Monero Community Workgroup Meeting: Saturday 11th May 15:00UTC

[plowsof]

Location: Libera.chat, #monero-community | Matrix

Instructions for joining the monero.social Matrix server.

Time
15:00 UTC Check your timezone

Moderator: plowsof

Please reach out in advance of the meeting if you would like to propose an agenda item.

Proposed Meeting Items:

1. Introduction
2. Greetings
3. Community highlights
   • LocalMonero winding down localmonero.co
   • Geonics film ft. Monero in the news decrypt.co
   • andrea writes article regarding the recent samourai situation mises.org
   • Feather versions 2.6.5 and below are no longer able to send transactions. Upgrade to the latest version to fix the issue. Details @ https://featherwallet.org/changelog/
   • CypherStack release GBP paper monerologs.net issue foud by kayabanerve and corrected monerologs.net
     News: Monero Observer - Revuo Monero - The Monero Standard - Monero Moon
4. CCS updates | Payout requests: selsta / 0xffff / j-berman / hinto / escapethe3ra / jeffro256

a. Seraphis General Paper Review
b. Droplet - A New Easy To Use Mobile Wallet
c. New Monero Website
d. How to mine Monero guide
e. j-berman full-time development (3 months)
f. I2P SAMv3
g. hinto-janai full-time work on Cuprate (3 months)
h. ofrnxmr feat. BasicSwapDEX - take over the world pt 2
i. v1docq47 - monerotopia 2023 (part 3) and monerokon 2023 (part 2) voiceovers and working on xmr.ru
6. Workgroup reports
a. Dev workgroup
b. Localization workgroup
c. Outreach workgroup
d. Events workgroup - MoneroKon 2024
e. Website workgroup
f. Policy workgroup
g. Research workgroup
h. Seraphis Migration workgroup
7. Open ideas time
8. Confirm next meeting date/time

Previous meeting including logs

Meeting logs will be posted here afterwards.

[plowsof]

Logs

< plowsof > Meeting in 2 hours~ #1002

< p​lowsof:matrix.org > Meeting time, greetings! #1002 follow on monerologs.org if you're on matrix dot org 👍️

< plowsof > hi

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > hi

< spackle > hi

< l​m:matrix.baermail.fr > hello

< m​ichael:monero.social > Hello.

< plowsof > quite alot has happened over the previous 2 weeks

< v1docq47 > hi

< plowsof > another spam attack? Local monero winding down? localmonero.co ... the exact reasons are still speculation. andrea released a nice blog about recent events which could have had an effect mises.org

< plowsof > Haveno soon?

< h​into:monero.social > hello

< plowsof > Geonics film ft. Monero in the news decrypt.co

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > Seems like a lot of people are gonna be late. We lost our schedule over one week without meeting 😝

< plowsof > moneros mustery resource issue with many large tx's in mempool??

< plowsof > cuprate project has began their weekly meetings also?

< plowsof > a full ccs ideas page https://ccs.getmonero.org/ideas/ (some causing quite the stir!)

< plowsof > bounties site going well.. in fact the next payout due is for tobtoht for adding manual / fee tiers into feather

< nioCat > and one funding required https://ccs.getmonero.org/proposals/selsta-13.html

< plowsof > kuno had a scammer, tldr is he approached merchants with some monero stickers and a fake story about a prize draw... took some videos in the venue... and obtained some donations... the vendors had no idea he was claiming to have onboarded them ehh

< r​ucknium:monero.social > The Solve4Monero funding proposal was rejected by the MAGIC Monero Fund: MAGICGrants/Monero-Fund#28 (comment) "The main concerns of the committee members were about the lack of experience of the programmers involved, the fact that the open source license status of the project is unclear, and some members thought the proposal filled a niche

< r​ucknium:monero.social > that other projects already filled."

< plowsof > thanks niocCat, Raised 130 of 159 XMR.. can the general fund beat the donors this time?

< selsta > nioCat: ty for posting

< plowsof > thanks for the update on that Rucknium

< plowsof > any other recent events people wish to bring up?

< c​t:xmr.mx > hello, sorry for beeing late

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > G4 Geostorm might bring monero.social instance down later in the day apparently

< plowsof > monero moon published an issue after some inactivity https://www.themoneromoon.com/p/the-monero-moon-issue-65

< plowsof > and revuo monero from rottenwheel is continuing strongly with regular articles https://www.revuo-xmr.com/

< plowsof > ah yes, Datahoarder mentioned that, thanks syntheticbird , hopefully it doesnt cause any other issues

< DataHoarder > G5 now :)

< plowsof > i assume the increasing number means is more bad instead of more .. not bad

< DataHoarder > no more glitching so far, seems it was just the initial upset event that caused reorg of the grid

< r​ucknium:monero.social > IIRC, it's the the IRC<>Matrix bridge that could be affected, not the monero.social Matrix server.

< DataHoarder > it was G5 already, just again G4/G5

< DataHoarder > and yep, just stuff that was hosted by me

< DataHoarder > if it's seen again overnight I'll try to send an update, but seems ok now

< plowsof > would a potential ccs protect m=relay from the sun?

< plowsof > hide it behind a solar panel?

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > now that's some ccs optimization

< plowsof > should we move into the ccs ideas unless there are other things to touch on?

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > we can move on

< plowsof > 5. CCS updates | Payout requests: selsta / 0xffff /

< plowsof > j-berman / hinto

< plowsof > those awaiting payout still i can poke the luigis / or feel free to poke yourselves now merge list

< plowsof > a. Seraphis General Paper Review

< plowsof > seems like this proposal is going to be closed judging by some passing coments in no wallet left behind .. but we dont need to discuss in detail here

< plowsof > b. Droplet - A New Easy To Use Mobile Wallet

< plowsof > merge / close please vote

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > merge

< plowsof > dethe talented dev, the current proposal just doesnt seem to be a hit at this moment.. close

< c​t:xmr.mx > huh, i kinda thought it was decided to be closed for now?

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > fair enough.

< c​t:xmr.mx > dethe said: >It was initially planned as RPC, but looks like this proposal will get closed unfortunately. The project isn't over, I have much bigger plans including LWS wallet

< plowsof > yeah just re airing in case

< plowsof > id like to see a return... maybe with some basic features / beginnings of lws support (we dont have any LWS wallets other than mymonreo)

< plowsof > lets move on

< plowsof > c. New Monero Website

< plowsof > popular idea, plenty of updoots

< plowsof > i was in favour of just the first milestone and adjusting of the rates/hours in the comments there

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > afaik the issue with second milestone is that janaka wanted to use AI to serve as a basis right ?

< r​ucknium:monero.social > "Ensure validated, accurate, up-to-date content, with all links working." Does this mean that all links/URLs in the current website will stay alive? I hope so. Even if those pages are not reachable from the new website. The pages may be linked from other resources outside of the website.

< plowsof > basically the whole things ,, a website written in astro, with no uh content management system (a suggestion was given by siren to go with something else)

< r​4v3r23:monero.social > +1 for website

< plowsof > all links working -> theres some automated github / accout who points out broken links

< s​iren:kernal.eu > my suggestion (imo a must) is using a site generator such as hugo and vitepress

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > what is a content management system in this context

< s​iren:kernal.eu > it's a site generator

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > I disagree with Siren Astro is already a good SSG that ship zerojs by default. Hugo and vitepress have less features and ergonomics

< plowsof > enter astro and content management system in a search engine

< plowsof > thats why i say its premature

< s​iren:kernal.eu > you're comparing pears to apples

< plowsof > the proposor would come out of the gate with all this

< h​into:monero.social > does core (or whoever deploys to monero-site) have any opinion on this? I would assume they would have to adjust to these changes

< s​iren:kernal.eu > I don't care but most people out there would want to write posts in markdown

< s​iren:kernal.eu > if it can do that much, it's acceptable

< plowsof > if the proposal is put forward, i fear we may get a pretty looking english site which needs to be remade from the ground up to itegrate it into some CMS thing .. more dissapointment for donors who wonder why isnt the new site deployed on getmonero

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > Astro support markdown -> pages out of the box.

< s​iren:kernal.eu > yes so it's not difficult to reinvent the wheel here a little and make it behave like a site generator

< s​iren:kernal.eu > but for the time being it is not rendering from markdown https://github.com/Janaka-Steph/monero-website/blob/main/src/pages/community/index.astro

< plowsof > premature proposal from someone who hasnt contirbuted to the current monero-site (pull request/review/comments), dropping to 1st milestone rates/hours adjustment is my opinion. if the proposal as whole is ok then share your approval

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > I think it would have been great if janaka was here to respond. There is not much we can discuss since he is the one that will ultimately write everything. We need to know whats his opinion on using hugo or other SSG, or if he is willing to adapt its Astro project to mdx pages

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > I think the proposal is ok, so maybe not merge but at least don't close it

< plowsof > ch3003 ack'd there would be a meeting today, but did not attend lets move on https://libera.monerologs.net/monero-site/20240508#c374507

< plowsof > d. How to mine Monero guide

< plowsof > moneroguides are back. i likes their previous series. calm and collected instructions

< plowsof > the 2 scripts / drafts for the proposed videos are already up , linked in the proposal https://github.com/moneroguides/2x01-mining-basics/blob/main/script.md / and https://github.com/moneroguides/2x02-setting-up-your-rig/blob/main/script.md (mining related)

< plowsof > hinto i will check sites back end admins opinion on this (new monero site)

< plowsof > if this is the first you are seeing these scripts then a proof read / thoughts may be too short notice. but they are there and awaiting feedback :)

< plowsof > we can move on unless someone has thoughts to share?

< r​ucknium:monero.social > This script combines how to mine Monero with why to mine Monero (besides the profit motive). Is that intended?

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > The video assume you've watched their video on Monero concepts. I believe it is intended

< r​ucknium:monero.social > It seems like a long script for someone who wants to click a few buttons to start earning money with their CPU.

< r​ucknium:monero.social > I'm not against it. Just an observation.

< plowsof > they may just join the matrix mining group and ask "how do i mine with my gpu?" instead? it happens still

< plowsof > alot of people are impatient yes

< c​t:xmr.mx > but you only earn money with your cpu if you know what you are doing

< plowsof > so a note about the video length (if its too long)

< plowsof > im confident in the wuality of the previous works to gather feedback from the community to create some videos we want. its a small shame they decided the topics without asking first but here we are

< plowsof > quality*

< c​t:xmr.mx > if you open monero gui and click "mine" you most likely loose money against all the other highly optimized setups unless your power is free. So yeah, a thorough guide that is easy to digest might be worth it

< plowsof > mining / how to mine are hot topics

< c​t:xmr.mx > will read the scripts after this meeting

< plowsof > thanks. i think we can move on and let the proposal gather feedback

< r​ucknium:monero.social > ceetee.mx: The draft script talks about how mining difficulty is calculated in detail, for example.

< plowsof > too long, maybe too many details.. could it be condensed

< l​m:matrix.baermail.fr > specially if it's an "introduction" video

< plowsof > moving on for now, good points

< plowsof > e. j-berman full-time development (3 months)

< plowsof > its j-berman

< r​ucknium:monero.social > +1 j-berman merge

< r​4v3r23:monero.social > auto-merge

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > couldn't have said it better: auto-merge

< c​t:xmr.mx > merge

< c​t:xmr.mx > new rates are fair

< r​ucknium:monero.social > I do not agree with the comments on the CCS about the cost. Good programmers who can work with Monero's C++ code are valuable.

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > Yes

< c​t:xmr.mx > ofrn asked, and got a very good detailed explanation

< c​t:xmr.mx > elaborating why the cost is fair

< r​ucknium:monero.social > And they could be working for someone else. j-berman worked for Haven (not Haveno) in 2021, a fork of Monero.

< r​ucknium:monero.social > There are many forks of Monero and cryptonote that could attract Monero protocol developers.

< plowsof > thanks for the feedback. i would say the self promotions every quarter are not realistic for the long term (in other places where market rates are given 2-5 % yearly or 10%? for a promotion is more realistic

< plowsof > but the current rates are great / still awesome value. jberman is not only a developer

< c​t:xmr.mx > i think we got a great deal before, and those were "get to know each other" rates

< plowsof > i think we can move on with 5 mins left as to not go over too much

< plowsof > f. I2P SAMv3

< plowsof > i have no problem skipping this proposal, as theres a gaping "to be decided" (the person who will actually do the work)

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > you can skip

< plowsof > g. hinto-janai full-time work on Cuprate (3 months)

< r​ucknium:monero.social > IMHO, this proposal gives great detail, but it is missing info about the bigger picture. What's the benefit/downsides of having an integrated vs non-integrated i2p? What's the security model of nodes inside i2p? What about i2p nodes being cut off from the clearnet Monero network?

< plowsof > thanks Rucknium, great points

< r​ucknium:monero.social > I didn't check hinto's work on database, but I think supporting cuprate is important because the C++ monerod has a lot of technical debt and bottlenecks that we are discovering with the unusual transaction loads recently.

< plowsof > hintos github shows his insane activity, not surprised a reduction in hours is requested.

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > hinto-janai did an excellent work last CCS and I would like to confidently say auto-merge. They have explained their new rates in their gist. There is also a small delay (1 months) in which without hinto, boog900 will be alone working on cuprate

< plowsof > my only concern is that hinto is actively seeking other employment? what happens if one of the 16 job offers is too good to refuse. should the cuprate team not be seeking a replacement?

< r​ucknium:monero.social > Monero cannot scale with the current monertod codebase. Hopefully the C++ codebase will improve, but cuprate can help figure out better designs, discover where the bottlenecks in monerod are, and possibly provide a faster, more reliable remote node experience.

< plowsof > is that even a bad thing?

< r​ucknium:monero.social > monerod*

< plowsof > hinto will you leave us???? sir?

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > I can't speak for hinto, but yamabiiko and me will be working on Cuprate next month. So that's already a margin in case hinto decide to leave

< plowsof > stop applying for jobs when we're paying you to work on cuprate!!! :D

< h​into:monero.social > To clarify: only some of 16 jobs listed were offers, rest were either just a contact of interest from the company or me simply being interested in the job

< h​into:monero.social > I am not actively seeking employment and have not since last year October when I started discussing Cuprate's database with Boog900

< plowsof > ok thanks for clarifying and others for feedback

< plowsof > ofrnxmr's new idea.. we can skip and return after mentioning v1dos proposal

< plowsof > i. v1docq47 - monerotopia 2023 (part 3) and monerokon 2023 (part 2) voiceovers and working on xmr.ru

< s​iren:kernal.eu > even if you were seeking employment or were employed, we should be result oriented ;)

< plowsof > what usually happens for v1do's proposal is we reach out to the xmr.ru community and wait for some feedback.. it gets merged and funded. sound good?

< c​t:xmr.mx > sounds good

< plowsof > thank you for attending v1do!

< p​lowsof:matrix.org > v1docq48:

< plowsof > moving on to ofrnxmrs new proposal

< plowsof > h. ofrnxmr feat. BasicSwapDEX - take over the world pt 2

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > oh boy

< v1docq47 > np, plowsof you can ping XMR.RU telegram

< plowsof > i have deleted the fake comment from tecnovert AND one other troll comment where they where going down a line of "i worked with hi privately and he scammed me! me too" without evidence. so i felt justified in removing.

< v1docq47 > ill add the news to the next issue of monero news (youtube)

< plowsof > will do v1do 👍

< plowsof > the rest ehh.. remain unless they too should be deleted, or preserved to show 'whats happening'

< c​t:xmr.mx > honestly I'd rather keep it

< plowsof > (from the sock accounts*) like.. the 'price went down' is gold

< plowsof > lol

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > As I said before, I've discussed with particl devs, and they weren't aware of ofrnxmr's CCS proposal. I can't share more informations about it, but my take is close it

< plowsof > syntheticbird reached out to the tecnodevs / ajs requested the comment in a gist to reveal the imposter

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > about it, at the moment*

< c​t:xmr.mx > there is some fuckery going on that is way worse then ofrn

< c​t:xmr.mx > i commented earlier today on the proposal

< c​t:xmr.mx > for now, I'd definitely keep it open just to see what happens next

< plowsof > i think 'that' situation there is almost seperate to the entire proposal (such an event can happen to any proposer) . we can filter certain alias email servers and require manual verification to dampen this in the future

< h​into:monero.social > has there been any public responses/confirmations from the BasicSwap devs about this proposal?

< plowsof > only that the account(s) did not belong to them. further, no public statement

< c​t:xmr.mx > so far i did not get a reply

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > I asked to, but as you can see there are none yet, for good reasons. If the proposal isn't closed, it'll hopefully be more clear in the coming weeks

< c​t:xmr.mx > specifically, I texted the guy who was presenting at monerokon last year

< p​lowsof:matrix.org > @cryptoguard:matrix.org is somewhat of a community/dev manager as i understand it and may have some comments

< c​t:xmr.mx > mentioning this so that we dont flood them with questions

< plowsof > ofrnxmr isnt here but he messaged me that cryptoguard would have something to say

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > Yes, cryptoguard should be able to clarify

< plowsof > yeah they are/have already been at Monerokon (basicswap) , and recently listed on getmonero

< l​m:matrix.baermail.fr > regardless of what the devs of basicswap thoughts on it, the proposol is of low details with only information on distribution of the payout without explanation.

< plowsof > thanks for commenting on the gitlab ct

< s​yntheticbird:monero.social > The current proposal is disastreous to say the least, that ofrn find an agreements with devs or not, the entire document have to be rewrite from scratch.

< plowsof > thanks for the feedback all so far

< plowsof > i think we can end it there while discussions continue?

< plowsof > adding a monerokon blog to site qould benefit from some feedback too monero-project/monero-site#2292

< c​t:xmr.mx > yeah i'm curious what happens in the time till next meeting

< plowsof > thank you all for attending and sorry for going over rushing over things >_<

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