[Glitch] Shuma Gorath's Chaos Dimension

[Immersion95]

This super was always a strange case as it uses a special rendering during the sequence.

From my readings, it uses multiple raster effects (please correct me if I'm wrong)

As of today, FBNeo renders it like this :

From the arcade version of MSH/MSHVSF

It should normally be like this :

From the home version of MSH from Marvel vs. Capcom Origins

I think that MAME renders it almost correctly :

From the arcade version of MSHVSF

Thanks for your help !

June 2022 Edit : Please disregard what I previously wrote, there is no software emulation that accurately emulate this effect (MAME being the worst offender and FBNeo being the closest).

The only correct emulation is from Jotego's FPGA core : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVctkwrDqYo&t=390s

[dinkc64]

Hi,
In order for me to be able to fix this, I will need an input recording made on the current version of FBNeo standalone (not the libretro version) as I can't make this combo myself. I recommend using the win32/gcc build as it's the most stable:
latest builds can be procured from:
https://github.com/finalburnneo/FBNeo-WIP-Storage-Facility/releases/tag/appveyor-build

[dinkc64]

Please try to do a few different versions of this combo in the recording if possible :)

how to record: game -> replay -> record input -> OK. The recording file(s) will be in the "recordings" subfolder/directory.

[Immersion95]

Done !

Here it is :
mshvsf.zip

I did it 1 time per player

[dinkc64]

thanks :)
Is it possible to also get some recordings from different scenes - such as the carnival and the temple as the other videos? I need something to compare to :)

[Immersion95]

I'll try but the thing is that I can't choose the background :p

[Immersion95]

thanks :)
Is it possible to also get some recordings from different scenes - such as the carnival and the temple as the other videos? I need something to compare to :)

Hi, do you still need it ?

[dinkc64]

yes :)

[dinkc64]

some news:
iq_132 is completely re-writing the cps1 & 2 drivers. since his code uses modern (scanline-based) frame-style - adding the multi-irq ability for this effect will actually be possible.

[Immersion95]

Hi,

Thanks a lot !

Wish iq_132 good luck in that endeavor !

[Immersion95]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Xldt_dxUr4

You can see a few examples of Chaos Dimension there.

Best regards.

[barbudreadmon]

Anyone confirmed it's not happening on real cabinet ?
Comparison with ps3 and MAME might be a bad idea, since the first is probably a native port, and we got several bug report of "cps1/2 differences with mame" last year that turned out to be MAME inaccuracies.

[Immersion95]

Anyone confirmed it's not happening on real cabinet ?
Comparison with ps3 and MAME might be a bad idea, since the first is probably a native port, and we got several bug report of "cps1/2 differences with mame" last year that turned out to be MAME inaccuracies.

Would also love to know but I watched a lot of real CPS2 footage in vain...

[dinkc64]

Just fyi I'm going to try to revisit this sometime in the near or not so near future.. hopefully :)

[dinkc64]

@Immersion95
I've got it looking sorta-good in my test build, but I really need more movie files at different scenes. The carnival scene would be nice, because we have footage of how that's supposed to look. Can you help?

[Immersion95]

@Immersion95
I've got it looking sorta-good in my test build, but I really need more movie files at different scenes. The carnival scene would be nice, because we have footage of how that's supposed to look. Can you help?

Of course, what can I do ?

[barbudreadmon]

Of course, what can I do ?

Footage from MAME with the special attack on various stages, and especially the amusement park one, would be nice :)

I found those 2 videos, i suspect the first one is from MAME, the second one is from the xbox360 console port, they contain footage of the special attack on various stages :
https://youtu.be/qohgHUl2t40?t=527
https://youtu.be/cZnOjg4ZMbc?t=73

[dinkc64]

Please read the first & second reply from me in this bug report, I need to be able to see the chaos dimension attack at the amusement park and if possible, another scene that is not the tree w/owl scene.

best regards,

• dink

[Immersion95]

I will definately do it this weekend with MAME :)

[dinkc64]

Immersion95, we need it to be done with FBNeo, windows standalone version using the recording option, please :) From the message at the top: (pasted)
Hi,
In order for me to be able to fix this, I will need an input recording made on the current version of FBNeo standalone (not the libretro version) as I can't make this combo myself. I recommend using the win32/gcc build as it's the most stable:
latest builds can be procured from:
https://github.com/finalburnneo/FBNeo-WIP-Storage-Facility/releases/tag/appveyor-build

Please try to do a few different versions of this combo in the recording if possible :)

how to record: game -> replay -> record input -> OK. The recording file(s) will be in the "recordings" subfolder/directory.

[Immersion95]

Here is my shitty arcade run :p ! Done with the linked fbneo.

I did it in all the stages and finished arcade !
msh-5.zip

[barbudreadmon]

awesome, thanks for this :)

[dinkc64]

Thank you!
There's one last thing I need, this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXvw4N2YfLY
but on a real arcade pcb. I really need to see a chaos dimension on the amusement park on real pcb, because I have conflicting information about how it's really supposed to look on that scene. If that can be found, it would be super helpful :)

[thomasgoldstein]

If we can't find a footage from the arcade version, here's an idea: try to find a footage of the Dreamcast port (or the actual game), assuming it behaves like the arcade version.

[Immersion95]

If we can't find a footage from the arcade version, here's an idea: try to find a footage of the Dreamcast port (or the actual game), assuming it behaves like the arcade version.

There is no Dreamcast port, only PSX & Saturn. PSX changes the effect completely and Saturn kinda looks like FBNeo. The only render that I've never seen is from the CPS2 Board. I've tried to watch every youtube vids but there's nothing. The newest MiSTer CPS2 core displays it like current FBNeo/Saturn. MAME should be the closest one as it is the same effect as the MVSC:Origins' one.

[thomasgoldstein]

Ah, sorry, I got mixed up with Marvel vs Capcom somehow.

[dinkc64]

@Immersion95
Since there is no footage from cps2 board, can you try to find some on mame? The link in the top message stopped working.

[barbudreadmon]

this video is supposed to be from real hardware : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fq9ayzoeoPs&t=8455s

[Immersion95]

I think it's time to close this issue is I'm unsure of the way it should look on real hardware.

I haven't find real footage ressembling MAME and MVC Origins.

[barbudreadmon]

I prefer keeping this issue open as long as we don't know the exact status of this, furthermore i might be able to get some real footage later this week (i'm going to some gaming event and i know there will be cps cabinets)

[Immersion95]

The only real footage that I could find :

https://youtu.be/iC9r26qHtsk at 54:39

Unfortunately this looks like the Saturn version/FBNeo version and it's ugly. It seems to be the real board too.

[barbudreadmon]

It seems to be the real board too.

Yes, it's confirmed in the comments.

I suppose that means our current emulation is right. It might be that the visual effect renders better on an actual crt ?

Well, i'll close this issue new week if nothing new comes up.

[dinkc64]

I have no doubts that we're rendering it correctly, as ugly as it looks - I studied the renderer and scroll registers that get changed during your playthrough on fbneo and it couldn't possibly be any other way :/

I kinda like how the "xbox arcade" ver. does it by shuffling the background layers, though.

best regards,

• dink

[Immersion95]

I was so focused on MAME being more accurate that I didn't even think that this was the correct way even doubting real footage lol.

Still FBNeo isn't displaying it properly (but it's almost perfect).

The only 100% faithful one is from Mister FPGA's Jotego core, here is a video :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVctkwrDqYo&t=390s

You can see that the top layer (where the bar is) is also moving up and down and the space can even be seen. In FBNeo every layer is moving accurately except that one (or those two ?). This is also happening on real CPS2 board.

[dinkc64]

I'm confused here, been messing with the code for hours now, and the game always requests the first raster to start @ visible line 16 (actually 32, but first visible line is 16, so 32-16 = 16)... during the chaos dimension effect.
If I start the raster at the first visible line on the screen, it breaks raster fx everywhere else.

Would it be too much to ask you for a savestate from mame (v0.155, or latest, has to be standalone version) right as you trigger a chaos dimension (hopefully before the raster effect starts)? I would like to do a bit of debugging there to see what's going on.

best regards,

• dink

[Immersion95]

I'm confused here, been messing with the code for hours now, and the game always requests the first raster to start @ visible line 16 (actually 32, but first visible line is 16, so 32-16 = 16)... during the chaos dimension effect. If I start the raster at the first visible line on the screen, it breaks raster fx everywhere else.

Would it be too much to ask you for a savestate from mame (v0.155, or latest, has to be standalone version) right as you trigger a chaos dimension (hopefully before the raster effect starts)? I would like to do a bit of debugging there to see what's going on.

best regards,

• dink

Of course, thanks a lot for your help !

Here it is, I did 2 states - "Chaos Dimension" in MSH with latest MAME 0.243 sta.zip

[Immersion95]

Reopened it in standalone's repo