Mapgen Watershed development

[paramat]

WIP. Terrain is still being tuned, large scale base terrain shape is being reconsidered, a few other things to do, but in a reasonable state and usable.

As this mapgen uses a new node and needs additional mapgen aliases you need to use this mod with it https://github.com/paramat/volcanic
Uses the Biome API just like all other non-mgv6 mapgens so will be compatible with biome system mods like Ethereal.

(Tenplus1: it doesn't have that feature, sorry, but maybe i'll add floatlands).

[nerzhul]

please use pragma once

[paramat]

Will do.

[paramat]

Done.

[paramat]

Build will fail due to LINT sillyness but will whitelist it closer to merge, some of the LINT suggestions may be useful.

[kilbith]

No 👎 One simple mapgen is enough, no need to add new fancy ones.

Joke aside, we should deal with your PR like you with the new proposed features, particularly on the graphics. This isn't fair-play otherwise.

[ghost]

To be fair, and to save paramat the typing, he is currently active to maintain it.

[paramat]

kilbith likes to take any opportunity to pester me.

we should deal with your PR

'we' is not the right word, you're not a MT dev.

[kilbith]

you're not a MT dev.

Yep, fortunatety. People shouldn't consider you as a core-dev either.

[SmallJoker]

How the mapgen currently looks (seed = "watershed") with coordinates around 0,0,0 and 500,0,500:

[pilino1234]

terrain looks like a first draft of a mapgen? 👎

slopes look way to steep to be climbable, and it looks very unnatural (inb4 mt is not meant to be realistic).

[paramat]

pilino1234 is another who likes to take opportunities to pester me, and tends to turn up alongside kilbith, or when i'm in argument. So i don't consider their comments reasonable.

[pilino1234]

So i don't consider their comments reasonable.

your loss. But my point still stands 😄

[paramat]

No, because i know that there are many gentle slopes in it as well as lot of variation and rough areas.
So did you try the mapgen and travel many 1000s of nodes or judge on 2 screenshots?

[benrob0329]

I think the mapgen looks interesting, but also a bit odd. I feel like the huge vertical cliffs here, combined with the huge caves of mgv6, the mountains of mgv7, and the rivers of valleys would make one awesome mapgen, rather than 4 or 5 good ones.

[kilbith]

pilino1234 is another who likes to take opportunities to pester me

You never wondered why you arise such hostility against you in the community? Also pilino1234 is not my henchman, he comes up with some constructive critics and you take it in a personal way. Poor guy, come to London in January if you have guts.

[paramat]

Poor guy, come to London in January if you have guts.

Another physical threat.

[kilbith]

No, an invitation to discuss in face to face. I don't know how do you interpret that as a "physical threat", I never did that.

[benrob0329]

*sigh*

[paramat]

It looks like a physical threat to most, that's all that matters.

[rubenwardy]

Both @kilbith's and @pilino1234's first comments are valid comments, and valid criticisms. What exactly does this mapgen offer that others don't? Why did you open a PR when it's half complete - what do you want feedback on?

Whilst mapgens are mostly self-contained - don't touch other code parts much - it's still something extra to maintain, so should offer something new. For example, better erosion mechanics.

[masrourmouad]

Nice job Paramat , but i think that the mapgen should be self-contained

[paramat]

rubenwardy, they are not valid comments.

we should deal with your PR like you with the new proposed features, particularly on the graphics.

This is obviously taking an opportunity to pester, as it implies my reviews of features are somehow unreasonable, as kilbith believes, so suggests that reviews of this should be unreasonable, which is what pilino1234 then did, and to an extent you did too with your comment.

terrain looks like a first draft of a mapgen?

We have cliff terrain just like this in mgv7. The first screenshot shows cliff terrain running int a mountain, neither screenshot show anything less developed than what you see in other mapgens.

slopes look way to steep to be climbable

These are cliffs, mgv6 and mgv7 also have unclimbable cliff slopes.
The mountain is steep because it is a mountain, mgv7, valleys and carpathian all have steeper mountains than this.
The mapgen has a variety of terrain, there's more than cliffs and steep mountains.

and it looks very unnatural

It's actually designed to be more natural than many mapgens, however i could add another octave of noise to the cliff terrain shape, it's possibly a little too rounded, if that's what you meant.
It seems pilino1234 only looked at 2 screenshots, didn't try the mapgen, then made an effort to be as negative and unreasonable as possible.

---

Rubenwardy your comment gives the impression you are joining in and being overcritical.

This offers things other mapgens don't, more realistic rivers, canyons, volcanos and a mapping feature that allows you to shrink the world to any scale to use as a 3D map.
However also it combines the best features of other mapgens, which is exactly what c55 and hmmmm had in mind for new mapgens.
It's not half finished, it just needs tuning and possibly floatlands adding and a new base terrain shape. The reason i opened it now is because i have been working on it for a long time and realised i could continue tweaking it forever, opening a PR helps me to focus on it by giving me a deadline of 0.5.0.
I don't need any feedback, but reasonable feedback is welcome and will be considered.

When the creators of mgvalleys and mgcarpathian offered their mapgens, i and others were very 'hands-off', allowing them to create what they want and accepting it as long as it was liked and met minimum quality standards. No-one became overly concerned with if it added something new, and gave the authors time. Now that i make one, people are being overcritical and overquestioning, please treat me how i treated the creators of mgvalleys and mgcarpathian. As the magen dev, i will treat myself the way i treated them.

but i think that the mapgen should be self-contained

Why? It's designed to use the Biome API and functions of class MapgenBasic, cavegen, dungeongen etc. so can't be. Our mapgen architecture is all about sharing common functions. If i twas slef-contained no-one could use it with their biome mods or games.

[rubenwardy]

You've just refuted their argument and explained what this PR offers, that's what I was looking for

[rubenwardy]

I will say that the behaviour of kilbith in this thread was completely unprofessional and uncalled for

[kilbith]

I will say that the behaviour of kilbith in this thread was completely unprofessional

Minetest is not a professional organization.

[HummusSamurai]

I rarely get to comment here because of inactivity, but I must say this is very pretty!

I adore the flat mountain tops and the evil looking mountains and the water bodies.

I hope it gets merged soon.

[pilino1234]

then made an effort to be as negative and unreasonable as possible.

it's your job as the author of this pr to convince people that adding yet another mapgen is necessary (by providing screenshots etc.)
what does this new mapgen provide that other mapgens don't provide by tweaking their "essential, non-negotiable" mapgen parameters that there are so many (and so little user-friendly docs) of? Currently, all the mapgens feel like similar iterations of the same thing.

only looked at 2 screenshots, didn't try the mapgen

Yup, when i wrote the comment i had only seen the two screenshots that Krock had provided, because there was nothing else available.
I've tested the mapgen for quite a bit now, and find that especially the jungle terrains extend for extremely long distances. considering that jungle is a pain to travel through as a player, i suggest reducing the size of the jungles. The actual terrain looks nice enough, but I feel it's too similar to previous mapgens to warrant adding yet another one.

[Ezhh]

Looking forward to wandering round those volcanoes. :)

[srifqi]

So, we have obsidian volcanoes? Woah!

[catagent101]

I really like the plateaus, they look like great places to build a home on, since they have a nice view of the area below. The volcanoes are also impressive.

[C1ffisme]

I actually think this mapgen looks pretty cool, although I agree with the people that say that this is a little too steep. (Although a part of me wants it to be as steep as it currently is, because that's part of the "wow" factor of this mapgen.)

[paramat]

The volcanos are lined with a new node 'volcanic rock'.
The screenshots above only show steep terrain, there are more gentle slopes elsewhere (that admittedly need tuning).

[paramat]

Removed screenshots.
I was hoping opening this PR would help me to complete the mapgen but i realise there is still much to do. I'll reopen in a new PR later.