI). I can already put them in the Stronghold Crusader to any Lord of AI. But there are 3 problems: Here are the icons of Lord Wulsack that I want to: By the way, I pulled out the Pig Attack animation with the Stronghold 1 Demo and pasted it into the Stronghold Crusade. To view the Bin files you need the Rad Video Tools program. http://www.radgametools.com/bnkdown.htm Stronghold 1 DEMO To transfer animations you just need to re-name for example from Stronghold 1 Demo the Pig Attack file to Pg_plead1 and drop the finished file into the binks folder in the Stronghold Crusade. And we get that when the Pig loses, it will play the animation from Stronghold 1 Demo. In this way, you can and take the animation of Lord Wulsak and replace it with any Lord of the AI. Even so, you can view all the animations in the game. |
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Where are the binks (videos) for Lord Woolsack in Stronghold 1? I found the voice files but not the binks :( Also should he recruit a few Arabian swordsmen mercenaries which he could use along with his siege pikemen do you think - just to make him a bit more unique? So the archers and spearmen would advance first then a group of mostly pikemen with a few Arabian swordsmen would advance a bit later? |
ap_civil5 - ap_civil8 |
I think he doesn't need mercenaries. Maybe some crossbowmen or tunneler. |
Thanks! :D
OK no mercenaries then! Crossbowmen would make him a bit too strong for his character I think, as would digging tunnels. One other idea - he is very cautious so I think he shouldn't send his first siege until he has about 180 troops in total. Also his recruitment speed should be set to medium. |
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@PitchNeeded |
But of course he could raid enemy buildings occasionally between sieges with big groups of pikemen. :D |
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Right. .... and spearmen cannon fodder. :D 100% army Lord Woolsack: |
I think he should occasionally raid with a big group of pikemen, but not too often. |
On resource centers |
Indeed. The pikemen are also perfect to counter his rival Sir Longarm (Marshall)'s knights. :D |
:D Yes, I would like to see their fight |
Well I am making the AIVs now for Lord Woolsack, irregular shaped castles with quite a few perimeter turrets and only 1 or 2 big square towers will be his distinctive feature. If we give the settings we want for Lord Woolsack to @showdown or @ByBurton before AICE is released, as well as the binks and speech files, plus the AIVS I am making, maybe they could create an option in the patch to temporarily replace any one of the existing AIs with Lord Woolsack, just so we can use this new AI until we find a space for a new AI in the game without having to replace them. Of course it should be made to require Stronghold 1 to be installed to be able to use Lord Woolsack, because of the quotes, binks and character himself being from Stronghold 1. So these should be the settings I think for Lord Woolsack:
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@PitchNeeded perfectly |
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Can you define this "Troops used: pikemen, European archers, spearmen, catapults, trebuchets, rams, oil engineers, tower ballistae" a little more please? What units is he supposed to use in what way? |
I think digging moat should spearmen somewhere 20 units. Major melee troops are Pikemen and Spearmen. I think it would be better if half of the archers cover the army and siege weapons and half will attack with Pikemen and Spearmen. I think the first attack of Lord Woolsack should be 300 units, because he is careful and to exactly finish the enemy. |
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@ByBurton |
I think he needs 4 iron mines. |
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sounds a lot like a frederickesque economy right there keep in mind if you want to make him the same strength level of the marshal who has 1 quarry and 2 iron mines who also produces the 2 most expensive units in the game the setup for woolsack should probably be a little weaker ;) |
Well, this is only ideas for now. Offer your scheme of economics and troops Lord Woolsack. It is desirable in detail |
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Nope, Lord woolsack looks more like a chill guy, so no fast recruitment. Medium at most. Not as slow as the Sultan, but maybe as the Sheriff? |
Was actually just thinking that, he would have too big a gold surplus with both ale and religion - he probably doesn't need that big an economy, especially if he has a decent number of poleturners and fletchers (he can sell a few weapons). So either religion or ale then but not both. I think we should just give him religion then and no ale to make him different to his rival Marshall. And maybe just 2 stone quarries and 2 iron mines.
I think ideally both spearmen and pikemen should dig, especially if he is attacking Frederick or Nizar with their big moats! And I think both spearmen and pikemen should always be sent in Woolsack's sieges. I like the idea of a two stage melee unit siege attack, first stage with spearmen advancing, supported by advancing archers that would distract enemy fire from the spearmen, the trebuchets and rams being built as this is happening, and then pikemen being sent in afterwards. I don't think he needs patrolling around the siege engines (especially as no other AI currently does that do they?). I think 80 units sent on his first siege (at an army size of about 200 units in total) is a good number for him I think for his first attack, goes with his 'careful' character but isn't so big a number that would make him unlikely to siege at all during a game (Lolasik's proposal of a total army count of 300 before a siege is too high I think). |
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Only one kind of unit can dig, sadly. |
:( Hopefully this can be changed eventually, but if not, of course it would probably be better if it was the pikemen that could. Do you think it would be possible to add this new Lord Woolsack AI as an option with the patch loader when the AICE is released @ByBurton. That would be amazing! :D Sadly it would have to replace another AI though temporarily whenever the box is ticked on the patch loader (as there is no space in the game for a new AI in its own right) but it would still be good to have to test out! It also should ideally have a mechanism which would require Stronghold 1 to be installed to use the voice files/binks from that game for Lord Woolsack. I am busy doing the 8 AIVs now for Lord Woolsack. No ale, just religion and positive fear factor. Will upload them here soon. |
Just using slingers, Arabian archers and slaves in his sieges would certainly be unique, he could have big armies though like Abbot. |
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He IS attacking with lots of units. You forgot he also uses some swordsmen. |
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I prefer this AI idea to The Khan I must say! :D Sounds great! He could be called 'The Mamluk' after the slave warriors during the Crusades who eventually formed a dynasty. |
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@ByBurton Just out of interest, what did you set his first attack number to? |
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I can't check right now, am at work. Sorry. |
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Introducing my new historical AI character idea: King Baldwin of Jerusalem Baldwin was historically the name of several kings of Jerusalem during the Crusades and in general the kings of the kingdom of Jerusalem took part in more action than Western European based kings such as Richard the Lionheart and Phillip. So I think it would be good to have King Baldwin in the game. Baldwin builds cross shaped castles to fit his status as the king of the Crusader kingdom. They have lookout towers at the front part of the cross with ballista towers at the sides. He uses good fear factor, ale and religion and has a quite fast recruitment interval of 2.
King Baldwin uses slower units, these being crossbowmen, monks and swordsmen. The monks represent the horde of religious warriors that joined the Crusade and the swordsmen the heavier armed Templar fighting experts. I was tempted to make him use knights but enough AIs raid with them already and I liked the idea of an AI raiding with groups of European swordsmen:
Here is King Baldwin's main attack. He will also train some pikemen if he has to dig up a moat, and pikemen are also used for his counterattacks.
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@PitchNeeded By the way edited my castle? He fits .. |
I think his castles are different enough to those of the abbot in style. I suppose he is a little bit like the Abbot but with good fear factor (and I really wanted an AI to use monks but with good fear factor), although to make him different to abbot and fit with his character as Baldwin, king of Jerusalem he trains better quality troops as well as the monks, and monks are only really sent as arrow fodder during sieges, as well as a last ditch defence he can spam. I am going to do different styles of crosses for his castle, so the Celtic cross and Maltese cross will feature too. Feel free to do a cross shaped castle for him if you want, it would be greatly appreciated: specifications:
We can use good_soldier for the binks, and the speech files will be from the advisor from the Stronghold Crusader 'Crusader States' campaign. Any other ideas about King Baldwin of Jerusalem would be appreciated. |
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Also I think it would be a good idea for us to make another historical Arabian sultan during the Crusades which could feature as an AI in the game, either Sultan Nur el-Din (positive fear factor) or Sultan Baybars (negative fear factor). But I am not sure about troop types, I think slingers should feature though as they are an underused unit by the vanilla AI. Any ideas would be great for this..... |
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@Lolasik011 I have been thinking about the Arabian AI we should create, I think it should be Sultan Baibars https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baibars , one of the most notable historical Sultans during the later part of the Crusades period, who reconquered nearly all of the Crusader states region. I have some ideas for him. In the excellent series of historical novels by Robyn Young about the late Crusades which I have read, Baibars is described as having the nickname 'The Crossbow' because of a mark in his eye he had historically. So I am thinking that, in a similar way to Emir using one type of European troops in addition to Arabian units (European archers), Baibars could be the only Arabian AI to use crossbowmen defensively (supported by slingers and a few fire throwers in his towers). He wouldn't use any Arabian archers (just to make him unique for an Arabian AI and not too overpowered). To balance him and not make him stronger than Saladin, he wouldn't use bread production (just cheese and apples (cows for the leather armour) ) and so wouldn't have quite as good an economy as Saladin or Emir. He could still sell some crossbows though for gold. He would have ale supply just like them though. Baibars historically could be ruthless at times (he assassinated the previous sultan and also he broke his word about sparing the citizens of Antioch) and so doesn't seem as chivalrous as Saladin, so neutral fear factor would be fine for him. I was considering a slight amount of negative fear factor for him but I want his troops to still be strong especially as he will use slingers and also I don't think Baibars was that cruel to his own people historically as according to his wikipedia article, he seems to have been remembered as a popular ruler by his own people. As for his siege attacks, he could use horse archers, Arabian swordsmen, crossbowmen and slingers. Slaves would be sent if he has to dig up a moat. He should have a fast recruitment speed as I want him to be aggressive, and it fits his character. As for raids, I am not sure yet, but maybe a mix of slingers and slaves like the Snake, but bigger groups of them and less frequently sent than Snake because of their bigger size? I am not sure about his castle style though, we need something Arabian looking but very different to any other Arabian AI's castles. He should use some tower ballistas and mangonels. However he shouldn't use a moat in my opinion (as it would make him a bit overpowered especially combined with the crossbowmen), but he should use some wooden killing pits and some dogs too. He could use a little pitch below his towers and gatehouses, and like Sheriff he could light it with his fire throwers, as Baibars won't have any tower archers. I will leave it up to you @Lolasik011 , to design his castle style if you want! Or if anyone else wants to.... |
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@PitchNeeded Ok I will try to create a Castle. |
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@PitchNeeded I took my previous Castle, and created a new one. |
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I was actually thinking he could have an inner and outer wall in all his castles, that would make him different. So then, the plan is an inner wall with gatehouses and an outer wall with some big round towers and some lookout towers too. I shall make a castle based on your prototype, but not as big, can you do a full castle for him, but a bit smaller please. Give him about 7 fletchers and 7 tanners, all close to the stockpile and armoury. He only needs 1 armoury I think. Give him 2 inns, 3 breweries and 1 healer too, and he will of course need a mercenary post, barracks and engineers guild. |
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@Lolasik011 I used your design to create my first castle for Baybars.
I still have to adjust his tactics. On testing him on 2000 gold against Saladin, even with a fast recruitment speed, he seems to be gathering too much gold at the minute (a bit like the Abbot) because of his cheap units. I may have to make him raid with horse archers as well as slingers and slaves so he can use more of his gold. |
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@PitchNeeded |
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@PitchNeeded Can you please share the Castle and aic file Baibars? |
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Yes I will share both of them soon, and I will create another similar castle with those lookout towers where they stood before as another AIV for him. Here is Baybars' siege, horse archers advance first with slingers and slaves to dig the enemy moat, then the crossbowmen and Arabian swordsmen arrive later. He uses 2 catapults and 2 rams.
(behind the first siege horse archers he decided that time to send a raid of more horse archers) I decided that to balance him better (he has crossbowmen after all), Baybars won't use fire much, so no slaves, fire ballistae, oil engineers or pitch and just a few fire throwers on his moat. Raids consist of horse archers and slingers. He raids frequently. |
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@PitchNeeded i like |
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@Lolasik011 I will make more castles for him soon. In the meantime, can you come up with a new idea for an AI with a unique troop combination that isn't used by any other AI in the game or those we have made so far, and I will help you make it. I would like to see what you come up with. It can of course be a good or evil AI. |
I'll think about the new AI Lord ... |
OK. I also have another idea for an AI lord, the first female AI lord, a historical character that took part in the second crusade called Elanor of Aquitane. I want her to attack with knights as part of the siege force as that would be very unique for an AI but I don't know what other troops she should use to make her different enough from Phillip or Marshall or what style of castles she should use, perhaps you can help me with ideas for that. |
I think it would be good if she used knights and crossbowmen when attacking. But how will she kill the Lord ??? You can certainly add some pikemen 10 - 15 Units to kill the Lords ... |
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Knights and crossbowmen, along with a small number of pikemen sounds good. I have an idea for her castles. I will start creating the first one now. |
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Adding more than 16 AI characters without a replacement will be possible in the next patch? |
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No, at this stage it will never be possible. There is simply too much involved when we are not using original code. |
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If there ever be Definitive edition of stronghold crusader I'm praying that they will allow adding more custom made characters than 16 |
Now it looks possible we will be able to put new AI lords temporarily in the game, with the help of the AICE (and eventually we may be able to open a space in the game to put a new AI there permanently without temporary replacement), I have opened up a new issue where we can discuss AI lord ideas so we can maybe add some officially to a future patch after AICE is released to temporarily replace an AI for a game. Here are some ideas, feel free to share your own AI lord ideas here too!
The Ilkhan
The title of Mongol lords during the later Crusades who were based east of Syria and threatened the Arabian sultanate.
Ideas for this AI: castle isn't so good defensively and looks more like a warcamp than a castle (so a bit like the Pig's castle with low walls but rounded in shape rather than rectangular and only having one or two big towers ) However this lord uses a fast and powerful attack combination:
Horse archers, macemen and laddermen
He uses a bit of negative fear factor, some ale, stone, iron, lots of weapon production
Lord Woolsack
The one I have mentioned a lot, would be quite easy to put the binks and speech files in from Stronghold 1. It should of course be made that a Lord Woolsack AI would require Stronghold 1 to be installed if it was made into a patch option.
Anyway, big groups of pikemen for counterattacking and raiding. He wouldn't siege until he had a big army as he is a bit of a cautious character. Would recruit monks too for sieges (as he does look like a monk). Would send the monks and pikemen as part of one group during sieges, along with archers. The pikemen would distract attention from the monks being shot down and with +5 positive fear factor, the monks would be a bit stronger than Abbot's ones. Lord Woolsack would use trebuchets in sieges and maybe a ram too, but would create some catapults from time to time for his harassment siege engines.
Like his friend/rival Sir Longarm/ Marshall, his castle wouldn't be the best defensively but would have one or two big towers and lots of small perimeter turret towers. Lots of poleturners of course, a cathedral, +5 positive fear factor, apple and cheese farms.
Robin Hood
ByBurton is a fan of this AI character being introduced. Would love to see him recruit loads of archers and tunnelers for hand to hand combat - tunnelers are faster than spearmen, cheap and would make his sieges different from Rat or Snake.
Huge bow production and ale, apples and cheese. Castle with lookout towers and moat like ByBurton suggested!
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