dail2017-01-31a.xml

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>

<!DOCTYPE publicwhip
[
<!ENTITY aacute "&#225;" >
<!ENTITY eacute "&#233;" >
<!ENTITY iacute "&#237;" >
<!ENTITY oacute "&#243;" >
<!ENTITY uacute "&#250;" >
<!ENTITY yacute "&#253;" >
<!ENTITY yen    "&#165;" >

<!ENTITY Aacute "&#193;" >
<!ENTITY Acirc  "&#194;" > 
<!ENTITY Eacute "&#201;" >
<!ENTITY Iacute "&#205;" >
<!ENTITY Oacute "&#211;" >
<!ENTITY Uacute "&#218;" >
<!ENTITY zcaron  "&#381;" > 
<!ENTITY hellip  "..." >
<!ENTITY bullet  "&#8226;" >
<!ENTITY Dagger  "&#8224;" >
<!ENTITY eth  "&#240;">

<!ENTITY ndash   "&#8211;">
<!ENTITY mdash   "&#8212;">
<!ENTITY iexcl   "&#161;">
<!ENTITY divide  "&#247;">
<!ENTITY euro    "&#8364;">
<!ENTITY trade   "&#8482;">
<!ENTITY bull    "&#8226;">
<!ENTITY lsquo   "&#8216;">
<!ENTITY rsquo   "&#8217;">
<!ENTITY sbquo   "&#8218;">
<!ENTITY ldquo   "&#8220;">
<!ENTITY rdquo   "&#8221;">
<!ENTITY bdquo   "&#8222;">
<!ENTITY dagger  "&#8224;">

<!ENTITY Scaron "&#352;" >
<!ENTITY scaron "&#353;" >
<!ENTITY Ouml   "&#214;" >
<!ENTITY szlig  "&#223;" >
<!ENTITY agrave "&#224;" >
<!ENTITY acirc  "&#226;" >
<!ENTITY atilde "&#227;" >
<!ENTITY auml   "&#228;" >
<!ENTITY ccedil "&#231;" >
<!ENTITY Ccedil "&#199;" >
<!ENTITY egrave "&#232;" >
<!ENTITY ograve "&#243;" >
<!ENTITY Egrave "&#200;" >
<!ENTITY ecirc  "&#234;" >
<!ENTITY euml   "&#235;" >
<!ENTITY icirc  "&#238;" >
<!ENTITY igrave "&#204;" >
<!ENTITY iuml	"&#239;" >
<!ENTITY ntilde "&#241;" >
<!ENTITY nbsp   "&#160;" >
<!ENTITY ocirc  "&#244;" >
<!ENTITY ouml   "&#246;" >
<!ENTITY oslash "&#248;" >
<!ENTITY uuml   "&#252;" >
<!ENTITY ucirc  "&#251;" >
<!ENTITY thorn  "&#254;" >
<!ENTITY Icirc  "&#206;" >

<!ENTITY pound  "&#163;" >
<!ENTITY sect   "&#167;" >
<!ENTITY copy   "&#169;" >
<!ENTITY reg    "&#174;" >
<!ENTITY deg    "&#176;" >
<!ENTITY plusmn "&#177;" >
<!ENTITY sup2   "&#178;" >
<!ENTITY sup3   "&#179;" >
<!ENTITY micro  "&#181;" >
<!ENTITY para   "&#182;" >
<!ENTITY middot "&#183;" >
<!ENTITY ordm   "&#186;" >
<!ENTITY frac14 "&#188;" >
<!ENTITY frac12 "&#189;" >
<!ENTITY frac34 "&#190;" >
<!ENTITY oelig "&#339;" >
<!ENTITY aelig  "&#230;" >
<!ENTITY Aring  "&#197;" >
<!ENTITY aring  "&#229;" >
]>


<publicwhip scrapeversion="a" latest="yes">
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.1" nospeaker="true" time="14:00:00" url="">Prelude</minor-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.2" nospeaker="true" time="14:00:00" ><p>Chuaigh an Ceann Comhairle i gceannas ar 2 p.m.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.3" nospeaker="true" time="14:00:00" ><p>Prayer.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.4" nospeaker="true" time="14:00:00" ><p>Paidir.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.5" nospeaker="true" time="14:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100003#A00100">Leaders' Questions</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.6" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="14:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100003#A00200"><p>Ireland and the United States of America have always had a very special and historical relationship and all efforts should be focused on maintaining that.  That said, the events of the past seven days have left people extremely concerned about what is happening.  Apart from the casual attempt to humiliate the Mexican President, there has been an executive order essentially arbitrarily banning from the United States millions of people from seven different nations on the basis of religion and nationality.  This is completely unacceptable.  It stigmatises an entire religion and associates it with terrorism and mayhem.  It is also dangerous in that it emboldens others to act against people of the Muslim faith.  The ban contravenes the Geneva Convention and offends our concept of human decency, our values and religious liberty.</p>  <p>  It is striking to note the contrast between how the world reacted to the refugee question after the Second World War and how the world today, particularly democracies, is reacting.  After the Second World War, we had open doors whereas democracies are now closing their doors to genuine refugees from war-torn areas.  In that context, it is very heartening to see the Jewish community standing shoulder to shoulder with their Muslim brethren in defending them against this particular ban.</p>  <p>  There is no logic to the ban in terms of what it sets out to achieve.  As a matter of fact, US born citizens have been responsible for the majority of the heinous terrorist acts that have occurred on US soil.  America was built on immigration and refugees, which have been an essential ingredient in the entrepreneurial flair and economic development that occurred in the United States.  It is interesting that many of the major companies in the technology industry, for example, Google, Facebook, Lyft, Airbnb and Viber, have given large donations to the American Civil Liberties Union to fight cases and defend those who have been affected by the ban.  The ban is damaging to America and the world. </p><p> I believe the Taoiseach should proceed with his visit to the United States.  It is important in terms of the historical relationship I mentioned earlier.  It is not just about a bowl of shamrock.  I also believe the pre-clearance facility should be maintained because to get rid of it would be to disadvantage the more than 1.5 million who travel on an annual basis.</p> <p> We need a commitment from the Taoiseach that he will state publicly that the ban is morally wrong and violates the Geneva Convention in respect of refugees and discriminates on the basis of religion and nationality.  Does the Taoiseach accept that and will he say so in those terms?  Has the Taoiseach written to President Trump conveying the Government's opposition to this executive order and has he asked him to repeal it?  If not, will he commit to so doing?  Will the Taoiseach agree to an all-party motion strongly opposing this ban and conveying our Parliament's unified and unanimous opposition to it?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.8" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:05:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100004#B00200"><p>On 27 January the President of the United States signed an executive order expressed to be done under the powers vested in him under the US Constitution and the laws of the United States, including the Immigration and Nationality Act, INA.  The precise meaning of a number of the provisions of the executive order are uncertain.  Federal judges in Brooklyn, Massachusetts, Virginia and Washington have issued rulings preventing persons claiming refugee status being sent back to their home countries and the removal or deportation from the United States of persons claiming refugee status pending full court hearings.  The legal position is evolving, as we are now aware.  On Sunday, 29 January, the Chief of Staff stated that green card holders from the seven banned countries would not be prevented from returning to the United States, going forward.  This appeared to be a reversal of one of the key components of the executive order made the previous Friday.  In the case of holders of dual nationality and dual passports, clarifications have issued from the USA in the past 24 hours to the effect that if the holder uses his or her passport from the country not listed in the executive order he or she will be entitled to be admitted to the USA.  The legality of the executive order and US immigration rules are entirely a matter for the US courts.</p>  <p>  Deputy Martin will be aware that Ireland has granted citizenship to approximately 5,000 people from the seven countries involved.  Therefore, they have Irish passports and, for instance, Syrian passports.  Clarification has now been received to the effect that if one of those persons presents an Irish passport at the point of pre-clearance either in Dublin or Shannon, it is on that passport he or she will be judged and will not be refused entry to the United States.  There are a number of important points to be made on this issue.  The rights available to refugees or persons wishing to seek asylum in Ireland remain unchanged.  Those applying for asylum having arrived in this country or having been transit passengers withdraw from or do not succeed in getting pre-clearance will be considered in each case under the International Protection Act 2015.  In other words, if they are turned back at US immigration in Dublin or Shannon and they come back into the Irish setting they are then dealt with under the International Protection Act 2015.  As I said, the situation with regard to dual Irish-prohibited states nationals has been clarified.  On presentation of an Irish passport they will not be hindered from entering the United States.</p>  <p>  Ireland will continue to consider any immigration matters arising from the executive order in line with Irish law.  I intend to go to the United States to speak directly to the US President.  This morning, the Cabinet was fully in favour of retaining our pre-clearance facility and the Attorney General has confirmed that the issue in so far as the legality is concerned is a matter for the United States courts.  In so far as Ireland is concerned, we are in compliance with human rights legislation and in accordance with our own Constitution.  Pre-clearance is an important element for Ireland and it is available in Shannon and Dublin.  Many other airports have sought it.  I have already condemned torture and breaches of human rights in any country around the world and will continue to do so very vociferously.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.9" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="14:05:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100004#B00300"><p>The Taoiseach has not answered any of the specific questions I put to him.  The essential issue is the moral authority that governs the enactment of the executive order.  I ask the Taoiseach if he would publicly state that the ban is morally wrong and violates the Geneva Convention in respect of refugees and discriminates on the basis of religion and nationality.</p><p>Does the Taoiseach accept that is the essence of the executive order?  We could discuss legal clarity and the evolution of the legal issues but the fundamental point is that there was political intent militating against the populations of the seven nations.  This is unacceptable in terms of how democracies operate and behave.  I refer in particular to a country such as the United States, which, as I have said, was built on immigration, religious freedom and civil liberties.  The order offends those very concepts.</p> <p> I asked the Taoiseach whether he would agree to an all-party motion strongly opposing this executive order.  I asked him whether he wrote to President Trump.  He might confirm whether he did.  Does he intend to write to him?  Will he write to him conveying the Government's opposition?  I have heard about concern and heard the Taoiseach stating he has examined this, that and the other but I have not heard the fact that this is wrong being clearly articulated.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.11" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:15:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100005#C00200"><p>I do not object to an all-party motion provided we can come to an agreement on it.  I do not want circumstances in which we are expected to have all-party motions every week.  There have been a number of executive orders signed in the first ten days of the US presidency.  As a member of the Government, I have condemned torture, waterboarding and breaches of human rights around the world.  I have not written to the US President because I intend to visit him in the Oval Office in the White House and say my piece publicly - both before and then.  President Trump is well used to disagreements and will obviously have many more in the time ahead.</p>  <p>  This is not just about visits to the US President, as Deputy Martin knows.  We have very long-established traditions with United States.  We were those emigrants who first saw Miss Liberty appearing out of the Hudson fog and said we had realised our ambition to be able to go to the United States.  We want to hold on to pre-clearance, and that is subject to the international agreement between the two parties.</p>  <p>  I fully agree that it is not righteous or correct policy to ban on the basis of country, nationality or creed.  I have said that publicly already.  If the drafting of an all-party motion can be achieved, I will have no objection to it.  This is an issue that affects people from all over the world.  I am merely pointing out, in the context of pre-clearance and the position of our people here in Ireland, the clarifications that are evolving from the White House in respect of the order issued by the US President.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.12" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="14:15:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100005#C00300"><p>I also wish to raise with the Taoiseach the executive order introduced by US President Donald Trump last week to halt the US refugee programme and the introduction by him of a travel ban for nationals from seven Muslim majority countries.  If we can get agreement on an all-party motion, Sinn F&eacute;in will be up for that.  This executive order is a breach of EU and UN obligations, in addition to being a subversion of acceptable standards of decency and equality.</p>  <p>  It is disappointing that the Taoiseach has yet to raise this matter with the US Administration.  He should have expressed his opposition to the blanket 90-day travel ban for nationals from Iran, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria and Yemen.  He should have made it clear that he will not be implementing this executive order at pre-clearance centres in Dublin and Shannon.  This order will certainly undermine efforts to improve relationships between those of all faiths and nationalities throughout the world.</p>  <p>  As the Taoiseach just said, generations of Irish fled starvation, poverty and conflict here to make a new life and contribute to building America.  Millions of them and their descendants are still there.  Let us note that they are among the most outraged over these recent months.  This D&aacute;il should note that very many Americans are opposed to President Trump's policies.</p>  <p>  The Taoiseach should have acted more decisively on this matter.  I acknowledge he has initiated a review, which is welcome, but the Government's primary responsibility must be to ensure this fundamentally unjust order is not used in Irish airports.  I would like the Taoiseach to make that clear in his response.  He needs to introduce measures, if necessary, to ensure no one is a victim of discrimination and that no international or domestic law is broken.  He needs to ensure that this State's obligations under the European Convention on Human Rights and other international agreements are fully observed.</p><p> There have been widespread protests in the USA and an understandable and justifiable international outcry at the actions of the Trump Administration.  Will the Taoiseach take this opportunity to advise the undocumented Irish in the USA not to be alarmed by recent developments?  Like the Taoiseach, I know from my contacts that many people there are frightened for their futures.  Will the Taoiseach meet them when he travels to the USA?  His primary focus has to be to engage with the diaspora, stand with the undocumented Irish and maintain our strong ties with Irish America, particularly as regards the ongoing process of change on this island.  Will the Taoiseach assert clearly the Irish people's total opposition in the strongest possible terms to the racist, anti-women and anti-immigration policies of President Trump?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.14" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100006#D00200"><p>Yes.  Deputy Adams speaks about contact with the Administration.  Obviously, diplomatic contact has been made.  We have had clarification from the Customs and Border Protection people in respect of the matters I mentioned.  Clearly, this is a matter of serious concern not just for Irish people or for those holding dual nationalities and dual passports here, but for people from all over the world.</p>  <p>  The Minister, Deputy Flanagan, is on his way to Washington today and will be speaking with Speaker Ryan tomorrow in respect of this matter.  Clearly, Congress has a serious issue to deal with in terms of its discussions about this particular order.</p>  <p>  I intend to meet the undocumented Irish in Washington and other locations, as will every Minister, Deputy Adams, who travels to America for the St. Patrick's week celebrations, the St. Patrick's week presentations and so on.</p>  <p>  No person is vulnerable to being deported from here or being removed from the country because, under section 12 of the Aviation (Preclearance) Act 2009, if people are turned back at a preclearance facility either in Shannon or in Dublin and are looking for refugee status or whatever, they are then dealt with under Irish law.  We are fully compliant with the international norms and requirements on us.  Obviously, we have had legal advice in respect of that at Government level.</p>  <p>  We have made this point and will continue to make it very clearly, as other leaders around the world will do, that blanket bans on any country on the basis of religion are not morally acceptable.  I disagree entirely with the policy that has been laid out.  Clarifications are evolving and some have been given in the past 24 hours to us here from the Customs and Border Protection personnel in Washington, who have been contacted formally by Ireland.</p>  <p>  There are typically 325,000 passengers arriving in the United States every day.  While all passengers can be subject to secondary screening, usually fewer than 1% are referred for such screening.  The US authorities are very conscious of the good relationship that has existed between Ireland and the US for very many reasons and for very many years.  They are fully aware of the preclearance facilities and their value and they are anxious that they would be continued for the future, as are we.  We want to be perfectly clear, however, that we are fully compliant with human rights legislation. There is no infringement in that regard and the issues that are arising now legally are strictly a matter for the American courts.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.15" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="14:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100006#D00300"><p>I am still disappointed that the Taoiseach has not raised his opposition to this ban directly with the Trump Administration.  I wrote to the Taoiseach last week about this.  I also wrote to President Trump.  The Taoiseach could have done the same.  He is the Taoiseach and represents the people of this State.</p>  <p>  The celebration of St. Patrick's Day in the USA is not the province of any US President, tradition or political party.  These celebrations are inclusive and they cover a wide range of opinions, ethnic backgrounds and people of all colours and creeds.  Sinn F&eacute;in has played a positive role in building and supporting Ireland's relationship with the USA.  We will continue to do so.</p><p>However, we have also consistently criticised successive Administrations on their policies, both publicly and directly with Presidents Clinton, Bush and Obama.  Our main engagement is with Irish America.  It is the bridge between this island and the people in the USA.  Many of them are as appalled as anyone else by the racist, anti-women and anti-immigration policies of President Trump.  Does the Taoiseach agree that as well as standing up and against President Trump's unacceptable policies, we need to keep building support within the USA for the process of change in our own country?  That is not something the Government has done in the past.  I ask the Taoiseach to commit to doing that in a better way in the future.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.17" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:25:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100007#E00200"><p>I reject that assertion from Deputy Adams.  We have been very active over many years in dealing with the Administrations and members of the opposition in the United States.  He is aware that I have had the privilege in recent years of being in Washington for St. Patrick's Day.  It is not just about meeting the President but the Vice President, the Speaker of the House, the Irish caucus, members of the Republican Party and the Democratic Party, the immigrant associations, the emigrant associations, the Irish Lobby for Immigration Reform, ILIR, the United States Chamber of Commerce, the Irish diaspora and so many other elements of Irish United States business.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.18" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="14:25:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100007#E00300"><p>Will the Taoiseach give them a vote?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.19" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:25:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100007#E00400"><p>Every single person who represents us in this case will do the same in the United States right across America.  It is more important than ever before that Ireland's voice would be heard and that we stand up for values and integrity.  We were those people for two and a half centuries.  I will stand up for the undocumented Irish.  If they are to make America great, they have every right to pursue a legitimate policy of becoming US citizens, if that is their wish.  I will not leave 50,000 of them isolated and on their own this St. Patrick's week.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.20" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1317" speakername="Martin Ferris" time="14:25:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100007#E00500"><p>Is the Taoiseach going to give them the vote?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.21" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:25:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100007#E00600"><p>It is more important than ever that Ireland's voice would be heard.  Right across America we have influence and we will use it in a right and proper fashion.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.22" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="14:25:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100007#E00700"><p>Will the Taoiseach write to President Trump?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.23" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1263" speakername="Michael Collins" time="14:25:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100007#E00800"><p>In recent years community and voluntary groups the length and breadth of this island kept the country going when at times it looked like an impossible task.  In particular, in rural Ireland when few other supports were at hand, the community and voluntary sector came to the forefront in delivering local services such as meals on wheels, tidy towns projects and maintaining towns and villages throughout the countryside.  For many voluntary groups to survive, they need a workforce such as those that can be provided by work schemes, for example, the rural social, RS, scheme, community employment, CE, scheme and the T&uacute;s scheme.  Workers on those schemes have worked diligently, many of them carrying out work usually done by local authorities which they can no longer do due to embargoes on recruitment of road maintenance staff.</p>  <p>  In the past 12 months, it has become more difficult for community and voluntary groups to access workers, especially in rural areas where rules and guidelines are taking over from what was previously work on the ground.  It cannot be more simple.  A person who is in receipt of a social welfare payment and who cannot get another type of employment should be able to go on a work scheme and stay on it until employment is found for him or her.  Instead of that being the case many people who are called to go on CE, T&uacute;s or RS schemes in rural areas in particular have been told they are on JobPath and although they do not have a job they are not allowed to go on any other work scheme until JobPath finds them a job.  That is causing a nightmare for community and voluntary groups in filling positions to carry out works in the community, leaving many of them without a workforce, especially as many CE workers are now only allowed to stay on a scheme for 12 months and have to go back on welfare after that period.</p>  <p>  It could not be more simple.  If a worker is on a work scheme working while in receipt of a welfare payment, he or she should be commended on doing so and should be left on it until he or she finds employment.  All those problems are not intended by the Department of Social Protection to undermine community and voluntary groups but that is the effect they are having.  That is the case in particular in rural communities where a pool of suitable workers has to meet with such criteria and people find it almost impossible to get on a scheme.  The new obstacles are creating nightmares for groups and leaving local communities without a workforce in many cases.  I called in the programme for Government for separate rural and urban work schemes because one hat does not fit all.  It is becoming more clear that rural issues such as low employment, low population and rural isolation are not entering into the mindset of those city-based individuals in the Department of Social Protection.  I urge the Taoiseach to set up separate rural and urban work schemes and immediately reverse the rules which prevent a person on JobPath from being able to work on any other scheme.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.24" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:35:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100008#F00100"><p>The Deputy should look at the rural development programme launched recently by the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, which, for the first time in many years, is a comprehensive plan that is realistic and can be achieved.  The CSO figures today show that unemployment is down to 7.1% from 15.2% just a few years ago.  Last week, the Minister for Social Protection announced an extra 550 places under the rural social scheme for those on farm assist or fish assist depending on the areas in which they live.  There are plans to look at community involvement and extensions of time for people who have been working on community schemes and who cannot be replaced that easily so I do not accept that there is no opportunity for every community around the country to benefit from this programme.  This, together with the programme for Government, which impacts across the country and every spectrum, was evidenced in the response from communities all over the country last year in the centenary commemorative events for 1916 where communities came out and demonstrated their own power and potential.  I believe very strongly in that.  </p>  <p>  The programme launched last week covers a range of opportunities for communities all over the country and the money is in place between now and 2020 for communities to make that happen.  Whether it is through the local enterprise office or the Intreo office, the systems have changed so that people looking for employment or opportunity now have the chance to sit down with somebody directly to see what might be appropriate for them or in their best interests to allow them to get off social protection and get into a better system by having a job and a wage.  While the Deputy's point can be valid in any area, I have to say that arising from the publication of the plan last week, there is the opportunity for every community to benefit from a range of things, many of which were identified in the Commission for the Economic Development of Rural Areas report a number of years ago and which are now embellished in this programme for rural development and the achievement of rural potential.  I would advise the Deputy to follow through on elements of that with particular reference to the locality in west Cork to which he referred.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.25" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1263" speakername="Michael Collins" time="14:35:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100008#F00200"><p>I thank the Taoiseach for his reply.  I hope the Taoiseach envisages that the rural plan will be one that will create many jobs.  From what I have seen of it, I feel there is a lot of copy and paste in it but our judgement on that will be down the road.  The set up of JobPath was poorly thought through, in my own view and the view of many in the community.  Schemes like community employment schemes, T&uacute;s and the rural social scheme need further support.  There should be no more instances where good workers are sent home after 12 months when there is no other employment in their community.  There should also be no more instances of a person having to wait on social welfare for 12 months if on welfare.  There should be an immediate work start in the community.  There should be no more strict guidelines leading to more and more community and voluntary groups finding it impossible to fill positions.  It is wrong to require individuals from peninsulas like Mizen Head, Sheep's Head and Beara throughout west Cork and throughout the country to have to travel possibly 25 miles in some cases to meet JobPath requirements.  This shows little or no respect for individuals on welfare.</p>  <p>  The need to set up a rural and urban works scheme is critical, in my view and in the view of the community and voluntary sector, as is a clear understanding of the needs in those communities like employment and travel.  Eligibility for entry to all work schemes needs to be relaxed because if not, the communities in west Cork and throughout the country will be far sadder places in which to live.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.26" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:35:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100008#F00300"><p> Communities in west Cork are already doing work here.  The Wild Atlantic Way is being developed as far as Mizen Head or Sheep's Head in terms of hospitality and tourism opportunities.  There are so many opportunities community leadership can avail of through a series of issues in those programmes.  They may not be of the order of millions but they certainly have the potential to employ people at local level and give them the opportunity to grow small enterprises from communities - not just those like the Deputy's communities but communities across the country.  I know this myself from so many areas.  There is so much work that can be done under the rural social scheme, for example, where a place might need to be improved and brightened up for elderly people living on their own.</p><p>There are many small ways in which the countryside can be improved by virtue of these particular schemes.  However, the activities involved must be suitable and appropriate for the people taking part in the schemes.  Participants might own their own farm or business, for example, which requires them to be able to work for a few hours.  That flexibility is there.  Unemployment has fallen from 15.3% to 7.1%.  It needs greater imagination and creativity to enable workers to avail of the range of potential that is out there.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.28" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1230" speakername="Stephen Donnelly" time="14:45:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100009#G00200"><p>We all agree Brexit poses a very serious risk to jobs in Ireland.  The British Irish Chamber of Commerce estimates there is some &euro;1.3 billion in weekly trade between the two countries, which supports approximately 400,000 jobs across the two islands.  The fall in sterling is already putting agrifood companies out of business.  If the United Kingdom defaults to World Trade Organization tariffs, particularly on food, that will put many more Irish companies out of business.  As well as these serious risks, however, there also significant opportunities.  One estimate from the City of London is that some 35,000 jobs could be relocated in financial services alone.  The chief executive of Lloyds Banks has said he has shelved plans for new job creation in financial services in the UK.  The chief executive of JP Morgan said, before the referendum, that some 4,000 of its jobs might have to be relocated to elsewhere in the EU.  Last week, in Davos, he said it was likely there would be more job movement at JP Morgan that was hoped would be the case.  The chief executive of UBS has indicated the company is looking at moving some 1,500 jobs.  The chief executive of HSBC has said Brexit is likely to see that company moving more than 1,000 jobs.  The list goes on.  Despite these opportunities, the word I am getting from senior executives working in financial services in London and elsewhere in the UK is that they have had neither sight nor sound of Irish politicians or officials.  On the other hand, they tell me, they are being actively courted by the French, Germans, Belgians and many other EU nations.  The Scottish Parliament and Welsh Assembly have contacted them to discuss moves within Britain.  These companies are looking at their options for moving jobs because of the need to have a presence within the EU.  They cannot understand why the Irish authorities have not been in contact with them.</p>  <p>  Yesterday's meeting between the Taoiseach and the British Prime Minister, Ms Theresa May, is clearly to be welcomed, as is the fact the Minister of State, Deputy Dara Murphy, is in London this week to engage with financial services.  Welcome, too, is the launch today of a new Action Plan for Jobs which specifically highlights Brexit.  However, what matters is what is happening on the ground.  The business leaders I am hearing from both in the UK, particularly in London, and in this country are saying that when it comes to action on the part of the Irish authorities, not much is happening.  There are plenty of words and good sentiments but not much is actually being done.  Why is Ireland not actively reaching out to our expatriate community in areas like financial services in London, as IDA Ireland has done successfully in the United States for decades?  Why are business leaders in London saying they are yet to hear from Ireland when it comes to Brexit?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.29" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:45:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100009#G00300"><p>The Deputy needs to go back to the people to whom he has spoken.  He referred to what he has been hearing.  I assure him that Ireland is very active in this field, and not just by way of the Minister of State, Deputy Eoghan Murphy, who is dealing with financial services.  The Minister for Finance, many other senior Ministers and I, together with IDA Ireland and everybody else, are quite active in talking to interests in London who may wish to change location.  We have a unique opportunity arising out of the many difficulties and challenges Brexit is presenting and will present.  Our position is good on account of being in the eurozone, being so close to London, having an English-speaking population, and having at our disposal a proven track record and competence developed over the years in the area of financial services.</p><p>The Deputy will be aware that many queries have come into the Central Bank as financial houses or elements of financial houses decide where they will move to, and it might be to Frankfurt, Amsterdam, Paris, Dublin or New York.  However, I assure Deputy Donnelly that we are not behind the scenes in talking to anybody who is interested in coming here or in presenting our case as an attractive location with a vibrant, energetic workforce, and with the capacity to continue to attract the "churn" of talent needed here and access to the Single Market and the European system, which is so important for financial services.</p> <p> People I have met have very varied views about Brexit as far as London is concerned, but we will fight our corner hard and fairly.  I can confirm to the Deputy that it has been confirmed to me that particular companies wish to move to this country, and in due course they will make their decisions formally, but we are right in there; we are not behind the scenes.  With respect to the people who are giving the Deputy that information, it is not true to say that Ireland is not taking action and involving itself in serious conversations with people in London and elsewhere in the United Kingdom.  With regard to what Deputy Donnelly pointed out, it is true to say from Bord Bia's assessment that in terms of value, the reduction due to currency fluctuations in the agrifood sector has been &euro;500 million.  That is why the Minister has brought in low interest, long-term credit for small firms.  I notice some Irish agri-firms are acquiring others to be available and ready to rebound when the currency situation levels itself out.  I spoke to Prime Minister May about a number of elements last night.  In conclusion, we are very active in this field and we will fight our corner hard and fairly.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.31" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1230" speakername="Stephen Donnelly" time="14:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100010#H00200"><p>In terms of Brexit, a new increasingly protectionist United States and the European Commission now retargeting our corporation tax regime, I believe jobs in Ireland are more at risk now than they were due to the banking collapse.  That is why the Taoiseach's answer is so concerning.  I accept that actions are being taken.  I take the Taoiseach at his word when he says Ireland is doing things but the sense from business leaders and from the public is that while actions are being taken, too few actions are being taken.  They are being taken too slowly and with too much deference to the European Union.</p>  <p>  As an example, we keep hearing from Ministers that Brexit has not happened yet.  I heard it said on a radio programme about two nights ago, but Brexit has happened.  For the small and medium enterprises, SMEs, that are struggling, and the ones that have been put out of business, it is happening.  For the people who are living and working around the Border regions, it is happening.  For the Irish ex-pats who are looking at moving jobs back into the EU post-Brexit, it is happening.  While I accept absolutely that there are conversations going on, senior Irish executives are saying that while they are being courted by numerous EU nations, they are not hearing anything from Ireland.  My sense is that while actions are being taken, they are being taken too slowly and without a clear vision for success.  Does the Taoiseach accept that there is an ex-pat community in London that we should be targeting and are not and that more needs to happen very quickly.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.32" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="14:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100010#H00300"><p>The Government deliberately beefed up Enterprise Ireland and IDA Ireland, which are very active in this field.  We have 1,500 companies in the country exporting to the United Kingdom, and we are very conscious of that fact.</p>  <p>  I take Deputy Donnelly at his word.  He is telling me that business leaders in London are telling him that there is nothing happening on the ground.  Let us do a deal here.  If he gives me the names of the business leaders I will see that they are called together and given the full regime in terms of what is happening so that they will hear about the work that we are at and the extent of the connections.  They will then know that what they are saying to the Deputy is inadequate in terms of its veracity and extent.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.33" nospeaker="true" time="14:55:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100011#J00100">Order of Business</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.34" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1222" speakername="R&oacute;is&iacute;n Shortall" time="14:55:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100011#J00200"><p>Today's Government business shall be No. 13, motion re eighth report of the Committee of Selection, without debate; No. 14, motion re referral of joint committee of proposed approval by D&aacute;il &Eacute;ireann for a directive of the European Parliament and of the Council amending Council Framework Decision 2004/757/JHA of 25 October 2004, laying down minimum provisions on the constituent elements of criminal acts and penalties in the field of illicit drug trafficking, as regards the definition of drug, without debate; and No. 4, Disability (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill 2016 - Order for Second Stage and Second Stage.  Private Members' business shall be No. 89, motion re Bus &Eacute;ireann, by Fianna F&aacute;il.</p>  <p>  Wednesday's Government business shall be No. 22, statements on the establishment of a commission of investigation into NAMA; No. 23, Criminal Law (Sexual Offences) Bill 2015 - Order for Report and Report and Final Stages; No. 1, Minerals Development Bill 2015 - Second Stage; and No. 4, Disability (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill 2016 - Second Stage resumed.  Private Members' business shall be No. 90, motion re roads funding, by the Rural Independent Group.</p>  <p>  Thursday's Government business shall be No. 23, Criminal Law (Sexual Offences Bill) 2015 - Report Stage (resumed) and Final Stage;  No. 1, Minerals Development Bill 2015 - Second Stage; and No. 4, Disability (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill 2016 - Second Stage resumed.  No. 15, report on Garda oversight and accountability by the Joint Committee on Justice and Equality, will be debated in the evening slot.</p>  <p>  I refer Members to the first revised report of the Business Committee dated 26 January 2017.  With regard to today's business, it is proposed that Nos. 13 and 14 shall be taken without debate.  It is proposed the D&aacute;il shall sit at 10 a.m. tomorrow to take No. 22, which shall be brought to a conclusion after 120 minutes.  The speech of the Minister or Minister of State and the main spokespersons for parties or groups, or a Member nominated in their stead, shall be not more than 15 minutes each and all Members may share time.  If the statements conclude before 12 noon the House will be suspended until that time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.35" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="14:55:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100011#J00300"><p>There are two proposals to be put to the House.  Is the proposal for dealing with Tuesday's business agreed to?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.36" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="14:55:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100011#J00400"><p>It is not agreed.  I am fully aware the Business Committee met last week and agreed the business for today and this week, but over the weekend since the meeting a matter of extreme urgency has intervened and I ask the Government and the House to consider the need for us to change this week's order to discuss it.  Obviously I am speaking about President Donald Trump's travel ban, which I and many of us believe is absolutely abhorrent.  It has very serious implications for millions of people trying to enter the United States and we have the very serious implications of the possibility of a Bill which rides roughshod over human rights, possibly Irish law and certainly international law-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.37" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="14:55:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100011#J00500"><p>We cannot have the debate now.  The Deputy has raised the point.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.38" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="14:55:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100011#J00600"><p>-----at our own airports.  What is happening at our airports is important.  We do not even have clarity on this issue.  I appeal to the Government and the House to have a debate on the implications of the travel ban for the world and specifically for this country this week as a matter of absolute urgency.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.39" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="14:55:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100011#J00700"><p>The ordering of business is now a matter for the House itself, rather than in former D&aacute;ileanna where it was a matter for the Government.</p><p>I submitted a private notice question to the Ceann Comhairle on a matter of very serious importance, namely, the executive order signed by President Trump and its implications for this country.  It is important that we deal with this issue today and that we have clarity on a range of issues which I set out in the private notice question.  I am very supportive of the retention of pre-clearance facilities in this country, which were hard fought for.  We must have assurances that international law is complied with and it would be good for us to hear a clear statement to that effect from the Taoiseach.  I ask the House to set aside two hours to debate these issues today and maybe 30 minutes at the end for a question and answer session with the Taoiseach or a designated Minister so that our attitude to this critical issue is very clear and clarity can be given to the impact on our country.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.41" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1294" speakername="Eamon Ryan" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K00200"><p>I add my voice to the calls for a debate on the ban introduced by executive order of the US Government.  I was taken by what the Taoiseach said to the effect that we could look for a common agreed motion across the House, expressing our concern about the nature of that order.  If there are ways in which the entire House could come together and agree such a motion it would give a very strong message.  We should arrange the business to allow for that.  If there is a motion, can we vote on it on Thursday, or will it be put back until the following Thursday?  What will the arrangements be for agreeing such a motion?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.42" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K00300"><p>The Business Committee should reconvene to look at these sessions.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.43" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1226" speakername="Catherine Murphy" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K00400"><p>I endorse the points Deputy Ryan made and we would be very supportive of approaching it in that way.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.44" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K00500"><p>I wish to make an observation.  We have had no contact with any of the other parties which have just spoken about any move-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.45" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K00600"><p>An e-mail was sent to the Business Committee.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.46" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K00700"><p>Deputy Boyd Barrett thinks he runs the show in the Business Committee.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.47" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K00800"><p>I am not on the Business Committee.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.48" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K00900"><p>In a former time, when I sought to change a ruling of the Business Committee I was rounded on by the people who have just stood up and spoken.  They rounded on me in very bad terms, at the Business Committee and subsequently.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.49" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K01000"><p>Does Deputy Martin not want a debate on the situation in the US?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.50" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K01100"><p>I have just debated the executive order with the Taoiseach and I have no objection to anything but I do not like shallow grandstanding.  I put to the Taoiseach the idea of a cross-party motion and I have no difficulty working with other parties to achieve a cross-party motion.  I have no difficulty in having a debate on this issue.  I am just observing that some Members object strenuously when people try to vary decisions of the Business Committee until it suits their own political agenda and then they think they can play fast and loose with it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.51" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K01200"><p>This is a unique set of circumstances.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.52" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1308" speakername="Paul Murphy" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K01300"><p>This is the D&aacute;il.  An event of immense importance has happened over the course of the weekend.  Millions of people are being denied access to America by a racist Muslim ban and it has happened to at least one person on Irish soil so we have to have a debate.  A motion is all very well but we have no interest in signing up to an all-party motion which will say a c&uacute;pla focal of criticisms about Trump but suggest the Government does absolutely nothing about it.  We suggest a joint motion by all the forces who have said the Taoiseach should not go to the White House on St. Patrick's Day as a clear statement of protest.  That is the message this D&aacute;il should send and we should have an opportunity to put that motion at the debate.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.53" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1347" speakername="Mattie McGrath" time="15:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100012#K01400"><p>I propose that the Business Committee reconvene.  The Business Committee works hard every week to decide the order for the week and it was read out by Deputy R&oacute;is&iacute;n Shortall today.  If it is going to be changed every week, or every so often, it will undermine it.  I propose it be asked to look at it again.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.54" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1338" speakername="Regina Doherty" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L00100"><p>For what it is worth, I thought we had established a precedent after the last time this happened.  That was that when something momentous happened over the weekend, as it did this weekend, we would give notice to the Business Committee, we would decide whether or not we would meet, and we would then make our decisions on whether to change the Order of Business at that stage, rather than doing this time-wasting, drama-seeking business that we do every week.  Can I suggest that we meet?  If we could pass a unanimous motion in this House it would send a clear message to the people outside, as opposed to being divisive just for the sake of it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.55" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L00200"><p>On a point of order-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.56" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L00300"><p>I am sorry but the Deputy cannot raise a point of order on this matter.  The Taoiseach wants to make a comment.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.57" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L00400"><p>That is fine but I still want to make a point of order.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.58" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L00500"><p>All right, I will come back to the Deputy.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.59" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L00600"><p>Private Notice Questions are a matter for your adjudication, a Cheann Comhairle.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.60" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L00700"><p>Yes.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.61" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L00800"><p>It may well be that, as regards what Deputy Martin raised, if we could have statements on an agreed motion it might be in everybody's interest.  The House of Commons had a unanimous decision last night in respect of this matter.</p>  <p>  As regards the point raised by Deputy Paul Murphy, for the clarification of the House, on Saturday morning I understand that a foreign national was refused US pre-clearance at Dublin Airport and was returned to the Irish immigration authorities.  I can inform the House that the person in question is lawfully resident and working here in Ireland and therefore was able to leave Dublin Airport as he was entitled to remain here.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.62" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1308" speakername="Paul Murphy" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L00900"><p>He was not able to go to America.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.63" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01000"><p>Some 1.18 million people used the pre-clearance facility in Dublin last year, while 204,000 people used it at Shannon Airport.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.64" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01100"><p>We need to hear these things and that is why we should have a debate in order to have full clarity.</p>  <p>  On a point of order, on reflection perhaps the Chief Whip would withdraw what she said.  This is not an issue where we are time-wasting by standing up.  I submitted a Private Notice Question and thought that was the way it was going to be dealt with.  I have just been notified by text that it has been disallowed.  I want to use the procedures of this House to advance something that I regard as important.  I do not regard the Chief Whip's comments as being right and proper.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.65" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01200"><p>On a point of order-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.66" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01300"><p>No, wait.  The Deputy has been in already.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.67" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01400"><p>It is a point of order.  On our behalf, Deputy Barry circulated an e-mail this morning to all members of the Business Committee requesting this debate, so that communication to the Business Committee has already occurred.  It was suggested that we had not done that courtesy, but we did it this morning.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.68" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01500"><p>Can I suggest that we convene a meeting of the Business Committee at 4.15 p.m. when this matter can be considered?  Is that agreed?  Agreed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.69" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01600"><p>We did not have that response over the civilians in Aleppo.  There are double standards going on here.  Thousands of innocent children were murdered by Russian forces and President Assad's, but we do not get the same response from over there at all.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.70" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01700"><p>I am sorry.  There are two proposals to put to the House.  I have put the proposal in regard to Tuesday's business.  Is Tuesday's business agreed to?  Agreed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.71" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01800"><p>Subject to proper procedures.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.72" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L01900"><p>Yes.  Second, is the proposal for dealing with Wednesday's business agreed to?  Agreed.  Thank you all very much.</p><p>I now call Deputy Miche&aacute;l Martin on promised legislation.  </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.73" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L02000"><p>The programme for Government commits to ending the casualisation of the workforce.  I have raised with the Taoiseach the need for greater protection for employees on insecure and low-hour contracts.  Many people on zero-hour contracts go from week to week not knowing what they are going to earn or when they are required to work.  They are waiting at home for a phone call and have insecure employment conditions.  Such workers are predominantly women and are treated very unfairly.  Employer flexibility is important, but in some instances the degree to which workers' rights are undermined and violated is unacceptable.  It is a key commitment in the confidence and supply agreement, and it is in the programme for Government as well.  I would appreciate it if the Taoiseach could give me an update on when the Government intends to legislate for it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.74" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L02100"><p>I will have to come back to Deputy Martin on that.  I know it is part of the confidence and supply arrangement, and it is in the programme for Government.  I will ask the Minister, Deputy Mitchell O'Connor, to give the Deputy an update forthwith.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.75" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="15:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100013#L02200"><p>Under the section dealing with the North, the programme for Government commits the Government to "maintaining the needs of the victims and their survivors at the core of our approach".  Could the Taoiseach explain how this squares with the decision of the Government to force the family of S&eacute;amus Ludlow, who was murdered in 1976 in north Louth, to go to the High Court today?  In 2006, the final report of the Oireachtas joint committee on justice concluded that commissions of investigation were needed.</p><p>Despite this clear statement of support, successive Fianna F&aacute;il and Fine Gael-led Governments have refused to do this.  As a consequence of the State's actions, the Ludlow family, who have been seeking the truth for 40 years, today find themselves in the High Court.  Will the Taoiseach instruct his legal representatives in the court to stop opposing the creation of commissions of investigation as recommended?  Will he support the family in their efforts to establish the circumstances of Seamus Ludlow's death and the role of British state agencies in it and establish the commissions of investigation recommended by the justice committee?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.77" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100014#M00200"><p>It is not appropriate to the Order of Business or promised legislation.  It is more appropriate to something like a Topical Issue.  I do not know if the Taoiseach wants to comment.  I do not even know if it would be appropriate in the circumstances to comment.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.78" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100014#M00300"><p>The matter is before the courts as I understand it.  I will say that in general there is a whole range of legacy issues that need to be dealt with arising from the Good Friday Agreement.  I regret that it was not possible to have that agreement reached under Stormont House and Fresh Start.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.79" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="15:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100014#M00400"><p>It was agreed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.80" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100014#M00500"><p>I raised legacy issues yesterday evening with the British Prime Minister and the Secretary of State, in particular the Dublin and Monaghan bombings in respect of which there have been three all-party Oireachtas motions over the last number of years.  I pointed out the urgency of moving on with a number of these.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.81" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="15:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100014#M00600"><p>Since last year, I have been calling for the immediate publication of the expert reports in the &quot;Grace&quot; foster care scandal.  It is time the public knew exactly who was responsible for the horrific litany of abuse against &quot;Grace&quot; and more than 40 other children and young people and how this came about.  We have been told the HSE refused to publish these reports on the advice of local garda&iacute; in Waterford that it might jeopardise potential inquiries.  Following a letter from Deputy John Deasy to the Garda Commissioner, the way was finally cleared two weeks ago for the publication of these reports with the Commissioner seeing no issue with that.  These young people were failed by the State.  As such, will the Taoiseach give the D&aacute;il a clear timeline for the publication of these reports?  This is an issue that has been highlighted by many journalists, in particular in the <i>Irish Examiner</i>.  Will the Taoiseach provide all parties with draft terms of reference for an inquiry and provide an indication of when that inquiry might begin its work?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.82" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100014#M00700"><p>I refer to the latest position on the publication of the Devine and Resilience Ireland reports which relate to the case of "Grace" who resided in a former foster home in the south east which is the subject of abuse allegations.  This has run now for some time.  The Minister of State, Deputy Finian McGrath, has consistently stated his view that the HSE-commissioned reports by Conal Devine and Resilience Ireland into certain matters should be published as soon as possible.  The Minister of State conveyed his view to the HSE on 1 November 2016 and asked it to re-examine the issues around the publication of the two reports and to give serious consideration to doing that.  This followed the report by Conor Dignam SC which recommended further engagement between the HSE and An Garda S&iacute;och&aacute;na.  Following a meeting between senior HSE officials and garda&iacute;, the HSE has confirmed that it intends to publish redacted versions of both reports before the end of February 2017.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.83" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="15:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100014#M00800"><p>Why so long?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.84" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100014#M00900"><p>Arrangements will be put in place to ensure that the contents of the reports are conveyed in a meaningful way to service users with varying degrees of disability.  A communications plan is also being developed given the potential impact of the reports on service users, their families and the employees of relevant agencies, and dedicated teams will be put in place to provide all necessary assistance and support to those impacted.  The HSE expects to have the two reports published by the end of February.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.85" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="15:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100014#M01000"><p>Despite my very considerable disappointment that the Government failed to support Deputy Broughan's motion last week on the need for an immediate commission of investigation on the Stardust tragedy, the Government motion passed and that committed to certain things.  These include the appointment of an independent judicial figure and following that the possibility of a commission of investigation.  Last night, I had a very upset Antoinette Keegan representing the Stardust families on the phone to me feeling that since the passing of that motion, the Government has pulled the wool over her eyes.  She is very concerned that what she thought she understood from the Government on its plan to deal with this matter is quite different to what is now occurring.</p><p>I want to ask the Taoiseach the precise steps that will be taken in terms of following up on the Stardust motion.  I ask that the Minister, as a matter of urgency before those steps are put in place, agrees to meet Antoinette Keegan and the Stardust committee to ensure, as the motion promises, that the families are on board with what is being done.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.87" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N00200"><p>The person Deputy Boyd Barrett mentioned need not worry.  The motion was accepted and approved by the D&aacute;il and will be honoured in full.  The Minister of State, Deputy McGrath, spoke to me about this matter today.  The element of the motion that requires the Government to meet the individuals on the Stardust committee will be honoured.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.88" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N00300"><p>When?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.89" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N00400"><p>Very shortly.  The examination of the new information and evidence that has come to hand will be done in a proper and fitting fashion.  If that warrants a commission of investigation, then that is what will happen.  The Deputy can inform the person who has contacted him on a number of occasions that is so.  The Government will not renege on the motion that was accepted by the D&aacute;il last week.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.90" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1347" speakername="Mattie McGrath" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N00500"><p>A commitment was given in the programme for Government to support agriculture and the farming community.  It is totally unacceptable that thousands of farmers are waiting for GLAS and other payments.  They have been told that the delays are due to computer glitches, but that does not wash with me or anybody else.  The situation is totally unfair and the morals are very wrong.  If they owed money-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.91" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N00600"><p>That is not on promised legislation.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.92" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1347" speakername="Mattie McGrath" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N00700"><p>It is, of course.  A commitment was given in the programme for Government to support agriculture.  These delays are stifling agriculture.  The Minister, Deputy Coveney, was in the Department for five years.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.93" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N00800"><p>Put down a parliamentary question.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.94" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1347" speakername="Mattie McGrath" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N00900"><p>I have done.  Farmers are protesting today.  There is no modicum of fairness in the fact that farmers will not get the money they have invested, spent and borrowed in order to develop their industry in line with the commitment in the programme for Government.  They have been given every reason for delays, the latest of which is IT problems.  If they are late with returns to the tax office or in arrears they would be charged huge penalties, as would everybody else.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.95" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01000"><p>The point is made.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.96" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1347" speakername="Mattie McGrath" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01100"><p>It is totally unfair and this has to be sorted out.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.97" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01200"><p>Last year, 2016, was the first full year of payments under the GLAS scheme.  At the end of December 2016, there were 37,500 active participants in the GLAS scheme, of which 27,400 received 85% of their 2016 payment.  As Deputy McGrath is aware, payments can only issue when all of the required validation checks have been successfully passed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.98" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1347" speakername="Mattie McGrath" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01300"><p>They have been.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.99" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01400"><p>Further payments of &euro;4.2 million have been issued to just under 1,200 participants in the past few days.  Approximately 8,900 cases remain outstanding and, starting immediately, further payments will be made on a weekly basis as cases are cleared.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.100" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01500"><p>There are just over six minutes remaining and 14 Deputies offering.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.101" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1230" speakername="Stephen Donnelly" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01600"><p>The programme for Government makes a commitment to setting up a new specialist court for people in mortgage distress.  Obviously, setting up such a court requires significant new primary legislation.  When can we expect to see the heads of Bills to establish such a court?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.102" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01700"><p>All I can confirm is that work is well under way in the Department on this issue.  I will advise the Deputy as to the state of play in so far as when the heads of Bills come to Government and are likely to be published.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.103" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1220" speakername="Mary Butler" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01800"><p>There is a commitment in the programme for Government to review legislation relating to elder abuse, specifically from a psychological and financial point of view.  Has this review commenced and when can we expect to see a report on it?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.104" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N01900"><p>I will have to advise Deputy Butler of the position.  I am not aware of the extent of the work that is taking place.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.105" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1215" speakername="Eoin &Oacute; Broin" time="15:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100015#N02000"><p>There is a commitment in the programme for Government to deal with the shortage of new homes by incentivising and supporting increased delivery of private sector construction and the action plan for housing has very considerable targets in this regard.  However, there is a question mark over the accuracy of the housing completions statistics that have been used to measure progress.  Obviously, work is ongoing on the building control Bill.  Given the fact that some experts have said there could be an overestimation of 50% by the Government, will it include in the legislation a statutory register for housing completions so that we can accurately assess the level of completions on an annual basis?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.106" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O00100"><p>I will ask the Minister for Housing, Planning, Community and Local Government to answer the question.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.107" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1286" speakername="Simon Coveney" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O00200"><p>As I stated last week, we should be in a position to bring the heads of the building control Bill to Cabinet before the end of February and we will then have an opportunity to debate the detail of the Bill.  It is important that we have consistent and accurate figures on completions so that we can meet the targets we have set out.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.108" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1258" speakername="David Cullinane" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O00300"><p>On 12 June 2015, Clerys closed its doors and many people lost their jobs in what was a tactical insolvency.  Since then the Cahill-Duffy report made a number of recommendations.  When will we see a Bill that deals with tactical insolvencies so that we do not have a repeat of what happened to the Clerys workers?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.109" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O00400"><p>I do not have an up-to-date report on that particular question, but I will come back to the Deputy on it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.110" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1336" speakername="Lisa Chambers" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O00500"><p>There are various health service commitments in the programme for Government, in particular, commitments relating to early intervention and paediatric care.  Figures recently released to me show that there are more than 260 children in County Mayo waiting for a first occupational therapy assessment and more than 420 children currently waiting for an appointment.  What will the Taoiseach do to immediately address the shortages in staff and resources for occupational therapy services in County Mayo?  I imagine that those shortages are being experienced in every county.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.111" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O00600"><p>I am not aware of the detail of the figures referred to by Deputy Lisa Chambers.  It is clear that improvements have been made but a number of children have not yet been assessed.  I will advise the Deputy on the current situation and how it might improve.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.112" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1344" speakername="Eamon Scanlon" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O00700"><p>I wish to raise the issue of promised legislation to deal with insurance companies that are ripping off the people at this point in time.  I have been contacted by a number of constituents.  One lady who has a ten year old car had it tested under the NCT procedure.  She was told by the insurance company that she would have to take it to the main dealer to get it certified as being roadworthy.  Another constituent who had a ten-years no claims bonus had, unfortunately, to go to England to work.  He had continuous insurance in England.  He is back now and, thankfully, has a job, but is being told that his no claims bonus is null and void despite the fact that he has had continuous insurance for the past 13 years.  This is what is going on in the real world.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.113" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O00800"><p>The Minister of State, Deputy Eoghan Murphy, is dealing with the report on this matter next Thursday.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.114" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O00900"><p>Will there be a debate in the House?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.115" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01000"><p>There will be a debate in the House on it next Thursday.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.116" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1218" speakername="Shane Cassells" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01100"><p>The opening line under the energy policy section of the programme for Government states, "It is clear that there is a need for much better engagement with citizens and communities about the energy policy decisions that affect them".  Last Thursday at the EirGrid annual conference held in Dublin Castle, the Minister of State, Deputy Se&aacute;n Kyne, when speaking about the decision by An Bord Plean&aacute;la in Christmas week to grant permission for 400 overhead pylons through counties Meath, Cavan and Monaghan, told EirGrid that the authorities in both jurisdictions "are clear in [their] support for this vital element of electricity grid infrastructure".  There is no support for EirGrid's proposal through the impacted counties and the elected members, from councillors to Deputies, have registered their opposition.  Has the line about listening that is contained in the programme for Government any meaning or is the Government, as the Minister of State put it, clear in its support for EirGrid's 400 overground pylons?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.117" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01200"><p>Certainly not.  The Government always listens.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.118" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1218" speakername="Shane Cassells" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01300"><p>Pardon, Taoiseach.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.119" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01400"><p>Certainly not.  The Government always listens and listens carefully.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.120" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1218" speakername="Shane Cassells" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01500"><p>I asked if the Government was clear in its support.  Is the Government clear in its support for the overhead pylons?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.121" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01600"><p>We have an all-island energy agreement in this area.  There is a need for development of the proposal from the Northern end as well.  There is an independent process that is to be gone through.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.122" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01700"><p>We cannot hear the Taoiseach.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.123" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01800"><p>We cannot hear him.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.124" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1218" speakername="Shane Cassells" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O01900"><p>The Deputies could not hear that answer, Taoiseach, never mind anyone else.  It is indicative of the people not being listened to.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.125" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O02000"><p>It is a serious matter.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.126" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O02100"><p>I call Deputy Louise O'Reilly.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.127" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1302" speakername="Louise O'Reilly" time="15:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100016#O02200"><p>The programme for Government, underpinned by a Sinn F&eacute;in motion which received cross-party support, commits the Government to the granting of an automatic medical card for children in receipt of domiciliary care allowance.  The Taoiseach has told me repeatedly that it is on its way.  Yet, this morning representatives from Our Children's Health were on the streets outside the Department of the Taoiseach once again protesting for something which the Taoiseach stated they would have shortly.  I have a simple view of the matter.  Sinn F&eacute;in included this as a commitment in our alternative budget and it was costed by the Department of Finance at &euro;17 million, but &euro;10 million was allowed for it in the Government's budget.  The Taoiseach has never had any intention of implementing it.  He is delaying because the money has not been put aside.  It is cruel.  These people cannot wait any longer.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.128" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P00100"><p>The measure is a part of the programme for Government and I am glad the Deputy is supporting it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.129" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1302" speakername="Louise O'Reilly" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P00200"><p>I would be glad if the Taoiseach supported it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.130" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P00300"><p>I understand the protestors fully recognise the progress that has been made.  This is a serious business, much too serious for people to be claiming credit.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.131" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1302" speakername="Louise O'Reilly" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P00400"><p>When will it commence?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.132" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P00500"><p>There are 10,000 children involved.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.133" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1302" speakername="Louise O'Reilly" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P00600"><p>Some of them are listening to this discussion.  It is cruel.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.134" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P00700"><p>Very substantial progress has been made on the measure, which will be introduced by the Minister for Health as soon as he can do so.  It is not as simple as the Deputy proclaims but 10,000 children will benefit.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.135" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1302" speakername="Louise O'Reilly" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P00800"><p>The parents of these children will stay on the streets protesting.  The Taoiseach should be ashamed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.136" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P00900"><p>That completes questions on promised legislation.  My apologies to the six Deputies who were listed but were not called because we ran out of time.  For the information of anyone who may be interested, we call Deputies in the order in which they indicate.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.137" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1331" speakername="Peter Fitzpatrick" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01000"><p>On a point of order, I am not being biased in saying that none of the Fine Gael Deputies who indicated had an opportunity to speak.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.138" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01100"><p>That is not my fault.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.139" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1331" speakername="Peter Fitzpatrick" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01200"><p>I suggest that the six backbench Deputies who waited for an hour to speak today should be given an opportunity to speak on the Order of Business tomorrow.  Week after week, the Ceann Comhairle informs the House that Deputies who did not have an opportunity to speak will be given an opportunity to speak the following day.  This is my fourth day on the trot trying to speak on a specific topic and I indicated early.  The same mouthpieces keep wasting the time of the House.  All I am asking is for fair play in the Chamber.  I have spent one hour for four days on the trot trying to raise an issue.  I am not blaming the Ceann Comhairle but seeking a fair system.  I am sure most of the six Deputies who were not called to speak today are from Fine Gael.  Is there any chance we will get fair play?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.140" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01300"><p>That is what Deputy Fitzpatrick gets for joining Fine Gael.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.141" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01400"><p>To answer the Deputy's question, three of the Members who did not speak are from the Fine Gael Party.  If they had indicated earlier, they would have been able to speak.  The Deputy was the last Member to indicate.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.142" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1243" speakername="Josepha Madigan" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01500"><p>The Ceann Comhairle was looking in the other direction.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.143" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01600"><p>I scan the Chamber constantly each day and the Deputy was the last to indicate.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.144" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1331" speakername="Peter Fitzpatrick" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01700"><p>To conclude my point-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.145" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01800"><p>No, I am not having a debate on the issue.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.146" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1331" speakername="Peter Fitzpatrick" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P01900"><p>Last Thursday, a Fianna F&aacute;il Deputy who walked into the Chamber after I indicated was allowed to speak before me.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.147" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02000"><p>Please resume your seat, Deputy.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.148" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1331" speakername="Peter Fitzpatrick" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02100"><p>I want fair play for my constituents in Louth.  I am fed up with this.  It has happened four times on the trot.  What do I have to do?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.149" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02200"><p>Please resume your seat, Deputy.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.150" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1331" speakername="Peter Fitzpatrick" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02300"><p>I will resume my seat, but I am looking for fair play.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.151" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02400"><p>Excuse me, if Deputies want to come into the Chamber late or indicate late, I cannot do anything about it.  Some Deputies are so enthusiastic that before Questions on Promised Legislation starts, they send notes to me in the Chair asking to be included.  I do not have any control over that.  I will deal with people as they present themselves and if that procedure is not to Deputy Fitzpatrick's liking, I suggest he asks his representative at the Business Committee, which will meet at 4.15 p.m. to discuss the aforementioned issues, to suggest a more effective way of dealing with business.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.152" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1331" speakername="Peter Fitzpatrick" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02500"><p>I want to-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.153" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02600"><p>Resume your seat, Deputy Fitzpatrick.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.154" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1331" speakername="Peter Fitzpatrick" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02700"><p>A Cheann Comhairle, I just wanted to thank you.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.155" nospeaker="true" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02800">Media Ownership Bill 2017: First Stage</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.156" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1226" speakername="Catherine Murphy" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P02900"><p>I move:</p><blockquote>That leave be granted to introduce a Bill entitled an Act to amend the Competition Act 2002 in order to retrospectively and hereinafter protect both diversity of ownership and control of media businesses in the State and the plurality of the media; and to include content in the context of a changed media environment where readership and listenership figures are not adequate measures of potential reach.</blockquote><p>The basis of the Bill is the vital place free and pluralistic media have in a vigorous and vibrant democracy.  One would have to have been living under a rock to be completely unaware of the increasing fears regarding freedom of the press and the escalation of fake news and dubious facts.  One of the safest ways to mitigate against fake news or partisan reporting is to do everything in our power to protect the diversity of ownership in the media landscape.  This issue has raised its head for decades.  In 1973, the National Union of Journalists expressed concerns with regard to media plurality and various flashpoints have arisen over the years.  However, nothing has been done to change the ever increasing concentration of media ownership in an ever declining number of hands.</p><p>We are awaiting a decision on whether Independent News and Media, INM, will be allowed to proceed with the acquisition of the Celtic Media Group, a move which would result in INM increasing its substantial dominance of the print media by effectively controlling the bulk of regional newspapers across the island of Ireland.  The Broadcasting Authority of Ireland, BAI, in what can only be described as a curious move, approved the acquisition and the Minister has put the decision out for public consultation before making a final decision.  The reason I describe the BAI's decision as curious is that the media merger guidelines of 2015 make reference to a significant interest test on the notion of the public interest not being served by allowing any one individual or undertaking to hold more than 20% of a stake in the media business.  Despite this, the majority shareholder in INM holds in excess of 20% because the guidelines were to be applied for future shareholdings only.  It is worth noting that the majority shareholder in INM is also the owner of the Communicorp Group, the company which owns the vast majority of radio stations outside the public service broadcaster. </p><p>My experience during the Siteserv controversy and the ensuing media blackout of my speech, with the exception of <i>broadsheet.ie</i>, <i>The Sunday Times </i>and <i>Village</i>magazine, brought home to me the acute need for impartial and fearless media.  That someone with such dominance of ownership could also chill other outlets outside his control made a stark point to me.  There have been stories from former employees of INM and Communicorp about ownership influence on editorial content and so on.  These are the very reasons this issue is of utmost importance. </p><p>The Bill seeks to rebalance the media landscape by reconstituting media plurality in Ireland.  Media plurality has the potential to be compromised by the ability of some key players and a small but increasing number of others to gain a stake of more than 20% in media businesses.  We cannot be complacent in assuming that what has happened in other countries and is currently happening with regard to fake news and powerful interests controlling the public debate could not happen here.  It most certainly could unless we take significant and forceful steps to ensure it does not.  </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.157" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P03000"><p>Is the Bill being opposed?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.158" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P03100"><p>No.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.159" nospeaker="true" time="15:50:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.160" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P03300"><p>Since this is a Private Members' Bill, Second Stage must, under Standing Orders, be taken in Private Members' time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.161" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1226" speakername="Catherine Murphy" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P03400"><p>I move: &quot;That the Bill be taken in Private Members' time.&quot;</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.162" nospeaker="true" time="15:50:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.163" nospeaker="true" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P03600">National Famine Commemoration Bill 2017: First Stage</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.164" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1310" speakername="Colm Brophy" time="15:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100017#P03700"><p>I move:</p><blockquote>That leave be granted to introduce a Bill entitled an Act to provide for the commemoration of the Great Famine; to provide for the establishment of a National Famine Commemoration Day; and to provide for related matters.</blockquote><p>This is a small, compact Bill.  We should have a national day marked in the calendar to commemorate the greatest tragedy that has ever befallen the country.  The Bill proposes to designate this day the second Sunday in May.  I will refer to some of the arguments I have made previously on this issue, on which I have spoken in the Chamber previously.  I had my first opportunity to speak on it shortly after I was elected and, subsequently, on 5 July 2015.  Some of the topics I raised then are critical reasons for making this proposal. </p><p>The Famine has shaped modern Ireland more than any other event and this needs to be recognised in the same way we mark other days of national commemoration.  We commemorate the Easter Rising every year and we have other significant dates fixed in the calendar to mark those from this country who lost their lives in war.  That we do not have a fixed date in the calendar marking the Famine is a major mistake.  We should place the Famine on the same level as the other commemorations to which I referred.</p><p>I advocate this change for a number of key reasons, which I will repeat today.  We should embed in the national consciousness the importance and significance of the Famine.  Having a fixed date would enable us to work with children, schools and the next generation because they would be able to clearly see the Famine marked every year.  This would enable the State to provide a much more rounded commemoration and to mark the Famine in away that fully integrates the generations, particularly the next generation because schoolchildren would play a part.  </p><p>The Famine is probably the greatest event that internationalised Ireland in terms of what followed it and the emigration that flowed from it.  In setting a fixed date for the Famine commemoration day in the calendar we would be giving an opportunity to the diaspora throughout the world, and to all the people who claim descent, to note this date as the date on which they will have an opportunity to join with people in this country in marking what is the greatest national tragedy ever to befall the island of Ireland.</p> <p> The Bill is at its heart a straightforward and simple Bill.  I do not believe it is divisive and I hope it will receive widespread support.  I would like at this point to pay tribute to those people who have worked on the national Famine commemoration days held thus far.  The small but significant change proposed in this Bill, in terms of setting a fixed date in our calendar as the forever Famine commemoration day, is what we need to do at this stage.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.166" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q00200"><p>Is the Bill opposed?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.167" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1338" speakername="Regina Doherty" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q00300"><p>No.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.168" nospeaker="true" time="16:00:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.169" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q00500"><p>Since this is a Private Members' Bill, Second Stage must, under Standing Orders, be taken in Private Members' time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.170" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1310" speakername="Colm Brophy" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q00600"><p>I move: &quot;That the Bill be taken in Private Members' time.&quot;</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.171" nospeaker="true" time="16:00:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.172" nospeaker="true" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q00800">Prohibition of Above-cost Ticket Touting Bill 2017: First Stage</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.173" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1304" speakername="Noel Rock" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q00900"><p>I move:</p><blockquote>That leave be granted to introduce a Bill entitled an Act to render it unlawful for any person to sell or offer for sale tickets for major sporting, musical or theatrical events for a price in excess of the officially designated price.</blockquote><p>I propose to share my time with Deputy Stephen Donnelly.  I welcome the opportunity to co-propose this Bill to the House alongside Deputy Donnelly who has worked with me on it.  I understand from some of the longer serving journalists and other people around the House that it is a little unusual for people to co-propose a Private Members' Bill, particularly so when there is a member of a party and an Independent member involved.  Perhaps this epitomises new politics in a positive way.</p><p>I would like to outline the potential solution proposed in this Bill and how it will impact on people.  The nature of the problem is straightforward and easy to understand.  For too long now, music and sports fans have been gouged, effectively paying multiples of face value for tickets to both music events and sports events.  A small cottage industry has developed around this issue and this industry has become more automated, industrialised and more formalised than ever before, with the result that normally the primary seller would perhaps regulate but in this instance it appears that the primary seller, the well known entity, Ticketmaster, is also a controlling stakeholder in one of the largest secondary selling entities, Seatwave.  It is clear there is a potential conflict of interest arising, including the potential for the primary ticket seller not to regulate in the best interests of the consumer, as it would usually do in a normally functioning market.  Deputy Donnelly will outline how the market is not functioning in an effective way.  It is, therefore, felt that Government regulation is necessitated because the market is not functioning in a normal way for sports fans or music fans.</p><p>The Bill is based on the Belgian model which sought to outlaw the above-cost selling of tickets.  In other words, it seeks to outlaw ticket selling at above-cost face value plus a small service fee.  This provision was implemented in Belgium, which is a fellow EU member state, and as such it is compatible with all relevant EU laws on competition and consumer protection.  It is clear that it has had a very positive halo effect within Belgium and the ticket selling industry in Belgium.  This is a positive move for consumer protection and competition.  I pay tribute to Deputies Naughten, Shatter and Ring who have all previously proposed similar legislation over the last two decades.  I believe now is the time to take action on this issue.  I also believe this is one of the most symbolic examples of what is called &quot;nominative determinism&quot;, which means that a person's surname reflects the work he or she is doing, which in my case, my surname being &quot;Rock&quot;, speaking on behalf of music fans in the country, is most fitting.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.174" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1230" speakername="Stephen Donnelly" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q01000"><p>I regret I cannot claim any nominative determinism in terms of my surname.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.175" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q01100"><p>There are many good ballad singers with the surname &quot;Donnelly&quot;.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.176" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1230" speakername="Stephen Donnelly" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q01200"><p>I thank Deputy Rock for his work on this Bill.  It seeks to address an issue in what is a complicated market in respect of which some very serious comments were made recently in the House of Commons, including allegations of complicity by re-sellers working with organised touts who are breaking the law and very serious allegations about links between profits being made in this industry and Dublin-based paramilitaries and armed organisations in Israel.  As such, we need to take this issue very seriously.</p>  <p>  The power of the Bill is in its simplicity in that what it essentially provides is that in most cases a ticket must be resold at the original cost.  In other words, a person is not permitted to purchase 20, 100 or 1,000 tickets at a cost of &euro;80 each and then re-sell them to fans at a cost of &euro;1,000 each.  My understanding is that the Government is supportive of the direction of the Bill but that there are technical issues that will need to be addressed on Second and Committee Stages, including re-sellers moving out of this jurisdiction and how that can be addressed.  However, this Bill will send out the very clear signal that it will be illegal for anyone to engage, in an organised way, in the block-buying of tickets for music or sports events and to re-sell them with a profiteering motive.  I look forward to the Bill's passage through the House.  </p>  <p>  I draw the attention of the Taoiseach and the Government Chief Whip, Deputy Regina Doherty, that while ticket touting relative to some of the issues discussed in this Parliament in the last few weeks and to be discussed today is a niche issue, having heard the testimony from the UK House of Commons that the profits from this are being linked to Dublin-based to paramilitaries I would ask that this Bill be given a higher level of consideration by the Business Committee than it would otherwise be given.  I again thank Deputy Rock for his work on this Bill.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.177" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q01300"><p>Is the Bill opposed?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.178" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1338" speakername="Regina Doherty" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q01400"><p>No.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.179" nospeaker="true" time="16:00:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.180" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q01600"><p>Since this is a Private Members' Bill, Second Stage must, under Standing Orders, be taken in Private Members' time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.181" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1304" speakername="Noel Rock" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q01700"><p>I move: That the Bill be taken in Private Members' time.&quot;</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.182" nospeaker="true" time="16:00:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.183" nospeaker="true" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q01900">Pensions (Amendment) Bill 2017: First Stage</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.184" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1252" speakername="John Brady" time="16:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100018#Q02000"><p>I move:</p><blockquote>That leave be granted to introduce a Bill entitled an Act to amend the Pensions Act 1990 to prevent solvent companies walking away and reneging on their pension obligations to their employees.</blockquote><p>In recent years there has been a concerted effort to close defined benefit, DB, schemes regardless of the health of the company.  We know this is happening.  We saw it happen most recently in Independent News &amp;amp; Media.  If a company is profitable as Independent News &amp;amp; Media is, then it cannot be allowed to walk away from its pension commitments to its employees.</p><p>In reviewing our pension system in 2012, the OECD clearly identified healthy sponsors being allowed to walk away from DB pension plans and shutting them down as another weakness of Irish legislation.  Back then, the OECD recommended that Irish legislation should be strengthened to ensure that healthy sponsors are not allowed to walk away from DB plans unless assets cover 90% of pension liabilities.  If, as legislators, we do not address what Independent News &amp;amp; Media has done we will be allowing other companies to do the same.  We are saying that this is okay and we are actively leaving the door open for other companies to do the same.  We cannot allow healthy companies to decide they no longer want to fund employees&rsquo; pensions and to then consciously commence wind down of DB pension plans.</p><p>This Bill is about ensuring that employers' obligations are honoured.  It is about protecting schemes and employees.  The Bill directly addresses the issue of healthy companies walking away from DB pension schemes.  It strengthens legislation and it ensures that employees are protected.  It also implements a key recommendation from the OECD, which, if implemented at the time, would have prevented the issue at Independent News &amp;amp; Media arising.  According to the Irish Association of Pension Funds, the number of active DB schemes has fallen from just over 1,200 at the end of 2006 to fewer than 500 today.  The number of active members in those schemes has dropped from 270,000 to 126,000 as of the end of last year.</p><p>These schemes and members must be protected.  There is an onus on all legislators to ensure they are.  With cross-party support for this Bill, we can send a clear message to companies that they will not be allowed to wind down consciously their defined benefit pension plans and renege on their pension commitments to members.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.186" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R00200"><p>Is the Bill opposed?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.187" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1338" speakername="Regina Doherty" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R00300"><p>No.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.188" nospeaker="true" time="16:10:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.189" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R00500"><p>Since this is a Private Members' Bill, Second Stage must, under Standing Orders, be taken in Private Members' time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.190" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1252" speakername="John Brady" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R00600"><p>I move: &quot;That the Bill be taken in Private Members' time.&quot;</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.191" nospeaker="true" time="16:10:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.192" nospeaker="true" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R00800">Eighth Report of Standing Committee of Selection: Motion</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.193" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1338" speakername="Regina Doherty" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R00900"><p>I move:</p><blockquote>That D&aacute;il &Eacute;ireann approves the Eighth Report of the Standing Committee of Selection in accordance with Standing Order 27F, copies of which were laid before D&aacute;il &Eacute;ireann on 26th January, 2017, and discharges a member and appoints a member to a Committee accordingly.</blockquote></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.194" nospeaker="true" time="16:10:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.195" nospeaker="true" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R01100">Drug Trafficking Proposal: Referral to Joint Committee</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.196" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1338" speakername="Regina Doherty" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R01200"><p>I move:</p><blockquote>That the proposal that D&aacute;il &Eacute;ireann approves the exercise by the State of the option or discretion under Protocol No. 21 on the position of the United Kingdom and Ireland in respect of the area of freedom, security and justice annexed to the Treaty on European Union and to the Treaty on the Functioning of the European Union, to take part in the adoption and application of the following proposed measure:Proposal for a Directive of the European Parliament and of the Council amending Council Framework Decision 2004/757/JHA of 25 October 2004 laying down minimum provisions on the constituent elements of criminal acts and penalties in the field of illicit drug trafficking, as regards the definition of drug,a copy of which was laid before D&aacute;il &Eacute;ireann on 26th January, 2017, be referred to the Joint Committee on Health, in accordance with Standing Order 84A(4)(<i>k</i>), which, not later than 9th February, 2017, shall send a message to the D&aacute;il in the manner prescribed in Standing Order 90, and Standing Order 89(2) shall accordingly apply.</blockquote></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.197" nospeaker="true" time="16:10:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.198" nospeaker="true" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R01400">Ceisteanna - Questions</major-heading>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.199" nospeaker="true" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R01450">Brexit Issues</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.200.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R01500"><p><i>1.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he will report on his telephone conversation with the British Prime Minister, Ms Theresa May, on 16 January 2017; the issues that were discussed; if no special status for any devolved Administration in Northern Ireland was mentioned; if there was discussion on immigrant screening or Border control before her speech on 17 January 2017; and if there are plans to meet her to discuss Brexit issues and the way they apply to the island of Ireland. <b>[2732/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.201.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R01600"><p><i>2.</i> To ask the Taoiseach the outcome of his discussion with the British Prime Minister, Ms Theresa May, regarding her 12-point plan for the United Kingdom leaving the European Union. <b>[2739/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.202.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R01700"><p><i>3.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he will report on his engagement with the British Prime Minister, Ms Theresa May, on 16 January 2017. <b>[2762/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.203.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R01800"><p><i>4.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if Ireland will be part of the direct negotiations on Brexit, particularly in regard to the Border with Northern Ireland, the impact of exiting the European Union and the possible exit from the customs and trade agreement, which will automatically result in a return to borders on this island. <b>[3071/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.204.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R01900"><p><i>5.</i> To ask the Taoiseach his discussions with EU leaders and the British Prime Minister, Ms Theresa May, on the possibility of a hard Border between Ireland and Northern Ireland; and his plans to avoid this outcome. <b>[3238/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.205.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R02000"><p><i>6.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he will report on his engagement with the British Prime Minister, Ms Theresa May, during her recent visit to Dublin. <b>[4070/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.206.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R02100"><p><i>7.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he will report on his meeting with Prime Minister May on 30 January 2017. <b>[4116/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.207.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R02150"><p>I propose to take Questions Nos. 1 to 7, inclusive, together.</p>  <p>  My meeting with Prime Minister May yesterday covered a wide range of issues.  We discussed the recent political developments in Northern Ireland and the implications that Brexit will have for the North and for relationships across these islands.  We reiterated our joint and continuing commitment to the Good Friday Agreement and its institutions and our shared desire to see a fully functioning Executive back in place as soon as possible.  We agreed on the importance of our two Governments working together to ensure that the frameworks of the Good Friday and successor agreements are fully preserved in the upcoming Brexit negotiations and outcomes.  We discussed the necessity of ensuring the continued free flow of trade on the island and the need to avoid a hard Border.  I made clear to the Prime Minister that, in my view, any manifestation of a hard Border would have very negative consequences.</p>  <p>  We agreed that we both want to see a close, friction-free economic and trading relationship between the UK and the EU, including Ireland.  Prime Minister May and I also reaffirmed our commitment to maintaining the common travel area and agreed to continue working together to this end.  I emphasised to the Prime Minister the importance of finding a way forward on outstanding commitments, particularly on issues such the legacy institutions under the Stormont House Agreement, and the Irish language.  Our discussions also covered the importance of our future co-operation in key areas, such as agriculture and food, energy, security and criminal justice, education and culture.  Our two Governments are agreed that a close, trouble-free, economic and trading relationship between the UK and the EU, including Ireland, is in our best interests. </p>  <p>  I had previously spoken with Prime Minister May on the evening of Monday, 16 January, when we discussed the situation in Northern Ireland and repeated our desire to see the institutions established under the Good Friday Agreement operating effectively, and in particular to have a fully functioning Executive in place as soon as possible following the election.  We also discussed her speech on Brexit, scheduled for the following day.  In that speech, the Prime Minister provided some important clarity on the proposed approach of the British Government to the Brexit negotiation process.  I note, however, that there is still a lot of detail that remains to be set out as we move towards those negotiations commencing.</p>  <p>  From our perspective, our overall negotiation priorities remain unchanged.  These are our economy and trade; Northern Ireland, including the peace process and Border issues; the common travel area; and the future of the European Union.  I am under no illusion about the challenges that remain to be addressed.  Ministers and I will continue to meet and engage with our EU counterparts over coming weeks to emphasise Ireland&rsquo;s concerns and to ensure they are fully reflected in the EU position once negotiations commence.  This activity is reinforced by extensive engagement at diplomatic and official levels.  The Government is acutely aware of the potential risks and challenges for the Irish economy and will remain fully engaged on this aspect as the negotiations proceed.  I believe that, from my discussions with other members of the European Council and the EU institutions, there is a good understanding of the significant implications for Ireland arising from Brexit.  While this does not, of course, guarantee that it will be possible to mitigate against all the negative consequences of the UK's eventual departure from the EU, it is vital that we continue to engage with our EU partners and the EU institutions in order to defend our interests to the greatest extent possible.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.208" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R02200"><p>It is seven months since the Brexit referendum.  The failure to go beyond generalities has now gone from frustrating to causing widespread concern.  In past negotiations, such as those on the fiscal treaty and EU debt terms, the Taoiseach perfected a strategy of refusing to say what he was looking for until the negotiations were over, after which he would declare the negotiations as a major triumph for Ireland.  The worst example of this was, of course, when he said we were about to get billions for bank recapitalisation.  We both asked for this and received exactly nothing.  The Taoiseach will remember that famous meeting.  This cannot go on.</p>  <p>  The Taoiseach keeps on saying everybody is in favour of maintaining the common travel area and protecting the Good Friday Agreement but nobody has spelled out what that means.  The common travel area has always been about more than just presenting passports at the border; it is about an automatic right to work, claim social protection payments, use the health service, vote and gain access to the education system on the same terms as citizens of the relevant jurisdiction.</p>  <p>  There are three major urgent matters requiring clarification.  Has the Taoiseach said to Prime Minister May that we will not agree to diluting the role of the European Convention on Human Rights in Northern Ireland's peace settlement?  Second, has he said to her that any amendment to the role of the European Union in the Northern Ireland Act 1998 must be subject to previous negotiation?  Finally, has he said to her and the European Union negotiators that Northern Ireland residents must retain their core rights as EU citizens?  Northern Ireland will have the largest bloc of EU citizens living outside the European Union after Brexit.  These are very basic questions.  These are fundamental points that should not be open to negotiation.  Could the Taoiseach indicate whether he asked those three specific questions of the British Prime Minister? </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.209" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R02300"><p>Yes, I discussed the question of human rights with the Prime Minister and made the very point that we do not want to see any diminution of human rights in any changes contemplated by the British Government or in the Human Rights Act.  I understand that is not the immediate focus of the British Government at present.</p>  <p>  If there is any change to the role of the European Union in the Northern Ireland Act 1998 or any change contemplated, we will obviously be on the side of the 27.  Any change signalled would, of course, have to come before us, including the Barnier task force and, eventually, the European Council directly.  That has not been raised directly with me.</p>  <p>  With regard to Northern Ireland, obviously when people voted for the Good Friday Agreement in the North and South, they did so with the expectation of their being able to enjoy the rights, privileges and benefits of EU citizens.  We want to see that maintained.  We will work very hard in that regard.  I do not want to see any change from what the people voted for and what was confirmed North and South.</p>  <p>  The Deputy referred to generalities.  Of course, this has gone on now for quite some time but we agree that there should be very good working relationships and that we want no change to the common travel area, which gives people a right of movement north, south, east and west for social purposes, residency and work.  The Prime Minister is very committed to that, as are we.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.210" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="16:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100019#R02400"><p>We understood from Prime Minister May yesterday and reports in the British media that the Brexit legislation is likely to come before the UK Houses of Parliament for voting in or around 7 March and that at that point she will be readying herself for the EU summit meeting of Heads of Government in Malta.  The timelines are getting very much shorter.  Thus far, the Taoiseach has been giving us general outlines of his wish list but he has not told us in any detail Ireland's list of "must do's" regarding Brexit.  While there has been much focus, understandably, on the implications for cross-Border activity between the North and South and for the island of Ireland, the fact remains, nonetheless, that in the Republic alone Brexit has implications for tens of thousands of jobs.</p><p>Has the Taoiseach proposed to the British Government that the Brexit legislation should include a clause relating to Northern Ireland and the fact that people there have not voted for Brexit and, under the Belfast Agreement, have a special relationship with the rest of the island?<br/><br/>We also want to know about simple matters-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.212" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S00200"><p>No, Deputy.  We are out of time and will have none for-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.213" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S00300"><p>-----like the recognition of teaching qualifications in the South, the North and various parts of the UK.  There are complex and simple issues that we need to know about.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.214" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S00400"><p>I discussed this with the Prime Minister last night.  I understand that the legislation is starting today in the House of Commons.  It should be finished there by around 7 February.  She might be in a position on 9 March to have that matter completed and to move Article 50 before the end of March.  I asked that perhaps we might have a clearer view as to when Article 50 would actually be moved so as to be more acquainted with what might be in the letter that is going to accompany it from the British Government to the European Commission.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.215" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S00500"><p>What did she say?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.216" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S00600"><p>How did she respond to that?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.217" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S00700"><p>I had contact with Mr. Mark Durkan, MP, the other day in respect of Committee Stage of the Bill in the House of Commons.  He made the point that we needed to look at the implementation bodies that were set up under the Good Friday Agreement because they were predicated on the dispensing and disbursal of European funding under various headings - INTERREG, PEACE funds and so on.  There is &euro;3 billion there out to 2020, as the Deputy is aware.  The MP intends to table amendments on Committee Stage in the Bill in the House of Commons reflecting that.</p>  <p>  We have to devise possibly a new structure here in respect of what is going to happen when CAP dries up.  Who will deal with the subsidies there?  When Britain stops payments into the European Union budget, are these subsidies to be reduced?  How do we regulate the payments through INTERREG and PEACE funding?  These are subject to many of the sectoral committees that we are now engaged in, which will come to a head again on 17 February when we have another all-island forum dealing with a whole range of sectoral issues where options have been put forward by voices from business and different sectors that are very useful for us as we prepare.</p>  <p>  There will be another question, I am sure, a Cheann Comhairle.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.218" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S00800"><p>I listened intently to the Taoiseach's report and to what he and the British Prime Minister stated yesterday.  I saw no mention of the Taoiseach defending the vote of the people in the North to stay within the EU.  If he will be straight about this issue, I want to know whether he argued for the North to be given a specially designated status within the EU.  As I have often told him, there is a logic behind this.  It is the only way to ensure that there is no land border on this island between the EU and the British state.  Did the Taoiseach make this proposal to the British Prime Minister?</p>  <p>  A report of the policy department of the citizens' rights and constitutional affairs of the European Parliament published a report that specifically warned that Brexit would affect the Good Friday Agreement.  It claims: "The impact (of Brexit) will be political, in particular since the Good Friday Agreement - an international agreement - will require alteration".  It also warns about "the re-establishment of a hard border between the north and the south" and the "reversal of improvements in cross-border trade."  While it acknowledges the positive impact of EU funding streams in the past, it states that will not be the case in future and there will be a negative financial impact.</p>  <p>  The weekend saw the British Secretary of State deciding, on the anniversary of Bloody Sunday, that investigations by the PSNI and others into past events were too greatly focused on the actions of the British Army and other state forces.  That followed a whole series of attacks on the Public Prosecution Service and the Lord Chief Justice.  None of these claims is true.  What is true is a desire on the part of the British state and some Unionist parties to provide immunity to British soldiers and others.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.219" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S00900"><p>I thank the Deputy.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.220" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01000"><p>Did the Taoiseach challenge the Prime Minister on this?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.221" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01100"><p>Before I call the Taoiseach, we have just a little over a minute left, so can we take ten minutes from the remaining groups of questions?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.222" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01200"><p>Agreed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.223" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01300"><p>Will we take ten minutes from the second group?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.224" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01400"><p>From the third group.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.225" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01500"><p>No.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.226" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01600"><p>Sorry.  Is it the second group?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.227" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01700"><p>Why the third group?  The second only has two questions.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.228" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01800"><p>The second group.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.229" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S01900"><p>We have to make a decision-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.230" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02000"><p>Yes.  The second group.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.231" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02100"><p>-----on whether to take ten minutes from the next groups.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.232" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02200"><p>Can we take it from the second group because there are fewer Deputies in it?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.233" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02300"><p>Can we take ten minutes from the second group?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.234" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02400"><p>I agree.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.235" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02500"><p>I love it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.236" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02600"><p>We can or we cannot.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.237" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02700"><p>On a point of order, I do not mind co-operating, but that last intervention took the biscuit.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.238" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02800"><p>Why?  It made perfect sense.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.239" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S02900"><p>If it happens to come from a certain quarter, we dispense with the rules.  No 15 minutes.  I have been very gracious every week.  I do not mind giving up time and so forth.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.240" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03000"><p>Okay.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.241" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03100"><p>The Deputy is very good.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.242" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03200"><p>Is he not great?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.243" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03300"><p>Last week, the same thing happened and Deputy Howlin lost time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.244" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03400"><p>We will influence-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.245" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03500"><p>We are going to lose out.  Basically, it means that there will be just two question slots.  It is calling for a review of this process.  That is the point that I was going to make.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.246" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03600"><p>That is fine.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.247" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03700"><p>This is happening every week.  We are taking ten minutes from subsequent questions.  There are three 15-minute slots.  If ten minutes are taken, we are <i>de facto</i>talking about two slots.  We can take five minutes from each slot.  I do not mind.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.248" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03800"><p>What is the agreement?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.249" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S03900"><p>Ten minutes from the second slot.  That is the consensus.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.250" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04000"><p>Agreed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.251" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04100"><p>Sorry?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.252" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04200"><p>No, that is not what Deputy Martin said.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.253" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04300"><p>Everyone else has a different view, so here we are.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.254" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04400"><p>More Deputies have indicated to speak in the third slot-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.255" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04500"><p>Tyranny of the minority.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.256" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1214" speakername="Frances Fitzgerald" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04600"><p>Yes.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.257" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04700"><p>-----which is why I suggested that it be taken from the-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.258" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04800"><p>There are four-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.259" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S04900"><p>May I debate the point-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.260" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05000"><p>How many Deputies does Deputy Coppinger represent?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.261" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05100"><p>-----or does Deputy Martin want to talk over me?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.262" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05200"><p>I represent 44 Deputies.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.263" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05300"><p>We should all go home, so.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.264" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05400"><p>Deputy Martin resents anyone else speaking in the D&aacute;il-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.265" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05500"><p>Come on.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.266" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1214" speakername="Frances Fitzgerald" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05600"><p>Deputy Martin is right.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.267" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05700"><p>-----but the Trump issue, if the House does not mind me saying, trumps the second slot's issue on many grounds.  No. 1, there are more Deputies involved.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.268" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05800"><p>Can we proceed?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.269" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S05900"><p>No. 2, it is more important.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.270" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S06000"><p>These are the procedures, are they not?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.271" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S06100"><p>We will proceed with this item.  My apologies, Taoiseach.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.272" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S06200"><p>The murder in Aleppo trumps an awful lot of issues in the House, but there was silence from the other side.  Double standards.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.273" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S06300"><p>The Deputy did not care when there were loads of massacres.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.274" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S06500"><p>I discussed the fact of the vote of the people of Northern Ireland with the British Prime Minister.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.275" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S06600"><p>I asked whether the Taoiseach defended it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.276" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S06700"><p>I also noted the fact that she was in Cardiff yesterday meeting with the devolved assemblies.  I noted in particular that she received a plan for the future from the First Minister of Scotland and from the First Minister of Wales, Ms Nicola Sturgeon and Mr. Carwyn Jones.  Unfortunately, because the Executive was deliberately collapsed by Sinn F&eacute;in, there is now no leadership to present a plan to the Prime Minister from Northern Ireland.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.277" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S06800"><p>The Taoiseach is our leader.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.278" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S06900"><p>We did have generally the same direction and objectives with the former First Minister, Ms Foster, and former deputy First Minister, Mr. Martin McGuinness, which was to be welcomed, at the North-South Ministerial Council.  It is important to say that I discussed with the Prime Minister the particular and special and unique circumstances that apply in Northern Ireland that do not apply anywhere else in Europe, which <i>de facto</i>makes this a special case.</p><p>Deputy Adams asked me about having a situation where there is no land border between the Republic and Northern Ireland.  I am not sure that we are going to achieve that.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.279" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07000"><p>I did not ask about that.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.280" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07100"><p>I have made the point very strongly that we will not have a return to a hard Border or, as they say, the borders of the past.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.281" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07200"><p>How is the Government going to achieve that?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.282" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07300"><p>I made the point to the Prime Minister that this would be very controversial, would bring with it serious implications, and we are not going back there.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.283" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07400"><p>I am sure she was impressed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.284" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07500"><p>I think-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.285" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07600"><p>I thank the Taoiseach.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.286" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07700"><p>Let me just make this point, a Cheann Comhairle.  There might be another question when I might return to answer this.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.287" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07800"><p>No, we are moving on to the second group of questions.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.288" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S07900"><p>In that case-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.289" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08000"><p>No.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.290" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08100"><p>On a point of order,-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.291" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08200"><p>No.  Resume your seat.  We are moving on to the second group.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.292" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08300"><p>I asked the Taoiseach a question-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.293" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08400"><p>It is grossly unfair to exclude-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.294" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08500"><p>-----about the remarks made by the Secretary of State, but he did not answer.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.295" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08600"><p>I am sorry, but there was no agreement on what the alternative arrangement would be.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.296" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08700"><p>There was.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.297" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08800"><p>There was not agreement, Deputy Howlin.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.298" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S08900"><p>That means that, if I stand, I can use up ten minutes arguing about procedure to exclude Deputies.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.299" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09000"><p>There was time, Deputy.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.300" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09100"><p>That is unfair.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.301" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09200"><p>We are moving on to the second group of questions.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.302" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09300"><p>I tabled questions.  The Labour Party has a voice in this and I would like to be able to ask the question.  This is grossly unfair.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.303" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09400"><p>We have heard Deputy Burton on this particular matter.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.304" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1214" speakername="Frances Fitzgerald" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09500"><p>Yes.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.305" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09600"><p>What does Deputy Howlin mean?  The Labour Party has asked two questions.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.306" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09700"><p>I sat on the reform committee with the Ceann Comhairle-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.307" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09800"><p>Yes.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.308" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S09900"><p>-----for very many meetings.  I understood that all Deputies were to be treated equally in the House.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.309" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10000"><p>Yes.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.310" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10100"><p>Was I wrong?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.311" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10200"><p>You were not, but we do not have agreement-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.312" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10300"><p>Why am I the only Deputy with a question in this group of questions who is to be excluded?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.313" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10400"><p>The time ran out and there was not-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.314" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10500"><p>A Cheann Comhairle-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.315" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10600"><p>Wait.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.316" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10700"><p>I have no difficulty with giving five minutes to Deputy Howlin.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.317" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10800"><p>Just wait a minute, Deputy, please.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.318" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S10900"><p>We would have asked and answered-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.319" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S11000"><p>Time ran out and there was no agreement.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.320" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S11100"><p>-----the questions.  Deputy Miche&aacute;l Martin invited a procedural debate and got it from the Deputy opposite.  He used up the time in which I could have properly put a question.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.321" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S11200"><p>Come on.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.322" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100020#S11300"><p>These are important issues for our people.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.323" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T00100"><p>No, just to be clear.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.324" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T00200"><p>A Cheann Comhairle, could I make a proposal?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.325" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T00300"><p>It is grossly unfair.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.326" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T00400"><p>The clock stopped while we considered the procedure we would adopt.  We did not have agreement.  Deputy Martin proposed one thing.  Deputy Howlin and Deputy Adams proposed something entirely different.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.327" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T00500"><p>Then you should have looked for consensus.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.328" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T00600"><p>In the absence of an agreement, therefore, I suggest we proceed to the next group of questions.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.329" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T00700"><p>If I could make a very brief proposal, could we provide an extra five minutes to allow Teachta Howlin to put his question but perhaps the Taoiseach would also answer my question which he refused to do?  With the agreement of Teachta Martin will you, a Cheann Comhairle, allow his colleague five minutes?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.330" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T00800"><p>Do Members agree to give another five minutes?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.331" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T00900"><p>Yes.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.332" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01000"><p>So we will not get the third-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.333" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01100"><p>Yes.  I am a very reasonable man, but the issue still needs to be reviewed because it cannot be done under the existing rule.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.334" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01200"><p>I welcome the statement made yesterday jointly by Prime Minister May and the Taoiseach that they wanted a seamless and friction-free Border.  That sounded to me like a very good soundbite.  Could I ask how they jointly agreed to achieve that because if the UK exits the Single Market and the customs union unilaterally that would change the legal definition of the Border between the Republic and Northern Ireland?  I do not know whether the Taoiseach had an opportunity to see "Newsnight" last night but that is exactly the point that was made again by the appointed person from the European Parliament, Guy Verhofstadt.  How is that objective to be achieved?</p>  <p>  I have two brief supplementaries.  Has the Taoiseach thought about the possibility of sectoral agreements to cover vital interests between Britain and Ireland in parallel to the negotiations.  Finally, does the Taoiseach have legal advice on whether the final agreement will require ratification by a referendum in this State?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.335" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01300"><p>Deputy Howlin's first question is in respect of the seamless frictionless-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.336" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01400"><p>Seamless and friction-free border.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.337" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01500"><p>The lycra option.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.338" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01600"><p>Friction-free, frictionless border.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.339" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01700"><p>The Sir Humphrey formula.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.340" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01800"><p>What I pointed out to Deputy Burton in response to her question is that if the legislation has gone through by 7 or 9 March, before the meeting in Malta, the Prime Minister will then at some stage move to trigger Article 50 by letter to the Commission.  That letter is important because therein lies the key to what it is we are talking about.  In her speech at Lancaster the Prime Minister referred to the fact that Britain is withdrawing from the Single Market.  That brings its own implications.  We want the common travel area retained.  We also made the point that the UK has not defined exactly what it wants in respect of the customs union, whether it is full membership, associate membership or non-membership.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.341" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T01900"><p>What did the Prime Minister say?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.342" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02000"><p>That question must be addressed by the British Government.  I discussed it with the Prime Minister last night and it is not for me to pre-empt what it is the British Government will decide in that regard, but that is the area where the negotiation will be critical when the talks start.  If we want a seamless, friction-free, trouble-free Border that is the crucial area to be negotiated.  The Prime Minister is very much aware of that now.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.343" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02100"><p>Could we now move on to Questions Nos. 8 and 9?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.344" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02200"><p>What about the other two questions?</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.345" nospeaker="true" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02300">Legislative Programme</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.346.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02350"><p><i>8.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he will report on the Bills in preparation in his Department.  <b>[2735/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.347.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02375"><p><i>9.</i> To ask the Taoiseach the status of Bills under preparation in his Department.  <b>[4071/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.348.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02387"><p>I propose to take Questions Nos. 8 and 9 together.</p><p>The only Bill in preparation in my Department is the National Economic and Social Council, NESC, Bill.  The Bill will dissolve the National Economic and Social Development Office, NESDO, and place the NESC on a statutory footing.  It is a short answer.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.349" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02400"><p>The Taoiseach's Department is also responsible for the entire legislative programme and through the Office of the Attorney General drafts the overwhelming majority of legislation.  Due to his constitutional powers the Taoiseach also has the ability to block the Oireachtas from even voting on most legislation, including amendments.  What he has never done is to outline his approach to using those powers or to discuss what reforms are required.  As a minority Government which says that it understands that it cannot impose its will on the majority, the Taoiseach's actions concerning the legislative agenda have become increasingly unacceptable.  The blocking of Deputy Jim O'Callaghan's Judicial Appointments Commission Bill on the grounds that it supposedly created a charge on the Exchequer was a very clear abuse and it involved the Taoiseach taking upon himself the right to effectively veto all legislation.  It was an unprecedented manoeuvre which was mean and petty.</p>  <p>  The simple question I put to the Taoiseach is if he intends honouring his commitment to allow non-governmental Bills to be voted on and enacted?  There was significant discussion on the issue prior to the formation of the Government and the reform of D&aacute;il &Eacute;ireann, the balance between the Executive and the Legislature and it was accepted that there needed to be far more practical facilitation of legislation from the Opposition and that the issue of a charge on the Exchequer had been abused in the past, had been used excessively and that it would end and greater flexibility would be shown.  Is the Oireachtas going to be allowed to act as a proper legislative body or does the Taoiseach intend to maintain his personal right to veto anything he does not like?  There were clear political reasons why the Taoiseach tried to kill off the Judicial Appointments Commission Bill.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.350" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02500"><p>Deputy Martin's question is in respect of the Bills in preparation in the Department.  I have answered that for the Deputy.  The only Bill is the National Economic and Social Council, NESC, Bill.  Deputy Martin is now asking me a different question about the management of the legislative process that is being followed.  Deputy O'Callaghan never sent his Bill for pre-legislative scrutiny.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.351" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02600"><p>No, but the committee approved it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.352" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02700"><p>He booked Report Stage before the Bill was even on Committee Stage.  The Ceann Comhairle is well aware of the number of Bills that have been allowed to pass without being blocked and the challenge now is for the parties to say which ones we want to pursue.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.353" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02800"><p>The Taoiseach blocked it because the Minister, Deputy Ross, said so.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.354" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T02900"><p>We will never be able to get through the 30 or 40 Bills that are lined up now in addition to the list published by the Government.  I suggest that the Fianna F&aacute;il Party would decide on the three or five Bills it regards as a priority.  Deputy O'Callaghan's Judicial Appointments Commission Bill is now going through in conjunction with the Government Bill.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.355" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03000"><p>No it is not.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.356" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03100"><p>There is a way of doing this that should not cause controversy between us.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.357" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03200"><p>It most certainly is not.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.358" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03300"><p>Two can play at that game.  Deputy O'Callaghan did not have pre-legislative scrutiny carried out on his Bill.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.359" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03400"><p>He did, but the Taoiseach's people did not turn up.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.360" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03500"><p>As I understand it, he did not bring it for pre-legislative scrutiny and he booked Report Stage before it reached Committee Stage.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.361" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03600"><p>It went through the parliamentary process but people did not show up.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.362" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03700"><p>In any event, I take the Deputy's point.  I have not signed any money messages against any of the Bills that have come through the House.  I have allowed them to go through.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.363" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03800"><p>The Taoiseach did on that Bill.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.364" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T03900"><p>The new politics is to have backbenchers bring forward non-governmental Bills and to have them processed and now there is a big backlog of those.  The parties sponsoring the Bills need to identify what are their priorities and we will try to facilitate them.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.365" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T04000"><p>If I understand correctly, the one Bill sponsored by the Taoiseach's Department is to do with the National Economic and Social Council.  An bhfuil s&eacute; sin ceart?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.366" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T04100"><p>T&aacute; s&eacute; sin ceart.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.367" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T04200"><p>We discussed that recently.  The purpose of the Bill is to abolish the National Economic and Social Development Office and to place the National Economic and Social Council on a statutory footing.  The National Economic and Social Forum and the National Centre for Partnership and Performance were dissolved in 2010 and this piece of legislation has been talked about since the time Brian Cowen was Taoiseach.  As far as I can ascertain the Bill has been on the Government's legislative programme since 2013.  When will the amended Bill on the National Economic and Social Council be introduced?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.368" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100021#T04300"><p>The function of the National Economic and Social Council is to analyse and report to the Taoiseach on strategic issues relating to the proper development of the economy, the achievement of social justice and the development of a strategic framework for the conduct of relations and arrangements between the Government and the social partners.  That function was set out in the 2006 NESDO Act and that context has changed significantly since then.  There are other forms of dialogue and interaction with interest groups.  There is no question that the process has gone on a long time.  I do not have a specific timescale for the completion of the assessment process.  Considerable work is being carried out in the Department of the Taoiseach and that work is still going on to ensure the best arrangements for the future composition of the council.  Given the changes in recent years it is worth taking some time to make sure that we have the best and most appropriate arrangements in place.  The council's term expired during the summer.  It is important to invest time and effort now to make sure we have the best arrangements in place in addition to it being vital that the highest quality research and advice are available to the Government, particularly at a time of great change.</p><p>I expect and want the NESC to continue to provide this function.  However, I must give consideration to that.  I should add that the outgoing members of the council will be involved in the task as well.  I will advise Deputy Adams and the House as to when we might be able to complete this work.  I agree that it has gone on for a considerable period of time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.370" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U00200"><p>The NESC has undertaken a very useful function and has been out of existence since last summer.  The Taoiseach said that it is doing a very useful job but it does not exist.  Does it exist in some shadow form?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.371" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U00300"><p>Perhaps I should have said that it did do a very useful job.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.372" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U00400"><p>The Taoiseach spoke about its future role.  Is it intended to appoint an interim NESC until the new legislation is published and enacted?  I previously raised the issue of constitutional Bills.  A number of constitutional amendments are referenced in the programme for Government while the constitutional convention is sitting at the moment.  Is it the Government's intention to introduce any constitutional Bills in 2017?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.373" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U00500"><p>The future role I envisaged for the NESC is for it to continue to be able to engage in dialogue with all Ministers and the relevant organisations.  Formal structures in place include the national economic dialogue, the Labour Employer Economic Forum, the Climate Change Advisory Council and the social inclusion forum.  The role of the NESC needs to be assessed in light of those arrangements.  We now have the national risk assessment process and have just published the national risk assessment for 2016, which identified strategic risks in the economic, governmental, geopolitical, social and technological areas.  The programme for Government points to the requirement for longer term planning, specifically, areas like housing, broadband, climate change, pensions and long-term funding models higher education and health.  We need to find ways of bringing those together so there is a great deal of work to be done on that.</p>  <p>  In respect of constitutional amendments, the Government has not considered what amendments, if any, should be decided by referendum in 2017.  When the Government does consider that, it will make any announcement that is appropriate.  As Deputy Howlin is aware, following the Constitutional Convention, the number of recommendations for referenda were quite extensive.  The Citizens' Assembly is deliberating at the moment in respect of the Eighth Amendment of the Constitution.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.374" nospeaker="true" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U00550">Official Engagements</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.375.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U00600"><p><i>10.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he has had discussions with the Trump Administration in the United States of America regarding President Trump's stated support for Brexit and other member states leaving the European Union.  <b>[2740/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.376.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U00700"><p><i>11.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he or his officials have had any engagement with the President of the United States, Mr. Donald Trump, or his officials since his inauguration on 20 January 2017.  <b>[2759/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.377.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U00800"><p><i>12.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he has had contact with the President and Vice President of the United States of America since their inauguration.  <b>[2787/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.378.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U00900"><p><i>13.</i> To ask the Taoiseach his proposals for official trips abroad during the first six months of 2017.  <b>[3242/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.379.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01000"><p><i>14.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he has had any contact with President Trump and Vice President Pence since their inauguration.  <b>[4124/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.380.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1367" speakername="Br&iacute;d Smith" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01100"><p><i>15.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he has had contact with President Trump since his inauguration.  <b>[4126/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.381.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01200"><p><i>16.</i> To ask the Taoiseach if he has confirmed a visit to the White House on St Patrick's Day; and if he has had any engagement with the new President or Vice President of the United States since their inauguration.  <b>[4129/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.382.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01300"><p><i>17.</i> To ask the Taoiseach the official visits abroad he has scheduled for 2017.  <b>[4583/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.383.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01400"><p><i>18.</i> To ask the Taoiseach the discussions he has had with the new US Administration concerning Brexit and a US and UK trade deal.  <b>[4577/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.384.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01500"><p>I propose to take Questions Nos. 10 to 18, inclusive, together.</p>  <p>  I have not had any contact with either President Trump or Vice President Pence since their inauguration on 20 January.  However, as I have previously reported to the House, I raised immigration reform and our economic and trading interests with both President Trump and Vice President Pence during my phone calls with them following the US elections.  President Trump's office has made clear his intention to continue the St Patrick's Day tradition and this has since been confirmed by his office since his inauguration.  I pIan to continue to protect and promote the strong links between the Irish and American people by visiting the US for a St. Patrick's Day programme.  As in previous years, I will work to protect and advance the interests of the undocumented Irish and promote Ireland's political and economic values and interests.</p>  <p>  Regarding other official trips abroad, there will be a summit of EU Heads of State in Malta on the future of the EU on Friday, 3 February.  A meeting of EU Heads of State and Government is planned for 24 to 25 March to coincide with the 60th anniversary of the Treaty of Rome and there are scheduled meetings of the European Council on 9 to 10 March, 22 to 23 June, 19 to 20 October and 14 to 15 December.  </p>  <p>  In addition, an extensive programme of engagement with all other EU member states and the EU institutions has been under way for some time in the context of outlining Ireland's Brexit priorities.  For my part, I recently visited Prime Minister Rajoy in Madrid.  I plan to visit Warsaw in February to meet Prime Minister Szydlo.  I will also take the opportunity while in Poland to participate in a number of trade promotion events.  I will continue to engage with my EU counterparts, as will other Ministers, over the coming weeks to emphasise Ireland's concerns in this regard and to ensure that they are fully reflected in the EU position once the negotiations commence.  Arrangements for other meetings with some of my European Council partners are being explored.  I will be happy to report to the House in due course on all such engagements.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.385" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01600"><p>Has the Taoiseach had contact with President Trump since his announcement of the restrictions on immigration?  This is the weekend of the anniversary and commemoration of the Holocaust.  I think the Taoiseach knows that the implementation of the Holocaust began with people in Nazi Germany being required to carry papers and passports carrying the word "Jude" - Jew.  I was chairperson of an EU Council of Ministers dealing with development and humanitarian aid in the aftermath of the Rwandan genocide.  The basis of that genocide was a provision stating that people had to have their tribal affiliation set out on their documentation and passports.  Has the Taoiseach or any of his senior civil servants had contact with the Trump Administration and does he support the view of the recently sacked US acting Attorney General that this is likely to be illegal under US law and the US Constitution and the US as we know and understand it?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.386" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01700"><p>The words of Donald Trump and now the decisions by President Trump have caused huge anger across the US and around the world, including in Ireland.  His executive order halting the US refugee programme and the introduction of a travel ban on nationals from seven Muslim-majority countries is counterproductive and wrong.  The Taoiseach has said as much in interviews and here in the D&aacute;il but I work on the broad presumption that Donald Trump does not watch "Oireachtas Report".</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.387" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01800"><p>You are right there.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.388" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1330" speakername="Gerry Adams" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U01900"><p>How would he know of the feeling of people here?  How would he know if our leader, the head of Government, has not contacted him through the appropriate channels and told him this?  How would he know that we will not put up with this in terms of our controls here?  It was very disappointing to hear during Leaders' Questions that the Taoiseach has not conveyed his view, as stated here, which I presume is also the view of the Government and which is clearly the view of the majority of people on this island and within this State.  There is no point in business as usual here.  The Taoiseach needs to send that very clear message to the Administration in Washington.  It may have no effect but unless it is done the potential impact of sending that clear message from this small island will not be known.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.389" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100022#U02000"><p>The world has been rocked over the weekend by events in the US with President Trump throwing around executive orders like confetti - attacking women's rights one day, attacking Mexicans the next and, most notably, introducing what is effectively a Muslim ban.  The response of the American people, particularly young people, has been tremendous, to use a Trump phrase.  They have been protesting at airports and sending President Trump a message that this is not acceptable.  What will be the Taoiseach's response and the response of this Government?  They say you do not know history is being made while you are actually going through it but I can tell the Taoiseach that these are historic events that call for more than a strongly worded letter, which seems to be what is being advocated by some parties here today.  It calls for much more.</p>  <p>  Last summer, the Taoiseach said that President Trump was racist and dangerous.  Now it is no longer theoretical or hypothetical.  He has passed dangerous and racist laws.  Ireland is a very small country in the scheme of things but we have one very powerful weapon at our disposal, which is the power to deprive President Trump of a huge public relations job on 17 March and to prevent the "greenwashing" of his racist actions.  No other country has the chance to showcase and send him such a message.  It would be rank hypocrisy for the Taoiseach to go to Washington on 17 March to celebrate migration to the US by Irish people when Irish people who are Muslims may not even be allowed entry to the US.</p><p> This will probably be Deputy Enda Kenny's last bowl of shamrock event as Taoiseach and I ask him to make it an historic one.  The Taoiseach should do something more important than sending a strongly worded letter.  Frankly, I do not believe that the Taoiseach will look Donald Trump in the eye and convey the anger of Irish people and most decent people in the world because he has not done it yet, despite saying that he would.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.391" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V00200"><p>I join with others in appealing to the Taoiseach, as Leader of this House, to forge a common view on the outrageous actions of the Trump Administration in its first ten days of office.  We await further actions.  What he has done in regard to refugees, to travel, to international trade and in insulting the leader of the largest neighbouring country Mexico is a start.  There are other issues, such as climate change and his views on woman and the disabled.  It is a moment of enlightenment.  We need to take a stand on these issues.  I would ask the Taoiseach to acknowledge that it is not business as usual.  This is a unique set of circumstances in that we have never had a Donald Trump figure in such a powerful office before.  Can we seek to forge a common view within this House to make clear the values of the Irish people?  The great majority of the Irish people find what Donald Trump has done and proposes to do anathema.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.392" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V00300"><p>It is now clear that Donald Trump's extremist views were not some electoral ploy but that, in fact, a dangerous far-right extremist and racist is now the President of the United States.  During questions to the Taoiseach a year ago, I asked was Trump dangerous and racist and the Taoiseach responded to me-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.393" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V00400"><p>No, Deputy Boyd Barrett asked me were his comments.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.394" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V00500"><p>No, I asked the Taoiseach-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.395" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V00600"><p>No, check the record.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.396" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V00700"><p>-----did he agree that he was dangerous and racist and the Taoiseach said that he was dangerous and racist.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.397" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V00800"><p>Hair splitting.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.398" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V00900"><p>What I want to ask the Taoiseach is, when somebody shows that he is dangerous and racist and is implementing racist attacks and policies on vulnerable people, at what point do we draw the line and say it is not acceptable to shake hands with such a person, to give him PR opportunities and to give him gifts on behalf of the Irish people.  The policy of appeasement in the 1930s of Hitler and the fascists was a disaster.  Anybody would recognise that.  He should have been recognised for the dangerous threat he was back then.  Trump is echoing those far-right and extremist policies and I put it to the Taoiseach there can be no appeasement of somebody like that.  Such a person has to be challenged, not have his hands shaken or be in any way legitimised or endorsed by the Taoiseach, particularly on a national day of celebration.  How can the Taoiseach possibly shake hands with somebody who, the Taoiseach said, was dangerous and racist?  By the way, I put that question to others in this House who may also be invited to Washington that they also give a commitment they will not shake hands with this dangerous racist.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.399" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01000"><p>The answer to the question from Deputy Joan Burton is, &quot;no.&quot;  I have not been in contact directly with the American President.  There has been official contact at diplomatic level.  I pointed out today, in answer to questions on Leaders' Questions, that we have had confirmation and clarification given in regard to a number of matters arising from the executive order signed by the US President, specifically, in regard to the 5,000 people from the seven countries named in the executive order who have received Irish citizenship in the past five or six years and their right to be able to enter the United States on presentation of their Irish passport as distinct from the passport of their original country.  This was not a matter that was clarified early on.  It is now clarified.  It has been clarified by official contact at Government level in the United States.</p><p>The Deputy asked me about the <i>pro tem</i>US Attorney General, Ms Sally Yates.  Ms Yates is a woman of great courage.  She stood up for what she believed in here.  This is a matter of the interpretation of the United States legislation and constitution.  I understand that Ms Yates considered the matter carefully over the weekend and wrote what she believed in.  I understand that the letter was hand-delivered to her at 9 p.m., at 9.02 p.m. the White House issued its statement and at 9.15 p.m. the newly appointed interim US Attorney General signed the reversal order of her direction.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.400" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01100"><p>It speaks volumes.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.401" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01200"><p>The Deputy asked if I support Ms Yates.  I recognise that here was a person of courage who was not afraid to stand up for her belief in respect of the laws and constitution of the United States.</p><p>Deputy Coppinger raised the populist question of migration.  What did Deputy-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.402" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01300"><p>The populist question of migration-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.403" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1214" speakername="Frances Fitzgerald" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01400"><p>The issue of going to the White House.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.404" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01500"><p>Why so?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.405" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01600"><p>Yes.  The populist question that I should not go to the White House.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.406" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01700"><p>Populist?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.407" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01800"><p>It is a populist question.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.408" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V01900"><p>Is it?  Okay.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.409" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02000"><p>Deputy Coppinger always follows that line and that is her right, if she wishes.</p>  <p>  I intend to go to the United States, to speak directly to the American President in the White House and to speak directly to the Vice-President and to the Speaker of the House.  If Deputy Coppinger thinks that Ireland, on St. Patrick's Day or in St. Patrick's week, should abandon those Irish-Americans, should abandon those 50,000 undocumented brothers and sisters of her own who are in the United States-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.410" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02100"><p>What about Irish Muslims?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.411" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02200"><p>-----who want a path to legitimate citizenship to work in the United States, I for one will not leave them isolated and alone at a time of considerable concern for them.  If Deputy Coppinger checks with the emigrant offices, she will note the increased activity and calls and visits from Irish people - the Deputy's brothers and sisters and mine - who are concerned about what might happen here.  It is for that reason more than anything else that I want to be able to speak directly, eye-to-eye, to the American President and inform him of their passion for a path to legitimate citizenship of the United States to work for that economy and their families in the land of their choice.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.412" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02300"><p>Will the Taoiseach mention non-Irish people as well?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.413" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02400"><p>In respect of Deputy Howlin's remark, I agree it is not business as usual any more.  It is not politics as usual anymore.  Senior hurling has gone global.  In that sense, we have got to stand up for what we believe in and politicians and leaders can differ.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.414" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02500"><p>What has hurling got to do with this?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.415" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02600"><p>We share great and traditional values with the United States-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.416" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02700"><p>It is just an opportunity to have the last half-word on a serious issue.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.417" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1224" speakername="Miche&aacute;l Martin" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02800"><p>It will be a hurley instead of a bowl of shamrock.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.418" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V02900"><p>----over many presidencies and we want to maintain those values, that credibility and those traditional links.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.419" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1353" speakername="Brendan Howlin" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03000"><p>Will the Taoiseach try to garner that support here?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.420" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03100"><p>Politicians differ.  I differ because I disagree with the policy being outlined here by the American Administration.</p><p>If Deputy Boyd Barrett goes back and checks the record, unless my memory fails me-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.421" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03200"><p>I will send the Taoiseach the transcript.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.422" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03300"><p>Unless my memory fails me, Deputy Boyd Barrett's question to me was about whether the comments of the then candidate were racist-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.423" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03400"><p>And dangerous.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.424" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03500"><p>Yes.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.425" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03600"><p>The Taoiseach said, &quot;yes.&quot;</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.426" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03700"><p>My answer to that was that I considered that the comments at that time were racist and dangerous.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.427" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03800"><p>Does the Taoiseach consider the policy now racist and dangerous?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.428" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1289" speakername="Pat Gallagher" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V03900"><p>The Taoiseach, without interruption.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.429" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V04000"><p>Deputy Boyd Barrett is now changing the question and attacking the personality.  The Deputy's question to me was about the comments at that time.</p><p>In any event-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.430" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1238" speakername="Richard Boyd Barrett" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V04100"><p>Are these policies not dangerous or racist?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.431" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V04200"><p>I intend to outline-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.432" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1289" speakername="Pat Gallagher" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V04300"><p>In football or hurling parlance, the Taoiseach is in injury time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.433" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1254" speakername="Ruth Coppinger" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V04400"><p>It speaks volumes of the straight talking the Taoiseach will do to President Trump.  The Taoiseach is already back-tracking on what he said.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.434" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1245" speakername="Enda Kenny" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V04500"><p>I will always obey the referee.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.435" nospeaker="true" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V04600">Topical Issue Matters</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.436" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1289" speakername="Pat Gallagher" time="16:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100023#V04700"><p>I wish to advise the House of the following matters in respect of which notice has been given under Standing Order 29A and the name of the Member in each case:  (1) Deputy Eugene Murphy - the appointment of a child psychologist for north Roscommon; (2) Deputy Jonathan O'Brien - concerns for local authorities selling homes under the tenant (incremental) purchase scheme 2016; (3) Deputy Noel Rock - the withdrawal of funding for DCU's inter-generational learning programme; (4) Deputy Bernard J. Durkan - delays in development at the Town Centre, Naas, County Kildare; (5) Deputy Imelda Munster - funding for preservation works at the 13th century barbican, St. Laurence's Gate, in Drogheda town; (6) Deputy Brendan Smith - concerns with EirGrid plans for the North-South interconnector; (7) Deputies Louise O'Reilly and David Cullinane - the withdrawal of the appeal in the recent consultants contracts case; (8) Deputy Fergus O'Dowd - extension of the designated rent pressure zones to County Louth; (9) Deputies Willie O'Dea and Paul Murphy - exclusion from the redress scheme of former pupils of a school in Limerick; (10) Deputy Seamus Healy - delays with needs assessments for children in south Tipperary; (11) Deputy Tom Neville - the additional beds needed at University Hospital Limerick; (12) Deputy Martin Ferris - obstetrics at University Hospital Kerry; (13) Deputy Robert Troy - the rejection of the business case for a maternity scanning service at Mullingar regional hospital; (14) Deputy Frank O'Rourke - operational difficulties in orthognathic surgery at St. James's Hospital; (15) Deputies Se&aacute;n Crowe, Clare Daly, Richard Boyd Barrett, Alan Farrell and Mick Wallace - the US immigration issues and pre-clearance at Irish airports; (16) Deputy Niamh Smyth - introduction of the 20-week anomaly scan at Cavan General Hospital; (17) Deputies Joan Burton and Gino Kenny - the proposed sale of Luggala House and estate in County Wicklow; (18) Deputy Thomas P. Broughan - the US immigration issues and pre-clearance at Irish airports; (19) Deputy Fiona O'Loughlin - requirement to improve facilities in all three schools in the Curragh Camp; (20) Deputy John Curran - the lack of dental services for children in Clondalkin; (21) Deputy Thomas Byrne - safety issues and the general effectiveness of the N2 as a national route; (22) Deputy John Brassil - the lack of a dedicated obstetric theatre in University Hospital Kerry; (23) Deputies Pearse Doherty and Pat The Cope Gallagher - suspension of chemotherapy referrals at Letterkenny University Hospital; (24) Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan - the recent High Court challenge to the Magdelen redress scheme; (25) Deputy Mattie McGrath - delays in processing GLAS payments; (26) Deputy Pat Buckley - implementation of recommendations from the CFRAM report on flooding; (27) Deputy Billy Kelleher - the provision of Freestyle Libre under the long-term illness scheme; (28) Deputy John Brady - the planned downgrade of Irish Rail services across the State; and (29) Deputy Martin Heydon - the need for improved facilities at Curragh post-primary school.</p><p>The matters raised by Deputies Willie O'Dea and Paul Murphy, Eugene Murphy, Seamus Healy and Jonathan O'Brien<i></i>have been selected for discussion.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.438" nospeaker="true" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00200">Ceisteanna - Questions (Resumed) - Priority Questions</major-heading>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.439" nospeaker="true" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00250">Arts in Education Charter</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.440.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1271" speakername="Niamh Smyth" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00300"><p><i>43.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht the progress on implementing the arts in education charter; and if she will make a statement on the matter. <b>[4578/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.441.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1271" speakername="Niamh Smyth" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00400"><p>I ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs to update us on progress on implementing the arts in education charter, and if she will make a statement on same.</p></reply>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.442.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00500"><p>I thank the Deputy for raising this matter.  I know she has a particular interest in it.</p><p>A Programme for a Partnership Government commits to the continued implementation of the arts in education charter and my Department is working closely with the Department of Education and Skills and the Arts Council to deliver the objectives of the charter.  The work of the two Departments and the Arts Council in implementing the charter is achieved largely through existing structures such as education centres.  Good progress has been made to date in terms of launching Ireland&rsquo;s first arts in education portal, holding national arts and education days and developing teacher artist partnerships through the education and training centres.</p><p>In terms of direct support for the arts, this is primarily a matter for the Arts Council and its ten-year strategy, , places specific emphasis on the need to plan and provide for children and young people.  The strategy also commits to working to achieve full implementation of the arts in education charter.  Arising from the significant increase of support of &euro;5 million which I secured for the Arts Council as part of budget 2017, I am pleased to say that Arts Council funding in this area for 2017 has, in turn, increased from &euro;3.1 million in 2016 to &euro;3.7 million this year.  That is a very clear indication that the Arts Council is prioritising arts participation by young people and children.</p><p><b></b>In addition to the charter, the Creative Ireland programme, which the Taoiseach and I launched in December, places a special focus on enabling the creative potential of every child.  Building on the arts in education charter, this will involve the development of an integrated plan to enable every child in Ireland to access tuition in music, drama, art and coding by 2022.  My Department will be working with relevant Departments and other stakeholders over the coming months to develop this plan.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.443" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1271" speakername="Niamh Smyth" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00600"><p>In the 2016 A Programme for a Partnership Government, the Government committed itself to implementing the arts in education charter, and specifically the local arts in education partnership, which as we know goes across departmental strands between the Minister and the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Bruton.  We need to have both Departments heavily involved in that regard.  Does the Minister and the Minister, Deputy Bruton, have any practical plans in place for the implementation of local arts in education partnerships throughout the country?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.444" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00700"><p>Yes, it is in the programme for Government.  Also, a key priority in 2017 will be the advancement of the Creative Ireland programme, in particular pillar one, which is enabling the creative potential of every child element.  A key feature will be the launch of "Creative Children", which will be an integrated implementation plan, and the creative schools programme in September.  My Department is working very closely with the Department of Education and Skills to deliver that programme.  One of the key objectives of Creative Ireland is that by 2022, every child in Ireland will have access to tuition and participation in art, music, drama and coding.  There will be a cross-departmental approach to this involving my Department, the Department of Education and Skills, the Department of Children and Youth Affairs, the Arts Council and the Heritage Council.  The Ministers, Deputy Bruton and Deputy Zappone, are very support of this initiative.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.445" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1271" speakername="Niamh Smyth" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00800"><p>I thank the Minister.  Is that a separate scheme with regard to a schools programme or one that will be run in parallel to the local arts in education partnerships?  Has that idea been scrapped?  Is this a new one in place of that?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.446" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00900"><p>Regarding the local arts in education partnership, the Arts Council has got additional funding and it is now taking the lead in rolling out the actions in the arts in education charter.  That came about as a result of that charter.  It was a very useful pilot in Monaghan, and the Deputy is very familiar with it, which highlighted the benefits of working together.  However, having succeeded in getting the significant additional resources for the Arts Council, it is clear that the best way to deliver the charter is for the Arts Council to work with the education centres and all the providers who support teachers across the spectrum.  The wider ambition is the Creative Ireland initiative, and I want children to have access to tuition and participation in arts.  By 2022, every child in the country should have access to that because we know that when children have access to the arts, it is good for their self-esteem and good for them in the longer term.  They are more creative and open-minded, and they perform better at school.  There is a big focus on that, and it is very important.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.447" nospeaker="true" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W00950">Regional Development Initiatives</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.448.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W01000"><p><i>44.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht the steps she will take to prevent the emptying of the west of Ireland and the further over concentration of economic activity and population in Dublin. <b>[4579/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.449.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W01100"><p><i>Per capita</i>growth in the west is one quarter of what it is in Dublin.  Unemployment is almost three times higher along the Border, and in the Minister's constituency, than it is in Dublin.  Broadband speeds are 36 times higher in parts of Dublin than they are in parts of the regions where they cannot get broadband.  The north-west quarter of the country is without rail or motorway service while Limerick and Cork are connected by a single carriageway.  How does the Minister expect to reverse the lopsided growth in the State if we do not address the lopsided infrastructural state of the country?</p></reply>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.450.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W01200"><p>A Programme for a Partnership Government commits to delivering balanced regional development, particularly in the west of Ireland.  Key elements of the Government's strategy to achieve this goal are shared across a number of Departments.  However, within my Department, I am progressing a proposal for the development of an Atlantic economic corridor to attract Irish and multinational investment to grow jobs along the western seaboard.</p><p>I and my Department officials held a number of meetings towards the end of last year with public bodies and representatives from a group of chambers of commerce from the western region to explore how best to develop the proposal for an Atlantic economic corridor.  The chambers group, along with the American Chamber of Commerce, published the initial proposal for the corridor last year.</p><p>It is clear from these meetings that there is support for the proposal and I intend to convene a further meeting of the group in the coming weeks to map out the next steps in the process.  Any proposals for the development of the western region will be framed in the context of the new national planning framework, which will be prepared this year by the Minister for Housing, Planning, Community and Local Government, Deputy Simon Coveney.  The national planning framework will be a long-term framework for future development and investment, including in the regions and rural Ireland.</p><p><i></i>Last week, the Government published the first ever comprehensive action plan for rural development, Realising our Rural Potential: Action Plan for Rural Development.  This plan will also be of key importance in delivering balanced regional development.  The action plan seeks to make rural Ireland a better place to live, work and conduct business through a series of measures which will be delivered in the short to medium term.  The national planning framework will build on the action plan for rural development, and seek to address longer-term structural issues facing rural Ireland.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.451" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W01300"><p>It is important to focus on where we are at now.  A national spatial plan that was developed in 2002 is defunct now.  We have a lopsided, two-tier economy and a damaging over concentration of population and economic activity in the Dublin area.  In Dublin, we have rising house prices, rising rents and a commuter belt currently in gridlock in terms of motorways such as the M50, which affects 100,000 people every day.  Dublin is over-heating.  It has 38% of the population of the State.  By contrast, London has about 13% of the population of Britain.  It is likely that Dublin is heading towards a population of 50% of the State under current growth patterns, which would mean that this State would become a city state, with one city and the rest of the island depopulating to service that city.  That imbalance helps nobody.</p>  <p>  The Minister launched a document last week.  We wish her well with it but when we consider the gravity and the magnitude of developments spatially in the past year, it will not do anything to address those issues.  What projects of significance will the Government get involved in to address that issue?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.452" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="17:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100024#W01400"><p>We are trying to set up the Atlantic economic corridor to bring balance to it.</p><p>The reason we are trying to establish it is to compete with Dublin and Cork.  The Deputy is correct.  At present jobs, population, the price of housing and transport are very serious problems in Dublin.  This is why the Minister, Deputy Coveney, has his plan out for consultation.  I hope people such as the Deputy, his party and all interested groups in rural Ireland make submissions to the plan because we must balance what is happening in the country.  We must look at the skilled workforce and infrastructural assets we have in the regions.  The Deputy is quite correct that broadband is a very important issue.  This is why the Ministers, Deputies Humphreys and Naughten, are working very strongly and have made major progress on it.  It is why we are working with the local authorities to ensure we are ready to roll out broadband.  Without broadband we have serious problem in rural Ireland.  When I go to public meetings or meet groups, businesses and people who want to invest in the west of Ireland they speak about broadband and it is a big issue.  We need everybody working together including all State agencies.  This is why I met them recently.  This does not involve just one Department as all State agencies must work together.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.454" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100025#X00200"><p>I would like the Minister of State to address the following question.  How much money does he believe is necessary to develop the Atlantic corridor?  What is the ballpark figure?  We are not asking for a commitment from the Government, but roughly how much money will be necessary?</p>  <p>  The document produced last week by the Minister, Deputy Humphreys, stated she seeks to accelerate preparation for the development of broadband, not to accelerate the delivery of broadband but just the preparation for it.  Of course broadband is massively problematic.  The fact is the Minister cannot give me a guarantee today that all houses in rural areas will have broadband by 2022.  This is phenomenal.</p>  <p>  With regard to IDA Ireland, in recent years it has delivered well over 60% of its jobs in the Dublin and Cork regions.  In the plan launched by the Government last week Cork was dropped from the metric, which now includes only Dublin.  This is unusual because what was always measured was the area outside of Dublin and Cork.  When I debated this with the former Minister with responsibility for enterprise, he always stated we cannot force foreign direct investment into locations outside of Dublin.  The reason they go outside is if they can function there.  They can function if they can transport, communicate, employ people and have competitive inputs.  They do not have this on the basis of &euro;16 million scattered throughout the country.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.455" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="17:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100025#X00300"><p>The Minister, Deputy Humphreys, is working with local authorities on broadband.  The Minister, Deputy Naughten, has responsibility for it, but the Minister, Deputy Humphreys, is working with the local authorities and I am supporting her to ensure that when broadband is ready to roll out the local authorities will have their job done.</p>  <p>  The Deputy asked me a specific question on what it would cost.  He and I know that even the Minister for Finance could not cost what is needed.  I will give the Deputy something that is there already with regard to funding for regional development.  A key support in the region is the European Regional Development Fund, which has &euro;409 million.  It is monitored by the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform.  There are also two separate regional operational programmes managed by the Southern Regional Assembly and the Northern and Western Regional Assembly.  European money is going into the region.  We need further State funding.  We need to identify what we want.  We need broadband.  In certain areas we need the continuation of major road works.  I was in Ennis on Sunday and it is great to see the bypass, which will connect Clare to Galway and continue almost into Mayo.  We need further investment and money to put in place the infrastructure.  If we expect businesses to come to the western region, if they are to compete with Dublin we need to have the infrastructure.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.456" nospeaker="true" time="17:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100025#X00350">Rural Development Policy</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.457.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100025#X00400"><p><i>45.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht further to the recent publication of the Government's plan for regional and rural towns and villages, her plans to publish a plan for the provision of services, jobs and infrastructure for those living outside of such settlements; and if she will make a statement on the matter.  <b>[4315/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.458.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100025#X00500"><p>What the Government published is a plan for towns and villages and particularly towns.  My question is when will we have plan for rural Ireland?  What RTE reported, no doubt based on briefings from the Minister, is significant.  It stated the action plan for rural development contains 270 measures aimed at rejuvenating 600 towns and villages in a three year period, but warned of the fallout for agribusiness.  The Minister stated people are needed to revitalise towns.  It seems we do not have a plan for rural Ireland.  When will we get a plan for rural Ireland?</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.459" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100025#X00600"><p>We launched the Government's action plan for rural development, which includes town, villages and rural areas, in Ballymahon, County Longford last Monday week.  The action plan will act as an overarching structure for the co-ordination and implementation of initiatives right across Government, which will benefit rural Ireland.  Supporting towns and villages is only one element of a much more comprehensive plan.</p>  <p>  The action plan contains more than 270 actions to be delivered by a range of Departments, State agencies and other bodies across five thematic areas.  The plan will support sustainable communities and enterprise and employment, maximise our rural and recreation potential, foster culture and creativity and improve rural connectivity.  The actions set out in the plan will deliver benefits to all rural communities, whether they are located in a town, village, surrounding countryside or on one of our offshore islands.</p>  <p>  A key objective of the action plan is to support the creation of employment throughout the regions to ensure people who live in rural areas have increased opportunities for employment locally.  The action plan also contains a series of specific measures to enhance local services, including in the areas of health care, transport and rural schools.  There are also actions in the plan to strengthen safety and security for people living in rural areas, and to support and empower local communities. </p>  <p>  The actions in the plan are only the start of an ongoing process which will be built on continuously to unlock the potential of rural Ireland and improve the lives of people who live and work in rural communities.  Focusing on towns and villages is sound regional development.  We need vibrant towns and villages to support the environs and some might say the hinterland.  This is not just about the towns and villages, it is about parishes, communities and the whole of rural Ireland.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.460" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100025#X00700"><p>I thank the Minister for the reply.  I did a word search on her famous plan.  Town is mentioned 75 times, village 35 times, hinterland once, countryside four times and parish is not mentioned at all.  Most of us know the geography of rural Ireland is largely based on parishes.</p>  <p>  It is interesting there is no mention whatsoever of the provision of sewage in all the little villages which do not have sewage services.  There is no mention of bringing water.  In fact, there is no mention of water, apart from waterways, with regard to bringing water to those houses still dependent on wells and streams.  There is no reference to reversing the vicious cuts affecting the pupil-teacher ratio in primary schools.  There is no reference to the horse industry, which is a rural industry.  It cannot be a town industry.  It is vital for the development of jobs in rural Ireland.  There is no reference to fibre optic, which is the only type of broadband that suits rural Ireland.  There is also no reference to townlands.  I ask the Minister to be honest about this.  As far as the Government is concerned, it wants to push everybody out of the traditional parishes and settlement patterns of rural Ireland and put them all into towns because it does not believe in rural Ireland.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.461" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100025#X00800"><p>I certainly do not want to push anybody out of rural areas because I would be the first person to be pushed out.  I live in a one-off house in Aghabog, a rural parish in County Monaghan.  I am very much aware of the community ethos to which the Deputy referred.  Far from seeking to damage our rural parishes and communities, this action plan will support them.</p>  <p>  The CL&Aacute;R programme is vital for community support.  As the Deputy knows, it was his initiative and it certainly is a good programme.  It was closed in 2009 and we were delighted to be able to open it up last year.  We provided more than &euro;8.5 million under the programme last year with a further &euro;5 million available this year.  This is direct investment into parishes and rural areas.  We provided more than &euro;7.5 million in rural recreation funding last year and almost &euro;10 million in town and village renewal funding.  This is the type of funding that supports some fantastic projects in rural Ireland.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.462" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100025#X00900"><p>The words of the Minister's plan belie what she has just said to me.</p><p>There is no reference to rural housing in the plan, except one, which is to an increased delivery of small housing schemes in towns and villages as an alternative to once-off housing.  On top of what the Minister for Housing, Planning, Community and Local Government has clearly indicated, which is that he wants development to take place slowly in a small number of nominated areas, this clearly shows the Government's intent.  I understand where the Minister and her colleague are coming from but the Government's intent is that we do not live in the traditional parishes of rural Ireland.  St. Thomas', Ballyea and other great hurling strongholds do not exist as far as the Government is concerned or, if they do exist, the quicker we get rid of them the better.  The Minister's own plan clearly states that housing in the countryside is not desirable.  Does she not accept that is the situation?  </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.464" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y00200"><p>I do not accept that.  I am very familiar with planning guidelines and there are some areas in which people cannot build one-off houses in rural Ireland, under planning legislation brought introduced in 2008 or 2009.  People are sometimes not allowed to build in areas under strong urban pressure but there is an alternative, which is to live in the centre of towns.  If you have vibrant towns you will have vibrant rural areas to feed into the towns.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.465" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y00300"><p>A vibrant rural area will have a vibrant rural town.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.466" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y00400"><p>This action plan was developed as a result of widespread consultation and comes on foot of the CEDRA report, chaired by Pat Spillane.  One of the first recommendations of the commission was that the Government reinvigorate its approach to support for rural economic development by preparing a clear and committed rural economic development policy statement.  That is what the action plan is.  The commission also recommended setting up a policy delivery and co-ordination mechanism and that is what this will do.  I will monitor progress on this plan, which contains 275 actions, very closely.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.467" nospeaker="true" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y00500">Rural Development Plan</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.468.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y00600"><p><i>46.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht the details of grants and supports her Department proposes for the restoration of properties in rural towns and villages; and if she will make a statement on the matter.  <b>[4314/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.469.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y00700"><p>Will the Minister give us details of the scheme of grants and payments in respect of doing up properties in rural towns and villages?  When does she propose to launch the scheme and what is the amount of money allocated to it in the current year's budget?</p></reply>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.470.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y00800"><p>On 23 January , the Government's action plan for rural development, Realising our Rural Potential, was launched in Ballymahon, County Longford.  The plan is a whole-of-Government initiative and contains over 270 actions across five thematic pillars, to be delivered by Government Departments, State agencies and other groups.  The action plan contains a number of measures which have the objective of rejuvenating Ireland&rsquo;s rural towns and villages to make them more attractive places in which to live and work and to increase their tourism potential.</p>  <p>  As part of budget 2017, I have secured funding of &euro;12 million for an enhanced town and village renewal scheme this year.  This represents a tripling of the original 2016 baseline allocation of &euro;4 million for the scheme.  The town and village renewal scheme for 2017 will be launched shortly and towns and villages to be included in the scheme will be selected through an application and assessment process.  The scheme will be funded by the Department and administered by local authorities.</p>  <p>  As part of the scheme, I intend to launch a pilot project later in the year to encourage residential occupancy in rural towns and villages.  This pilot will be launched in the second half of the year, when details of the scheme have been finalised in consultation with relevant Departments.  The pilot will examine ways in which properties that are currently not in use in town centres can be renovated to allow them to be used for residential purposes.  In 2016, financial support was also provided by my Department through a number of structured schemes for the conservation and protection of heritage buildings, including the built heritage investment scheme, the structures at risk fund and other initiatives operated by the Heritage Council and the OPW.</p>  <p>  The Government&rsquo;s action plan for housing and homelessness, which comes under the remit of the Minister for Housing, Planning, Community and Local Government, also includes a number of schemes which support the repair or refurbishment of properties.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.471" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y00900"><p>Can the Minister tell us the date of the launch of the scheme and where the proposed pilot will be?  What is the likely number of towns, villages and parishes in which it will be located?  It is very difficult for people to plan if they get a lot of soft publicity in newspapers and media about such a scheme being launched but then find they get absolutely no information at all about it.  The Minister spoke of an application process.  When will the application process forms and information be available?  We are approaching February and this information should be made available quickly because people will have to plan and look at their finances.  Otherwise there will be no movement on it this year at all.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.472" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y01000"><p>I never said there was an application process.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.473" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y01100"><p>The Minister said applications would be assessed.  I wrote it down.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.474" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y01200"><p>I am referring to the pilot scheme to get people back into towns and villages.  I never mentioned an application process.  I said I was looking at developing a pilot scheme, to be rolled out in the latter half of this year, to encourage people to take up residential occupancy in rural towns and villages.  The details of the scheme will be finalised through collaboration with relevant Departments with a view to launching it in the second half of the year.  I will be working with my colleague, the Minister for Housing, Planning, Community and Local Government, Deputy Simon Coveney, to introduce a range of initiatives to encourage more people to live in village and town centres because if we are serious about rural regeneration we need to start with our rural towns and villages.</p>  <p>  A package of schemes will support our rural communities in 2017, including a &euro;12 million town and village renewal scheme.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.475" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y01300"><p>I am confused because in the general publicity around the launch of the scheme the Minister made much of the fact that people in small towns and villages would be able to take commercially-designated premises and convert them to accommodation.  She and others in Government, as well as Government backbenchers, mentioned the availability of first-time buyers' grants for people to do up properties in these towns.  I am just repeating what was in the media, where a menu of items was identified.  Can the Minister account to the D&aacute;il in detail for what she is proposing?  It is all over the place.  Young couples in towns and villages around the country would have an interest in these schemes but they are very confused over the Minister's proposals.  They need to make plans to raise finances and do other things if they are to avail of these schemes.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.476" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100026#Y01400"><p>The tax incentive to which the Deputy refers is the help-to-buy scheme and that relates to first-time buyers of newly-built homes.  I am referring to something completely different, about trying to get people back in to the centre of towns to live.  I will roll out a pilot scheme in the latter half of this year.</p><p>The pilot scheme will examine grant-aiding people who want to move into vacant buildings in the centre of town.  They would receive grant aid to help them to renovate the premises.  It is a pilot scheme for a limited number of towns that will be selected.  I have no idea yet what towns they will be, but I will decide that at a later date with the relevant agencies.  I want to be very clear that it is a pilot scheme.  The help-to-buy scheme is completely separate.  It is under the aegis of the Department of Finance and relates to new houses.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.478" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z00200"><p>Will the Minister set out in some detail what the proposals are?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.479" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1289" speakername="Pat Gallagher" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z00300"><p>The Deputy already had two questions.  I call Deputy &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.480" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z00400"><p>Can I answer that?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.481" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1289" speakername="Pat Gallagher" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z00500"><p>This is an exception.  I will give the Minister ten seconds.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.482" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z00600"><p>Go raibh maith agat.  I am working to devise that scheme.  It is being worked on and if the Deputy has any suggestions I would be glad to hear them.  It is a pilot scheme that will be rolled out in the latter half of this year.  The details are to be decided.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.483" nospeaker="true" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z00700">Sc&eacute;imeanna Taca&iacute;ochta Gaeilge</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.484.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z00800"><p><i>47.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht c&aacute; mh&eacute;ad airgid a d&rsquo;&iacute;oc a Roinn agus &Uacute;dar&aacute;s na Gaeltachta faoi seach le hOllscoil na h&Eacute;ireann, Gaillimh (Acadamh na hOllscola&iacute;ochta Gaeilge san &aacute;ireamh) anuraidh; c&eacute;n m&eacute;id at&aacute; geallta don bhliain seo; agus an nd&eacute;anfaidh s&iacute; r&aacute;iteas ina thaobh. <b>[4316/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.485.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z00900"><p>Mar is eol don Aire St&aacute;it, bh&iacute; airgead nach beag &aacute; thabhairt ag &Uacute;dar&aacute;s na Gaeltachta agus ag an Roinn Eala&iacute;on, Oidhreachta, Gn&oacute;tha&iacute; R&eacute;igi&uacute;nacha, Tuaithe agus Gaeltachta do Acadamh na hOllscola&iacute;ochta Gaeilge le c&uacute;rsa&iacute; tr&iacute; Ghaeilge a fhorbairt.  An bhfuil an tAire St&aacute;it, tr&iacute;d an Roinn agus an t-&uacute;dar&aacute;s, ag lean&uacute;int leis an bpolasa&iacute; sin?  An bhfuil s&eacute; ag tabhairt taca&iacute;ochta do Ollscoil na h&Eacute;ireann, Gaillimh, le c&uacute;rsa&iacute; tr&iacute; Ghaeilge a chur ar f&aacute;il?</p></reply>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.486.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1314" speakername="Se&aacute;n Kyne" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01000"><p>Bhunaigh Ollscoil na h&Eacute;ireann, Gaillimh, O&Eacute;G, Acadamh na hOllscola&iacute;ochta Gaeilge le hoibleag&aacute;id na hollscoile oideachas tr&iacute;&uacute;-leibh&eacute;al tr&iacute; mhe&aacute;n na Gaeilge a fhorbairt.  Theastaigh uathu cur chuige n&iacute;os saind&iacute;rithe agus n&iacute;os strait&eacute;is&iacute; a fhorbairt chun c&uacute;rsa&iacute; tr&iacute; mhe&aacute;n na Gaeilge agus gn&iacute;omha&iacute;ochta&iacute; taighde a fhorbairt ar bhealach inmharthana agus chun pobail Ghaeilge a chaomhn&uacute; sa Ghaeltacht.  Comhoibr&iacute;onn an tAcadamh le d&aacute;mha, le ranna agus le hoifig&iacute; eile na hollscoile chun forbairt a dh&eacute;anamh ar raon agus ar l&iacute;on na gc&uacute;rsa&iacute; a chuirtear ar f&aacute;il tr&iacute; Ghaeilge ar champas na hollscoile i nGaillimh agus sa Ghaeltacht.  I gcomhr&eacute;ir le socr&uacute; a rinneadh i gcomhar le hAcadamh na hOllscola&iacute;ochta Gaeilge O&Eacute;G agus leis an &Uacute;dar&aacute;s um Ard-Oideachas in 2015, ceada&iacute;odh all&uacute;ntas gur fi&uacute; &euro;2.7 milli&uacute;n san ioml&aacute;n - &euro;900,000 in aghaidh na bliana acad&uacute;la - le leithdh&aacute;ileadh ar an Acadamh i leith na mblianta acad&uacute;la 2015-16, 2016-17 agus 2017-18. T&aacute; an t-all&uacute;ntas seo ceadaithe don Acadamh le cumas&uacute; d&oacute;ibh lean&uacute;int orthu ag sol&aacute;thar raon c&uacute;rsa&iacute; tr&iacute; mhe&aacute;n na Gaeilge sna hionaid Ghaeltachta at&aacute; faoina sc&aacute;th, is iad sin, An Cheathr&uacute; Rua, Carna agus Gaoth Dobhair. </p><p>Faoi r&eacute;ir na gcoinn&iacute;ollacha a cuireadh leis an all&uacute;ntas sin, &iacute;ocadh &euro;1.2 milli&uacute;n san ioml&aacute;n leis an &Uacute;dar&aacute;s um Ard-Oideachas in 2016 le d&aacute;ileadh ar an Acadamh i leith na mblianta acad&uacute;la 2015-16 agus 2016-17.  D&eacute;anfar &iacute;oca&iacute;ocht eile leo in 2017 nuair a thagann &eacute;ileamh ina leith agus an Roinn a bheith s&aacute;sta go bhfuil na coinn&iacute;ollacha &aacute;bhartha a cuireadh leis an gcead&uacute; comhl&iacute;onta go s&aacute;s&uacute;il.  </p><p>In &eacute;ind&iacute; leis an all&uacute;ntas bliant&uacute;il de &euro;900,000, t&aacute; &euro;57,000 san ioml&aacute;n ceadaithe ag &Uacute;dar&aacute;s na Gaeltachta don Acadamh i dtreo chostas re&aacute;cht&aacute;la an ch&uacute;rsa diopl&oacute;ma sa phlean&aacute;il teanga agus buan&uacute; teanga agus t&aacute; &euro;36,000 de seo &iacute;octha leo &oacute; 2015 i leith.  Ina theannta sin, t&aacute; &euro;37,125 ceadaithe ag &Uacute;dar&aacute;s na Gaeltachta mar chabhair chun na costais a bhaineann leis an gc&uacute;rsa diopl&oacute;ma sa chult&uacute;r d&uacute;chais a sheasamh agus t&aacute;thar ag s&uacute;il leis go n-&iacute;ocfar &eacute; seo i mbliana. </p><p>&Iacute;ocadh suim de &euro;321,368 le hOllscoil na h&Eacute;ireann, Gaillimh faoi na sc&eacute;imeanna taca&iacute;ochta Gaeilge i 2016.  T&aacute; suim de &euro;305,114 ceadaithe i leith na bliana acad&uacute;il 2016-17 agus t&aacute; &euro;154,500 de sin &iacute;octha agus san &aacute;ireamh san suim a h&iacute;ocadh leo i 2016. </p><p><i>Additional information not given on the floor of the House.</i></p><p>Cuireadh an maoini&uacute; seo ar f&aacute;il tr&iacute;d an &Uacute;dar&aacute;s um Ard-Oideachas faoi na Sc&eacute;imeanna Taca&iacute;ochta Gaeilge chun sraith de shainch&uacute;rsa&iacute; tr&iacute;&uacute; leibh&eacute;al i nGaeilge, at&aacute; &aacute; gcur ar f&aacute;il ag Ollscoil na h&Eacute;ireann Gaillimh agus at&aacute; d&iacute;rithe ar riachtanais an Aontais Eorpaigh do phoist a dteasta&iacute;onn ardchumas Gaeilge ina leith, a shol&aacute;thar. </p><p>Tagann s&eacute; seo ar fad ar nd&oacute;igh leis an obair lean&uacute;nach at&aacute; ar bun ag mo Roinn i gcomhph&aacute;irt&iacute;ocht le raon leathan p&aacute;irtithe leasmhara, an tAcadamh agus &Uacute;dar&aacute;s na Gaeltachta ina measc, chun c&uacute;ram a dh&eacute;anamh de chur i bhfeidhm na r&eacute;ims&iacute; gn&iacute;mh faoi leith den Strait&eacute;is 20 Bliain don Ghaeilge 2010-2030 at&aacute; &aacute;bhartha sa ch&aacute;s seo, s&eacute; sin, an tOideachas agus an Ghaeltacht.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.487" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01100"><p>T&aacute; m&eacute; ag iarraidh na figi&uacute;ir&iacute; sin ar fad a thabhairt liom, ach breathna&iacute;onn s&eacute; go bhfuil thart ar &euro;1.5 milli&uacute;n &aacute; thabhairt idir an t-&uacute;dar&aacute;s agus an Roinn.  As v&oacute;ta na Roinne ar fad a thagann s&eacute; sa deireadh do Acadamh na hOllscola&iacute;ochta Gaeilge.  Ag &eacute;ir&iacute; as sin, ba mhaith liom ceist a chur ar an Aire St&aacute;it.  An gceapann s&eacute; go mbeadh s&eacute; s&aacute;s&uacute;il nach mbeadh uachtar&aacute;n Ollscoil na h&Eacute;ireann, Gaillimh, in ann gn&oacute; a dh&eacute;anamh leis an Acadamh agus leis an Roinn tr&iacute; mhe&aacute;n na Gaeilge?  An bhfuil i gceist ag an Aire St&aacute;it aon rud a dh&eacute;anamh faoi sin?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.488" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1314" speakername="Se&aacute;n Kyne" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01200"><p>T&aacute; a fhios agam go bhfuil Bille foilsithe ag an Teachta ar an &aacute;bhar sin agus s&iacute;lim go mbeimid ag d&eacute;anamh pl&eacute; ar an mBille sin go luath.  Mar is eol don Teachta, t&aacute; Ollscoil na h&Eacute;ireann, Gaillimh, faoi oibleag&aacute;id ag an Rialtas faoi fhor&aacute;lacha ailt in Acht an Chol&aacute;iste Ollscoile, Gaillimh le c&uacute;rsa&iacute; tr&iacute;&uacute;-leibh&eacute;il tr&iacute; mhe&aacute;n na Gaeilge a fhorbairt agus a shol&aacute;thar.  Is &eacute; misean Acadamh na hOllscola&iacute;ochta Gaeilge ceannr&oacute;da&iacute;ocht a spreagadh agus a l&eacute;iri&uacute; i measc phobal na Gaeilge sa Ghaeltacht agus laismuigh de, ceannr&oacute;da&iacute;ocht a chuirfidh le forbairt s&oacute;isialta, cult&uacute;rtha, eacnama&iacute;ochta agus teanga an phobail sin agus pobal na t&iacute;re tr&iacute; ch&eacute;ile.  N&iacute; ceist &iacute; cumas Gaeilge an uachtar&aacute;in do mo Roinn, ach tuigim go bhfuil an Teachta ag cruth&uacute; leas&uacute;, mar a d&uacute;irt m&eacute;, faoi sin.  &Oacute; thaobh an eolais at&aacute; agam, phl&eacute;igh coiste sti&uacute;rtha na hollscoile an cheist seo le d&eacute;ana&iacute;.  T&aacute; s&eacute; r&aacute;ite go dteasta&iacute;onn a l&aacute;n scileanna chun post uachtar&aacute;nach a dh&eacute;anamh agus, mar gheall ar easpa ioma&iacute;ochta sa chom&oacute;rtas deireanach, rinneadh cinneadh an polasa&iacute; sin a athr&uacute;. </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.489" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01300"><p>&Oacute;n bhliain 1929 i leith, bh&iacute; Gaeilge ag uachtar&aacute;n Col&aacute;iste na hOllscoile, Gaillimh, mar a bh&iacute; s&eacute; ag an am, n&oacute; Ollscoil na h&Eacute;ireann, Gaillimh, mar at&aacute; s&eacute; i l&aacute;thair na huaire.  Th&aacute;inig for&aacute;s agus forbairt ar an ollscoil i gcaitheamh na hama sin.  N&iacute; d&oacute;igh liom go nd&eacute;arfadh &eacute;inne go ndearna an t-uachtar&aacute;n at&aacute; ann faoi l&aacute;thair drochjab sa phost a bh&iacute; le d&eacute;anamh aige.  Iarraim ar an Aire St&aacute;it agus ar an Rialtas taca&iacute;ocht a thabhairt do mo Bhille nuair a thiocfaidh s&eacute; faoi bhr&aacute;id na D&aacute;la.  An gcinnteoidh siad go mbeidh ar a laghad institi&uacute;id tr&iacute;&uacute; leibh&eacute;al amh&aacute;in sa t&iacute;r ina bhfuil rath ar an d&aacute; theanga?  Is &eacute; seo an dream is oilte agus is m&oacute; oideachais sa t&iacute;r.  An mbeidh an Rialtas ag tac&uacute; leis an D&aacute;il le cinnti&uacute; go mbeidh Gaeilge ag ar a laghad uachtar&aacute;n d'aon cheann amh&aacute;in de na col&aacute;ist&iacute; ar fud na t&iacute;re, s&eacute; sin Ollscoil na h&Eacute;ireann, Gaillimh, a bhfuil c&uacute;ram faoi leith uirthi i leith na Gaeilge? </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.490" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1314" speakername="Se&aacute;n Kyne" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01400"><p>T&aacute; cinneadh le d&eacute;anamh ag an Aire Oideachais agus Scileanna, an Teachta Bruton, faoin cheist seo.  N&iacute;l a fhios agam c&eacute;n uair a bheidh an Bille at&aacute; curtha chun cinn ag an Teachta os comhair na D&aacute;la.  C&eacute; gur pr&iacute;omhcheist don ollscoil &iacute; an cheist seo, n&iacute; bheidh aon athr&uacute; ar an bpolasa&iacute; at&aacute; san ollscoil an Ghaeilge a chur chun cinn.  Beag beann ar an gcinneadh a dh&eacute;antar, beidh an polasa&iacute; maidir leis an nGaeilge a chur chun cinn l&aacute;rnach san ollscoil amach anseo.  Mar is eol don Teachta, t&aacute; institi&uacute;id&iacute; ag an ollscoil i gCarna, ar an gCeathr&uacute; Rua agus i nGaoth Dobhair at&aacute; l&aacute;rnach &oacute; thaobh an Ghaeilge.  Beidh na haonaid l&aacute;idir seo ag br&uacute; ar aghaidh leis an nGaeilge.  &Oacute; thaobh uachtar&aacute;nacht Ollscoil na h&Eacute;ireann, Gaillimh, is pr&iacute;omhcheist &iacute; sin don Aire, an Teachta Bruton, agus freisin do bhord sti&uacute;rtha na hollscoile.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.491" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1312" speakername="&Eacute;amon &Oacute; Cu&iacute;v" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01500"><p>Is ceist &iacute; d'Aire St&aacute;it na Gaeltachta freisin.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.492" nospeaker="true" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01550">Other Questions</major-heading>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.493" nospeaker="true" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01600">Rural Development Plan</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.494.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1281" speakername="Mick Barry" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01700"><p><i>48.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht if her Department will be introducing legislation to give effect to the objectives set out in the Action Plan for Rural Development; and if she will make a statement on the matter.  <b>[4137/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.495.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1281" speakername="Mick Barry" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01800"><p>Will the Minister of State's Department be introducing legislation to give effect to the objectives set out in the Action Plan for Rural Development, and will he make a statement on this matter?</p></reply>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.496.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="17:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100027#Z01900"><p><i>Realising our Rural Potential</i>, the Government's Action Plan for Rural Development, was launched on Monday, 23 January in Ballymahon, County Longford.  The plan is a whole-of-Government initiative and contains over 270 actions across five related pillars to be delivered by Departments, State agencies and other groups.  The plan will support sustainable communities, support enterprise and employment, maximise our rural and recreation potential, foster culture and creativity, and improve rural connectivity.</p><p>The action plan does not, in itself, require legislation to be implemented.</p><p>Many of its objectives, including increasing employment in rural areas, protecting vital local services, revitalising rural towns and villages, and ensuring that all homes and businesses are connected to broadband, will be achieved through targeted programmes and policy implementation.  Where legislation is required to implement any individual action, it will be a matter for the responsible Department to progress that legislation.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.498" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1281" speakername="Mick Barry" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA00200"><p>The action plan was launched with great fanfare, which conjured up the image of an interventionist Government.  How does the Minister of State square this promised interventionist approach by the Government to revive rural life in the coming years with the simultaneous threat being posed to the future of Bus &Eacute;ireann in a matter of a few short weeks?  Transport was mentioned three times at the publicity launch of the plan while it is mentioned 39 times in the Minister's action plan itself.  The responsibility of the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport and of the National Transport Authority are cited in the context of delivering improvements in rural transport connectivity.  What faith can we have in these promises in the context of what has taken place in Bus &Eacute;ireann?  The Government is standing over the threat to slash the wages and conditions of 2,500 members and even the threat to the very future of the company itself.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.499" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA00300"><p>As the Deputy knows, Bus &Eacute;ireann is a semi-State company and this is a matter for its management.  The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Shane Ross, has said rural services will be protected and he has responsibility in relation to transport.  The Department to which the Deputy put down the question has no responsibility in relation to Bus &Eacute;ireann.  However, we are very much involved in rural transport.  The Minister has said there will be no cuts to rural services and I accept his word.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.500" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1281" speakername="Mick Barry" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA00400"><p>I raised some of these questions with the Taoiseach last week under promised legislation and he said, rather contemptuously, that it was never the intention that every single town and village in the entire country would be provided with transport.  He also said, however, that the Government would endeavour to ensure that where there is connectivity at the moment with Bus &Eacute;ireann, such connectivity will remain notwithstanding cuts in that company.  I put it to the Minister of State that this is a very loose formulation which allows for a situation in which the four to six connections a day Bus &Eacute;ireann might provide a town or village can be blown out of the water by Mr. Hernan and the management of Bus &Eacute;ireann with the sanction of the Minister, Deputy Ross, and the Government.  They will then get some private operator to connect to the town once a day.  Is the Minister of State prepared to give a commitment that any single service of Bus &Eacute;ireann's which might be cut, albeit none should be, will be replaced bus for bus and journey by journey and that one connection will not replace five or six in any given day?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.501" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA00500"><p>I cannot give any such guarantee.  I am not the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport and I am not the chief executive of Bus &Eacute;ireann.  I note, however, that a commitment has been given that no community will be left without a public service.  It must be remembered that in my own area we have many private sector providers doing a great job on rural transport.  I have many companies in north Mayo where we would not have a service if we were depending on Bus &Eacute;ireann or anybody else.  That service is being provided by the private sector and we are delighted to have it.  The providers work with the Department of Social Protection and people can use their free travel passes.  I hope these services will continue.  As I say, the Government has given a commitment that no community will be left without a service.  However, I cannot speak for Bus &Eacute;ireann.  I do not have the authority.  I am not the Minister and I am not the chief executive of Bus &Eacute;ireann.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.502" nospeaker="true" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA00600">National Museum</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.503.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA00700"><p><i>49.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht her views on the management of the National Museum of Ireland. <b>[4174/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.504.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA00800"><p>I thought long and hard before raising this question because I do not seek to cast aspersions on any individual in the National Museum of Ireland.  I had hoped the Department would grab the bull by the horns on this issue and fix it.  The difficulty is there but that has not been the case.  Even though we have very good people in the museum and a new chair is on the board and trying to fix it, there are still massive difficulties.  The National Museum of Ireland is limping along, hampered and hammered by dysfunction with regard to HR crises over the last 15 years.  From the information I have received, it seems the Department does not want to get involved and to fix it.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.505" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA00900"><p>The National Cultural Institutions Act 1997 establishes the National Museum of Ireland as an autonomous body.  As Minister, I have no involvement in the day-to-day running of the National Museum of Ireland.  Section 29 of the Act provides that the director of the museum shall carry on, manage and control generally the administration and business of the museum and perform such other functions as may be determined by the board.  The code of practice for the governance of State bodies as published in 2016 sets out the key functions which all State boards should fulfil including reviewing and guiding strategic direction and major plans of action, risk management policies and procedures, annual budgets and business plans, setting performance objectives, monitoring, implementation and State body performance and overseeing major capital expenditure and investment decisions.  A board is required to promote the capacity of the State body, including the capability of its leadership and staff, and is also responsible for holding the CEO and senior management to account for the effective performance of their responsibilities.</p>  <p>  The National Museum is a valuable part of the cultural heritage of the State.  Like all cultural institutions, it suffered during the economic difficulties of recent years, but is now looking to prepare for the future in a strategic fashion.  I have been pleased to have been able to increase the resources provided to the board in recent years.  The museum has also commissioned a master plan to provide for its future development.  This should be a valuable contribution to steering the museum's development in the years to come.  I appointed a new board to the museum in June 2016 under a dynamic new chair, Catherine Heaney, and I am confident it has a wide range of skills to address the challenges facing the museum and to ensure that the staff and management continue to deliver an excellent service to the public across the museum's four locations.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.506" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA01000"><p>I understand that two finance staff of the museum, including the former financial manager, have taken personal injuries cases to the High Court for bullying within the National Museum of Ireland and that these cases were settled out of court by the museum.  A finance manager was made redundant recently and the finance department of the museum is now populated mostly with agency staff.  It is not good enough for the Minister to build a paper wall between herself and the National Museum of Ireland because this is costing money.  Approximately &euro;3,500 is spent every week on agency staff in the finance department alone.  Only one member of the finance staff is left there.  We also know that over the past number of years a large number of reports and agencies have been involved and that has cost the State massive money.  What has been the cost of this dysfunction within the National Museum of Ireland and how many protected disclosures have been received from the National Museum of Ireland by the Minister?  Is the Minister happy, given that there is no financial manager there, that the correct governance and financial oversight is in place within the operation?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.507" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA01100"><p>I am very satisfied that the correct governance is in place.  There is a board there and the oversight by the board.  I cannot interfere with those functions of the museum which are properly those of the board and the director.  I cannot get involved in the day-to-day running of the museum.  It is not my job to do it and I do not intend to do it.  The HR issues to which the Deputy refers are a day-to-day matter for the board and the management of the National Museum of Ireland as an autonomous body.</p>  <p>  The new board is in place and I keep in contact with the chair, Catherine Heaney.  She is very committed to working to address all of the challenges facing the museum.  The museum is not limping along by any means.  It welcomed 3.6 million visitors to its four sites last year while 5.5 million visits were made to the National Museum of Ireland website and social media platforms.  I note that 10,000 records were placed online while 420,000 people took part in the museum's learning programmes.  The museum mounted a wide programme of events including the production of "Pals: the Irish at Gallipoli" with 400 performances seen by 12,000 visitors.  It is a very busy place and it is doing well.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.508" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100028#AA01200"><p>I am not casting aspersions.  There are some great people there doing great work.</p><p>The fact is that I received an internal HR report through an FOI request.  It measured six key areas with regard to the level of management.  In those areas, the report stated the services were well below average and there were clear psycho-social risks within the workplace in five separate areas, namely, management support, peer support, relationships, role and respondents.  The respondents reported in the bottom 20% possible.  Some 15% of respondents working there felt things were starting to improve and 18% felt that senior management was trying to do its best.  </p> <p> The report goes on and on, and is damning.  It states that many agencies have been in and around the National Museum over the past number of years trying to resolve these issues.  I would like to know how much has been spent on those agencies.  Will the Minister confirm that a well-known agency dealing with sexual misconduct was employed by the National Museum of Ireland over the past ten to 15 years? </p> <p> There are really good people there with lots of energy.  Imagine if they were liberated by proper management within the National Museum.  Imagine the opportunities this country would have if these issues were fixed.  It is not good enough for the Minister to hide behind a wall.  She should bring these people in, fix the problem and make sure we have a National Museum to be proud of in this country.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.510" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB00200"><p>It is a matter for the board and management of the museum.  I am not going to get involved in the day-to-day running of the museum.  It is independent in that respect.  I understand the chair of the board has been in contact with the Deputy and is keen for engagement, as are the members of the Oireachtas joint committee, in terms of addressing future developments at the museum.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.511" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB00300"><p>It will not be fixed</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.512" nospeaker="true" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB00350">Rural Development Programme Funding</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.513.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB00400"><p><i>50.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht the amount of new money that will be used to fund the Action Plan for Rural Development.  <b>[4173/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.514.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB00500"><p>This question refers to new money in the rural development plan.  The Minister of State, Deputy Ring, did a great job in impersonating an Opposition Deputy when he told us what the Department needed to fix the problems.  He has correctly identified what we need.  The only thing he did not identify were the funds required.  Over the past eight years we have had an investment famine in this country.  Ireland is second from the bottom in Europe with regard to infrastructural investment.  That is why there has been a corrosion in the infrastructure or rural Ireland.  This question seeks to find out what the Minister will do to address the infrastructural famine in terms of real investment.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.515" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB00600"><p>This is the first plan of its kind to take a cohesive and co-ordinated approach across the whole of Government to economic and rural development.  Over the three-year period of the action plan for rural development, the Government will invest a significant level of funding in programmes which will support rural Ireland.  Many of the funding components are new, or have only been announced in recent weeks, in anticipation of the action plan being published.</p><p>Examples of new investments include up to &euro;60 million over the next three years to rejuvenate over 600 rural towns and villages; a doubling of funding for flood risk schemes to &euro;100 million per annum by 2021; &euro;6 million for investment in the development of blueways; &euro;10 million will be invested in our national parks and nature reserves; and a &euro;10 million, or 50%, increase in funding under the SEAI&rsquo;s better energy communities programme, which will total &euro;30 million for 2017.  Other important measures in the action plan include the recruitment of 3,200 new garda&iacute; over the next four years; the introduction of a new community CCTV grant scheme; significant investment in the seniors alert scheme; and the provision of 50,000 apprenticeships nationwide by 2020.  The details of funding for these, and other new initiatives, will be a matter for the relevant Minister.</p><p>As far as my Department is concerned, funding for regional and rural programmes has increased from a figure of &euro;61.2 million in 2016 to &euro;79.2 million in 2017, an increase of 29%.  It is important to bear in mind, however, that many of the commitments in the action plan involve new policy initiatives which will not necessarily require additional funding to have a positive impact, for example the development of a new and effective framework for rural-proofing Government policies or the development, for the first time, of a national policy on social enterprise. </p><p><i>Additional information not given on the floor of the House</i></p><p>These new measures will complement existing programmes which are referenced in the action plan, such as the &euro;4 billion rural development programme 2014-2020 or the &euro;275 million initial allocation to the national broadband plan.  These programmes are referenced in the action plan because they will clearly play an important part in the Government&rsquo;s approach to rural development.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.516" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB00700"><p>The great lie that this Government has managed to spin over the past number of years is that the economic crisis is over.  The truth is that the economic crisis has been rolled into a 40 year debt.  Every year this State spends about &euro;7 billion just to service the interest on that debt, a situation which will continue until about 2050.  That &euro;7 billion invisibly robs this generation and the next of the ability to invest in the infrastructure we need.</p>  <p>  It seems that the Minister is seeking to be the Minister for the loaves and the fishes because she is spreading &euro;60 million around 600 towns and villages.  The Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport said secondary roads alone need &euro;3 billion to bring them up to the required standard.  We can contrast the &euro;6 billion that is necessary with the &euro;60 million that is so-called new money.  It is not new money, rather it was press-released to death in the budget a number of months ago.  This is money that has already been declared.  I ask the Minister to identify the necessary funds to take this issue seriously.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.517" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB00800"><p>The &euro;60 million for investment in towns and villages to which the Deputy referred is only one aspect of this plan.  There are many other aspects to it and billions of euro are being invested in rural Ireland.  The Deputy referred to roads and infrastructure.  They are a matter for the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport.  There are commitments in the plan regarding rural and regional roads.  Other programs such as Leader and CAP are included in the plan.  They provide vital support for rural communities and, in particular, areas outside our towns and villages.  We have to include schemes that support rural development in an action plan for rural development.  Some announcements may already have been made.</p>  <p>  This is a co-ordinated approach to rural Ireland.  We had consultation and the CEDRA report.  This is for what we have been asked, namely, a cohesive plan for rural Ireland and that we all work together.  The 2016 commemorations were very successful because everybody worked together and it was a plan in which communities could get involved.  That is what made it the success it was.  This is the same. </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.518" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB00900"><p>I agree that the 1916 commemorations were successful.  They got off to a jittery start, it is fair to say, and the Opposition made a good job of putting a light on the Government to pull up its socks.</p>  <p>  The Minister cannot say roads are a matter for the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport while at the same time stating the report is a whole-of-Government report.  We are able to criticise some elements but not others.</p>  <p>  The Minister said there is a long list of actions in the report but many are reheated or aspirational actions with no funding or anchor with regard to performance indicators.  Many are fluff, to be honest.  Some of the statements could be filed under different categories.  The report could contain statements such as "The Minister will engage with people in an effort to see if, where possible, to look into a discussion leading to prepare a plan that would endeavour to set up a committee to commission a report to do something in the future". </p>  <p>  In our pre-budget submission, Sinn F&eacute;in identified &euro;1.2 billion of new money for infrastructural spend, compared to the &euro;300 million that Fine Gael identified.  We did this under exactly the same European fiscal rules structures.  It is possible, if one has the ambition, determination and ideology, to get the money necessary to fix the problem.  Where will the money come from?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.519" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="17:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100029#BB01000"><p>Last week, the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Ross, announced a 9% increase in the allocation for local and regional roads.  The Minister of State at that Department, Deputy Patrick O'Donovan, opened the sports capital programme with &euro;30 million are available nationwide.  The Deputy will, as do I, appreciate the significance of the sports capital programme to local clubs across the country.</p>  <p>  The Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Leo Varadkar, allocated an additional 500 places for the rural social scheme.</p><p>There is a lot in that but what is also important is that I will be monitoring the monthly progress on this report and a six-monthly report will be made available to the public for everyone to see what has been achieved and measure the progress to date.  There is also the Cabinet committee that is chaired by the Taoiseach, so every Minister will be held to account.  It is not a matter of setting out the actions and nothing happening.  The Action Plan for Jobs was a very successful plan and I hope that this plan will be even more successful.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.521" nospeaker="true" time="18:00:00" ><p>Question No. 51 replied to with Written Answers.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.522" nospeaker="true" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC00300">Post Office Network</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.523.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC00400"><p><i>52.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht the way in which her Department proposes to oversee and monitor the implementation of actions to support the post office network arising out of the report of the post office renewal board and the Post Office Hub Working Group as outlined in point 20 of the Action Plan for Rural Development; and if she will make a statement on the matter. <b>[4246/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.524.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC00500"><p>We are all aware of the importance of the post office as a key part of the infrastructure of rural villages and towns throughout the country.  Often they stand alone as the last bastion or outpost and as a place for the provision of communal services where people, especially the elderly, can come to meet and discuss matters.  We have numerous reports, including the Kerr report, the report of the Post Office Hub Working Group and the McKinsey report, and are now suffocating in a sea of vague commitments but nothing concrete has happened to date.  Will the Minister put an end to the prevailing uncertainty and seize the initiative?  We know what is required which is to recognise the social value of the post office network to the people of rural Ireland.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.525" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC00600"><p>The Post Office Network Business Development Group, chaired by Mr. Bobby Kerr, was established in late 2014 to examine the potential for additional Government business as well as commercial business to be transacted through the post office network.  The final report of the group was published in January 2016.</p>  <p>  On foot of the report, two working groups were established to progress the recommendations arising from the report of the business development group.  These were the Post Office Network Renewal Implementation Group, chaired by Mr. Kerr, and the Post Office Hub Working Group, which I chaired.</p>  <p>  The network renewal group examined a number of issues relating to the post office network, including the number and spatial distribution of post offices, branch modernisation, the streamlining of products and services, and postmaster contracts. Mr. Kerr submitted his final report to An Post on 23 December last.</p>  <p>  The role of the Post Office Hub Working Group was to identify potential models under which the post offices could act as community hubs, especially in rural areas.  This working group has completed its work and final drafting changes are currently being made to the group&rsquo;s report.  I will make this report available to the Government as soon as possible.</p>  <p>  The recommendations arising out of these reports will be considered by the board of An Post and the Government and I anticipate that a number of firm actions will be agreed for delivery by An Post and my Department as well as, potentially, other Departments.</p>  <p>  These actions will be monitored on an ongoing basis by my Department through its direct engagement in delivery as well as through the processes which are being put in place to monitor the implementation of the Action Plan for Rural Development as a whole.  A monitoring committee, which will be chaired by the Minister, Deputy Heather Humphreys, will meet regularly to monitor the progress of each of the actions in the plan.  The monitoring committee will include the key stakeholders from relevant public bodies as well as business and rural interests.  Progress reports will be published every six months.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.526" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC00700"><p>I thank the Minister of State for the extensive reply and do not doubt his bona fides.  However, would the Minister of State agree that having the provision of financial services at its core is essential to the survival of the post office network?  My colleague, Deputy Burton, as Minister, was a strong advocate of the basic payment account system.  She also advocated the potential of the German Sparkasse model for the development of public banks, which could be integrated into this, along with the credit union movement.  Surely some liaison could be struck that would ensure that services are available to rural people.  There is a huge deficit, if not a dearth, of banking services, particularly for the elderly. The banks disgraced themselves with the way they treated individuals throughout the country, but they disgraced themselves even more so with the way they treated communities in the country.  As the Minister of State knows, they closed everything.  They ran away and left the Government carrying the can and this is the one way Government can redress the situation.  It is absolutely essential that there is a provision of services.  In the context of the McKinsey report, is that part of the core recommendation?  As I understand it, although I may have taken him up wrong, Mr. McRedmond recently stated that we should perhaps consider having full banking services rather than just the basic payment account.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.527" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC00800"><p>Deputy Penrose is a plain speaking man.  To outline the situation, I put a lot of work into this over the past six months and was hoping to have the report ready for Government before Christmas.  I do not have statutory responsibility for An Post, but I have been given the role by Government to see what can be done to improve the services.  Mr. Kerr gave his report to An Post on 23 December.  I met Mr. Kerr as well as representatives from the Irish Postmasters' Union and, on Thursday morning, I will meet Mr. McRedmond again.</p>  <p>  I will tell the Deputy what I am doing and I will put it on the record today.  I will arrange to meet with representatives from the Irish Postmasters' Union, Mr. McRedmond, who I will meet this Thursday, and my officials next week.  Certain proposals have been made by Mr. Kerr and the Department is also making proposals and I hope that we can reach agreement on them.</p>  <p>  Deputy Penrose spoke about the basic payments and community banking.  Deputy Burton has tabled a question on the matter also.  The Government has committed to and is examining this.</p>  <p>  At every opportunity I get, I am like Deputy Penrose, that is, straight talking.  There is no point having rural post offices if people do not use them.  I listened to and watched people that never stood in a post office out protesting.  They are great for protesting.  They will come out when there is a protest but if they had to get a few stamps they would go into town and not get them in the local post office.  I hope that we can get agreement when this report is done and that the rural community will support the post offices.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.528" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC00900"><p>I concur.  As the part-owner of a rural shop, the rush of people out of rural villages into large towns is a scandal.  They bypass everything.  I will not participate in any protest about any of those services - post office or otherwise - because if people used them they would be under less threat.  I put it to the Minister of State that the final Kerr report is, no doubt, an excellent report and I have no doubt that the Department, among others, had a good input into it.  However, is the secret here not that the Minister for Finance, Deputy Noonan, and those in his Department are recalcitrant?  They have no interest in advancing this matter and the Minister of State has an awful fight on his hands.  I know it.  I am plain speaking as well and I may as well be doubly plain speaking with the Minister of State because he understands it.  He was not brought up with a silver spoon.  The situation is that I know the way the Minister for Finance and those in his Department work because I saw it with the Bankruptcy Bill.  They can put blockages where even a magician would not put a blockage.  That is what they are doing.  I know what the Minister of State faces.  Get the Minister for Finance and his officials together and we will make rural Ireland survive with the help of the people, but the rural communities better get off their butts as well and stop complaining and looking for a protest.  We have enough of that racket going on throughout the country.  I am not part of that protest movement.  It is part of an action movement we should be.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.529" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC01000"><p>An action plan for rural Ireland.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.530" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC01100"><p>I have never been in that Department but I see that Deputy Burton is smiling.  She was very close to those in the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform and knows that what Deputy Penrose is saying is correct.  I will do my best.  I must say that the Minister for Finance, Deputy Noonan, has given me great support as has the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, Deputy Donohoe.  However, when I bring this to Government is when I will know if I have real support.  I can tell the Deputy one thing, which is that I am waiting now to try to reach a resolution between An Post and the postmasters.  I will bring it to Government and I have no doubt that the Minister, Deputy Humphreys, will support me.  I hope many of my colleagues will also.  We have a plan but we will need a few euros.  I have no doubt that the Department and the Government will not be found wanting.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.531" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC01200"><p>I hope the Minister of State is right.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.532" nospeaker="true" time="18:00:00" ><p>Question No. 53 replied to with Written Answers.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.533" nospeaker="true" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC01400">Rural Development Plan</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.534.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1322" speakername="Bernard Durkan" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC01500"><p><i>54.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht the extent to which she hopes to maximise opportunities for the development of the arts and a greater awareness of heritage and economic opportunities likely to arise therefrom arising from the recently announced Action Plan for Rural Development; and if she will make a statement on the matter. <b>[4133/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.535.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1322" speakername="Bernard Durkan" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC01600"><p>The purpose of this question is to ascertain the extent to which it is intended in the Action Plan for Rural Development to utilise the arts and our heritage as a means of improving our economic opportunities in the years ahead.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.536" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="18:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100030#CC01700"><p>The Action Plan for Rural Development is the first whole-of-Government strategy aimed at people living and working in rural Ireland.  It aims to unlock the potential of rural Ireland through a framework of supports at national and local level which will ensure that people who live in rural Ireland have increased opportunities for employment locally and access to public services and social networks that support a high quality of life.</p>  <p>  The action plan is an overarching structure for the co-ordination and implementation of initiatives right across Government which will benefit rural Ireland.</p><p>It takes a cohesive and co-ordinated approach across the whole of Government to the implementation of economic and social policies that impact on rural communities.  The plan contains 276 actions which aim to improve the economic and social fabric of rural Ireland spread across five pillars.  Arts and heritage are covered under the fourth pillar of the plan, Fostering Culture and Creativity in Rural Communities.  The key objectives of this pillar are to increase access to the arts and enhance cultural facilities in rural communities, further develop and enhance culture and creativity in rural Ireland through the establishment of culture teams and creativity hubs as part of the Creative Ireland programme and promote the Irish language as a key resource in Gaeltacht and other rural communities.  These objectives will be delivered as part of the work programme across my Department, in particular, as part of the Creative Ireland programme which the Taoiseach and I launched in December. </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.538" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1322" speakername="Bernard Durkan" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD00200"><p>I thank the Minister for her reply.  To what extent does she expect to be able to ensure all Departments are cohesive and co-operate in their support for the various objectives set out in the rural action plan?  Does she envisage that its objectives will be achieved within a reasonable period?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.539" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD00300"><p>The answer to the Deputy's second question is "Yes".  The plan contains 276 time-bound actions, with responsibility for each action assigned to a relevant Department and-or agency.  Implementation of the actions will be monitored closely and progress reports will be published every six months on the delivery of each action and the addition of new actions in response to new challenges and opportunities.</p>  <p>  The former GAA Kerry footballer, Mr. Pat Spillane, was appointed as an ambassador for the action plan for rural development.  Mr. Spillane previously acted as chair of the Commission for the Economic Development of Rural Areas, known as CEDRA.  The ambassador will assist in communicating the messages in the plan and work to engage local communities in its delivery.  Mr. Spillane will also be a member of the monitoring committee which will oversee the implementation of the action plan.  The Cabinet committee on rural affairs will also meet regularly and I will monitor the implementation of the plan monthly.  Progress reports will also be published every six months.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.540" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1322" speakername="Bernard Durkan" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD00400"><p>Will a specific Department play an integral part in delivering services at local level?  With whom does one correspond to achieve progress, particularly if a number of interdependent agencies are involved?  Will it be possible, after the first six months, to initiate reviews every three months given that the focus will be on planning in the first six months, at which point the operation of the action plan will take over and this will require closer and shorter-term monitoring?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.541" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD00500"><p>I work closely with local authorities through which we have rolled out the town and village enhancement scheme and the Cl&aacute;r and rural recreation programmes.  We will continue to work with them in implementing the action plan.  This will be important as they are often the key to local communities.  The plan takes a ground-up approach in which communities will devise plans based on what will work best in their locality.  They will then present their plans to their respective local authority which will, in turn, submit applications to the Department.  This approach has worked well in the town and village enhancement and Cl&aacute;r programmes.  People have told me the funding provided under the town and village scheme has been very useful and the scheme has benefited a number of projects across the country.</p>  <p>  I assure the Deputy that the plan will be closely monitored.  In addition to the monitoring committee, the Cabinet committee on rural affairs chaired by the Taoiseach will also monitor it.  We will all be held to account to ensure the plan is implemented. </p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.542" nospeaker="true" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD00600">Banking Sector</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.543.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD00700"><p><i>55.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht the progress of the investigation of the establishment of a public banking system here by her department; the likely timeframe of the investigation; the stakeholders involved; the way in which interested parties can make a submission to the investigation; and if she will make a statement on the matter. <b>[4074/17]</b></p></ques>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.544.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD00800"><p><i>62.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht the progress of the investigation of the establishment of a public banking system here by her department; the likely timeframe of the investigation; the stakeholders involved; the way in which interested parties can make a submission to the investigation; and if she will make a statement on the matter. <b>[4244/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.545.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD00900"><p>Where are the proposals for a Sparkassen type banking system?  When will a pilot of local banking for rural Ireland be introduced in counties Longford, Westmeath, Offaly and Laois based on the German Sparkassen model?  I am disappointed that almost no progress has been made on this project and that it was not specifically included in the rural action plan, apart from a nod towards examining the issue again.</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.546" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD01000"><p>I propose to take Questions Nos. 55 and 62 together.</p>  <p>  A Programme for a Partnership Government envisages that An Post, the League of Credit Unions and other interested stakeholders will be asked to investigate and propose a new model of community banking, such as the Kiwibank model in New Zealand, which could be delivered through the post office network.  The programme for Government also includes a commitment to investigate the German Sparkassen model for the development of local public banks that operate within well defined regions.  The role of my Department in this matter will be to work with other Departments and stakeholders to examine the feasibility of these and potentially other models.</p>  <p>  Senior officials from my Department have met their counterparts in the Department of Finance and are developing a work programme to examine the potential of the Sparkassen model and other models of local public banking, as referenced in A Programme for a Partnership Government.  It is anticipated that this work will be concluded by the middle of the year.  It is envisaged that a consultation exercise with relevant stakeholders will be undertaken as part of the work programme.  These stakeholders will include, for example, the Irish League of Credit Unions and other parties with a particular interest in the community banking model.</p>  <p>  My Department has already received a submission from Irish Rural Link on the Sparkassen banking model and this is being considered by my Department as part of the work programme with the Department of Finance.  Other parties interested in making a submission can write to my Department at any stage.  While my Department is facilitating the process of progressing the commitment in the programme for Government on this particular matter, wider policy responsibility for public banking falls under the remit of the Department of Finance. </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.547" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD01100"><p>In earlier exchanges, we heard about the imbalance in development between the east coast and the broad Dublin region, which nowadays extends from Dundalk to Wexford and as far west as south County Kildare.  Since the Second World War, a model of local banking used in rural areas and small towns in Germany has provided small and medium enterprises with basic access to capital.  Sparkassen has done considerable work in Ireland and recently held a seminar in the RDS explaining the model and the assistance they were prepared to provide.  The Minister for Finance, Deputy Michael Noonan, is a friend of the German finance Minister, Mr. Wolfgang Sch&auml;uble, who is in favour of the Sparkassen model.  We are being offered assistance in respect of a type of banking that is not available here.  We just spoke about the demise of post offices and difficulties with a number of credit unions.  Why not use this golden opportunity to create a financial structure that would service rural areas, particularly small and medium enterprises?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.548" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD01200"><p>It is clear the economic recovery has been unbalanced.  While the greater Dublin region and multinational export sector have been experiencing growth, the recovery in the Border, midlands and west, BMW, region is undermined when agricultural enterprises and other small and medium enterprises lose access to the financial system.  Will a pilot scheme for the Sparkassen model be introduced?  County Westmeath, which I represent, is ready, willing and committed to adopt a pilot scheme for the BMW region.  Is it not the case that with the demise of building societies and the withdrawal of bank branches across the country, human intelligence and knowledge of business in the BMW region have been replaced with algorithms and remote banking, which have no interest or stake in the community?</p>  <p>  We are facing the challenge of Brexit.  Action 23 of the rural action plan refers to investigating the potential of the German Sparkassen model.  If that is the case, why have Sparkassen or Kiwibanks not been included as a responsible body in the plan?  The Departments of Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs and Finance, An Post and the Irish League of Credit Unions are involved.  Surely the rural action plan presented an ideal opportunity to have these banks included in the overall responsible body.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.549" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="18:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100031#DD01300"><p>Credit is crucial as it is the lifeblood of rural enterprise.</p><p>We  have had this huge problem with regard to credit in rural areas for many years.  The commercial banks have been retreating from rural areas, purposely to retain their businesses in the large towns.  They have been facilitated in doing this through the Government's creation of two pillar banks.  Some 90% of business is done with the two pillar banks.  The Government created an oligopoly whereby the banks can determine the level of service, the price of service and the location of service.  We have huge opportunities with regard to the post offices, the credit unions and the public banking system, or<i></i>Sparkassen, but the Government has not acted on this in any way.  <br/><br/>I have spoken to senior people within the regulation space in the credit unions in this country and they have said that the reason they are not given extra banking powers is because the Government does not believe in its ability to govern that extra strength.  If that space does not exist, the logic is that the Government would create the supports necessary for the credit unions to fulfil it.  The Sparkassen has massive space, about 40%, of this sector in Germany.  It is illogical why it is not being used here.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.551" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE00200"><p>There is an action in the plan to support credit unions.  To be fair, credit unions have done an excellent job down through the years.  I am a supporter of the credit union movement.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.552" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1235" speakername="Peadar T&oacute;ib&iacute;n" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE00300"><p>Not in action.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.553" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE00400"><p>There is support for them.  There will be engagement with them the context of this plan.  The Sparkassen model and post office models will also be examined.</p>  <p>  In regard to a point raised earlier, 72% of all jobs created in 2016 were created outside Dublin.  There are many people in this country who are creating thousands of jobs throughout the country who are forgotten about in the context of the jobs being created by large companies such as Google and so on.  They should be thanked and complimented for the work they are doing.  In my own town, the Hughes family who create many thousands of jobs, recently purchased Westport House, thereby securing its future.  I welcome that.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.554" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE00500"><p>I saw a lovely picture recently of the Minister of State outside Westport Hotel.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.555" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1253" speakername="Joan Burton" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE00600"><p>The Minister of State, Deputy Ring, is in a very important position to take a leadership role in terms of completing the talking and starting the action.  We know the post offices are in difficulty, notwithstanding huge efforts which I made when Minister for Social Protection to ensure that they retained a large slice of business via the Department of Social Protection.  We know that the credit union model needs to make changes to become a more viable people-local community banking service, including in regard to the provision of basic bank accounts.  We know also that the Department of Finance, be it the Minister or the senior officials, is cold on the idea of local community based banking, yet the Taoiseach's favourite model is the viable local banking structure, Sparkassen, which operates throughout villages and towns in rural regions of Germany.  I call on the Minister of State to grasp the opportunity to give leadership on this issue.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.556" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE00700"><p>It is not the case that a public banking system would be not-for-profit or be restricted to lending to the regional economy for its business.  Post offices and credit unions could earn additional income from the sale of public banking services across the counter via their branches.  Is it not the case that the public banking system would be a more suitable place for the credit union movement to invest the &euro;9 billion which it has identified it wishes to lend to SMEs and, through another medium, provide them with much needed administrative support to meet the ever-burdensome Central Bank regulation system?</p>  <p>  My colleague, Deputy Burton, referred to the Department of Finance being cold to the credit union movement.  The attitude of the Department is below freezing when it comes to anything to do with the public banking system model.  It has no interest in it.  It is the best I have ever seen at putting on a facade.  One would need a rock shifter to get the Department to adopt this system.  If this can be done in Germany, it can be done in Ireland.  It needs to be done in Ireland.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.557" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE00800"><p>In response to Deputies Burton and Penrose, I am taking this matter seriously.  I am dealing with the post offices.  Officials from Germany will be in Ireland on 13 February to meet with my officials.  I have met Irish Rural Link and I will meet with the credit union movement and all the other stakeholders involved.  In regard to the Department of Finance, I know from experience, in terms of having to engage with officials in relation to funding, just how cold its reception can be.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.558" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE00900"><p>One could get frostbite.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.559" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1334" speakername="Michael Ring" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE01000"><p>I am not the greatest supporter of banks.  We all know what the banks did to this country.  We know also what the country had to do for the banks.  We have to be careful about how we deal with this issue.  We need to be sure that this model will work.  We do not want to use models that in the future the State will have to subsidise or takeover if difficulties arise.  When we do this, we must do it right.  I can assure Deputies Burton and Penrose that I will do all I can in regard to this matter, in respect of which I will certainly have to warm up the Department of Finance.  I will do my best and I might need the Deputies' support along the way.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.560" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1370" speakername="Willie Penrose" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE01100"><p>The Minister of State is the right man for the job.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.561" nospeaker="true" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE01200">Tourism Policy</minor-heading>
    <ques id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.562.q" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1343" speakername="Tony McLoughlin" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE01300"><p><i>56.</i> To ask the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht the steps she will take to achieve the increased level of tourism in rural counties as outlined in the action plan for rural development; and if she will make a statement on the matter. <b>[4067/17]</b></p></ques>
    <reply id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.563.r" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1343" speakername="Tony McLoughlin" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE01400"><p>I congratulate the Minister on the action plan for rural development, which is a much sought after plan.  I welcome the plan but I would welcome more information from the Minister on the proposals to increase the level of tourism in rural counties.  I represent the constituency in Sligo-Leitrim, where there is quite an amount of activity in terms of tourism.  I believe this plan has great potential for rural areas.  What are the Minister's plans in terms of increasing tourism levels in rural counties and what funding will be made available in this regard?</p></reply>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.564" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE01500"><p>Maximising our rural tourism and recreation potential is one of the key pillars of the Government's action plan for rural development.  The plan will act as an overarching structure for the co-ordination and implementation of initiatives across Government that will benefit rural Ireland.  Tourism is of key importance to the economic wellbeing of rural Ireland and the sector supports many thousands of jobs in rural areas.</p>  <p>  The action plan for rural development recognises the further growth potential that tourism presents for rural communities.  It sets out 50 distinct actions designed to maximise our rural tourism and recreation potential.  These combined actions aim to increase overseas tourists to rural Ireland by 12% by 2019.</p>  <p>  Through the action plan for rural development, we will support job creation through targeted initiatives such as the Wild Atlantic Way, Ireland's Ancient East and by developing the potential of Ireland's Lakelands.  We will promote and increase activity tourism in rural areas through the development of greenways, blueways and other niche tourism products.  My Department will fund the rural recreation scheme and the national walks scheme and will develop a public outdoor recreation amenities plan to transform the provision of outdoor recreation facilities on publicly-owned land and waterways.  We will also develop and promote our natural and built heritage through capital investment in our national parks and nature reserves, through investment in the Gaeltacht areas and by progressing the designation of additional sites in UNESCO's World Heritage list.</p>  <p>  My Department will work closely with the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport, F&aacute;ilte Ireland, Tourism Ireland, the Heritage Council and other key stakeholders around the country, such as Waterways Ireland, &Uacute;dar&aacute;s na Gaeltachta and local authorities, to deliver these actions.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.565" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1343" speakername="Tony McLoughlin" time="18:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100032#EE01600"><p>Following on from the Minister's reply and her remarks in regard to greenways, I would welcome some clarification from her in regard to the Sligo Greenway Co-operative and the shovel-ready greenway in my constituency which runs from Collooney to Bellaghy, which is a huge area.  There is enormous community spirit within Sligo Greenway Co-operative, to which many people have committed themselves over the last number of years.  I ask that the Minister consider this project a priority in the context of the Wild Atlantic Way.</p>  <p>  The Minister also referred in her reply to tourism officers in the context of the promotion of tourism in the country.  Unfortunately, unlike the local authority in the constituency of the Minister of State, Deputy Ring and in many other constituencies, there is no designated tourism officer in Sligo County Council.  Is it intended that this will be rectified under the plan?  We have many great natural resources in Sligo in terms of it being Yeats country.</p><p>We are also talking about the Wild Atlantic Way and what has happened for Sligo and the surrounding areas.  With regard to Sligo Greenway Co-op, what can be done to enhance and promote the greenway project and get it started?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.567" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="18:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100033#FF00200"><p>We are out of time.  Perhaps the Minister could correspond with the Deputy if she does not have a very brief response.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.568" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1249" speakername="Heather Humphreys" time="18:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100033#FF00300"><p>I have a brief one.  The matter of the tourism official is a matter for the local authority.  Perhaps the Deputy will liaise with the local authority in that regard.</p>  <p>  Much work is being done on tourism in counties Sligo and Leitrim.  Some &euro;100,000 was made available to the authorities in Carrick-on-Shannon to develop a Taste Leitrim food and enterprise zone.  I have seen how successful Taste of Cavan has been.  These types of initiatives are very good for boosting the local economy.  Some &euro;100,000 was provided to Tubbercurry enterprise centre.  The Deputy and others attended the event.  Moreover, &euro;200,000 was provided for a mountain biking project in the Ox Mountains.  This was a joint project involving Mayo County Council.  In total, counties Sligo and Leitrim received almost &euro;4 million in funding from my Department last year to support a range of projects under REDZ, the town and village scheme, CL&Aacute;R and the rural recreation scheme.  The Deputy mentioned one project in particular but all these initiatives come from the local authorities so it is a matter of working with them to make progress on them.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.569" nospeaker="true" time="18:30:00" ><p>Written Answers follow Adjournment.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.570" nospeaker="true" time="18:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100033#FF00500">Topical Issue Debate</major-heading>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.571" nospeaker="true" time="18:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100033#FF00600">Residential Institutions Redress Scheme</minor-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.572" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1227" speakername="Willie O'Dea" time="18:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100033#FF00700"><p>I thank the Ceann Comhairle for allowing me to raise this issue.  I thank Deputy Paul Murphy for raising it also.  We are here this evening to seek justice for the victims of sexual abuse in Creagh Lane primary school, Limerick city.  That the abuse happened is undeniable.  The perpetrator has been convicted by the criminal courts and put behind bars.  The victims, who fought their case long and hard against almost insurmountable odds, find there are two quite arbitrary and artificial barriers placed in their way by the State when trying to gain access to the State redress system.  First, they are supposed to have made a prior complaint.  Leaving aside the difficulty in acquiring evidence of a prior complaint back in the 1960s, the requirement requires a grotesque and deliberate misinterpretation of the judgment in the Louise O'Keeffe case.  Second, the victims are supposed to have sued the Minister for Education and Skills, which proceedings are no longer statute barred, or were no longer statute barred at a certain time.  The requirement to take proceedings against the Minister for Education and Skills flew in the face of all the legal advice the victims got at the time.  What group of people, particularly victims, would take legal action against the advice of their solicitors or counsel and against all prevailing legal advice?  That legal advice has subsequently been vindicated in not one but a number of High Court decisions.</p>  <p>  A redress scheme is a redress scheme, and a redress scheme should be concerned only with whether abuse took place, whether people were affected by it and the level of compensation.  We want justice for the victims of the sexual and physical abuse suffered in Creagh Lane primary school.  The victims in question have fought long and hard.  Their lives have been undermined and, in some cases, destroyed as a result of what they suffered as innocent children in the care of the State.  Is the Minister prepared to remove the two barriers to gaining access to the redress fund?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.573" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1308" speakername="Paul Murphy" time="18:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100033#FF00800"><p>There are some very courageous men and their families in the Visitors Gallery.  These are the men who suffered, along with others, the horrific sexual abuse in the late 1960s and who have had the courage to speak out and campaign about it despite all the difficulties they have faced along every avenue they have tried to go down.</p>  <p>  This is a very distressing issue, as one realises when one talks to the victims, as one should, but it is also a very simple issue.  The men were abused by a teacher being paid by the State.  That is uncontested.  The man was convicted.  Afterwards, the victims faced threats and bullying all over again, this time from the State.  The Government attempted to bully them into silence, telling them that if they did not drop their case, the State would pursue them for legal costs.  They faced the same bully-boy tactics used against the victims of abuse in 2009 after Louise O'Keeffe lost her initial case.  She went on to be vindicated by the European Court of Human Rights, which found that the State was liable for the abuse she faced in school.  At that time, the Taoiseach was forced to issue an apology to her.</p>  <p>  Despite this, the Government has thus far tried to avoid the consequences of the O'Keeffe ruling.  The focus on the need for prior complaints is completely bogus, as is hiding behind the suggestion that the case is statute barred.  The man responsible pleaded guilty to serious sexual assault.  There is no doubt about or question mark over the fact that the abuse occurred.  Despite this, the victims feel they are being persecuted for a second time 50 years on.  There are being told they do not qualify for the redress scheme through no fault of their own but through the actions of the State.  This is about the State accepting responsibility and apologising.  The least the Government could do in this regard would be to allow the victims into the scheme, which was set up precisely for this sort of circumstance.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.574" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1293" speakername="Richard Bruton" time="18:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100033#FF00900"><p>I thank the Deputies for raising this issue.  I am very much aware of the stress suffered by individuals who have suffered from sexual abuse.  I have met such people and understand the concerns expressed by the Deputies.  The historical legacy of sexual abuse in Ireland is appalling.</p><p>The redress scheme, established under the Residential Institutions Redress Act 2002, was intended to deal with very particular circumstances, namely, the abuse of children that occurred while the State was acting to a significant degree <i>in loco parentis</i>, that is, where children had been removed by the State from their parents and placed in institutions for their protection and welfare.  The redress scheme has not been extended to any institutions since 2005 and it has been closed for applications since September 2011.</p><p>The school referred to by the Deputies was not a residential institution, was not listed on the schedule of institutions covered by the legislation and, because it was a day school, was not eligible for inclusion within the redress scheme.  While there were calls for the redress scheme to be extended to other types of institutions and to day schools, the Government decided not to extend it.  The redress scheme was set up for particular types of institutions where children were placed in the care and protection of the State and did not have access to parental guidance or influence.</p><p>In the Louise O'Keeffe case, the European Court of Human Rights has found that the State has liability in these cases in specific circumstances, namely, where there was a prior complaint against the abuser in question and where the case is not statute barred.  In its response to the O'Keeffe judgment, the Government agreed that out-of-court settlements should be offered in those existing cases of school child sexual abuse being brought against the State where the cases come within the terms of the ruling and are not statute barred.  The State Claims Agency, which manages such cases on behalf of the State, has made settlement offers in six such cases, which have been accepted.  Subsequently, in July 2015, the Government approved proposals on the same basis to offer <i>ex gratia</i>payments up to a maximum of &euro;84,000 to those who initiated legal proceedings in cases of school child sexual abuse against the State but who subsequently discontinued their claims against the State.</p><p>Persons who believe their cases come within the criteria can contact the State Claims Agency and provide supporting evidence.  At this stage, I cannot say how many cases in this category will satisfy these criteria.  Where there is a disagreement between the State Claims Agency and the individual as to whether his circumstances come within the terms of the European Court's judgment, provision is being made for the application to be reviewed by an independent assessor.  In these settlements, the State will not be covering the liabilities of the perpetrators, school managers or patrons, or other co-defendants.  A person who suffered abuse or injury in school had recourse to report the matter to the relevant school or statutory authorities.  While the redress scheme has been closed since 2011, victims of sexual assault, like other injured persons, may bring personal injury cases for compensation through the courts for the injuries and loss they have suffered.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.575" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1227" speakername="Willie O'Dea" time="18:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100033#FF01000"><p>The Minister referred to an independent assessor to whom people can refer in the event of a disagreement between the claimant and the State Claims Agency.  What precisely will be the role of this assessor?  What is the point in the assessor if the State will not cover any of the liabilities?  Who will cover them?</p><p>Is the Minister telling us that he is not going to remove either of the two barriers and will leave the scheme as it is?  If so, this will not be the last he hears of it.<br/><br/>Will the Minister agree to meet the victims of Creagh Lane?  I appreciate that he has other appointments immediately after this debate, but I can approach his office to arrange a meeting.  Will he discuss their case with them?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.577" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1308" speakername="Paul Murphy" time="18:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100034#GG00200"><p>The Minister did not write that answer, but it is shameful to hide behind such a narrow interpretation of the O'Keeffe ruling.  Ms Louise O'Keeffe has commented on the matter of the prior complaint against the abuser in question.  She has stated that there is no legal basis for suggesting that it is necessary to establish a prior sexual abuse before one can succeed.  This is simply not the law.  The Government is choosing to take an excessively narrow view of the O'Keeffe judgment.</p>  <p>  The case is not statute barred as a result of anything that the defendants have done, but as a result of the State's actions over a period of years.  The Council of Europe reported that the authorities "explain that they are taking a holistic and flexible approach when assessing the existence of a prior complaint which would include not only complaints".  Is what the State is doing flexible and holistic?  Does the Minister not agree that this abuse should be included in the scheme?  I call on him to meet those who were abused.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.578" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1293" speakername="Richard Bruton" time="18:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100034#GG00300"><p>As the Deputies recognised, these legal measures were in place long before I came to this job.  The position as to when the State has a liability is clear.  The Oireachtas decided that the State would have a liability when it was acting in place of the parents.  That is how the residential institutions incurred State liability - the State had removed young people from their parents, set itself up to regulate the institutions where they were to be cared for, and failed in its duty.</p>  <p>  The situation with a day school is different, in that those schools were managed and run under school patrons and the State did not go to court, as it were, to place people in those institutions.  I understand that the court found liability on the part of the State in the Louise O'Keeffe case because the abuser had been identified and was known to the State and, as such, the State should have taken greater action to protect the child.  That is where the State's failing occurred.  This is the basis on which the Government's legal advice has interpreted the European court ruling.  The State must have known that an abuser was in place and did not take the steps required of it to protect children.  Unfortunately, this is the basis on which the State can be held liable.  As the reply indicated, others may also be liable, but not the State in other circumstances.</p>  <p>  The role of the assessor is to provide an independent process to determine whether individual cases fall within the terms of the agreement.  The State Claims Agency has arranged a process under which there would be such an independent assessor.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.579" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1227" speakername="Willie O'Dea" time="18:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100034#GG00400"><p>Will the Minister reply to my request for a meeting with the victims?  Will he make them a-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.580" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1293" speakername="Richard Bruton" time="18:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100034#GG00500"><p>I will consider that matter, but I do not have the capacity to deal with the issue.  The legislation is clear and I cannot just change this situation.  That is the legal advice that I have received.  I will consider the request, but I do not want to give the impression that I am in a position to introduce a scheme of compensation when the established rules as to when the State is liable are clear.  I do not want to give a false sense of expectation.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.581" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1308" speakername="Paul Murphy" time="18:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100034#GG00600"><p>At least meet them to explain that.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.582" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1227" speakername="Willie O'Dea" time="18:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100034#GG00700"><p>Will the Minister meet them?</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.583" nospeaker="true" time="18:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100034#GG00800">Mental Health Services Provision</minor-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.584" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1342" speakername="Eugene Murphy" time="18:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100034#GG00900"><p>I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Corcoran Kennedy, for taking this debate.  I have been highlighting the need to fast-track the appointment of a child psychologist in north County Roscommon for a number of months.  It was one of the main points that I raised with the Minister of State, Deputy Stanton, during a recent Oireachtas briefing for Members from Roscommon and Galway in light of the 36 Syrian children who will be seeking refuge in Ballaghaderreen in the coming weeks.  An immediate appointment is also necessary for the children of County Roscommon who have been languishing on an ever-growing waiting list since last summer.  I have tabled parliamentary questions on this matter and have had this matter listed for a Topical Issue debate.  In recent days, the Department of Health has approved a replacement post and a panel is in place.  This is welcome.  The pressure paid off in the end.  However, it is important that this vacancy be treated as a priority and filled as soon as possible.</p><p>Since many of the Syrian children coming to Ballaghaderreen will undoubtedly have suffered untold traumas, it is vital that the post be filled before they arrive in the first week of March.  Thirty-six children will be included in the group of 82 Syrians.  Of these, 13 are under four years of age, 19 are aged between five and 12 years and four are over 13 years of age.  There is a child psychologist covering the south of the country, but none is covering the remainder.  The child psychologist who was covering north Roscommon is on sick leave and the post has been vacant since before last summer.</p><p>Many Roscommon children are on the waiting list but are unable to access child psychological services.  For example, a six year old boy was referred by his GP.  After several weeks of phone calls, his parents finally received a call informing them that the psychologist looking after school-aged children had been on sick leave since last March and that a <i>locum</i>could not be found.  Officials could not say when the service would become available again, but they indicated that no children had been assessed since March and that the waiting list would be significant.  The school decided that it would use the single assessment that it was allocated each year to secure services for the child.  His school spent several weeks trying to find out when the assessment would take place, only to hear a few days before the Christmas break that no assessments would be offered to the school, as the psychologist was still on sick leave and no arrangements were being made for the post.  The family is not asking for preferential treatment or to skip the queue.  His parents just want to see him have access to the services that they contribute towards and that are supposed to be available in the public health care system.</p><p>Many of the Syrian children arriving in the county will have suffered a great deal of heartache and brutality.  They will need the support of child psychological services.  This issue must be addressed.  While I welcome the panel's creation, we must fill the vacancy urgently for the young people of County Roscommon who desperately need this service.  The list is growing.  We must deal with that, as we do not want long lists in situations such as this one.  The Minister of State will agree on the importance of having child psychological services.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.585" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1339" speakername="Marcella Corcoran Kennedy" time="18:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100034#GG01000"><p>I thank the Deputy for raising this important issue.  I am advised by the HSE that there is a vacancy in the psychology service in Roscommon arising from an extended sick leave and that a replacement post has been approved.  I understand that there is a basic grade psychology panel in place and that the vacancy is being treated as a priority and will be filled as soon as possible, taking account of the recruitment process.</p>  <p>  Primary care services are usually the first point of contact for families seeking help.  With appropriate information and training, GPs are best placed to recognise risk factors for mental health issues, provide treatment or advice where appropriate and refer to more appropriate services or specialist services when this is indicated.  Issues of a mild to moderate degree benefit from intervention at primary care level.  Many children and adolescents experience mild emotional difficulties, which are often transient and do not require specialist intervention, but require support from other services.</p><p>The HSE's national service plan provides &euro;5 million to address psychology services in primary care.  This allocation aims to support services to work more effectively through increased resources and the development of new ways of working both within primary care and between primary care and mental health services.  Primary care and mental health divisions in the HSE prepared joint plans for a more integrated primary care-based psychology service to focus on providing better access and using a multidisciplinary and multi-method approach.  The approach would address existing deficits and target areas of greatest need.</p> <p> From the funding, the HSE proposes to provide more than 100 assistant psychologist posts to deliver rapid access, low-intensity psychological interventions for young people with mild to moderate mental health problems.  That is currently being considered in the Department.  In addition, 20 additional staff grade psychologists for children in geographical areas, where there are no or an inadequate numbers of posts in place, are currently being recruited.</p> <p> The dedicated funding will also provide for the delivery a computerised cognitive behavioural therapy, cCBT, programme for young people.  The additional posts will provide services to service users under 18 years of age to address those waiting for treatment in the mental health and primary care divisions, while the online resource will also be developed for adolescents with mild to moderate mental health presentations.</p> <p> Resources are allocated to work towards ensuring there is a consistent baseline in terms of staffing across primary care services with the areas of greatest need being addressed in the first instance.  Working in partnership with other service provision stakeholders, primary care psychology services will adopt a stepped care model of service provision in child and adolescent services.  These services will include rapid assessment for all referrals, a single point of contact to the health care system for all non-crisis and non-complex emotional or behavioural referrals, and a continuum of care through integrated working with primary care and secondary care professionals and with community agencies.  Service provision will be monitored and evaluated regularly to ensure the resources are providing the new model of stepped care provision for young people.  The Deputy may rest assured that my Department, in conjunction with the HSE, will continue to closely monitor planned service improvements for this key care area.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.587" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1342" speakername="Eugene Murphy" time="18:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100035#HH00200"><p>I acknowledge the Minister of State's response.  I know her heart is in the right place and that she takes her brief seriously.  Two parliamentary questions were tabled on one of the cases to which I referred and I will outline it.  I was told that the case was referred to the primary care child and family service in May 2016.  I was informed the psychologist for the area is on long-term leave and national HSE approval is awaited for the temporary backfill of the post but, unfortunately, until such time as this position is filled there are insufficient resources within psychology to cross cover for this vacancy.  In other words, there is a shortage of money.  The reply finished with the line: "I trust this information is of assistance to you."</p>  <p>  The second reply to one of the cases raised indicated that the psychologist for this area is on long-term leave and the PCMG has approved this backfill.  I was told that the situation is currently awaiting national HSE approval.  The reality in the case of one of those families, which went to a private psychologist and paid significant money to have the child assessed, is that they were told their six-year old needs support because he is suffering from autism but nothing is available at the moment in Roscommon.  Some time will be available in the school come September but the centre of excellence in Athenry which deals with autism cases has a two-year waiting list.  We have significant problems within the system.  I am sure the Minister of State will acknowledge that.  I do not want children who are five, six or seven years old not being assessed, or even if they are assessed not getting the treatment for a long period.  The Minister of State is aware of the case I have outlined.  I urge her to give it her best shot and ensure a child psychologist is appointed to Roscommon because we need one currently.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.588" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1339" speakername="Marcella Corcoran Kennedy" time="18:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100035#HH00300"><p>Deputy Eugene Murphy will be pleased the replacement post has finally been approved by the HSE and that finding a replacement is being treated as a matter of priority.  I am told by the HSE that the intention is to fill the post as soon as possible.  The Deputy will understand that I cannot comment on the specific cases he has raised but it is helpful to outline them.</p>  <p>  In response to what the Deputy mentioned earlier in terms of the refugees coming to Ballaghaderreen, the Irish refugee protection programme was established by the Government in September 2015.  The intention is to provide a safe haven for persons seeking international protection.  A programme office has been established by the Department of Justice and Equality which will oversee the programme and support the work of the task force.  One of the objectives of the structures is to ensure there is a co-ordinated approach to addressing the health care and support needs of the people arriving under the programme.  A number of health-related initiatives are already in place to support refugees.  In that context the Health Service Executive is working to assess the overall care needs of the group that is due to arrive in Ballaghaderreen, both at local level and with Tusla, and expects to put appropriate measures in place to address those needs.  Attention to the provision of counselling and related psychological support services will form part of that approach.  The Department will be kept informed on all progress as it happens.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.589" nospeaker="true" time="18:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100035#HH00350">Disabilities Assessments</minor-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.590" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1348" speakername="S&eacute;amus Healy" time="18:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100035#HH00500"><p>The Disability Act 2005 provides for the assessment of health and education needs of persons with disability and provides for services to meet those needs.  Section 9(5) of the Act also provides that the executive shall cause an assessment of applicants to be commenced within three months of the date of receipt of the application.  The background information and supporting documentation refers to the need for services to be provided early in life to ameliorate a disability.  They set out the procedure for the application for the assessment of needs.  It states that the Act provides that the assessments must be started within three months of the application and also provides that the HSE must complete the assessment within three months.  That is a legal requirement of the HSE as set out in the Act.  Unfortunately, that is not the situation that pertains in south Tipperary and the legal entitlement is being breached.  Children are not being assessed within the three-month period.  There are huge delays in the assessment of needs of children.  The service is broken and we need an immediate solution.  The current situation for children in terms of the assessment of needs in south Tipperary is totally unacceptable.</p>  <p>  A considerable number of parents have contacted me on the matter.  I will give some indication of the difficulties and delays that arise.  A parent whose child was due to start an assessment on 19 January was told recently the assessment would not commence until April 2019, in two years' time.  That is simply not good enough.  The child is now over three years of age and will be more than five years old in two years' time.  As we all know, early intervention is crucial to ensure children with disabilities are properly looked after and have services provided to them.</p>  <p>  Where an assessment of needs has not been completed, there are consequent delays in the provision of other services, for example, resource teaching, special needs assistants, speech therapy and a range of services children with special needs require to ameliorate their position.  I urge the Minister of State to take steps to ensure the situation in south Tipperary is addressed and that additional staff are made available to the service there as a priority to ensure the legal entitlement of children to an assessment within a three-month period is fulfilled.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.591" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1339" speakername="Marcella Corcoran Kennedy" time="18:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100035#HH00600"><p>I am pleased to have the opportunity to update Deputy Healy and the House on the progress under way in developing services for children with disabilities and the current position on waiting times for assessment of needs in particular with regard to the disability services in south Tipperary.</p><p>Under the Disability Act 2005, a child can request an assessment of need.  The HSE recognises that it faces significant challenges in respect of meeting the statutory timeframes which apply to the assessment of need process.  The number of applications for assessment under the Act has increased each year since the Act was introduced.  More than 6,000 applications were received countrywide in 2016.  However, as of 31 December 2016, 100% of applications for south Tipperary, had commenced within the statutory timeframe.  At 31 December, there were a total of 42 applications overdue for completion with 14 of these overdue by less than one month and 32 overdue by less than three months.  In some individual assessments, it is more challenging to adhere to the statutory timelines, for example.  Where a psychology assessment is required, this may necessitate a number of visits over a prolonged period of time.  This would be true for instance regarding borderline cases on the autism spectrum.</p> <p> The Disability Act 2005 makes allowances for these exceptional circumstances in individual assessments as regards the timeline for completion of assessments.  In south Tipperary, it is acknowledged that there is currently a deficit in psychology services, a function which is essential for the completion of the assessment of need report.  However, recruitment is under way to fill an additional post for a senior psychology post for the early intervention team.  I know the Deputy will welcome this news.  Interviews are to be held in February.  The current Programme for a Partnership Government commits this Government to improving services and increasing supports for people with disabilities, particularly for early assessment and intervention for children with special needs.</p> <p> The HSE has recognised that early intervention services and services for school aged children with disabilities need to be improved and organised more effectively.  To this end, a major reconfiguration of therapy resources for children with disabilities aged up to 18 years is well under way.  This involves bringing staff from different service providers together into network teams and is called the national programme on progressing disability services for children and young people, nought to 18 years.  Since 2014, the roll out of the national programme on progressing disability services for children and young people, nought to 18 years, has entailed targeted investment of &euro;14 million and the provision of 275 additional therapy staff to increase services for children with all disabilities.  </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.593" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1348" speakername="S&eacute;amus Healy" time="19:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100036#JJ00200"><p>I acknowledge the Minister of State's reply and welcome the statement that a senior psychology post for the early intervention team is to be filled and that interviews will take place in February.  I ask that every effort be made to fill the post as quickly as possible.  As we all know, it can take time to fill a post even after successful interviews so I ask that the HSE be instructed to ensure that the post is filled without delay and that if possible, a temporary appointment be made in the intervening period to address the situation.  I know the Minister of State accepts that a waiting time of two years for a child to be assessed is simply unacceptable.  Obviously, it also delays other services that should be available for children with special needs.</p>  <p>  I take this opportunity to refer to the situation arising from the assessment of needs at national level.  There is a significant delay in respect of complaints with over 1,000 complaints still to be dealt with.  I understand that there is only one individual in the appeals office nationally with no full-time administrative support staff.  This situation is also unmanageable and needs to be addressed urgently by the Department and the HSE.  I welcome the Minister of State's response with regard to south Tipperary and hope interviews will be held and that the job will be filled shortly.  If there is any delay, I ask that an effort be made to ensure that the post is filled on a temporary basis.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.594" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1339" speakername="Marcella Corcoran Kennedy" time="19:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100036#JJ00300"><p>Clearly, I regret, as does the HSE, the difficulties some families experience in accessing the assessment of needs service.  The HSE has confirmed that it is working to reduce waiting times and address the issues arising for all children and their families through a number of measures.  The HSE is pursuing the filling of vacant posts and is highlighting the need for additional disability and psychology positions.  It has produced an analysis of service demand and resource requirements and the Department will consider this as appropriate.</p>  <p>  Other measures the HSE has taken with regard to assessment of need waiting lists in south Tipperary include validating the list in operation with a focus on those waiting the longest.  The HSE has also outsourced limited services for children to reduce waiting times.  In respect of the Deputy's final point about the appeals office, I do not have information about that but I will certainly make inquiries and come back to him on that.</p></speech>
    <minor-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.595" nospeaker="true" time="19:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100036#JJ00400">Tenant Purchase Scheme Eligibility</minor-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.596" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1280" speakername="Jonathan O'Brien" time="19:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100036#JJ00500"><p>This concerns the tenant incremental purchase scheme 2016.  This scheme is operated by local authorities and gives tenants the opportunities to buy their homes.  As the Minister of State will be aware, certain categories of houses under the ownership of local authorities cannot be sold to tenants under legislation.  These include properties that have been transferred to a planning authority in accordance with and agreement under section 96 of the Planning and Development Act - in other words, Part V houses.  If a developer builds a private estate, a certain percentage of houses in it are handed over to the local authority.  If someone is a council tenant living in one of those properties, they are unable to buy their homes under the legislation.</p>  <p>  I raise this issue for two reasons.  The first is because I wonder whether the Department has any plans to review the policy and make a once-off offer to those tenants.  I am dealing with a constituent who has been a tenant in one of these properties for the past ten years.  She qualifies under all of the other criteria - in other words, she has been a tenant for ten years and is within the income limits but, unfortunately, she is in this category of houses which under the legislation cannot be sold or transferred.  The sad thing is that these tenants will probably never have the opportunity to buy their own homes unless there is some review of the legislation.  They do not earn enough to get mortgages to buy brand new homes.  The point of a tenant purchase scheme is to give tenants who have been living in a local authority the opportunity to buy their homes at a reduced price.</p>  <p>  The second issue I want to raise concerns local authorities.  The lady to whom I referred got a letter in June 2011 asking for expressions of interest under the 2011 scheme.  At that moment in time, she did not go ahead with it because she did not meet the other criteria - in other words, she had not been a tenant for ten years.  She received another letter requesting an expression of interest in August 2016.  I have no issue with the letter because it clearly stated on behalf of Cork County Council that a tenant was only qualified for the scheme if they had been occupying a property which was available for sale from the council.  The letter referred to the tenant handbook which outlines the properties which are tenants are unable to buy.  Unfortunately, the tenant did not refer to the handbook.  My issue is that the council has a list of these properties and should not send out letters to tenants by name and address when it knows very well from the outset that these tenants cannot buy one of these houses under the scheme.  She received the letter on 17 August 2016 and made her expression of interest.  The council asked for a set of accounts for herself and her husband.</p><p>She went through all that rigmarole and paid a &euro;100 deposit.  It took the council three months to write back to inform her she was not eligible under the legislation.  This family's hopes were raised that they would finally be in a position to buy their own home, only to be informed that this was, in fact, not possible.  Are there any plans to introduce a once-off derogation to allow tenants in that position the opportunity to buy their homes?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.598" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1307" speakername="Catherine Byrne" time="19:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100037#KK00200"><p>I thank the Deputy for raising this issue.  The Minister for Housing, Planning, Community and Local Government, Deputy Coveney, cannot be here and has asked me to respond on his behalf.</p>  <p>  The incremental tenant purchase scheme came into operation on 1 January 2016 and is open to eligible tenants, including joint tenants, of local authority houses that are available for sale under the scheme.  The Housing (Sale of Local Authority Houses) Regulations 2015 governing the scheme provide for a number of specified classes of properties to be excluded from sale, including units provided to local authorities under Part V of the Planning and Development Act 2000, as amended, houses designed for occupation by older people, group Traveller housing, and houses provided for persons with disabilities making the transition from congregated settings to community-based living.  Local authorities may also exclude houses for reasons of proper estate management of stock, on account of their structural condition, or on the basis of proposals the authority may have to carry out remedial works in the estate concerned or regenerate the area in which the house is located.</p>  <p>  The provisions of Part V of the Planning and Development Act 2000, as amended, are designed to enable the development of mixed-tenure, sustainable communities.  Part V units are excluded from the incremental tenant purchase scheme to ensure units delivered under that mechanism remain available for people in need of social housing support and that the original policy goals of the legislation are not eroded over time.  The continued development of mixed-tenure communities remains very important in promoting social integration.  In addition, Part 3 of the 2014 Act obliges tenants to meet certain criteria in order to be eligible for the scheme.  These include having a minimum reckonable income of &euro;15,000 per annum and having been in receipt of social housing support for at least one year.</p>  <p>  In the determination of the minimum reckonable income, housing authorities may include income from a number of different sources and classes, such as employment, private pensions, maintenance payments and certain social welfare payments, including pensions, where the social welfare payment is secondary to employment income.  I understand there may be some tenants whose application under the scheme was refused on the basis they do not meet this income criterion.  This element of the scheme rules was introduced to safeguard the sustainability of the scheme itself.  It is essential that an applicant's income is long term and sustainable in nature.  This is necessary to ensure the tenant purchasing the house is in a financial position, as the owner, to maintain and insure the property for the duration of the charged period, in compliance with the conditions of the order transferring the ownership of, and responsibility for, the house from the local authority to the tenant.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.599" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1280" speakername="Jonathan O'Brien" time="19:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100037#KK00300"><p>I acknowledge the regulations were put in place to ensure communities were of a mixed tenure and to enable integration.  However, if the tenant to whom I referred were to buy her house in the morning, she would still be the same person.  It will not change the make-up of the community if she transitions from a social housing tenant to the owner of her home by way of the tenant purchase scheme.  I would understand if the property in question was designed for somebody with a disability, in which case it would be in the best interests of the council to retain it in the longer term given the huge shortage of properties suitable for persons with disabilities.  However, we are talking about a three-bedroom semi-detached house which has not been upgraded or refurbished to make it accessible.  The tenant and her family have been living there for ten years and, under the current legislation, will never have the opportunity to purchase it.  Will the Minister of State ask the Minister, Deputy Coveney, to consider introducing a once-off break to allow people like this woman the opportunity to buy their own home under the tenant purchase scheme?  It would not have to be open-ended arrangement.  In fact, something similar was done in the past, in 2011, when the scheme was opened up for 12 months.  I am calling for an exemption, for a limited time period, for people in the same position as the tenant to whom I referred, under Part V of the Planning and Development Act, as amended.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.600" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1307" speakername="Catherine Byrne" time="19:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100037#KK00400"><p>In line with the commitment given in the Rebuilding Ireland: An Action Plan for Housing and Homelessness, a review of all aspects of the first 12 months of operation of the scheme is being undertaken by the Minister's Department in close consultation with local authorities.  The Minister will consider the need for any change in the terms and conditions of the scheme based on the evidence presented by the review, which he expects to be completed by the end of the first quarter.  As part of the review process, the Department is engaged in a public consultation process which will inform the outcome of the review.  The Minister encourages all those interested in the scheme to make a contribution to the process.  Full details of how this can be done are on the Department's website.</p>  <p>  I have noted the details of the resident to whom the Deputy referred.  It was very unfair that she received a letter from Cork County Council indicating she was eligible for the tenant purchase scheme before being informed the council had made a mistake.  I understand the family's frustration and disappointment and concur with the Deputy's sentiments in that regard.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.601" nospeaker="true" time="19:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100037#KK00500">Disability (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill 2016: Order for Second Stage</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.602" nospeaker="true" time="19:10:00" ><p></p><p></p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.603" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1359" speakername="Finian McGrath" time="19:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100037#KK00700"><p>I move: &quot;That Second Stage be taken now.&quot;</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.604" nospeaker="true" time="19:10:00" ><p>Question put and agreed to.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.605" nospeaker="true" time="19:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100037#KK00900">Disability (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill 2016: Second Stage</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.606" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1359" speakername="Finian McGrath" time="19:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100037#KK01000"><p>I move: "That the Bill be now read a Second Time."</p>  <p>  I am delighted to present this Bill to the House, the purpose of which is to amend a range of legislation so that Ireland is in a position to ratify the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.  The enactment of the Bill will strengthen the position of people in this section of society even further.  I have long been a supporter of rights for persons with disabilities and ratification of this convention is one my own key priorities.  I appreciate there are many Members of the House who are also committed to this issue and have sought the ratification of the convention for some time.  It has taken longer than expected to get to this stage and I am disappointed we were not in a position to ratify by the end of 2016, as we had committed to do in A Programme for a Partnership Government.  However, the Bill before us will, when enacted, bring about changes to a range of legislation that will have a real effect on the lives of persons with disabilities.</p>  <p>  The ratification of the convention is the first action listed in the soon to be published National Disability Inclusion Strategy 2011-2020.  The process to get to this point has been complex and drawn out.  I accept the criticisms of colleagues in this regard.  It has been difficult to deal with the many complex issues.  However, when we ratify, we will be doing so in the knowledge there is no legislation on the Statute Book that contradicts the convention, as is the case in some other countries.  It is essential that the State is in a position to meet the obligations it assumes under the terms of any international agreement from the moment of its entry into force for Ireland.  For us, ratification is the end of the preparation and implementation process, not the beginning.  That was a crucial aspect of our preparations in bringing forward this Bill.</p><p>Ratification of a convention before we have amended domestic legislation that contradicts it makes no sense and does nothing to ensure compliance or to actually protect the people for whose benefit the convention exists.<br/><br/>The Bill covers a range of legislation covering very different areas of Irish life.  I thank the Attorney General's office and the many other Departments that have been involved in the development of the Bill because it is not limited just to the Departments that I have responsibility for, but has a much wider reach.  Despite the hard work of all involved, it was not possible to include all the heads as set out in the general scheme, which was approved by the previous Government in March of last year.  I will outline shortly what remains to be completed.  While the primary aim of the Bill is to remove the statutory barriers to ratification of the convention, the opportunity is also being taken to progress a number of other miscellaneous amendments to equality and disability legislation.  I will now put on the record of the House the main provisions of the Bill.<br/><br/>Section 1 provides for amendment of the Juries Act 1976 to provide that a person who is deaf shall not be ineligible for jury service by reason only of his or her requiring the services of a sign language interpreter and that the existing prohibition on a person with a mental illness or disability and is receiving medical treatment or is resident in a hospital or similar institution from serving is replaced with a functional capacity test.  Section 2 provides for amendment of the Electoral Act 1992 to repeal the prohibition on a person of unsound mind from standing for election to the D&aacute;il and thereby also removing the disqualifications for membership of the Seanad and for election to the European Parliament.<br/><br/>Section 3 makes two amendments relevant to the National Disability Authority, NDA, legislation.  It makes provision for the role of the authority as part of the monitoring mechanism for the convention and provides that staff of the authority become civil servants of the State.  The NDA is the only body within the justice Vote whose staff are not civil servants.  I thank the staff on the team at the NDA for the magnificent work they have done since I took over as Minister of State.  Aside from the impact this anomaly has on the management of human resources within the justice Vote, by limiting the Department's flexibility to move staff to fill priority needs, that the NDA's staff are public servants means the board must meet pension liabilities as they arise from its annual allocation.  This is a serious burden for a small body with a relatively small financial allocation.  Civil servant of the State status would mean that pension liabilities are met from the Vote for superannuation, and that was the approach adopted regarding the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission when it was established in November 2014.<br/><br/>With regard to section 4, the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities, UNCRPD, provides for reasonable accommodation, that is, practical help to ensure that the person with a disability can, for example, access a service provided for people with disabilities in the areas of employment and provision of services, provided the cost does not exceed a disproportionate cost.  The Supreme Court decided in an Article 26 referral of the Employment Equality Bill 1996 that it would be unconstitutional to impose such a requirement where the cost exceeds a nominal cost.  The Supreme Court decision hinges on the private property protection provisions of the Constitution.  Clearly, these do not arise in regard to the provision of public services.<br/><br/>The Attorney General has advised that the &quot;not exceeding a disproportionate burden&quot; standard is also appropriate in the case of commercial bodies whose activities are regulated for quality of service <i>vis-&agrave;-vis</i>banks, insurance companies, telecommunications and transport providers and credit unions.  We are then left with a range of smaller businesses, such as shops and restaurants.  The provision of the higher standard in the case of the remaining private sector providers can be considered in the light of developments with regard to EU anti-discrimination legislation and will need to be subject in the interim to a reservation.<br/><br/>Section 5 brings civilian staff of the Garda S&iacute;och&aacute;na back within the terms of Part 5 of the Disability Act, providing for a 3% public sector employment quota for people with disabilities.  This group of Civil Service staff were inadvertently removed from the scope of Part 5 by the enactment of the Garda S&iacute;och&aacute;na Act 2005.  I have also set myself a target to try to get that figure of 3% employment for people with disabilities up to 6% over the coming years.  We should be ambitious and have a vision, and we also have a strategy.<br/><br/>Section 6 makes two amendments relevant to the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission legislation.  It provides for the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission to act as <i>arnicas curiae</i>before the Court of Appeal, as well as before the High Court and the Supreme Courts as already provided for, but for technical and timing reasons it was not possible to include a reference to the Court of Appeal in the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission Act 2014, or to insert a cross-reference in the Court of Appeal Act 2014.  The opportunity is being taken now to resolve that anomaly.  It also creates a statutory basis for the IHREC's role in the monitoring framework in regard to the UNCRPD.<br/><br/>Section 7 provides for citation and commencement.  I would also like to highlight the heads that are to be included in the Bill as Committee Stage amendments but which were not ready in time for inclusion in the published Bill.  The main head that is outstanding deals with deprivation of liberty.  That is a very important issue and a number of my colleagues have raised it.  A draft text for the deprivation of liberty part of this Bill has been prepared by the Department of Health, but it requires further work before it can be submitted to the Government.  The Department of Health will sponsor a separate memorandum for the Government on this aspect as soon as the text is at a sufficiently advanced stage and it is intended that these provisions will be brought forward as Committee Stage amendments.  I suspect that this aspect of the outstanding work will take the longest to bring to finality.  Clearly, depriving a person of his or her liberty can only be accepted as a last resort.  An appropriate balance needs to be struck between protecting individuals who may be a danger to themselves or others by ensuring that we can provide social care in suitable settings for vulnerable individuals, and recognising that citizens should be free to make decisions for themselves except where the person&rsquo;s decision-making capacity is lacking.<br/><br/>With regard to the other heads on which work is ongoing, head 6 proposes to amend section 4 of the Criminal Law (Insanity) Act 2006 to provide that in the circumstances that existed in G. <i>v.</i>District Judge Murphy, the District Court will have jurisdiction to determine whether the accused person is in fact fit to be tried.  What is at issue here is to ensure that if a person is deemed to be not fit to be tried by the District Court and is sent on to the Circuit Court, and if the second court forms the view that the person is in fact fit to be tried, the lower limit on penalties available in the District Court should still apply to that person.  That explanation is in layman&rsquo;s language, and I have a more detailed legal explanatory text if Deputies have any questions later.<br/><br/>Head 7 provides for the replacement of a number of references in statute to &quot;lunatics&quot; or &quot;persons of unsound mind&quot; where the reference makes the person ineligible for membership or ceases to be a member of certain bodies or offices in so far as those amendments may be required for ratification.  This head has an impact on a number of items of legislation.<br/><br/>Head 10 provides for amendments to the Equal Status Acts 2000 to 2015.  Following the enactment of the Gender Recognition Act 2015, it is desirable to make explicit the prohibition of discrimination against transgender persons under equality legislation to reflect the significance of the establishment of a system of legal recognition of the acquired gender or transgender persons and of intersex persons.<br/><br/>Head 11 provides for amendments to the Employment Equality Acts 1998 to 2015.  It follows head 10 in making a corresponding amendment to the Employment Equality Acts.<br/><br/>Head 12 amends the Employment Equality Acts to encompass prospective employees, employers, vocational training bodies, professional bodies and trade unions in the definition of victimisation.  At present, the text of the definition of victimisation refers only to an employer-employee relationship.</p><p>This is out of line with EU legislation and the jurisprudence of the European Court of Justice.</p> <p> Head 13 deals with amendment of the Taxes Consolidation Act 1997.  This amendment was intended for inclusion in the Assisted Decision-Making (Capacity) Act but for timing reasons it was not possible to include it.  The opportunity is being taken to make the amendment now.  The amendment to the Taxes Consolidation Act will include the categories of decision-making representatives and attorneys as persons authorised to handle tax matters on behalf of incapacitated people.</p> <p> Head 15 is an amendment of the Social Welfare Consolidation Act 2005.  This is a new head which was not included in the general scheme as approved by the Government in March 2016.  The existing legislative provisions in the Social Welfare Consolidation Act 2005 empower the Minister for Social Protection to make regulations to appoint a person to act on behalf of a recipient or beneficiary of social welfare payments in circumstances where the recipient or beneficiary is certified by a registered medical practitioner to be a person who is, or is likely soon to become, unable for the time being to manage his or her own financial affairs.  The Assisted Decision-Making (Capacity) Act 2015 sets out guiding principles that are intended to safeguard the autonomy and dignity of the person with impaired capacity and it is vital the social protection arena takes full account of these principles.</p> <p> The Bill will be progressed to enactment at an early date to facilitate ratification of the UN convention as soon as possible.  The precise timing of ratification now depends on how long it takes for the Bill to progress through the enactment process and on issues relating to commencement of the deprivation of liberty provisions, which will be included in the Committee Stage amendments, and of the Assisted Decision-Making (Capacity) Act 2015.  Considerable progress has already been made to overcome the other legislative barriers to ratification that are not being addressed in the Disability (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill.</p> <p> The Assisted Decision-Making (Capacity) Act 2015 was signed into law on 30 December 2015 and is a comprehensive reform of the law on decision-making capacity.  The Criminal Law (Sexual Offences) Bill 2015 completed Committee Stage in December 2016 and is scheduled to return to the D&aacute;il for Report Stage on 1 February 2017.  When enacted, the Bill will reform section 5 of the Criminal Law (Sexual Offences) Act 1993 to facilitate the full participation in family life of persons with intellectual disabilities and the full expression of their human rights.  Achieving the necessary balance between these rights and ensuring appropriate protection is crucial.</p> <p> The legislation is good news not just for those who are directly affected by disability, but for all members of society, as it seeks to make society more equal and inclusive.  Equality and inclusivity are issues I want to push.  I look forward to engaging further with Deputies from all sides of the House to ensure an effective Bill is passed and enacted as soon as the outstanding work has been completed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.609" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1262" speakername="Margaret Murphy O'Mahony" time="19:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100039#MM00200"><p>I am delighted to have the opportunity to speak on this important and very long awaited Bill.  It is a crucial milestone towards creating a more inclusive society.  For my part and that of my party, we are committed to creating a more inclusive society and to dismantling barriers in a range of sectors that prevent people with disabilities from fully participating in society.  We need to ensure that people with disabilities are given equality of opportunity so they can participate in society to the best of their abilities.  For people with a disability, their challenge is often compounded not because of their disability, but because of how society treats people with disabilities.  During Fianna F&aacute;il's time in Government, we contributed to moving disability policy from a model that was based on management, charity, pity and, in some cases, neglect towards a social care model, recognising that people with disabilities are full and equal citizens entitled not only to dignity and respect, but also to independence, choice and control over their own lives.</p>  <p>  We are committed to the removal of barriers that prevent people with disabilities from fully participating in society and exercising their rights and entitlements as citizens, but there cannot be any complacency as the latest HIQA reports show very clearly.  Fianna F&aacute;il welcomes and broadly supports the provisions of the Bill, the primary aim of which is to address the remaining legislative barriers to Ireland's ratification of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.  However, we are disappointed that the Bill as published is incomplete, with many significant sections to be provided through Committee Stage amendments.  The Bill as published contains six substantive sections, and judging by what is proposed for Committee Stage, at least another six sections are in the offing.  It would appear that in order to meet the programme for Government commitment on ratification, it was imperative to publish a Bill come what may.  However, to publish what is essentially half a Bill is hardly the best way to honour the ratification of this very important United Nations convention.</p>  <p>  While the Bill has received a broad welcome, its content, and the absence of other content, has generated some concern among those who campaign for disability rights and inclusion.  I will take this opportunity to raise some of these concerns with the Minister of State, and I hope he will reply to them when he is responding to this Second Stage debate.  As I stated, while publication of the Bill is welcome, its incomplete nature has generated much concern.  The Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission is worried that a significant number of provisions in the Bill are due to be introduced through Committee Stage amendments, which significantly limits the scope for detailed analysis on which the commission can provide meaningful commentary.  The commission states this problem is especially acute with regard to the deprivation of liberty aspect of the Bill.  It states the human rights and equality implications of how deprivation of liberty is regulated are highly dependent on the processes and safeguards which will accompany the provision.  To carry out meaningful analysis of the adequacy of safeguards from a human rights and equality perspective it is necessary to consider the particulars of the proposal including, for example, the scope of the reform, how detention will be reviewed and the particulars of an appeal mechanism together with the remedies proposed to allow a person obtain appropriate redress and reparation.  The commission also states that in the absence of published draft legislation it is difficult for it to discharge its function to examine legislative proposals and make concrete recommendations which can be of use to the Legislature, particularly on this aspect of reform.</p>  <p>  It should be noted this concern is also shared by Inclusion Ireland, which states that legislative clarity is required on the issue of deprivation of liberty.  Inclusion Ireland points out how in the UK deprivation of liberty is defined as when a person is under continuous supervision and control and is not free to leave, the person lacks capacity to consent to these arrangements, and, conversely, that any care that restricts a person's liberty is appropriate and in the person's best interests.  If a UK facility wants to detain someone, it must get permission first and the care facility processes the safeguards.</p>  <p>  The Centre for Disability Law and Policy has also expressed concern about key amendments, including those on the deprivation of liberty of persons with disabilities being introduced on Committee Stage.  It states these are key human rights issues for people with disabilities, mental health service users and older people, but to date there has been no public consultation with these communities about the proposed legal changes.  It also states that because amendments are only being introduced on Committee Stage, there will be less opportunity to debate the provisions.  The centre is calling on the Department of Health and the Department of Justice and Equality to immediately publish their proposals for legal reform in this area and to engage in meaningful consultation with those who will be directly affected by this part of the law.  In light of these concerns, it may be worthwhile for the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Justice and Equality to hear in public from interested parties when the amendments are published and prior to Committee Stage.</p>  <p>  I will now turn to what is in the Bill.  Section 1 deals with jury service.  While the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission welcomes the proposed reform to amend the ineligibility condition for participation on a jury, it states the best approach involves an explicit presumption of capacity and that a person should not be ineligible by reason of his or her requiring reasonable accommodation.</p><p>The commission states that persons should be presumed to have capacity to serve on a jury and that reasonable accommodation should be provided to secure maximum participation in jury service.  Inclusion Ireland is concerned that the section on jury service is not consistent with the functional approach of the Assisted Decision-Making (Capacity) Act 2015.  It states that a person&rsquo;s capacity is assessed functionally and on the basis of his or her ability to understand, at the time that a decision is to be made, the nature and consequences of the decision to be made by him or her in the context of the available choices at that time.  A person will also enjoy a presumption of capacity to make decisions.  A person lacks capacity if he or she cannot understand information, retain information, use information and communicate a choice.  The Centre for Disability Law and Policy echoes this by stating: "A more human rights-compliant approach would be to disqualify a person who does not, in the opinion of the court, have the ability to perform the functions required of a juror, following the provision of reasonable accommodation."</p> <p> With regard to a monitoring framework for the implementation of the Act when passed, the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission, IHREC, welcomes confirmation of its proposed role in the monitoring framework required to be established.  The Bill proposes to give the commission the role to keep under review the adequacy and effectiveness of law and practice in the State relating to the protection of persons with disabilities.  However, the commission points to the heads of the Bill which would have provided that it is a function of the commission to act as the independent mechanism to promote, protect and monitor implementation of the convention.  The IHREC states that the function proposed under the Bill should be clearly linked to the commission&rsquo;s designation as the independent mechanism under Article 33 of the CRPD.  This would better align with the view of the UN Committee on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities that states must "adopt the necessary legal measures to clearly establish the independent mechanism".  The Minister might clarify why the reference to an independent mechanism, which was contained in the heads, did not feature in the Bill as published.  Furthermore the Centre for Disability Law and Policy has said it is concerned that the Bill does not provide any additional funding to the commission to carry out this work.</p> <p> Inclusion Ireland highlights another issue which the Minister should address.  It states that the proposals relating to an advisory committee are concerning.  The Bill states that "at least half of the number of persons appointed... shall have, or have had, a disability".  Inclusion Ireland believes that any advisory body should wholly comprise persons with personal, lived experience of disability and that this committee should be representative of all forms of disability.  It should be adequately resourced and facilitated and its members accommodated and supported.</p> <p> Turning now to the issue of reasonable accommodation, both Inclusion Ireland and the Centre for Disability Law and Policy signal some concerns here.  The former states that it is deeply regrettable that Ireland will enter a reservation in regard to reasonable accommodation and that different levels for reasonable accommodation, such as nominal cost for private services and disproportionate burden for public services in employment law, will operate in tandem.  The Centre for Disability Law and Policy states that it is gravely concerned that the Department of Justice and Equality proposes to enter reservations or declarations on Articles 12 and 14 relating to equal recognition before the law and liberty.  These articles are core to the spirit and purpose of the convention and we urge the Government to commit to their full implementation in line with the guidance provided by the UN Committee on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.</p> <p> I have raised these concerns because I believe it is critical for the Government to address them.  While Fianna F&aacute;il welcomes and broadly supports the provisions of this Bill, we will be tabling some constructive amendments to the published Bill.  We welcome the fact that the Bill has finally appeared but its abridged state means that we have to temper our response somewhat.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.611" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1255" speakername="Jack Chambers" time="19:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100040#NN00200"><p>I welcome the progression of the Bill to this Stage.  I am pleased to speak on the legislation and am glad my party will support it to ensure Ireland can finally move to ratify the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.  We engaged with the Minister on Committee Stage and the Minister is trying to meet a self-inflicted timeline.  Interaction has been complicated and it has been difficult at departmental level to get it drafted.</p>  <p>  It is unfortunate we have not seen the full Bill and that we have to table amendments on Committee Stage.  That undermines what the Minister and this House are trying to do as regards full oversight capacity on Second Stage.  It covers issues such as adequate standard of living and social protection, independent living, inclusivity, access to services, including health and education and privacy, among a host of other rights.  Ireland signed this convention in 2017, ten years ago.  We remain the only EU country not to have ratified it.  I look forward to the Bill being brought before the Joint Committee on Justice and Equality, of which I am a member, for further detailed scrutiny and constructive amendments which I and my colleagues, Deputies Murphy O'Mahony and O'Callaghan, will table.  The committee has already conducted pre-legislative scrutiny on the general scheme of the Bill, which has proven very helpful in understanding the strengths and weaknesses reflected by the Bill.</p>  <p>  It is crucial the required legislation is enacted so that the convention can be ratified.  This will ensure greater rights and dignity for the 600,000 people in Ireland who have a disability.  It will remove unfair and discriminatory provisions against people and will provide for better safeguards.  It will give people with disabilities a voice and will enable them to become more active players in decision-making around what services and supports they need and receive.  It is not only a matter of rights but how those rights are implemented, resourced and reflected in every part of our community, as well as at the departmental level.  When the committee engaged I asked the Minister what engagement the Department had had at a cross-departmental level and that has to be a focus.  This is the formal part but if it is not given life by the Department and put front and centre from the point of view of resource allocation then it will not deliver on its rights-based and codified approach.</p>  <p>  Regular reviews of procedures and process are also to be welcomed.  Ratifying the convention will also provide proper mechanisms of oversight and accountability and will allow for complaints to be made and heard where people feel their rights are not being recognised.  It is a great shame that it has taken all this time, and will take more, to achieve these basic and fundamental rights and entitlements.  Given the incomplete nature of the Bill before us, many questions remain as to how it will progress.  How will people with experience of disabilities be resourced and facilitated to play a crucial role in monitoring the implementation of the convention?  How will people with lived experience be key constituents in monitoring the UNCRPD in Ireland, as outlined in the convention?  These are among a multitude of concerns that I know are held by many human rights groups and stakeholders.  I understand and I am acutely aware of the frustrations felt by many over the slow pace of change.  I will take these concerns and considerations on board in my own work in ensuring this legislation is properly developed and enhanced and we will table a number of amendments on Committee Stage to deliver the best legislation for people whom it is meant to positively affect.</p>  <p>  I am cognisant of the lack of engagement felt by key stakeholders and by the people and families directly affected by this legislation.  This, too, is a missed opportunity because the Department had time to properly reach out to those groups which have not been consulted.  The Minister is shaking his head but it is not I who say this - it is the groups and stakeholders who are saying it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.612" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1359" speakername="Finian McGrath" time="19:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100040#NN00300"><p>I meet them regularly.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.613" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1255" speakername="Jack Chambers" time="19:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100040#NN00400"><p>They have publicly said that they feel they should have been consulted in a more wholesome way.  It is an unfortunate reflection of the public debate.</p>  <p>  I thank the many disability groups, including the Disability Federation of Ireland and the Equality Rights Alliance, for their work and advocacy in fighting for the rights of people with disabilities.  I pay tribute to the many centres for independent living, including the Blanchardstown centre in my own constituency, which do phenomenal work for people with disabilities.  I have been privileged to witness, at first hand, the important work they undertake to support disabled people and I have seen the incredible progress people can make with the right measure of encouragement, support and understanding.</p><p>By adopting a rights-based approach, it is important this is imposed on every resource allocation.  Before Christmas, in Mulhuddart in my constituency, there was an issue about the angle of a path and how someone was unable to cross the road to access the centre for independent living.  In fairness to Fingal County Council, it is trying to rectify the matter but without its positive approach people would be left behind.  It is important we couple what we are doing now and in the coming weeks with a real implementation of this approach across every level of Government and every resource allocation.</p> <p> My party has always been committed to fighting injustice and discrimination in all forms and to creating a more equal and inclusive society.  We are dedicated to removing restrictions that inhibit people with disabilities and ensuring that everyone can fulfil his or her potential to participate and contribute to a diverse society.  I am proud that Fianna F&aacute;il was the first party to outline a detailed commitment to address the needs and rights of those with disabilities.  The first national disability strategy was developed and commenced as a result of the party's work in this area.  This saw the creation of more residential and respite care places, the passing of important disability legislation and the setting of targets to ensure this was delivered.</p> <p> This continues to be followed in our national policy today as we move from an institutionalised approach to a community-based one.  The Bill before us is another important step in our support for people with disabilities.  It is a significant shift from a medical model to a rights-based system and it is welcome.  However, a number of important provisions will be required on Committee Stage.  Clarity is required on who has statutory responsibility for a decision on a patient leaving a residential care facility.  The absence of a statutory provision regarding deprivation of liberties in such cases means we are unable to comply with the UN convention as drafted.  The point is that there is no statutory law here.  Other provisions that will need to be brought forward relate to a person's fitness to be tried and the prohibition of discrimination against transgender persons, as well as the definition of victimisation.</p> <p> I wish to mention an excellent article by Mr. Paddy Connolly, the CEO of Inclusion Ireland, in which he said that people with disabilities are not a diagnosis, they are human.  In fairness to the Minister of State, the Department and everyone else involved, we are trying to remove a dehumanised approach that labels people.  We should value lives so that those with disabilities are given full resource allocations.  An inclusive decision-making approach is required so that people are not seen as a process of existence, but are put at centre stage.  They must be given the full capacity to live the life they want within our society.  </p> <p> We must address matters such as the quality of life of those within our communities.  This Bill will go some way towards achieving that.  An interdepartmental and intersectional approach is crucial to embracing the spirit of what the Minister of State is trying to achieve.  The Government should fully commence the Education of Persons with Special Needs Act 2004, the Citizens Information Act 2007 and the Disability Act 2005.  These measures were mentioned by Mr. Connolly in his article.</p> <p> I look forward to working constructively with the Minister of State on this legislation to ensure that Ireland ratifies the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities, UNCRPD, in order to protect the rights of people with disabilities in Ireland.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.615" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1280" speakername="Jonathan O'Brien" time="19:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100041#OO00200"><p>I wish share time with my colleagues, Deputies John Brady and Donnchadh &Oacute; Laoghaire.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.616" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1289" speakername="Pat Gallagher" time="19:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100041#OO00300"><p>Is that agreed?  Agreed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.617" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1280" speakername="Jonathan O'Brien" time="19:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100041#OO00400"><p>Sinn F&eacute;in welcomes the Bill before the House.  In the past 12 months, I have tabled a number of questions to the Minister of State concerning his timeline for publishing legislation which will enable us to ratify the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.  The Minister of State put a tight timeline on himself last year when he said he would publish the Bill before the end of 2016.  He has slipped by a couple of weeks and probably a couple of heads as well going by the legislation before us.</p>  <p>  It is certainly a good day, but not a great day unfortunately.  I have to be honest with the Minister of State about that.  I am concerned that he indicated he will bring forward a raft of amendments on Committee Stage to address some of the heads that were contained in the general scheme of the Bill, but which were not in the Bill as published.  When will we have Committee Stage?  I suspect that the debate on Second Stage will conclude quickly because everyone wants to move forward with this.  Everyone wants to see full ratification but there are some doubts as to whether we will see that.  It is my understanding that a number of reservations will be put in by the Government, although we can deal with them at a later stage.</p>  <p>  One suspects that we will not see Committee Stage in the short term.  I am sure that despite the Minister of State's own timelines, he would have preferred to hold off on debating this and instead finalise the amendments he will bring on Committee Stage and get them into the Bill.  In that case, we could all discuss what needs to be done.  Unfortunately, so far, the debate has been about what is not in the Bill, rather than what it contains.  </p>  <p>  Previous speakers mentioned the issues we need to address.  I echo what Deputy Jack Chambers said about the groups and NGOs in this field.  They feel they have not be sufficiently consulted.  The Minister of State talks to those groups regularly.  I talk to lots of people every day but that is not the same as consulting them.  Saying that he will talk to them is one thing, but it is quite another to bring them to the table as equals and consult them on this legislation.  Some of those groups have expressed reservations and feel they were not fully listened to.  They say that their concerns were not taken on board.  We need to examine that.</p>  <p>  I take Deputy Murphy O'Mahony's point about amendments on Committee Stage.  Given the way the legislative process works, those groups will not have an opportunity to appear before the Select Committee on Justice and Equality, which will be dealing with these amendments on Committee Stage, and give their viewpoints on it.  If that could happen, however, it would be excellent.</p>  <p>  I remind the Minister of State that Article 33.3 of the UN convention outlines how people with a lived experience of disability will be facilitated in the role of monitoring the implementation of the convention within this State.  The Minister of State should outline how that will be addressed.  The deprivation of liberty will not be addressed on Committee Stage, although that is one of the core aspects that needs to be included in order for this State to comply with the UNCRPD.  The fact that it will only be included on Committee Stage, rather than on Second Stage, is a mistake.</p>  <p>  Article 14B of the UNCRPD clearly states that persons with disabilities should not be deprived of liberty unlawfully or arbitrarily, that any deprivation of liberty is in conformity with the law, and that the existence of a disability shall in no case justify a deprivation of liberty.  That must be put into a statutory provision.  I know it is the Minister of State's intention to do so, but we have not seen how that will happen.  I encourage the Minister of State to publish the amendments as quickly as possible.  When he replies to this debate he should outline the timeframe for taking Committee Stage and the publication of those amendments.</p>  <p>  The Bill deals with jury service, the Electoral Acts and an expansion of regional accommodation, which is welcome.  It also provides an opportunity to include persons with a disability in a meaningful way in the advisory committee to the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission, in a monitoring capacity.  That has not been included in the Bill, so it needs to be addressed on Committee Stage.</p><p> Deputy Chambers touched on the recent remarks of the UN Office of the High Commissioner for Human Rights to the effect that the focal point of the convention should be close to the heart of government such as in the office of a president or prime minister or cabinet office.  I understand we have a "super junior" in the Minister of State, Deputy Finian McGrath, but some would argue that the equality division within the Department of Justice and Equality is too narrow and too siloed and that it would be better to put this within the Department of the Taoiseach.  I remain open to argument on that but Deputy Chambers touched on the interdepartmental collaboration which will be needed and the leadership at Cabinet level.  If this came under the Department of the Taoiseach, the Minister of State would probably put himself out of a job.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.619" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1359" speakername="Finian McGrath" time="20:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100042#PP00200"><p>It is tough enough.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.620" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1280" speakername="Jonathan O'Brien" time="20:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100042#PP00300"><p>I am not suggesting he do that, but that he at least look at what the High Commissioner's office has said.  No doubt, the equality division within the Department of Justice and Equality will not be sufficient to ensure full ratification.</p>  <p>  I turn to the long-term prospects for disabled people, their human rights and the ways they can participate in the democratic process.  We need to look at all of that in the round, which is why I would welcome the publication of the amendments as quickly as possible.  While we will support what is in front of us today, without those amendments we have to ask when we will see the full ratification, which is what people want to know.  We cannot see full ratification in this Bill alone.  If the Minister of State is talking about just having amendments, I ask him to outline the timeframe.  If we are looking at further legislation, such as a second Bill, what is the roadmap in relation to the Minister of State's own role?  People deserve an answer on that tonight.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.621" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1252" speakername="John Brady" time="20:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100042#PP00400"><p>I welcome a number of disability activists to the Visitors Gallery this evening.  They have waited a long time to listen to this debate.  Unfortunately, a number of them told me that the timing of the debate has meant a number of people could not be here this evening.  The example of disability activists from Galway was cited.  They would have had to travel here on a Tuesday evening, stay overnight and use up all their critical and hard-won personal assistance hours in the process.  They feel very excluded whereas the key to the legislation is inclusion.  They would have liked to be here for this critical debate but, unfortunately, it was not to be.</p>  <p>  Sinn F&eacute;in welcomes any positive move to ratify the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.  This is long overdue.  It is a real shame that we are reaching the tenth anniversary of the signing of the convention in March 2007 without having ratified it.  It is clear evidence that people with disabilities have not been a priority for successive Governments whether led by Fianna F&aacute;il or Fine Gael.  Indeed, the deadline for ratification set out by the previous Government in October 2015 has come and gone and Ireland remains the only country in Europe which has failed to ratify the convention.  Other countries have ratified without having to change legislation.  It is the view of many disabled people and disability activists that there is no legislative barrier to Ireland's ratification of the convention.</p>  <p>  The most alarming aspect of the Bill, as cited to me by many people with disabilities and those who have been active over many years, is the sudden absence of the word "equality".  Only last month, the Minister of State referred to the Bill at the joint committee as the "equality/disability (miscellaneous provisions) Bill".  However, the word "equality" has been removed from the Short Title of the Bill.  At the very least, this is questionable and it has raised many concerns among those who have been actively involved in disability rights over many years.  Concerns have been put to me directly by many people and I am echoing them here this evening.  The Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission has also voiced concerns about that omission from the Bill.  People with disabilities have not waited ten years to face a Bill which does not have "equality" at its core.  I ask that the reference to "equality" be reinstated in the Title of the Bill to take into account the wider reforms proposed in it because equality must be the cornerstone of the legislation.  People have been out there fighting long and hard for equality for those with disabilities and they must get equality in the Bill.</p>  <p>  The term "disproportionate burden" must be removed.  It reflects the Disability Act 2005 and puts the economy above and before the rights of persons with disabilities.  If we are to ratify the convention, we cannot have conditions alongside these rights.  It will mean that rights are dependent on available resources and that there is, in fact, no absolute right.</p>  <p>  I ask the Minister of State to clarify who will be in charge of the implementation of the ratification of the convention.  Many have called for this role to be independent of the State and it is important that the Minister of State outlines his plans in this regard.  It is also essential that people with disabilities are included on any advisory committee set up to oversee the ratification of the convention.</p>  <p>  Notwithstanding this era of so-called "new politics", we see that many of the most significant provisions of the Bill have yet to be published.  Some of my colleagues have outlined that point.  The provisions will not be set out until Committee Stage when they will be published as amendments, which is crazy.  It is absolute madness.  It impedes any proper discussion of the Bill and provides little opportunity for public debate and even less opportunity for provisions once introduced on Committee Stage.</p>  <p>  Ratification without real change in our laws and policy of the kind demanded by people with disabilities is meaningless and undermines the hard work of many campaigners and organisations.  We cannot rush this legislation through just for the sake of it.  We owe it to those with disabilities who have been sidelined by successive Governments to ensure that the ratification of the convention means that those with disabilities are no longer and will never again be sidelined.  We support the passage of the Bill on Second Stage but there are key areas which need to be addressed.  Deputy Jonathan O'Brien has outlined a number of them and we will be putting forward a number of amendments on Committee Stage.  It is clear that the Minister of State needs to address all of those issues which have been touched on here this evening.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.622" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1287" speakername="Donnchadh &Oacute; Laoghaire" time="20:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100042#PP00500"><p>Cuirim f&aacute;ilte roimh an mBille seo agus t&aacute;im sasta deis a bheith agam labhairt ar.  Although it is not before time to have the Bill, it goes a considerable way towards addressing many issues and opens the door to the ratification of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities, which the Minister of State, Deputy Finian McGrath, considers a priority.  However, there are very considerable gaps in the legislation.  I will not dwell on that any further except to underline the point, which has been well made at this stage, that these gaps are a considerable concern for my party.  A great many significant legislative sections remain to be added at a later date and it is questionable whether that is the best way to legislate.  I underline also the point made by Deputy Brady.</p><p>When the Bill was first published, or at least the heads, the word "equality" was contained in the Title and it has since been removed.  I wish to know the explanation or rationale for that change.</p> <p> As it happens, on 14 December last, I raised the issue of ratification directly with the Minister for Children and Youth Affairs, Deputy Katherine Zappone.  I once again asked that she call on her Cabinet colleagues to ratify the UN convention as a matter of urgency.  This was in the context of children facing discrimination due to disability, to a large extent, and, in particular, reports that children in the care of the State were being let down or put at risk in terms of child protection.  On that occasion, it had been almost ten years since the publication of the convention.  During that period, countries with fewer resources than Ireland, such as Togo, Uganda and Vietnam, along with 153 other countries, ratified the convention.  The point has been made about how isolated and unique Ireland is in a European context for its failure to ratify the convention.</p> <p> Gaps in how statutory authorities deal with children with disabilities were raised in the public domain before Christmas.  It was stated that the HSE believed that Tusla was failing on child protection measures for children with disabilities.  This applied in particular to children in the care of the State.  Serious concerns were raised.  I hope that these failings have been rectified and that child protection is now robust, and safeguards now exist and will continue to exist in the future.</p> <p> My party has campaigned on the ratification of the convention for a considerable number of years, and it is something that we consider a necessity.  This is a small victory for all those who have campaigned on the issue, even if its ratification will be so belated.  Perhaps final judgment will wait until the later Stages of the Bill.  However, there is much to be done.  My colleagues have already articulated that much greater steps can be taken.  My colleague, Deputy O'Brien, will table a number of amendments to strengthen the Bill in a number of areas, in particular the deprivation of liberty or, to put it simply, independence for people who happen to reside in residential care centres, something which may require further legislative clarity.</p> <p> Reference was made to the changes that will be made to the Electoral Act 1992.  I want to draw attention to the Electoral (Amendment) Bill 2016, which was published by Deputy Gerry Adams.  It so happens that it was the first Bill I co-signed on entering the House.  It provides that any location designated a polling station must be wheelchair accessible, something which is not currently legislatively required.  While the number of such locations that are not wheelchair accessible is limited, absolutely none should be.</p> <p> Likewise, I believe action should be taken to ensure independent voting by persons with impaired vision.  Much of the convention and the Bill is about ensuring that people have equal rights in terms of employment, education and a wide variety of areas.  That must be absolutely safeguarded in terms of the fundamental right to participate in the democratic process.</p> <p> T&aacute; daoine faoi mh&iacute;chumas tar &eacute;is a bheith faoi mh&iacute;bhunt&aacute;iste sa t&iacute;r seo ar feadh i bhfad agus leatrom d&eacute;anta orthu i go leor slite.  Faraor, i roinnt slite t&aacute; s&eacute; ag f&oacute;s ag tarl&uacute;, go m&oacute;rmh&oacute;r &oacute; thaobh fosta&iacute;ochta agus oideachais de.  T&aacute; s&uacute;il agam go gcabhr&oacute;idh an reachta&iacute;ocht seo ina dtaobh sin agus go dtabharfaidh s&eacute; cothrom na F&eacute;inne do shaor&aacute;naigh at&aacute; faoi mh&iacute;chumas.  Is m&oacute;r an n&aacute;ire &eacute; n&aacute;r &eacute;irigh leis an St&aacute;t an coinbhinsi&uacute;n UN seo a daingni&uacute; n&iacute;os luaithe agus gur th&oacute;g s&eacute; deich mbliana d&uacute;inn &eacute; a dh&eacute;anamh agus gur &eacute;irigh le roinnt St&aacute;t at&aacute; i bhfad n&iacute;os boichte n&aacute; &Eacute;ireann &eacute; a daingni&uacute; i bhfad n&iacute;os luaithe.</p> <p> This is an opportunity to speak to citizens of our country who have disabilities and to let them know that they will be treated as equals in the eyes of the State.  It is an opportunity to let children with disabilities know that Ireland is a country in which they are highly valued and given an opportunity to prosper and grow in seeking and reaching their full potential.  It is an opportunity to set the record straight and put legislation in place to ensure that Ireland ratifies the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.  I hope we get it right.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.624" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1299" speakername="Gino Kenny" time="20:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100043#QQ00200"><p>As a person who has worked in the field of disability and has always advocated for the rights of people with disabilities, it is imperative that the Bill is debated.  I welcome the Bill which, it is to be hoped, finally addresses the ratification of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities in Ireland.  It is now almost ten years since it was signed but, as of yet, Ireland has failed to ratify the convention.</p>  <p>  Over 150 countries around the world have ratified the convention since its conception.  Many people find the length of time it has taken to comply and ratify a convention that stops discrimination on the basis of ability quite extraordinary.  Other countries have ratified the convention without adhering to every single piece of legislation.  The very principles of ratification of the Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities will be a major step forward for the 600,000 people with disabilities in Ireland, who comprise 13% of the population.  It will also send a very clear signal that their rights are respected and vindicated.</p>  <p>  There has been a decade of delay or, more aptly, a lost decade during which persons with disabilities were discriminated against disproportionately in terms of health, poverty, education and employment.  Part of the Bill is to be welcomed as it will amend outdated legislation and include people with disabilities who were excluded.  The hard of hearing have been excluded from jury duty.  We need to introduce a standard in regard to reasonable accommodation.  The quota for the employment in the public sector of people with disabilities needs to be extended to Garda civilian staff.  More responsibility needs to be given to the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission.</p>  <p>  I disagree with the introduction of certain sections on Committee Stage, in particular those dealing with the Social Welfare Act and the Assisted Decision-Making (Capacity) Act.  People with disabilities have been waiting over ten years for this country to ratify the convention.  Perhaps there is a fear that the State will be sued because it is breaching the legal requirements involved.</p>  <p>  I hope ratification of the convention takes place in the next couple of weeks.  It is to be hoped that people with disabilities can finally become part of a society which has largely forgotten about and discriminated against them over the past ten years.  It is to be hoped that the Bill will finally ensure the ratification of the convention.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.625" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1281" speakername="Mick Barry" time="20:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100043#QQ00300"><p>The UN convention moves towards a rights-based model for those with disabilities.  We welcome the Bill as a step forward in the ratification of the convention.  Disability campaigners have been seeking ratification for almost ten years.  The only reason we are here now is because of their work which involved dragging successive reluctant Governments along the road.</p>  <p>  While the Bill is to be welcomed, we do not feel it goes far enough.  There is need to go further and reverse all austerity measures that have impacted on those with disabilities.  To its shame, Ireland is the last of the 28 EU states to ratify the convention.  This has been a disgrace and illustrates where disability lies in terms of Government priorities.  It is not just the current Government that has delayed the process for ten years.  The convention was signed in March 2007, when a Fianna F&aacute;il and Progressive Democratic Government was in power, followed by almost four years of a Fianna F&aacute;il and Green Party Government and over five years of a Labour Party and Fine Gael Party Government.  All of the establishment parties have been hesitant about the rights of people with disabilities.</p>  <p>  There have been savage cutbacks to services for people with disabilities.  The Disability Federation of Ireland has illustrated that those with a disability are at a high risk of poverty.  The at risk of poverty rate is 22.8% for disabled people.  There is a 51.8% deprivation rate and the rate of involvement in the workforce is just 30%.</p><p>This is not just because of an absence of rights, but is the result of decisions by Governments to make targeted cuts that affect those with disabilities.  There have been targeted attacks on people with disabilities by the Fianna F&aacute;il, Green, Labour and Fine Gael parties which I will outline, but, before I do so, I point out that the general austerity measures have impacted disproportionately on those with disabilities.  When the Government cuts transport services, people with disabilities are more affected than many other groups.  When there are general cuts to education, health and housing, it is those with disabilities who often feel the pinch the most.  The targeted cuts that were aimed at those with disabilities were extensive and, despite the so-called recovery, are far from restored.<br/><br/>Between 2008 and 2015, there was a &euro;159.4 million cut to disability health services.  The disability allowance, blind pension, invalidity pension and carer's allowance were cut by an average of 8% from 2009.  The budget for 2017 provided for a delayed &euro;5-a-week increase.  In responding to the budget in October, the Anti-Austerity Alliance outlined that this was inadequate after years of cuts and poverty.  The &euro;5 increase does not go nearly far enough in terms of keeping in touch with the rise in the cost of living.  It is calculated that the extra cost of living per week for a person with a disability is somewhere between &euro;207 and &euro;276.<br/><br/>Those with a disability have a right to access education but the funding to make it a reality is not in place.  The number of special needs assistants was capped in 2011 and, although altered, is still in place.  This shows that the Government is unwilling to take a rights-based approach.  Instead of looking at each child's educational needs and providing for them, it prefers to give a minimal service and pass it off as meeting the right to education.  A real right to education, like all rights, needs to be underwritten with finance.<br/><br/>The cuts made are too numerous to list in the limited time available but those with disabilities paying attention to the debate will be acutely aware of the 10% cut in the blind tax credit, the incapacitated child tax credit and the home carer tax credit; the change in the threshold for medical cards and the reduction in the number of discretionary cards granted; the 19% cut in the respite care grant in 2013 under the Labour Party; the cut to the household benefits package that massively hit the disabled; the 21% cut in the budget for the National Council for Special Education in 2011; and the 56% cut in housing adaptation grants in 2010, the restrictions on eligibility in 2014 and the very long assessment waiting times that many applicants for the grant experience.  Since 2007, there has been a reduction of 2.5 million in home help hours.  Thousands are waiting for occupational therapy and speech and language therapy and we have had the increase in the threshold for the drugs payment scheme while prescription charges for medical card holders have also risen significantly.<br/><br/>The UN convention is concerned with establishing a rights-based model as opposed to a medical model.  The idea behind it is to recognise the rights of people and then to provide the resources to deliver on those rights.  This should be welcomed and implemented fully.  There are two reforms in the Bill that implement change, but they do not go far enough.  This illustrates the general approach of the Government which is to go so far but then to stop short.<br/><br/>The Bill will change the Juries Act and change the blatant discrimination of disallowing all deaf people from serving on a jury.  It will also end the current practice of disqualifying those with a mental illness.  However, there should be careful attention to the wording as there should be a presumptive capacity to serve on a jury, as called for by the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission.  The other reform I welcome is the removal of the &quot;unsound mind&quot; disqualification from being a public representative under the Electoral Act.  However, the Act is not changed in a way that it introduces a rights-based approach to voters who are disabled.  There should be an explicit right to secrecy of the ballot for blind people with, for example, returning officers being obliged to provide for stencils in polling stations.  This would be a minor change, but it is not provided for in the Bill.<br/><br/>The major omission from the Bill relates to the deprivation of liberty.  I refer to both actual deprivation and de facto deprivation of liberty which can take place in the State.  The convention prohibits detention on the grounds of disability and requires a process outlined in law and a right of review and appeal.  I understand that the Minister may bring forward amendments on Committee Stage to deal with this, but that is not acceptable.  The purpose of the debate on Second Stage is to discuss the principles and identify problems with the approach of the Bill.  Deprivation of liberty is a major issue that should be debated fully in this House and the discussion should not be curtailed by having it in a committee.  It also means that Deputies have less time to advance amendments to what is being proposed.<br/><br/>Many people who have a mental illness feel coerced by the system that is now in place.  There is a power imbalance for many patients, even voluntary patients, and others in residential care.  The Bill should have explicit rights in place for people with disabilities and those with diminished capacity, such as the right to ongoing review of their situations, independent oversight of deprivation of liberty and access to redress.<br/><br/>The Bill does not go far enough in terms of the provisions on reasonable accommodation, which has disappointed many of those with a disability.  At present, there is a get-out clause for service providers.  If they can show that there is a cost other than a nominal one with it, they can get away with not providing access to those with a disability.  The Bill strengthens the position <i>vis-&agrave;-vis </i>the public sector and in important areas such as the position of financial institutions, but it remains weak <i>vis-&agrave;-vis</i>the private sector.  There should be a far stronger wording that gives rights to those with disabilities to access services.  Large private operators should be obliged by law to provide access to their services.  There should, of course, be some consideration for the size of the provider, as there is a difference between a small family-owned corner shop and a large retail outlet or supermarket.  However, if the Government contends there are constitutional issues with such provisions, we should have a referendum to secure these rights to reasonable accommodation for those with disabilities.<br/><br/>The Anti-Austerity Alliance welcomes the Bill but we would like to see its provisions strengthened.  Those campaigning for rights for people with disabilities should increase their campaign work in the crucial weeks ahead, while the Bill is going through the various Stages, in order to secure the strongest possible Bill from what is a hesitant Government that is accustomed to delay on the issue of rights for people with disabilities.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.627" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1289" speakername="Pat Gallagher" time="20:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100044#RR00200"><p>The Independents 4 Change have 20 minutes.  I call Deputy Pringle.  I also remind the House that we will adjourn the debate at 8 p.m. for Private Members' time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.628" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1366" speakername="Thomas Pringle" time="20:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100044#RR00300"><p>I am sharing time with Deputy Broughan.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.629" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1289" speakername="Pat Gallagher" time="20:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100044#RR00400"><p>Is that agreed?  Agreed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.630" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1366" speakername="Thomas Pringle" time="20:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100044#RR00500"><p>The primary purpose of the Bill is to address the remaining legislative barriers to Ireland's ratification of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.  The Bill has been widely accepted.  It is quite a straightforward Bill that deals with the issue of capacity to serve as a juror, removes references to "unsound mind" for persons standing for election, provides for the Department of Justice and Equality to be a focal point for implementation of the convention and deals with, among others, the issues of reasonable accommodation costs and the deprivation of liberty.  These relatively achievable goals are not without problems, however.  I will deal with them in more detail, but I first wish to make the point that the Government has had ten years to get the drafting and consultative process right for the Bill.  This is why I find it difficult to understand how it is that the Bill is still incomplete, with the Government proposing to introduce a swathe of amendments on Committee Stage.</p><p>Did we not see this previously when Report Stage amendments to the rent legislation introduced by the Minister for Housing, Planning, Community and Local Government, Deputy Simon Coveney, rendered the Bill unrecognisable?  Most worryingly, however, was that this left a democratic deficit in the D&aacute;il because many Members could not analyse or decipher the Bill before it was pushed through the House and into law.</p> <p> Why has it taken ten years to introduce such a mediocre Bill?  Last month, during Leaders' Questions, I raised the personal hardship caused by the failure to ratify the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities for people such as Frank Larkin, a disability activist in County Donegal.  I read out Mr. Larkin's letter which highlighted the frustration he has experienced during this long wait.  People such as Frank Larkin deserve nothing less than completed, tightly written legislation which ties together all the loose ends blocking the process of ratification. </p> <p> I will repeat some of the concerns about the Bill expressed by many disability advocacy groups.  One curious change was the removal of the word "equality" from the original general scheme.  The word should be reinstated, as advised by the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission, to recognise the wide-ranging aspects of the UN convention, including the protection of transgender individuals from discrimination.</p> <p> While the Bill aims to fix most of the outstanding obstacles to the ratification of the convention, many issues are not addressed and the Bill is, as I stated, incomplete.  Amendments dealing with Article 14 of the convention, which upholds a person's right not to be deprived of his or her liberty unlawfully or arbitrarily, will not be introduced until Committee Stage.  How will those living with disabilities be able to give their perspective on the legislation if it remains so incomplete?  What are the reasons for the delay in publishing these amendments?  Is it to allow the Minister of State to argue that he is doing something, however half-hearted?  The Government needs to come clean on any reservations it may have on disability legislation in general. </p> <p> Some discriminatory language persists in legislation and this Bill presented the Government with an opportunity to repeal or replace outdated and offensive terminology.  The term "of unsound mind" was used as recently as 2014 in the Companies Act.  The Bill was supposed to amend such terms across all legislation but this has not been done.  Will the Minister of State make a commitment to remove discriminatory language from our legislation in the near future to coincide with the ratification and implementation of the UN convention?  I ask him to respond before we conclude the Second Stage debate.</p> <p> The Bill does not address the outstanding issue of a person being found in a District Court to be unfit to plead guilty because he or she lacks decision-making capacity and the case is referred to a higher court with a harsher sentencing regime.  In 2010, the High Court found that this caused a constitutional issue for people with disabilities who become subject to a harsher sentencing regime purely because they have a disability.  This matter has not been resolved in the Bill.  Why has it not been addressed?</p> <p> The Bill recognises that people who are deaf should not be excluded from participation in a jury simply because they need the support of an Irish Sign Language interpreter.  Reasonable accommodation should also be extended to people with other disabilities. Section 2(b) amends a provision in the Juries Act 1976 on ineligible persons by relating ineligibility to capacity rather than disability.  This does not go far enough.  It would be more appropriate to create a system in which a person would be ineligible for jury duty if he or she did not, in the opinion of the court, have the ability to perform the functions required of a jury following the provision of reasonable accommodation.</p> <p> It will be some time before Ireland ratifies the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.  For example, the Assisted Decision-Making (Capacity) Act 2015 has not yet been commenced.  On 26 January, the Minister of State suggested in the Chamber that the Act would need to be commenced before ratification of the UN convention could proceed.  This is a cause of concern because a great deal of work must be done to prepare for this new, wide-ranging legislation which fundamentally reforms how people are supported to make decisions.</p> <p> While oversight of the implementation of the UN convention is given to the Department of Justice and Equality, this has not been placed on a statutory footing.  Furthermore, the convention recommends that the focal point be placed at the heart of government such as in the prime minister's office or with the cabinet - in Ireland's case, the Department of the Taoiseach - to ensure cross-departmental collaboration and leadership in meeting the task.  It is imperative that the remit of the Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission is expanded to include a truly independent capacity with a clear link to the designation of the commission as the independent mechanism under Article 33 of the convention.  The Bill does not explicitly define the remit of the Department of Justice and Equality and Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission beyond their administrative duties.  Given that this issue could be easily addressed, I wonder why the Bill does not provide for this change and other small but important changes to legislation. </p> <p> The significant role of people with disabilities in the monitoring and evaluation process of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities cannot be understated.  Not only is this role of vital importance, but it is a requirement in the convention.  Article 33.3, which sets out the requirement to involve people with a disability in the monitoring process, states: "Civil society, in particular persons with disabilities and their representative organizations, shall be involved and participate fully in the monitoring process."  The Minister of State must outline how those with lived experience will be resourced and facilitated to play a crucial role in monitoring the implementation of the UN convention and will continue to be key constituents in the monitoring of the convention in future.  This is of vital importance. </p> <p> Overall, I am concerned that the Bill is incomplete and may have been published prematurely to make it appear the Government has been doing something on the ratification of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities.  I am also concerned that, with amendments to be made on Committee State, we may wait for a long time for the Bill to progress and lose at least another year before ratification can begin.  After ten years of waiting, how does the Minister of State justify allowing more time to elapse before the proper ratification and implementation of the UN convention takes place?</p> <p> This debate presents the Minister of State with an opportunity to speak out on the real reasons ratification has been slow.  Cost has always been the key issue for the Fine Gael Party.  Fine Gael and Fianna F&aacute;il have never factored in the physical, financial and emotional costs placed on people with disabilities by the burden imposed on them by the failure to ratify the UN convention.  It is time the Government factored in these types of costs and recognised that ratification of this vitally important convention will benefit all citizens as it would further emphasise the principle of equality. </p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.632" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1361" speakername="Tommy Broughan" time="20:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100045#SS00200"><p>I welcome the opportunity to speak on this important Bill.  Mr. Paddy Connolly, the chief executive of Inclusion Ireland, wrote a moving and impassioned piece in the <i>Irish Examiner</i>today under the heading &quot;People with disabilities are not a diagnosis, they are human&quot;.  I presume the Minister of State read the article but if not, I urge him to do so.  Some of the words in it struck a chord with me, including, for example, the statement that the &quot;greatest threat to the wellbeing of people who have disabilities is their invisibility&quot; which &quot;renders them non-agents of their own fate, passive recipients of care rather than rights-holders&quot;.</p><p>Mr. Connolly also called out the statement by the Minister of State that Ireland is &quot;in advance of other EU states&quot; when it comes to persons with disability.  A study by the European Institute for Gender Equality showed clearly that this statement is simply not true.  Furthermore, Ireland is the only EU state that has not implemented the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities. </p><p>Mr. Connolly also stated that he recently resigned from the national disability strategy implementation group, which he described as a &quot;bureaucratic echo chamber&quot;.  As legislators, we must ensure that people with disabilities do not feel invisible and we must enhance and protect their right to live full and equal lives.  While I will support the Bill and welcome that it has finally come before the House, it is time the Government stepped out of the echo chamber and put words and promises into action.</p><p>I recently questioned the Minister of State on the amount of funding he had secured for disability in budget 2017.  As Deputy Pringle stated, the implementation of the UN convention revolves around cost and the unwillingness of the Fine Gael Party, with which the Minister of State is now allied, and the Fianna F&aacute;il Party in the past to spend the funding required to fulfil assessments for citizens with disability. </p><p>I have some questions for the Minister of State on the legislation, as it stands.  Will he outline what legislative provisions will be made to ensure that people with disabilities have equal and effective legal protection against discrimination on all grounds, as provide for in Article 5 of the UN convention?  The civil legal aid scheme does not extend to people with disabilities wishing to make complaints to the Workplace Relations Commission and thereby enforce their protection against discrimination.  The lack of legal aid renders the protection ineffective for many.  Given the limitations of the legal aid scheme, people with disabilities do not have access to legal advice and representation before other tribunals such as the social welfare appeals office.  How will the Minister of State address this issue?</p><p>This is most extraordinary legislation.  I cannot remember a Minister describing the introduction of a Bill in the House as an historic day before stating that it is proposed to introduce a raft of amendments at a later stage.  As Deputy Mick Barry stated, we will not have an opportunity to invigilate these amendments.  From that point of view, I hope the Minister of State is serious about this legislation and that it will mark a watershed of huge improvements for our 600,000 citizens with disabilities.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.633" nospeaker="true" time="20:30:00" ><p>Debate adjourned.</p></speech>
    <major-heading id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.634" nospeaker="true" time="20:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100046#TT00300">Bus Éireann: Motion [Private Members]</major-heading>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.635" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1250" speakername="Robert Troy" time="20:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100046#TT00400"><p>I propose to share time with a number of my colleagues.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.636" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1289" speakername="Pat Gallagher" time="20:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100046#TT00500"><p>As the Deputy is sharing time with six others, I ask him to be disciplined in making his contribution.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.637" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1250" speakername="Robert Troy" time="20:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100046#TT00600"><p>I move:</p><blockquote>That D&aacute;il &Eacute;ireann:<br /><br />recognises that:<br /><br />- Bus &Eacute;ireann is in serious financial difficulties with reported losses of &euro;5.3 million in 2016, and greater projected losses in 2017;<br /><br />- Bus &Eacute;ireann has said that the company&rsquo;s finances are in a &lsquo;perilous state&rsquo; and that this could lead to job losses unless restructuring proposals are accepted;<br /><br />- a major contributor to the falling revenues has been the commercial services which have struggled to compete with new market entrants in recent years;<br /><br />- the company cannot continue to operate in its current loss making position which is depleting its reserves and that without action the company could face liquidity and solvency issues within the next 24 months; and<br /><br />- any subsidisation of losses of the commercial operations of Bus &Eacute;ireann, which competes with private enterprises, would likely encounter European Union competition and state aid issues;<br /><br />acknowledges:<br /><br />- that the report by Grant Thornton faults the Expressway services for the significant losses and recommends the possibility of significant reductions in Expressway services, up to and including Bus &Eacute;ireann exiting these operations altogether;<br /><br />- that such action would result in Bus &Eacute;ireann shutting down many of its key routes serving large swathes of the country, leaving many areas in between big towns and cities with no direct Expressway services to Dublin or other cities and this cannot be considered acceptable;<br /><br />- the fact that this is being considered as a potential option is creating huge uncertainty and fear and is evidence of the neglect of rural Ireland by the Government; and<br /><br />- the need for the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport and the Government to act urgently to prevent the possibility of nationwide industrial action of the public transport services; and<br /><br />calls on the Government to:<br /><br />- commit to the importance of a public sector transport network that is adequately funded;<br /><br />- take more determined actions to secure the future of Bus &Eacute;ireann services nationwide and use its powers as a stakeholder to ensure that there are no changes to the Expressway service and that restructuring plans are agreed with workers and not imposed unilaterally;<br /><br />- increase funding to Bus &Eacute;ireann for free travel passengers as well as examining whether additional routes should be added to the public service obligation contract;<br /><br />- review the route licensing system, in conjunction with the National Transport Authority, NTA, to ensure wider concerns such as those regarding rural isolation or whether competition is sustainable on a route are included in decisions as to whether to grant or refuse bus route licenses to operators; and <br /><br />- introduce legislation to give the NTA greater licensing powers to approve or reject route amendments by Bus &Eacute;ireann and private operators.</blockquote><p>The purpose of the motion is to enable all Members of the D&aacute;il to discuss the serious challenges facing Bus &Eacute;ireann.  We know that in 2015 the company endured a loss of &euro;5.6 million and that losses in 2016 were between &euro;6 million and &euro;9 million.  I record in the D&aacute;il my party's commitment to a properly funded and sustainable public transport system for the benefit of all Ireland.  While acknowledging that private operators have a role to play, we do not believe public transport, or large sections of it, can be left exclusively to private operators, the core objective of which is to make a profit.  That is fair enough but the State and the Government have a duty and a responsibility to ensure that we maintain the core public service that is public transport.  We have a duty and a responsibility to ensure that all regions are served and have the benefit of public transport.  There are many people in communities who are reliant on public transport to get to work, medical appointments and college or to enable them to get out and about and remain connected with the outside world.  Whether the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Shane Ross, likes to admit it, there is real fear and anxiety among those who rely on these services and among the people working in Bus &Eacute;ireann. </p><p>Much of the loss is blamed on the Expressway service.  We know from the leaked Grant Thornton report, of which I had only a draft copy but I at least had a copy of it, that the Expressway service is the cause of the problem.  By way of example, a woman in my constituency in Rathowen, which is located on the N4, is a full-time carer for her blind sister.  The only way she can get to either Longford or Mullingar is on the Expressway service.  While there are other private operators on that route they do not stop at Rathowen.  There are three operators serving the Dublin-Carlow-Waterford route, including Bus &Eacute;ireann and two private operators.  Bus &Eacute;ireann, Expressway, is the only operator servicing the towns and villages between Carlow and Waterford.</p><p>I accept that the losses at the commercial arm of Bus &Eacute;ireann cannot be allowed to continue but it is worth noting that Bus &Eacute;ireann traded its way out of far more substantial losses in the past.  The Minister has said that he has no role to play in the restructuring of Bus &Eacute;ireann.  In 2015, his predecessor at the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport commissioned a report on a plan for the restructuring of Bus &Eacute;ireann.  However, when that plan was presented to the Department nothing happened.  Where is that plan that was presented to the Department in early 2016?  There was obviously an acknowledgement that there were serious financial issues in the company and that corrective action needed to be taken, otherwise no plan would have been sought.</p><p>A full year has been lost by inaction on the part of the Minister and his predecessor.  In terms of what could have been done, consideration could have been given to the use of better technology to ensure greater fuel efficiency across the full fleet of buses but that was not done last year.  Last year, &euro;7 million was paid for the hire of private coaches by Bus &Eacute;ireann.  We are now told it will be able to do without these coaches this year.  We know that one of the main reasons for the spike in losses in 2016 was the high cost of insurance yet nothing has been done.</p><p>Why was the report commissioned by the Minister's predecessor brushed under the carpet?  Why were other reports that we are told were presented to the Department in July, August and September not acted on?  When was the Minister made aware of the challenges that Bus &Eacute;ireann faces?  Inaction on the part of the Minister and his predecessor has contributed to the precarious situation in which Bus &Eacute;ireann now finds itself.  The only time that the Minister has acknowledged that there was a problem with Bus &Eacute;ireann was when he brought a memo in that regard to the Cabinet prior to Christmas.  That memo was exclusively based on an information session or a briefing he had with the chairman of Bus &Eacute;ireann.  The Minister did not seek a copy of the report or obtain an alternative opinion on it: he just brought it to the Cabinet.  Why was a full year wasted, leading to the need for a huge scurry of activity in the next couple of weeks?  </p><p>I wish the new acting chief executive of Bus &Eacute;ireann, Mr. Hernan, well.  We all want to see Bus &Eacute;ireann put on a sustainable footing for the benefit of all communities.  The Minister may laugh but I do not think this is a laughing matter.  We all want to see Bus &Eacute;ireann put on a sustainable footing and to have our communities served by a good public transport service.  We also want to see workers in Bus &Eacute;ireann respected for the work they are doing.  For any restructuring to work there needs to be buy-in from all stakeholders, including the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport, Bus &Eacute;ireann management and workers, the unions representing the workers and the National Transport Authority, NTA.  If Mr. Hernan thinks that by threatening unilateral pay cuts before any restructuring plan is finalised he will get buy-in, he is sadly mistaken.  Savings or efficiencies can be achieved in Bus &Eacute;ireann through non-pay cuts, examples of which I gave earlier.  The unions representing the workers acknowledge that greater efficiencies can be achieved but they need to be consulted in that regard and to not have preconditions forced on them prior to negotiations.  </p><p>Last week I posed the following question to the Minister in a Topical Issues debate.  Has the Department reviewed how the NTA issues licences?  If such a review has been carried out, when will it be made public in order that everybody can have the benefit of it?  The Taoiseach has stated - this was repeated by the Minister in his reply to the Topical Issues debate last week - that the NTA has rejected more licences than it granted.  However, neither have acknowledged the huge increase in the number of routes that have been brought on stream.  There has been no comment on the fact that private operators have been enabled to cherry-pick and head-run, which is the facilitation of private operators with a licence to operate on routes ten minutes prior to an existing Bus &Eacute;ireann service.  I do not blame the NTA for this because it is only implementing Government policy but what it is doing in facilitating this practice is reducing the profitable elements of Bus &Eacute;ireann.  What I have taken from the Minister's very limited input in this matter over the last few weeks is that he is happy for the private operators to run the commercial routes between the large urban areas, with the PSO being left to pick up the remainder of the routes.  Why are we taking our company off the profitable routes and telling them that the only routes on which they can operate are the PSO routes?</p><p>That is not fair or right.  Although the NTA has the power to grant a licence, which may be granted on the basis of a private bus company servicing certain routes, there are no consequences if the company decides to no longer service the towns in question.  That is not right or fair.</p> <p> Why has the Minister not sought an increase in funding from the Department of Social Protection?  There has been no increase in funding since 2010 despite a serious increase in the number of people availing of the service.  The Minister and the rest of the Government are facilitating an attack on the workers without considering any of the other issues, including where savings can be generated.  That is not fair.  The Minister has a responsibility to ensure we have an efficient, effective, sustainable integrated public transport system in the future.  It is time he stepped up to the plate and used this opportunity tonight to state how he will achieve this.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.639" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1283" speakername="Michael Moynihan" time="20:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100047#UU00200"><p>I thank the Ceann Comhairle for giving me the opportunity to speak in the debate and compliment Deputy Robert Troy on tabling the motion.  A number of issues arise, one being the future of Bus &Eacute;ireann.  Many communities throughout the country are very concerned about its future.  Deputy Troy has said it is now time for us to step up to the plate.  As a State, we must decide whether we want to ensure Bus &Eacute;ireann can continue to serve the communities throughout the country.</p>  <p>  Another issue arises regarding Bus &Eacute;ireann workers.  They have worked extremely hard for the company over the years and they are rightly concerned about their future and livelihoods.  On the face of it, the Government does not seem to be recognising the seriousness of the plight of the company and its workers.</p>  <p>  We have to make a decision on the future of Bus &Eacute;ireann and ensure it remains in public ownership and continues to serve citizens, including in communities that are often disenfranchised and in remote areas.  We must ensure the company remains viable and that its staff continue to be adequately rewarded for their work.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.640" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1354" speakername="James Browne" time="20:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100047#UU00300"><p>I thank Deputy Robert Troy for tabling this motion.  Many are asking whether the Minister, owing to his inaction, recognises the risks to public transport and the damage that could be inflicted in rural areas if he does not intervene.  It is said he perhaps lacks a vision.  It is becoming clear, however, that he has abdicated his responsibility and abandoned his duties, but he is very deliberate in doing so.  It is very clear his inaction was not by accident.  A pattern is emerging.  The agenda is clear in that, for ideological reasons, he is prepared to downgrade public transport, rural areas and public sector workers.</p><p>In my county, Wexford, there has been a failure and refusal to publish the Indecon report on Rosslare Europort.  Iarnr&oacute;d &Eacute;ireann is prepared to shut down the railway lines south of Gorey and now we may lose the Expressway services.  This<i>laissez faire</i>attitude risks inflicting untold and irreparable damage on rural areas.  The Minister's Fine Gael partners in government seem to be prepared to sit back and allow him to do this but ultimately it is they who, at election time, will have to answer for any pain inflicted on rural areas.  I ask the Minister to reconsider and intervene in this matter to ensure rural Ireland is protected.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.641" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1368" speakername="Bobby Aylward" time="20:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100047#UU00400"><p>Any Deputy will tell one that any changes to the scheduling of buses or the routes they travel, however slight they may be, can send the constituency office into overdrive.  The Bus &Eacute;ireann Expressway network reaches into almost every town and village in rural Ireland.  For many rural dwellers, the service represents the only avenue of transport.  It is a crucial service and its importance to the social fabric of hundreds of rural communities across the country cannot be overestimated.</p>  <p>  Deputy Robert Troy pointed to an example involving my constituency, namely, the Waterford-Carlow-Dublin route.  Bus &Eacute;ireann's Expressway service serves the smaller communities on the route, including my home parishes of Ballyhale and Mullinavat.  The two private operators in the area, which are working against Bus &Eacute;ireann, bypass these communities with a view to getting from A to B quicker and cheaper.  It is important to keep this in mind.  This is an example of where the State needs to step in and where it has an obligation to the people of the affected communities to ensure their service is maintained.  It is beyond belief in early 2017, with the economy recovering and the State's finances steadily improving, that the people of these rural communities could realistically face being stranded in social isolation.</p>  <p>  The Grant Thornton report faults the Expressway services for the major losses and recommends the possibility of significant reductions in Expressway services, up to and including Bus &Eacute;ireann exiting these operations altogether.  If the latter happened, it would be unbelievable.  This would result in Bus &Eacute;ireann shutting down many of its key routes across the country, leaving many areas in between the big towns and cities with no direct Expressway services to Dublin or other cities.  This cannot be considered acceptable.  That this is even being considered as a potential option is creating considerable uncertainty and fear.  The Government is allowing rural Ireland to be neglected once again.  Obviously we need to strike a balance when it comes to efficiency, minimum standards of operation and a good deal for the taxpayer when subsidising such services.  It is time, however, for a more hands-on approach from the Government, which must give a guarantee that it will step in when necessary where a service is clearly required but may not be commercially viable.  After mass last Sunday morning, pensioners asked that we keep the service in their small areas because, if it is not kept, they will have no access to transport and no connection.  It is important the Minister takes that on board.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.642" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1257" speakername="Fiona O'Loughlin" time="20:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100047#UU00500"><p>When I was leaving my home in Newbridge to go to work in Leinster House this morning, I had the options of driving, taking the bus or getting a train because I live close to a good rail network.  The train is quite expensive but that is another argument.  My brother, Cathal, who lives in my family home outside Rathangan, does not have those options.  There is no railway station in the town.  Cathal does not drive but needs to go to work every day.  His job is incredibly important to him.  He has Down's syndrome and going to work is the mainstay of his life.  It gives him independence, a salary and an opportunity to socialise in his workplace in the way many of us want to do.  Part of his journey to work requires his use of a public bus.  If that is taken away from him, I dread to think of the impact on him.  There are many more like Cathal in south Kildare, the rest of the county and across the country.  So many people are absolutely dependent on Bus &Eacute;ireann.</p>  <p>  We are lucky to have four railway stations in County Kildare but many counties, including that of the Leas-Cheann Comhairle, have none.  That the Government is even considering the possibility of closing down Bus &Eacute;ireann is appalling.  It is leading to considerable fear among many people in rural areas.  It is quite ironic that the Government published a paper last week with 276 actions for supporting rural areas while people feel they will lose out on the connectivity that is very important for their jobs, health and daily lives.  I plead with the Minister to show leadership by confronting the crisis facing the public transport system.  Ignoring the crisis will not make it go away.  The workers on Bus &Eacute;ireann absolutely need to be supported.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.643" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1357" speakername="Pat Casey" time="20:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100047#UU00600"><p>Public transport is not simply a matter of profit and loss.  The laws of the free market and business do not have total control here, nor should they.  In fact, the provision of public transport is one of the areas of public policy in respect of which it is important that the principles of equality and social need to remain key in determining the Government's role.</p>  <p>  The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Shane Ross, lives in north Wicklow and, therefore, knows how crucial public transport is in meeting the economic and social needs of the people.</p><p>He is aware of the county's particular needs, in that more than 70% of the working population leave it everyday to go to work, while there is a large number of isolated rural communities that require public transport in order to meet vital needs such as health appointments.</p> <p> No one argues that Bus &Eacute;ireann does not need to be placed on a sustainable footing, but that goal must see the wider needs of society being placed at the centre of any viable policy.  People living in Arklow and Wicklow town are becoming more reliant on the Expressway service to Dublin.  The No. 133 Expressway bus is not just full of students, tourists and day trippers; many use it to access appointments at, for example, St. Vincent's Univeristy Hospital.  Without Bus &Eacute;ireann's services, these vital transport needs would not be met by private operators.  For those living in many towns and villages in rural west Wicklow, for example, Carnew, Tinahely and Kiltegan, Bus &Eacute;ireann is the only provider of transport services to Dublin.  Are the people living in rural areas in County Wicklow and east Carlow not deserving of public transport services?</p> <p> The Government makes a great deal of noise about rural Ireland, but its actions show a disregard for the provision of a quality of service for the people living in rural areas of County Wicklow.  Deputy Robert Troy's motion is about policy, not personality.  Public service, not profit margins, should be the Government's mission statement.  Fine Gael has already let its mask slip, given the comments last week on the free travel pass for pensioners.  We know from testimony before an Oireachtas committee last week that Bus &Eacute;ireann is on life support and will close without urgent Government action.  That would be a disaster and a failure on the part of the Cabinet.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.645" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1213" speakername="Shane Ross" time="21:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100048#VV00200"><p>I move amendment No. 4:</p><blockquote>To delete all words after &ldquo;D&aacute;il &Eacute;ireann&rdquo; and substitute the following:recognises that:<blockquote>- Bus &Eacute;ireann is in serious financial difficulty;<br /><br />- Bus &Eacute;ireann has stated the company&rsquo;s finances are in a &quot;perilous state&quot; and that this could lead to job losses unless restructuring proposals are accepted;<br /><br />- a major contributor to the falling revenues has been the commercial services which have struggled to compete with new market entrants in recent years;<br /><br />- the company cannot continue to operate in its current loss-making position which is depleting its reserves and that without action the company could face imminent liquidity and solvency issues; and<br /><br />- any subsidisation of losses of the commercial operations of Bus &Eacute;ireann which competes with private enterprises would likely encounter European Union competition and state aid issues;</blockquote>acknowledges:<blockquote>- that an analysis commissioned by the company identifies the commercial Expressway services as the source of significant losses and recommends consideration of the reconfiguration of certain Expressway services;<br /><br />- the fact that this is being considered as a potential option is creating some uncertainty and fear; and<br /><br />- the need for the company and trade unions to negotiate on changes to prevent the possibility of industrial action in a company that provides important public transport services; and</blockquote>calls on the Government to:<blockquote>- commit, while taking cognisance of the overall budgetary parameters, to the importance of an adequately funded public service obligation, PSO, transport network;<br /><br />- review the adequacy of current funding levels associated with the free travel scheme, as well as examining whether additional routes should be added to the PSO contract;<br /><br />- request that the National Transport Authority, NTA, continue to exercise its statutory powers to ensure that PSO services are adequate to serve the needs of rural Ireland, in the event that there are changes to Expressway services in the future; and<br /><br />- bring forward amendments to the Public Transport Regulation Act 2009, taking account of the review of such legislation by the NTA and necessary improvements to strengthen public transport services to the consumer.</blockquote></blockquote><p>I thank Deputy Robert Troy for proposing the motion and everyone else who has contributed to the debate on it.  It is the right motion at the right time.  While I share the sentiments of nearly everyone who has spoken and agree with a great deal of what they have said, Deputy Robert Troy and I do not appear to share the road towards a solution.  That is what politics is about.</p><p>There are elements of the Fianna F&aacute;il motion with which the Government could agree and which it could support.  The Government is committed to having a well funded public transport system.  That is why we increased by 11% the amount of money available in PSO funding.  I have publicly acknowledged the need to examine the adequacy of the funding provided for the free travel scheme.  It is right that we examine whether funding levels which have effectively been frozen at 2010 levels are adequate today.  I will be working with my colleague, the Minister for Social Protection, on that matter.</p><p>Let the message go out in response to what has been said in this debate that rural Ireland is a top priority for the Government.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.646" nospeaker="true" time="21:00:00" ><p>(Interruptions).</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.647" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1213" speakername="Shane Ross" time="21:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100048#VV00400"><p>That is the truth.  It is evident in some of the measures that have been taken and some of the pledges involved in the public transport debate.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.648" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1335" speakername="Dara Calleary" time="21:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100048#VV00500"><p>Where is the-----</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.649" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1213" speakername="Shane Ross" time="21:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100048#VV00600"><p>I am committed to ensuring rural Ireland will maintain an appropriate level of public transport connectivity.  That is why I met the National Transport Authority, NTA, a few weeks ago to inform myself better of its statutory powers and track record in this regard.  I was reassured by what it had to state.  It will not be found wanting if routes and services are changed.  The Government stands ready with it to assist rural Ireland.  However, there are certain elements of the motion that the Government cannot support.  In recent weeks we have witnessed some confused thinking.  The motion ends with a call for the Government to interfere with Bus &Eacute;ireann's conduct of its commercial Expressway business, regardless of the financial consequences or whether there are the legal powers to do so.  The purpose of my amendment is to clarify the intent of existing policies and the opportunities available to the NTA to address concerns about the impact on rural Ireland's transport connectivity.</p>  <p>  I am conscious of the concerns expressed by the Bus &Eacute;ireann trade unions about the difficulties the company faces.  However, the company is anxious to engage with them in negotiating a plan that will secure its viability.  As Minister, I support constructive dialogue between management and employees, as it is only through such dialogue that the company's difficulties can be resolved.  The State is ready to assist in facilitating the resolution of the industrial relations issues.  It has been so ever since Se&aacute;n Lemass established new industrial relations machinery in 1946.  We should not undo his measured work and later subsequent reforms.  Accordingly, we should avoid embroiling Ministers in resolving industrial relations issues that cut across the respective roles of the Workplace Relations Commission and the Labour Court.  While I understand the implied concerns expressed in the Labour Party's amendment, the Industrial Relations (Amendment) Act 2015 provides a robust legal framework for the drawing up of sectoral employment orders.  Sinn F&eacute;in's amendment is not acceptable, as it asks me to intervene in industrial relations negotiations and matters that are primarily the responsibility of the company.  As for the amendment tabled by People before Profit in the names of Deputy Mick Barry and others, I am endeavouring to increase public transport funding as resources permit.</p>  <p>  Bus &Eacute;ireann faces significant financial challenges.  The company comprises three distinct business areas - PSO services, school transport services and Expressway services.  Its PSO services are the Exchequer-subvented services operated under contract with the NTA.  There are approximately 230 routes within the Bus &Eacute;ireann PSO network which account for approximately 40% of Bus &Eacute;ireann's total passenger journeys in any given year.  Last year the company received a subvention of just over &euro;40 million, a 21% increase on the amount received in 2015.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.650" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1306" speakername="Joan Collins" time="21:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100048#VV00700"><p>That is changing all of the time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.651" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1213" speakername="Shane Ross" time="21:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100048#VV00800"><p>The company's school transport services are operated by it under an administrative agreement with the Minister of Education and Skills.  The company operates 23 intercity and inter-regional routes under the Expressway brand.  Passenger journeys on Expressway services account for approximately 10% of the company's total passenger journeys in a given year.  These routes are operated on a commercial basis, on the majority of which the company faces competition from other licensed operators.  Expressway is loss making and the losses are now threatening the viability of the company as a whole.  Expressway services do not attract a Exchequer subsidy and there would be serious legal difficulties with the provision of any Exchequer funding for what is a commercial service operating in a commercial market.</p>  <p>  The PSO network is at the heart of Bus &Eacute;ireann's public transport services and important to our society as a whole.  Last year approximately 200 million people travelled on a PSO-subvented bus or rail service.  In 2016 we spent &euro;236 million in total on the PSO programme.  This year we will spend approximately &euro;262 million, 11% more compared to the amount spent in 2016.  The system needs more money, despite the fact that we have spent approximately &euro;2.3 billion since 2008.  I am committed to socially necessary services and increasing the PSO subvention as resources allow.</p>  <p>  Since the reforms introduced by the then Minister, Noel Dempsey, the NTA has been the single regulatory and licensing authority of the public transport system.  Alongside the PSO network of public transport services, there are also commercial bus services.  They laboured for nearly 70 years under anti-competitive legislation dating back to 1932.  The basic premise of the Act was, as the Minister at the time said, "to divert traffic into the hands" of what were then the three big players in the transport industry.  It was this legislation that Noel Dempsey sought to reform.  He introduced for debate in the Oireachtas the Public Transport Regulation Bill 2009.  He recognised the need for change and, in his introductory remarks, stated: "This Bill places the bus passenger at the centre of a new transformed national bus licensing regime." Since the Oireachtas passed that Act, I am glad to say the passenger has been moved to the centre of policy on commercial bus licensing and gained through the provision of more services, better frequencies and competitive fares.  Passenger numbers have increased substantially.  In 2015 approximately 23 million passengers travelled on a commercial service, or 9.5% more than in the year before.</p>  <p>  Contrary to some of the commentary, there has not been market saturation or market deregulation as such.  The market is still regulated, just in a different way than previously.  This is not to say a commercial bus service operates in the same manner as a PSO service.  Of course, it does not.  The commercial operator is motivated by profit, as one would expect.</p><p>I recognise that we have had instances whereby commercial operators have reconfigured commercial services in the past with the result that certain towns and villages lost a public transport connection but let us not forget that under the legislation passed by the Oireachtas, the NTA has the necessary statutory powers to ensure continued public transport connectivity regardless of decisions taken by any individual operator.  The NTA has assured rural Ireland that it can, and will, step into any area, consult local communities and assess what public transport services are required.  The NTA will ensure rural communities will stay connected even if there are changes to Bus &Eacute;ireann Expressway services.  It could be little plainer than that.</p> <p> It is clear that the dispute at Bus &Eacute;ireann requires urgent discussions between management and trade unions without preconditions.  The State can and will assist through the Labour Court and Workplace Relations Commission, WRC.  Bus &Eacute;ireann is now developing a new plan which it hopes will restore the company to a sustainable future.  As to PSO bus services in rural Ireland, Bus &Eacute;ireann will continue to offer socially necessary services and, importantly, will focus on offering the taxpayer real value for money in return for Exchequer financial support.  Outside of that core challenge there is a strong legal framework and a key role for the NTA.  As regards the licensing of bus services, my Department will examine the NTA's proposals for improvement of the existing licensing regime in terms of processes and enforcement.  In addition, we will bring forward any necessary legislative enhancement that will further the interest of consumers and allow the orderly development of commercial bus services in the future.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.653" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="21:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100049#WW00200"><p>I thank the Minister.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.654" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1213" speakername="Shane Ross" time="21:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100049#WW00300"><p>Let me add just one more paragraph as I wish to respond to the Labour Party's amendment.  As to the Labour Party concerns about ensuring a level playing field for all operators and avoiding a race to the bottom, there is already a legal framework in the Industrial Relations (Amendment) Act 2015 to address the issue of sectoral employment orders under that Act.  I also urge that the Sinn F&eacute;in and People Before Profit amendments be rejected.  I, therefore, commend my proposed amendment to the House.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.655" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="21:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100049#WW00400"><p>I understand Deputy Imelda Munster is sharing with Deputies David Cullinane and Martin Kenny.  Is that agreed?  Agreed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.656" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1333" speakername="Imelda Munster" time="21:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100049#WW00500"><p>When will the Minister, the Government and the NTA take responsibility for the financial crisis affecting the Expressway service and admit it was caused by bad policy, poor decision-making and gross underfunding?  The first cause of the crisis is the oversaturation of routes.  Seat capacity on the Dublin to Cork route has grown by 128%.  Seat capacity on the Dublin to Limerick route has grown by 111%.  There are similar increases on the Dublin to Waterford route and other routes.  The Minister said recently that only five licences were issued in recent years but what he did not say is they equate to 104 services on top of all the others, after the damage had been done.</p>  <p>  The second cause is the Department of Social Protection's underfunding of the free travel pass.  Travel providers only receive funding from the Department for 41% of the average fare and journey.  That has contributed massively to the financial loss.  According to Bus &Eacute;ireann's annual accounts, it pumped &euro;41 million from the Expressway business into the PSO network because of State underfunding.  That &euro;41 million would have gone a long way towards reducing the &euro;5 million loss of the previous year, the &euro;6 million or &euro;9 million loss from last year - it was pumped up over the course of three weeks from &euro;6 million to &euro;9 million - and the predicted losses for this year.  When Expressway was making money, it was pumped into the PSO network to make up for the lack of State funding.  PSO funding has been slashed from &euro;49 million in 2009 to &euro;33 million this year.  That is a huge cut in funding for a public service in which we were supposed to invest and enhance.</p>  <p>  The public transport network in Ireland has the lowest subvention level in Europe.  The workers did not cause that.  The reason for this financial crisis is bad policy, poor decision-making and gross underfunding, yet recently, large severance packages were paid to the former CEO and top management.  One wonders whether that was a reward for the crisis.  Last week we questioned the new acting CEO who would not reveal his salary but confirmed the previous CEO was in receipt of a salary between &euro;180,000 and &euro;190,000.  Let us compare that with the earnings of the average bus driver with 20 years' service who is on a meagre income of &euro;624 per week.  Where is the punishment for top management for mismanagement and bad policy making?  The workers have been targeted.  Bus workers with 20 years' experience on &euro;624 are targeted but where is the punishment for those who created the crisis?</p>  <p>  The acting CEO of Bus &Eacute;ireann also confirmed that routes had been identified to be axed but he would not reveal them.  They are being kept secret.  One must ask why that is the case.  Is it in order that this crisis can be played out and manufactured as an industrial relations crisis?  Is it to target the workers, because target the workers is what the company did?  The Minister was repeatedly asked to agree to engage in negotiations with all the stakeholders and he refused.  Why was that the case?  Was it because the workers were always going to be the soft target?  That seems to have been the plan.  Why did the Minister refuse to engage in negotiations and choose to target the workers?  Was it because it covers up a multitude of mismanagement, bad policy and poor decision-making?  Was the reason for refusing to engage with stakeholders due to the attempt to deliberately run down the public transport network through underfunding?</p>  <p>  I stated the staff members were targeted but in fact they were given an ultimatum.  Workers who did not create this crisis were given an ultimatum that was demeaning, inflammatory and provocative.  It included a 30% cut in average pay.  Sunday premium rates were slashed from 100% to 20%.  The 100% reduction in shift payments means that workers will no longer be paid to work shifts.  All drivers will have their current contracts changed.  Privatisation will be introduced and the casualisation of work will commence.  The company will decide when and where it brings in casual drivers.  It can select from a pool of casual drivers with zero-hour contracts.  The company will decide when to bring in outside contractors and the decision will be at its sole discretion.  Bus &Eacute;ireann workers can be left to sit at home while the company brings in contract drivers on the minimum wage.  In the same breath, Bus &Eacute;ireann classes itself as a premium employer.  What we have seen transpire in recent weeks is a semi-State company being directed by the Government to instigate a race to the bottom for workers' rights and conditions.  That is shocking.</p>  <p>  The CEO and a Minister said the workers were being given a 2% increase.  Bus &Eacute;ireann management said out of the other side of its mouth that the 2% increase would be paid if the cashflow is available.  One must bear in mind that 30% of the average wage has been taken off workers who might never get the 2% increase.  They are the same workers who did not create the crisis.</p>  <p>  I asked the Minister to commit, in conjunction with the NTA, to carry out and publish a review of the loss-making routes on which private operators currently operate.</p><p>The review should include the number of private licences issued on these routes, when the licences were issued and when these routes ceased to make a profit due to saturation.  It should also provide for the NTA to assess the renewal of such licences that are making a loss.  I also asked the Minister to commit to publishing details of routes and services that have been identified for potential closure.  I asked the CEO of Bus &Eacute;ireann that question at last week's meeting of the Joint Committee on Transport, Tourism and Sport.  His response was that he did not want to identify the routes publicly because it would cause undue stress but the same acting CEO had no problem publicly telling workers that 2,600 workers could lose their jobs.  He was not too concerned about causing stress or anxiety to the workers and their families.</p> <p> Up until now, the Minister has adopted a hands-off approach.  It is as if he is sitting on the bus and not driving it.  In other words, it is as if does not have responsibility for his current portfolio.  I am asking him to demonstrate leadership, to agree to intervene in the crisis and to instruct the management of Bus &Eacute;ireann to engage with the stakeholders without any preconditions.  If he does not engage at this stage, he knows what is down the road.  It is very obvious that there will be chaos across the public transport network.  He has a responsibility, as Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, to try to resolve this matter.  I plead with him to take responsibility in his role as Minister and request that the management of Bus &Eacute;ireann engage with the unions - in the absence of the provocative ultimatum and preconditions - in order to find a resolution to this.  If he does not do so and if the chaos we all know is about to unfold happens, he will be directly responsible for that chaos because he did not intervene.  Under no circumstances will anybody absolve him of that responsibility.  He is the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport and has been called on repeatedly to intervene.  Now is the time to ask the management of Bus &Eacute;ireann to meet the unions without preconditions.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.658" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1258" speakername="David Cullinane" time="21:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100050#XX00200"><p>The Minister made an extraordinary remark to the effect that rural Ireland is a top priority for this Government.  It bowled me over and I am sure it will bowl over many people in rural Ireland.  It seems the Minister has gone full circle back to his roots as a cheerleader for Fine Gael and its failed policies.  With all seriousness, the Minister cannot come into this House and say that this Government and the previous Government have treated rural Ireland as a top priority.  We have seen the closure of rural Garda stations, including one in the Minister's constituency.  We have seen health services stripped from rural areas, post offices and rural schools closed, small and medium-sized businesses not given the support they need and many towns and villages dying because of the lack of a joined-up policy and adequate resources.  The fact is that rural Ireland is far from a top priority for the Government.</p>  <p>  Bus &Eacute;ireann is an essential part of our public transport network.  It provides a good quality service to a huge number of towns and villages that would otherwise be isolated.  The private model that the Minister and the Government really want will not work in the interests of rural communities.  I am not against private operators but, first and foremost, I am for public services and a public transport system.  The outcome of the Minister's policy will be a less efficient and less reliable service.  It will mean reduced wages and conditions for employees, an increase in fares and no pension arrangements for workers.  I do not think Fine Gael cares about these issues and, quite frankly, I do not think the Minister cares about them either.  It is all about competition.  It does not matter whether it is cheap labour and people get less once the private operators make a profit.  </p>  <p>  A total of 100% of bus routes in Waterford city were privatised.  The Minister of State with responsibility for training and skills, Deputy John Halligan, stood on a picket line with workers and said that he would not be part of such a privatisation agenda.  He has gone very mute on this issue in recent times.  He jumped up and down and was very vocal when he was in opposition, as was the Minister.  Now that the Minister is in government, he is the driver of policy but a passenger in respect of this issue.  He is allowing himself to be a passenger because he does not want to take any responsibility.  I plead with him to do his job.  In many people's eyes, he is not doing his job.  It is a cop-out to say that he cannot intervene.  He can intervene and do his job but, just like those in Fine Gael, he is refusing to do so for ideological reasons.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.659" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1345" speakername="Martin Kenny" time="21:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100050#XX00300"><p>There is a statement on the Bus &Eacute;ireann website about the company's proud tradition of public service dating back to the foundation of the State.  For 90 years, the national bus network has been an essential and integral part of Ireland's transport infrastructure.  Public transport is a public service and, despite the Government&rsquo;s obsession with the market, it does not have to be making a profit to be successful.  A successful public transport service is one which provides an adequate transport service to citizens and if that involves subsidy, so be it.  There is no denying that Bus &Eacute;ireann is in trouble but it is no wonder when it seems to be run in such a way as to ensure it will not break even never mind make a profit.  The reality is that people in rural Ireland have no bus services.  I was recently contacted by a person who was called to attend a JobPath meeting.  The person lives in rural Ireland and when they said that they did not have a car to get to the meeting, they were told to take the bus.  This person would have to walk nine miles to get a bus, which only runs twice a week, to get to Carrick-on-Shannon.  There is no public bus service in many areas in rural Ireland.  The Expressway service has been taken away from many students who travel from rural areas to different universities.  This is now in line to be slashed.  There is all this talk about investing in rural Ireland and in people.  However, people's lived experience is that it is being pulled away from them time and again.  This effort by the Government to cut the Expressway service is another example of this.</p>  <p>  The Minister needs to get on board the bus.  He needs to take up the challenge and do a really good job of ensuring that Bus &Eacute;ireann delivers what is outlined on its website.  That is the Minister's responsibility and he needs to take it seriously and recognise that the ordinary people of Ireland need to have a proper service and that it is his job to ensure they get it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.660" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1301" speakername="Brendan  Ryan" time="21:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100050#XX00400"><p>Amendment No. 1 reads:</p><blockquote>To insert the following after &quot;Bus &Eacute;ireann and private operators&quot;:&quot;- ensure a level playing field for all operators, avoid a race to the bottom and safeguard the interests of workers by committing to a sectoral employment order setting out minimum pay rates, as well as pension and sick pay schemes for employees across the sector.&quot;</blockquote><p>I thank Fianna F&aacute;il for bringing the motion before the House.  If the party that cut the minimum wage is now to be a champion of worker&rsquo;s rights, I call on it to support our amendment to its Private Members' motion on Bus &Eacute;ireann.  We certainly support the thrust of the motion.  Our amendment is designed to ensure a level playing field for all operators, avoid a race to the bottom and safeguard the interests of workers by committing to a sectoral employment order setting out minimum pay rates, as well as pension and sick pay schemes for employees across the sector.  We believe we need a sectoral employment order in this area.</p><p>Under the Industrial Relations (Amendment) Act 2015 introduced by the previous Government, the Labour Court can investigate the conditions of employment in an industry and set basic, legally-enforced conditions of employment.  The Minister acknowledged that in his contribution, but will he support a move to achieve it in the sector?  It needs to apply to the bus market right now.  The future of Bus &Eacute;ireann is of great concern and importance and I implore the Minister to listen and take heed of what is coming through in this debate from our side of the House.  Our concern is that this crisis is being used to slash the terms and conditions of front-line staff in Bus &Eacute;ireann.  There must be no race to the bottom in this or any other industry.  We worked hard in government to implement laws to provide workers' representatives with mechanisms to protect against such threats.  These mechanisms are here and the Minister must push for them to be used.  What sectoral employment orders in this industry would ensure is that workers are not impoverished on the altar of efficiencies.</p><p>We all know the company is in a difficult financial situation.  The market place is highly competitive and margins are very thin.  These are real concerns and real challenges which need to be tackled.  We need strong leadership from management, workers' representatives and the Minister like never before.  I know the workers and staff want to be part of solving these problems.  We know there are difficulties in Bus &Eacute;ireann and these need to be addressed as a matter of urgency.  In the competitive environment Bus &Eacute;ireann must be able to respond to competitive pressures also.  The motion recognises that it is in a serious financial state with the big losses in 2016 that are expected to increase in 2017 should no changes be made.</p><p> We know the bus drivers and front-line staff in Bus &Eacute;ireann are willing to discuss proposals to ensure the company remains viable and is in a position to maintain and indeed grow its service into the future.  The Grant Thornton report provides for a number of options, including the nuclear option of Bus &Eacute;ireann ending its Expressway service altogether.  Nobody in this House, including members of the Government, wants that to happen.  Expressway is a very good service which delivers a public need with certainty, but it is operating with one hand tied behind its back.  The National Transport Authority must be tasked with urgently reviewing the Expressway routes, reporting on the level of public service obligation funding associated with those routes and providing subvention accordingly.  The lack of sectoral agreements within the industry tilts the playing field towards private operators paying lower wage rates.  The net result, as we have seen, is customers voting with their feet and moving to private contractors, rail services or their cars.  All methods of solving this issue need to be on the table.</p> <p> We must examine the role subvention can play in addressing the challenges for Bus &Eacute;ireann.  Our levels of subvention are well below European norms and that must be addressed as the economy continues to improve.  I acknowledge there has been some improvement in that regard this year.  At the moment, only 41% of the price of the fare for customers entitled to free travel is paid for by the Department of Social Protection.  If there is room for this payment to be increased, that might form part of a solution.  It will not, however, be the full solution.  In the course of getting to grips with the transport brief in recent months, I have spoken with many transport experts, some academics and interested individuals.  Almost to a man or woman, they have referred to the vital importance of a local and national bus network.  We have a Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport, which is answerable to the Minister, setting policy and allocating funding, alongside the NTA, which is responsible for awarding licences and setting bus routes.</p> <p> If the Minister supports the retention of a bus network which serves the entire country, he must engage with both the Department and the NTA to ensure the future of that network is not set back decades as a consequence of the approach that is being taken in this instance.  A failure to reach a solution in the coming weeks could have a ripple effect across our entire transport sector.  I cannot overstate the potential negative impact if this process continues down its current track of megaphone diplomacy.  The leaking of the management's plans to the press was a cack-handed move that has led to further mistrust among workers and their representatives.  The draconian measures that were leaked seem designed to scare and infuriate the workers.  Such drastic measures will never be agreeable to trade unions that achieved so much over such a long time.  Will the Minister instruct the NTA to set up a consultative group, as provided for in the Dublin Transport Authority Act 2008, and place it on a standing basis?  The group should include all relevant stakeholders, including representatives of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions.  Such an arrangement is provided for in the 2008 Act but has not yet been deployed.</p> <p> Unfortunately, the Government seems happy to allow the seeds of discontent to be sown among workers throughout the country, in many sectors and in many industries.  At best, it approach could be considered poor judgment; at worst, it seems deliberately antagonistic.  When my party was in government, in far more difficult financial times than this Government faces, we ensured as best we could that negotiations with trade unions were ongoing.  There was always a presence in government which instinctively looked out for the worker.  That is no longer the case.  In the nine months since this Government was formed, we have seen industrial action, work stoppages and discontent more usually associated with deep recession than economic recovery.  It is difficult not to conclude that the hands-off approach we are seeing to this crisis is deliberately antagonistic.  The Minister must take hold of the crisis now.  He is the only person with the authority to get all the stakeholders around the table, build up trust among them and work towards a solution.  He has an opportunity, too, by way of our amendment, to lay down a marker for the bus industry and set it up to be a level playing field.  A sectoral agreement to set minimum standards of pay and conditions in the industry would be a progressive step forward.  It would help to build trust and to find a solution to the current difficulties.  The fears of workers that wages and conditions will deteriorate and jobs will be shed must be allayed.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.662" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1341" speakername="Michael Fitzmaurice" time="21:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100051#YY00200"><p>I commend the Fianna F&aacute;il motion before the House.  It was alarming to discover in recent days that the different proposals that are being put forward by the board of Bus &Eacute;ireann are only now coming to light.  Nothing has been handled well in this matter.  The Minister says rural areas are a priority.  If that is so, surely he will ensure no bus routes are cut in those rural areas?  If the Government could make a statement to that effect, it would allay people's fears.</p>  <p>  Putting myself in the shoes of a private bus operator, I would not choose a route that was likely to see me losing money.  Bus &Eacute;ireann, on the other hand, is obliged to do the good, the bad and the in between.  Private operators, meanwhile, will not even buy a bus unless they are sure of making money.  That is the problem we are seeing across the country.  In recent years, the National Transport Authority seems to have adopted a stance whereby it envisages privatising the entire bus service.  As other speakers noted, in parts of rural Ireland there is absolutely no bus service.  When it comes to the school transport service, we are fighting day in and day out to ensure people can access the service.  Children are being told that even though their brother or sister went to a particular school, they cannot access transport to that school because of the new rules.</p>  <p>  It was alarming to hear Bus &Eacute;ireann's acting CEO, Mr. Ray Hernan, speaking about insurance and the need for an efficient service.  If changes are required, including in legislation, we need to make them.  Everybody supports an efficiently run bus service but we cannot drop the hatchet on it.  Since 2009, the public service obligation funding to the bus companies has reduced, even though some one third of citizens are now covered under the free travel scheme.  No company can sustain that type of pressure.  The Minister for Social Protection should be here today to deal with this aspect of the problem.  The bus is pulling out of town and if the Government does not get on it, Ministers will be hiring another bus in the coming months for the purpose of canvassing around the country.  That is what will happen if bus services are cut.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.663" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="21:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100051#YY00300"><p>Deputy Mick Barry is sharing time with Deputy Br&iacute;d Smith.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.664" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1281" speakername="Mick Barry" time="21:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100051#YY00400"><p>On three occasions since January 2015, Bus &Eacute;ireann brought forward plans to the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport which sought to address the issue of losses within the company, specifically within its Expressway operations.  On each occasion, the Department delayed taking action.  It is hardly a coincidence that the Department delayed action in 2015, in the run-up to the general election.  Crisis measures at Bus &Eacute;ireann would not have chimed well with the Fine Gael election mantra that we needed to keep the recovery going.  Dither and delay were the name of the game, and that game was played for the short-term party political benefit of Fine Gael.</p><p>Anybody who ever read the Minister's columns in the <i>Sunday Independent</i>will know he is an anti-union Minister.  Meanwhile, Mr. Ray Hernan, the new boss at Bus &Eacute;ireann, cut his corporate teeth at Ryanair, a company with a pronounced anti-union management ethos.  On 11 January, in a letter to workers, Mr. Hernan said the threat of insolvency within 18 months was very real.  On 25 January, he told an Oireachtas committee the company could be insolvent by the end of the year if losses continue.  Clearly, Mr. Hernan is putting the issue of the shutdown of Bus &Eacute;ireann on the agenda.  This is a company that employs 2,600 workers.  Leaving aside the cost of redundancy and social welfare payments for those workers and their families, the fact is they pay more than &euro;50 million per year to the State in payroll taxes.  Is the Minister for Finance prepared to forgo more than &euro;50 million in annual tax revenues in order to allow the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport to refuse to intervene to save a public service that might cost the Exchequer &euro;9 million in losses this year?  These are the economics of the madhouse.  They are Thatcherite policies and they make no sense whatsoever.</p><p>At the Oireachtas committee I gave the example of a friend of mine, John, who has been a bus driver with Bus &Eacute;ireann for many years.  I reported as to how John faces a cut of &euro;136 per week from allowances he currently receives for driving on Sundays, performing overtime during the course of the week and driving a bus long distances out into the county of Cork.  That man is facing a total of more than &euro;6,500 per annum in cuts.</p> <p> Bus &Eacute;ireann workers and their unions have made it abundantly clear that they will take strike action rather than sit idly by and watch Mr. Hernan cut their pay by thousands of euro per annum.  If I were an Iarnr&oacute;d &Eacute;ireann worker or a Dublin Bus worker, I would not be prepared to stand idly by either and allow the Bus &Eacute;ireann workers to be beaten up on knowing that my direct colleagues and I could very well be next.  A national transport strike is implicit in the current situation given the level of provocation taking place.</p> <p> Every trade union and every worker in the land has a vested interest in ensuring a precedent for massive wage cuts is not set in this example.  An injury to one is an injury to all and that is as true today as it was in the days of James Connolly and Big Jim Larkin.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.666" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1367" speakername="Br&iacute;d Smith" time="21:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100052#ZZ00200"><p>It is not that long ago that the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Shane Ross, knocked on my mother's door, as he does at every election, looking for the vote.  He should be warned that he is knocking on the door of a bus worker's family, and I think he will be run out of it in future, given his role as the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport.</p><p>In the not-so-far-off past the Minister railed against the establishment of quangos and those who avoid their ministerial responsibility.  Ironically, he is now using a quango, the National Transport Authority, NTA, to avoid his own responsibility.  He claims repeatedly that this is an industrial relations issue and not anything to do with him.</p><p>I argue this is a manufactured crisis in Bus &Eacute;ireann.  It was manufactured by successive Governments, which cut subvention from 2009 until last year and last year's increase does not wipe away the consequences of the systemic underfunding over the years and decades prior to that.  The crisis is manufactured also by the ideology of the National Transport Authority and its insistence on the free market dogma of competition and issuing licences to private operators on a vast scale.  Not only has it effectively flooded the capacity on key intercity routes, it continues to harbour plans for lunatic tendering competitions for all the public service obligation routes.</p><p>We should be clear that the crisis in Bus &Eacute;ireann has nothing to do with improving public transport or getting people out of their cars.  The opposite is the case.  It is ideology masquerading as economics and market competition to facilitate private operators who make vast profits and who are driving down the rates of pay and conditions of its workers, as well as driving down the right of all workers to expect decent conditions.</p><p>Farcically, as the National Transport Authority and the Government takes money from the State, the Government is taking money from Dublin Bus; it took &euro;2 million from it last year.</p><p>I wish to spend the final two minutes commenting on the Fianna F&aacute;il motion.  In typical fashion, Fianna F&aacute;il gives the appearance of saying one thing when it is actually saying another.  It is using all the usual flurry of sympathy but signifying nothing.  It is offering tea and sympathy to Bus &Eacute;ireann workers but notes strongly that the European Union rules of subvention may inhibit dealing with the actual cause of the problem.  I note how readily the soldiers of destiny will ignore European Union subvention rules if they impinge, for example, on the taxes of the multinational corporations and their affairs but how obedient they can be to Europe when the issues of workers' rights and public services are affected.  They are silent on the impact and the role of the National Transport Authority, but that is hardly surprising.  After all, it was they who invented the agency and gave it its remit, including one to do by stealth what they could not do openly, that is, achieve the effective privatisation of our public transport services.</p><p>I commend the workers in Bus &Eacute;ireann for the stance they have taken so far.  I reject the spin that this is a basket case of a company on the verge of collapse.  It is a company that has been undermined deliberately by Government and, considering that Bus &Eacute;ireann has seen a 10% growth in passenger revenues since 2010 and a 7% growth in passenger numbers since 2011, the workers are right to reject this so-called plan that will absolutely undermine their conditions.  I encourage them to remain strong and not to entertain the manufactured crisis of this Government and the NTA, behind which is the Minister's hand and the wider apparatus of the State.</p><p>I encourage other transport workers, especially those in Dublin Bus and in Irish Rail, to support their fellow Bus &Eacute;ireann<b></b>workers in this fight because what befalls them today could be visited on all workers in the transport industry tomorrow.  If this D&aacute;il motion and our amendment will not reverse the Minister's policy and that of the NTA, I believe action by workers and solidarity from all workers and trade unionists could reverse his policies and force him to cough up and speak up on their behalf.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.667" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="21:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100052#ZZ00300"><p>I understand Deputy Joan Collins is sharing time with Deputies Thomas Pringle and Thomas P. Broughan.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.668" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1306" speakername="Joan Collins" time="21:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100052#ZZ00400"><p>Yes.  I welcome the motion and I am glad to have the opportunity to speak about the situation in Bus &Eacute;ireann this evening but I want to state clearly that despite what the Minister has been putting out, this is not an industrial relations dispute.  The unions have made a wage claim.  Bus &Eacute;ireann has pulled out of the Workplace Relations Commission process and it is a matter of choice as to whether one goes into discussions on a pay claim.  In the meantime, it has written three letters to its employees stating how it will cut their wages by 25%.  That is the current position.  We are not in a situation where there is an industrial relations dispute.  We are in a situation where the company has issued letters to its employees and has not engaged at all with the unions representing those workers.</p>  <p>  In 2009, Bus &Eacute;ireann had a public subvention of &euro;44.9 million.  Today, it is &euro;33.7 million.  The company is trying to provide the same service with 25% less funding.  We know the Department of Social Protection funding has remained frozen since 2009 even though the level of service has increased.  Meanwhile, the Government and its predecessors have paved the way for private operators to come into the market and cherry-pick the most profitable routes serving only large towns and motorways, going directly from point to point and maximising profits.</p>  <p>  Bus &Eacute;ireann, by contrast, has sought to provide for those who need connectivity in more isolated areas.  That is particularly the case with users of the free travel pass who are often elderly and amount to as many as one third of Bus &Eacute;ireann customers.  Those citizens will be left on the side of the road by private operators but the Government has penalised Bus &Eacute;ireann for providing that essential service.  Due to insufficient public funding, the company is actually losing money from every extra passenger it takes.</p>  <p>  To deal with the crisis the company brought in a new management team under a shroud of secrecy.  No one knows how much the previous CEOs or managers got when they were let go.  We have Ray Hernan, who is notorious on foot of the anti-union positions he took in Ryanair.  Brendan McCarthy, who was in IBEC, went in to do a hatchet job in Irish Ferries when it was being pulled apart at the time.  Their solution is to replicate the low-wage private operators, cut terms and conditions for Bus &Eacute;ireann workers and allow for a race to the bottom.</p>  <p>  If the Government is not intent on turning rural transport in Ireland wholesale over to the market and if it wants rural transport to be publicly and properly funded and provided for those who need it, it must take determined action now to secure the future of Dublin Bus.  The Minister and the Government must do that as otherwise, they are leaving Bus &Eacute;ireann and public transport in rural areas in the lap of the markets, which will not work.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.669" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1366" speakername="Thomas Pringle" time="21:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100052#ZZ00500"><p>I welcome the opportunity to contribute to this important and timely debate on the motion.  In terms of the operations carried out by Bus &Eacute;ireann and the public service obligation, the latter cannot be removed from the Expressway service in such a clean manner because it provides a huge public service to many citizens.</p><p>This must be taken into account when considering the cost of the service.</p> <p> A total of 30% of Expressway passengers have the free travel pass.  As stated by Deputy Brendan Ryan, the Department of Social Protection pays only 41% of the cost of a ticket for a passenger using free transport.  Bus &Eacute;ireann has a disproportionate number of free travel pass passengers on its Expressway service as against private operators because it operates with a large social responsibility and part of its service is social.  It provides services to provincial towns and villages which private operators will simply will not provide.  Because private operators go from point to point such as from Galway to Dublin along the motorway network, they have a disproportionately high number of paying passengers who pay to travel from Dublin to Galway, without any thought being given to the service element required to be met by Bus &Eacute;ireann.  This is missing from the argument and the Government is deliberately abdicating its responsibility.  The NTA refuses to recognise this because, as has been said, it is driven by a market-led competition mantra and grants licences to compete with Bus &Eacute;ireann services which affect the future viability of Bus &Eacute;ireann.  We have to properly subsidise and support Bus &Eacute;ireann and recognise once and for all the social aspect of the business it operates as being viable and desirable.</p> <p> How much has the Expressway business subsidised other Bus &Eacute;ireann business as PSO funding has been reduced over many years?  Does this happen in Bus &Eacute;ireann's accounts?  How much money has been transferred from Bus &Eacute;ireann to support and cross-subsidise Irish Rail services over the years?  What impact has this had on its business?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.671" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1361" speakername="Tommy Broughan" time="21:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100053#AAA00200"><p>As President Trump might say, it is so ironic that the motion has been tabled by Fianna F&aacute;il, given that it played a huge role in the race to the bottom in public transport, beginning with the Public Transport Regulation Act 2009 which the Minister will remember.  A number of us argued about the dangers we see today in an incredible and vicious assault on the drivers and other staff of Bus &Eacute;ireann through cuts of more than 30%.  Bus &Eacute;ireann has pumped a lot of its money, &euro;41 million, into the commercial operation because of the fact that PSO funding has been slashed by 60% since 2009.  The Fine Gael-Fianna F&aacute;il Government was totally responsible for this.  It slashed PSO funding and refused to fund public transport.  If we look across Europe, as the Minister knows, there are many brilliant public transport systems, from Spain to the Netherlands and across to eastern Europe, where up to 90% of the costs are subsidised by the state.</p>  <p>  The 2,500 workers have been subject to a pay freeze since 2009, while there have been two cost reduction programmes.  The details of the assault given to us by SIPTU and the NBRU are astonishing and it is also astonishing that the House should countenance it.  There has been a 100% loss of Sunday premium payments and public transport services must be run every day.  The rota and shift premium has been eliminated to reflect so-called race to the bottom competition.  Overtime rates have been reduced by up to 40% or 50%.  There has been a 10% cut in basic allowances and a change to monthly payments.  We have seen examples where people wanted to go back to receiving weekly and fortnightly payments to manage low-income households.  Sick pay benefits have been slashed by up to 30%.  This represents a devastating attack on the workforce of this important national company and important national service.</p>  <p>  It may have been told earlier, but I will tell the story of one driver.  He is 53 years old and has worked for Bus &Eacute;ireann for the past nine years.  He works a seven week roster, working five days each week.  He works four Sundays out of seven.  His gross annual earnings are &euro;46,419, almost one quarter of the Minister's wages.  He is married with one child and has a mortgage, a credit union loan and outstanding debts since the recession.  Drivers have not received a pay rise since 2008, but half of the coaches they drive have increased passenger capacity, from 53 to 78 seats.  The drivers also took a pay cut in 2014 for 19 months to help Bus &Eacute;ireann to recoup some losses.  In the case of the particular driver in question, the impending cuts will equate to a loss of &euro;160 per week or &euro;8,300 per year.</p>  <p>  I have told the Minister that I want him to stop standing like a sphinx and get out and get involved in dealing with the issue.  This is the national public transport system and all of our constituencies require this vital national service to be maintained.  As the NTA stated, no town or village should be forgotten.  That is the Minister's responsibility.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.672" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1263" speakername="Michael Collins" time="21:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100053#AAA00300"><p>I support the motion.  Bus &Eacute;ireann provides essential services throughout the country and it is important that its future be secured.  Proposals to cut the Bus &Eacute;ireann Expressway service would have a huge impact on the people of Ireland, in particular those living in rural Ireland.  Bus &Eacute;ireann plays an important role by providing rural communities with regular access to towns and cities.  It is very much part of rural Ireland and provides connectivity.  The loss of vital transport links to Dublin would leave many rural communities even more isolated.  Any attempt to leave communities without any transport link to the capital must be resisted.  Economic development and growth in rural regions are largely dependent on being connected through good public transport links.  If the Expressway service to Dublin or other cities is cut, the economic gap between rural and urban Ireland will increase.</p>  <p>  Although the Expressway service is fully commercial, it is still run by a semi-State body which is funded by the taxpayer.  It has a public responsibility to serve all communities throughout the country.  It must not abandon this responsibility.  No other company provides direct links to neighbouring towns and cities.  If it cannot stand alone as an independent commercial service, the Government needs to look at making the routes PSO routes.  Furthermore, the winding down of Expressway services could lead to the direct loss of more than 500 jobs and the indirect loss of many more, as many firms throughout the country depend on business from Bus &Eacute;ireann.</p>  <p>  Bus &Eacute;ireann needs increased funding from the State to ensure an adequate subvention is provided.  Bus &Eacute;ireann ticket prices for regional services are unaffordable.  An example is the cost of a single adult ticket from Castletownbere in west Cork to Cork city which at &euro;24.50 is totally unaffordable.  It means that people are forced to use private cars rather than the public service.  A reduction in price through an increased Government subvention would undoubtedly lead to an increase in usage and, in the long term, an increase in profits.  Having a properly functioning public transport system is a key issue nationally when it comes to promoting balanced regional economic development, preventing social isolation and protecting the environment.  We need to protect existing routes and increase investment without delay.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.673" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1275" speakername="Michael Harty" time="21:50:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100053#AAA00400"><p>The position in Bus &Eacute;ireann is very worrying.  The recent presentation made by the acting CEO of Bus &Eacute;ireann, Mr. Ray Hernan, to the Oireachtas transport committee was frightening when he forecast that losses for 2016 would be up to &euro;9 million.  His assertion that the company could be insolvent by the end of the year without drastic cost reductions was very concerning for the travelling public and employees of Bus &Eacute;ireann.  As reported in <i>The Irish Times</i>this morning, Bus &Eacute;ireann has been in contact with the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport for two years regarding the deteriorating financial position and mounting losses of the company which continue to erode its net assets and threaten its survival across all services.  It is clear that jobs, routes and services are on the line.  In situations such as this rural areas come off worst as the densely populated areas close to the centres of power retain most services.  It is totally unclear which routes are threatened most, but I argue that the final decision must take into account the social, not just economic, implications.  Every service people living in rural Ireland value and need must be fought for tooth and nail and bus services are no exception.  Public service obligation funding which subsidises Bus &Eacute;ireann on unprofitable routes is a lifeline for pensioners, students and workers who do not have cars and live in isolated areas.</p><p>I am opposed to axing the long-distance Expressway service but I recognise the need to provide the most efficient operation possible and the need to be reassured that management and work practice issues within the service, which may contribute to high losses, are reduced or eliminated.</p> <p> There is much to recommend in this motion and the general thrust is fairly outlined in the current position.  However the proposal not to change or to remove the Expressway services is unduly restrictive and calling on the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Shane Ross, to act urgently to prevent the possibility of a national industrial action is unwise.  Intervention by the Minister in these circumstances should be an act of last resort, not of first resort.  I have no doubt that a Fianna F&aacute;il transport Minister, faced with a call to intervene in an industrial dispute like this, would not do so.  However, the Government's vision for bus transport in this country is unclear.  The Government is not a disinterested party and the Minister needs to set out his stall and his overall vision for bus and other transport services.  At the same time it would be unwise to tie the Minister's hands by involving him directly in the current impasse between management and the bus unions.</p> <p> Undoubtedly, the private sector has made inroads into old Bus &Eacute;ireann monopolies, in many cases providing popular high-quality, long-distance end-to-end services at affordable prices.  It may be that the private sector is in a position to take over some routes from the semi-State company and there is nothing wrong with a mix of State, private and community services.  In County Clare, the community-organised Clare Bus provides an outstanding community bus service in areas of Clare where there would be no transport at all.  This provides a very cost-effective, essential, client-orientated bus service which caters for all travellers' needs, including those with disabilities.  The Minister needs to clear the fog, assess what we have, determine what our bus transport policy should be and act accordingly in a social and cost-effective manner.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.675" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1347" speakername="Mattie McGrath" time="22:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100054#BBB00200"><p>The Minister met the NTA a couple of weeks ago to better inform himself about the powers it had and he says he was reassured in this regard.  He said they would not be found wanting if routes and services are changed.  He said, "The NTA stands ready to assist rural Ireland".  That is fighting talk.  There are many agencies such as the NTA, the TII and the HSE, which have abandoned rural Ireland and this is one of the last of them.  I wish the Minister well in his big portfolio but I plead to him to sort out the sorry mess in Bus &Eacute;ireann.  Many students and old people have no other way of travelling anywhere.  Students have to travel to and from college and there is a public service obligation for pensioners.  I travelled by train today and was impressed by the way an elderly lady was treated, with a ramp provided as she got on and one waiting for her when she arrived in Dublin.</p>  <p>  For a long time Bus &Eacute;ireann has not stepped up to the mark and I blame management for this.  It has allowed the company to drift, wander and meander.  We have all seen the lovely advertisement pictures of the red setter dog prancing along.  We will be left with the dog and no buses.  We will have no jobs either.  People here criticised the new management, saying they came from the same stable as Michael O'Leary, but that might not be a bad thing because we need to badly shake up the management.  Bus drivers have told me they are leaving Clonmel and other areas a half an hour after the private bus.  They are being blindfolded and their hands are tied behind their backs, while the private bus is full.  I do not know what Deputy Troy is muttering but I did not interrupt him.  Fianna F&aacute;il was in power but they did not give much help to Bus &Eacute;ireann either.  There are too many quangos and too many fat cats getting fatter and richer.  Some of the management left fairly fast with good packages.  I salute Ring a Link, of which I was a founder member.  It is a three-county project for rural transport and without such things rural Ireland would be forgotten about.</p>  <p>  I do not see many Fine Gael Ministers supporting the Minister tonight, though I welcome the Minister of State at the Department of Health, Deputy Catherine Byrne.  We need to see that there is still life in the dog and that he is not a dead dog.  We need to see him again but with the bus, rather than a rotting service which is being denied to the people of rural Ireland.  We need the workers to be treated fairly and they need to make changes too, which they are willing to do.  We need careful implementation and careful assessment and if the NTA stands willing, its time has come.  Let it stand up and be counted and see what it can do for rural Ireland, instead of taking everything away.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.676" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1348" speakername="S&eacute;amus Healy" time="22:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100054#BBB00300"><p>I am sharing my time with Deputy Eamon Ryan.  It is entirely proper that the Minister's constituents and the people of Dublin have good quality public transport such as the DART, Luas and bus services, both in Dublin and from Dublin to all the major towns and cities throughout the country.  The towns in my constituency such as Ballina, Nenagh, Roscrea, Templemore, Tipperary town, Carrick-on-Suir, Cashel and Clonmel have substantially fewer transport rights and substandard bus and rail service.  We have lost our bus routes in Carrick-on-Suir and the Minister and Iarnr&oacute;d &Eacute;ireann want to close our rail lines through Ballybrophy, as well as the Limerick-Waterford line, where trains are cancelled almost on a daily basis and which is earmarked for closure by the Government.  My constituents are entitled to the same adequate, good-quality transport service as are the people of Dublin.  Far from cuts and the closure of routes, we need more services.  The Minister should enact legislation to ensure more good quality transport services for all.  The public, the elderly and social welfare recipients, wherever they are in the country, are entitled to a good quality public transport service at reasonable rates.  Public transport services should not be subject to market forces as they are public services.</p>  <p>  The current difficulties are as a result of Government policy going back at least as far as 2009, which has been continued under the Minister and the current Government.  The subvention has been reduced from &euro;44 million in 2009 to &euro;33 million currently and the difficulty is anything but an industrial relations dispute.  It is a policy issue that has been driven by the Minister and the Government.  The difficult financial state of affairs of the company is largely as a result of the reduction in the subsidy and the free travel scheme, which is inadequately subvented by the Government.</p>  <p>  The attack on Bus &Eacute;ireann workers is a deliberate and vicious assault, not only on their pay but on their conditions.  A 30% reduction in pay is absolutely unacceptable and must and will be opposed trenchantly by the workers.  It is more than an attack on the workers at Bus &Eacute;ireann, however.  It is attack on all workers, whether they be in the public or the private sector, and it is the thin end of the wedge for privatisation.  The company must and will be defeated and strike action, including a sympathetic strike, is the right and only response to this vicious attack on workers by the company.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.677" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1294" speakername="Eamon Ryan" time="22:00:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100054#BBB00400"><p>I am pleased to follow Deputy Seamus Healy because he represents Clonmel which, in public transport terms, is a hugely historic and important town.  Bianconi had the laborious job of carrying picture frames around rural Ireland to sell and he saw rich people flying by in their coaches and resoled to set up one that would carry everyone.  He did that and his first route was from Clonmel to Limerick.</p><p>It stopped in Carrigavantry and the Glen of Aherlow, which was the first stop, and then every 20 miles.  He ended up with a system which was the Ryanair of its day, except it had a bit more class in terms of how everyone was catered for.  The service went as far as Belmullet and was then all over the country.  It was an integrated public transport system.  We should be looking what Bianconi did and we should create a new network.</p> <p> We have a real crisis at present in Bus &Eacute;ireann but the solution cannot just be sticking to the existing system.  We need to put more money into public transport, but we should use the opportunity to change the entire system and create a new and much more extensive network.  We must be ambitious and think like Bianconi in terms of what we could do, particularly for rural Ireland which is disadvantaged because it does not have any real functioning public transport system compared to what we might want if we had a Bianconi vision for this world.</p> <p> As I understand it, the real problem in Bus &Eacute;ireann at the present time concerns the competition between private operators that are allowed to run from city to city on motorways and Bus &Eacute;ireann's competing service which is much slower because stops must be made in a number of towns along the way.  The answer in creating this new network is to turn that into an advantage by ensuring that there is an integrated mesh network.  This would mean that the alternative bus that is stopping off at towns en route would be able to pick up passengers all along the way and would, thus, become profitable because it would have that source of custom to which a point-to-point city bus does not have access.  The way to achieve that is to examine some of the other State services and systems and connect them together to pull other passengers in.</p> <p> One obvious example  which has been tested in other countries and which works would be to see if we can use An Post and Bus &Eacute;ireann together.  For example, postal vans which deliver parcels to rural Ireland could become dual-function vehicles and could be used to carry passengers also.  We would then begin to have an interconnected system which would be flexible.  An Post needs a big investment to make that happen, but it is on the point of real change.  Their mail business is going, so they have to develop a parcel delivery system and other systems.</p> <p> Why not think big and ambitiously in this national planning framework we are about to put in place?  Rather than considering this as a crisis and asking how we can keep the current system going, we should think differently and consider connecting all those towns to which I refer.  It could involve other services.  We are spending &euro;50,000 a day on taxis for the health service.  Could we get them to be part of this integrated network system?  Some school buses are still only used for school hours and are empty in the middle of the day.</p> <p> We should also connect with the private sector so that when the Bus &Eacute;ireann bus arrives in a town, if there is a private operator going in the opposite direction from that town, there should be an integrated ticketing system.  We should have the same system as at bus stops in Dublin whereby people can see real-time information on when the next bus is coming.  People will then know they can make a connection.  We must create a meshed rural public transport system that works.  That needs investment and it may mean that we will not spend so much money on roads.  We will instead start spending on public transport that will use those roads first and foremost.</p> <p> Let us be like Bianconi and think big.  Let us have a service from Clonmel to Belmullet stopping at all points in between and starting at the centre of the world, Carrigavantry, where my family had one of the first stage posts - they later turned it into a pub - that took in Bianconi's horses .  I am very proud of this.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.679" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="22:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100055#CCC00200"><p>Deputy Dara Calleary is sharing time with Deputies Jackie Cahill, Mary Butler, Anne Rabbitte and Niall Collins.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.680" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1335" speakername="Dara Calleary" time="22:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100055#CCC00300"><p>I absolutely endorse everything that Deputy Eamon Ryan has just said.  That is the perfect system in terms of using all the assets of the State in a co-ordinated manner.  I fear, however, that our current system of government will prevent that from happening because the Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment will probably object to the Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport.  Ultimately, Deputy Eamon Ryan's vision could be achieved without additional major expense if we had a proactive National Transport Authority that thought outside the box.  However, if a person has to travel from Belmullet to attend a hospital appointment in Galway where Bianconi managed to get to over 100 years ago, he or she would have to go the night before.  That is because he or she will not get a mid-morning appointment.  They make someone turn up at 9 a.m. and one cannot get public transport that early.  A proper hub-and-spoke system would allow a person using an Expressway route to get into Galway in time for a hospital appointment and return home again.</p>  <p>  CIE buses used to deliver newspapers and parcels but they got out of that business under the old management system.  As previous speakers have said, management have so much to answer for but we are making the workers pay.  I asked the new CEO of Bus &Eacute;ireann, Mr. Ray Hernan who has been handed a very difficult job to outline the severance package of his predecessor.  He said he could not do so because of confidentiality.  There is no confidentiality around the assault on workers, however.  As we are keeping the heartbeat of this company going, we must address that issue.</p>  <p>  In a previous life, the Minister made a name for himself by telling shareholders what questions to ask at annual general meetings, AGMs.  May I ask him to answer these questions?  What actions did the directors appointed by the Department take when Bus &Eacute;ireann went from a &euro;400,000 surplus to a &euro;5.4 million loss?  They remained mute and did nothing.  They actually stood by while three rescue plans were turned down by the Department they represented.</p>  <p>  The Minister has a responsibility to the shareholders and employees.  He says he cannot get involved and that we have an industrial relations mechanism.  I call on the Workplace Relations Commission, WRC, to get involved.  There should be no need for a strike.  The WRC should get involved now and kill this off at the pass, rather than it becoming a case of people being inconvenienced.  A hub-and-spoke mechanism connecting public transport to the express routes is the way to go.  Bus &Eacute;ireann had that in place but it has been cherry-picked by the NTA.  We do not have confidence in the NTA in rural Ireland.  We see how they deal with taxi services which they long finger.  The NTA has to prove itself, as does the WRC.  Many elements of the State have to prove themselves to provide fair employment and a service that works. </p>  <p>  We have heard about red setters and Bianconi.  The ultimate red herring is that the Government will not get involved in this debate.  It feels it can stick its head in the sand.  If, however, there is a public service strike on 20 February - I predict that there will be - on the Minister's head be it.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.681" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1350" speakername="Jackie Cahill" time="22:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100055#CCC00400"><p>Yesterday, I received a phone call from an Expressway driver.  He also sent an e-mail saying that he works a six-week roster with one weekend off in six.  He has a lot of days on which he is away from home for 11 or 12 hours.  For two of the six weeks, he starts at 2 a.m. and 4 a.m.  He earns an average of &euro;700 per week.  Bus &Eacute;ireann proposes to cut that by removing the shift allowance of &euro;95 and reducing the double-time rate for Sundays from 100% to 20%.  The company is also seeking a general reduction of 10% in allowances.  The driver said it appears that he will bring home in the region of &euro;500 a week when these cuts are put in place on 20 February.  As stated, the man, who is from Clonmel, is an Expressway driver.  He will be eligible for income supplement if these cuts are imposed by Bus &Eacute;ireann.  The Minister has a responsibility.  I was sitting in my office this evening and I heard him say that the Government is intent on looking after rural Ireland.  The bucks stops with the Minister.  He must ensure that Expressway is preserved and that people in rural Ireland get the transport infrastructure they deserve.</p>  <p>  I have been sitting in this Chamber for the past 90 minutes and have listened to many Opposition Members criticising the motion moved by Deputy Troy.  This shows that Fianna F&aacute;il is on the right track.  We are putting forward the correct policies forward in respect of both urban and rural Ireland.  I wholeheartedly support the motion.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.682" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="22:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100055#CCC00500"><p>We have five and a half minutes left for three Deputies.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.683" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1220" speakername="Mary Butler" time="22:10:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100055#CCC00600"><p>I commend Deputy Robert Troy for being so proactive on this issue.  Everybody seems to be talking about this matter but very little action has been taken in respect of it.  The programme for Government contains a commitment to keep older people independent and active in their community.  It states, "We also recognise the value and benefit of rural transport to many communities, in particular for older people vulnerable to social isolation".  Older people living in rural areas do not have the same luxury of those living in larger towns and cities.  Here in Dublin we are spoilt for choice between taxis, buses, trains and Luas services.  The list goes on but, unfortunately, the same is not available to people who live in other parts of the country.  Expressway is a lifeline for both urban and rural passengers, including students taking the service from Waterford on a Sunday evening.</p><p>My own daughter does it.  She travels every Sunday evening to college in Limerick.  Whether it is the students travelling into Waterford from Cork, Carlow or Kilkenny, it is imperative that the bus service is there for them.  At the weekend, I spoke to many people in rural parts of my constituency whose only lifeline in many cases is Bus &Eacute;ireann and the Expressway coach service.  These people depend on free travel and the connectivity with which buses provide them.</p> <p> My late father, who has been dead for 21 years, had a saying, "If you are going on the bus, be on it," because he always trained us to be good timekeepers.  My worry now is that there will be no bus to get on.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.685" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1231" speakername="Anne Rabbitte" time="22:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100056#DDD00200"><p>I thank Deputy Robert Troy for bringing the motion to the House.  Earlier the Minister said there was a difference between himself and Deputy Troy and that they did not share the same road to a solution.  I agree with him.  Deputy Troy is standing up for rural Ireland.  He is standing up for the staff of Bus &Eacute;ireann, the towns, the young and the old.  He is standing up to create awareness that the Minister's Department is lacking when it comes to taking ownership.  He is listening to the concerns of the people in rural Ireland.  My colleagues, Councillors Kinane and Ivan Canning, are very concerned about the forthcoming opening of the Gort to Tuam motorway because Gort is going to be bypassed, as is Clarinbridge.  They have real concerns about what that will do to their rural communities because that was the lifeline that was bringing people into communities.  It was part of the connectivity we needed for tourism in the west.</p>  <p>  Regrettably, we now face the deadline of 20 February and people who work on the Expressway service or who have families and businesses that depend on it do not know what the future holds for it.  We ask the Minister to provide a clear and definite role of involvement and for leadership.  We know he can do it.  We ask him now to step up to the mark and support rural Ireland.  Given my constituency experience, I believe firmly that all rural towns and villages need serious resuscitation and not to have their oxygen supply taken away.  It is in the Minister's hands.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.686" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1221" speakername="Niall Collins" time="22:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100056#DDD00300"><p>The Minister must gain an appreciation of the concern in rural Ireland about the Bus &Eacute;ireann crisis.  My constituency of County Limerick is predominantly rural and people rely on the public transport service to travel to Limerick city for hospital appointments, their day-to-day business or to work.  Equally, they rely on it to get to the key county towns of Abbeyfeale, Newcastlewest, Rathkeale, Kilmallock and Cappamore.  If we do not resolve this crisis and avoid the insolvency of the company, the bus service may go.  As such, we have to see the Minister as shareholder representative step up to the plate.  The public must be reassured.  It is incumbent on the Minister to tell the public that this will be sorted out.  In the past few years, in particular under Fine Gael and the Labour Party, we saw the closure of post offices, Garda stations, public health clinics and banks, as well as the consolidation of services into the larger towns and cities.  If we take away the public transport service on which people rely, we will hugely discommode the people I represent.  As such, it is incumbent on the Minister and the Government to sort this out.</p>  <p>  In sorting out the problem, the workers cannot be asked to bail the company out.  I listened intently to what was said at the Joint Committee on Transport, Tourism and Sport last week when the acting CEO of Bus &Eacute;ireann detailed that the workers accounted for 40% of the cost base of the company.  It is not tenable or feasible for the workers to be stripped of more salary.  We have a race to the bottom in this country in respect of terms and conditions and rates of pay.  It is not sustainable that the workforce be asked by virtue of salary cuts or reductions in allowances or premium overtime to bail out the company.  There are many other areas which could be looked at, including insurance costs, route costs and reform of the National Transport Authority.  Many areas where there could be savings have been outlined, but the workers must be protected in terms of their salaries and terms and conditions.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.687" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1307" speakername="Catherine Byrne" time="22:20:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100056#DDD00400"><p>I echo the earlier comments of the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Shane Ross, on the counterproductive leaking of information about Bus &Eacute;ireann's challenges in recent weeks.  We must all remind ourselves that more than 2,500 people are employed in the company.  They have been subjected to headline after headline and speculation about their careers.  The distress is not helping them in any way and neither are the often wild accusations and speculations of some in the media and repeated, unfortunately, by some of the Members of this House.  In addition to the employees are the millions of people across the country, in particular in rural Ireland, who rely on Bus &Eacute;ireann as their public transport operator.  They have been subjected to speculation about potential route closures and service changes, a great deal of which is utterly unfounded and irrelevant.  For example, there have been media reports about the future of bus services in areas which are not even served by Expressway but instead by Bus &Eacute;ireann's PSO services.  Similar were stories of potential changes to the free travel scheme when there are no such proposals.</p>  <p>  I would like to think Members would have an informed debate in the Chamber and, amidst their disagreements, at least clarify factual positions.  Before us is a motion proposed by Fianna F&aacute;il, as well as amendments proposed by the Labour Party, the Anti-Austerity Alliance-People Before Profit, Sinn F&eacute;in and a counter-motion proposed by the Government.  There is much agreement across the proposals.  Everyone agrees about the importance of a quality, funded public transport network.  We all agree it is necessary to review the funding model for the free travel scheme and, albeit in different words, we agree on the need for the National Transport Authority, NTA, to consider issues affecting rural Ireland when considering commercial bus licence applications.  Again in slightly different words, all agree the NTA must have the necessary powers under the Public Transport Regulation Act 2009 to ensure commercial bus services play their part in our overall public transport network.</p>  <p>  I agree with Deputy Anne Rabbitte that in the capital city of Dublin we are spoiled for choice.  We are spoiled for choice because we have the infrastructure.  That infrastructure needs to be shared with the rest of the country.  I agree with Deputy Eamon Ryan, who has left the Chamber, about thinking outside the box.  As politicians, we sometimes have very narrow minds and we need to respond when people suggest things from outside the box.  We must take on board what they are saying and try to do something with it rather than just ignore it and pretend it is not there.</p>  <p>  However, there is one significant area of difference.  The Opposition motion calls on the Government to ensure no change to Expressway services and that an Act is proposed.  It is something I think instinctively appeals to a lot of people in the House this evening.  However, it imagines the Government can simply direct a company's board of directors and management to continue to provide a loss-making service.  Nobody wants any company to make losses.  It is important that every company, public or private, continues to work against losses it may incur.  It invites us to believe the Government can wave away the legal duties of the directors and instruct the company to act in any way the Government sees fit.  That is not possible.  We all know that.  The Opposition motion seeks to create a scenario where the Government can support and fund one commercial bus service to the disadvantage of another commercial operator.  However, none of that is credible.</p>  <p>  The Government is clear that when there is an industrial relations dispute, we must support the industrial relations bodies, including the Labour Court and the Workplace Relations Commission.  They are long established and well practised at handling these difficulties and the discussions that must take place between management and employees in Bus &Eacute;ireann.  The need for clear roles is also relevant to the proposed amendments tabled by Labour and the Anti-Austerity Alliance-People Before Profit.  Those amendments call on the Government to impose a sectoral employment order in the commercial bus market.  However, the existing legislation already allows for a sectoral employment order to be put in place following an application by a trade union or employer in the Labour Court and provides for the making of a recommendation by the court to the relevant Minister.  As such, a mechanism is in place that should be used.</p><p>The Government is equally clear that it cannot fund one commercial service over all other commercial buses.  To be fair, Fianna F&aacute;il seems to recognise that fact in the text of its motion.</p> <p> We all need to be clear about the real issue behind the current challenges facing Bus &Eacute;ireann and the options available to resolve them.  We heard different views expressed as to what those issues are.  We all recognise the importance of Bus &Eacute;ireann and acknowledge its role across its three services, namely, the PSO, school and Expressway services.  The vast majority of journeys, around 90% of all passengers, occur on PSO and school services.  The taxpayer funds these services each year - around &euro;190 million was granted last year, split between PSO and school services. </p> <p> Around 10% of passenger journeys occur on Expressway services.  This network route involves the commercial bus sector, a sector subject to regulations by the NTA and one in which other operators also provide services, subject to licence from the NTA.  We should not forget the other commercial bus operators, which hail from all four corners of rural Ireland.  They are often small, family-owned companies based in rural towns and villages which provide local employment opportunities as well as improving public transport connectivity.</p> <p> The reform introduced a number of years ago to facilitate commercial bus markets helped to increase passenger numbers and allowed for more people to avail of public transport services, competitive fares and improve service levels.  We should not be too quick to dismiss this.</p> <p> In some ways, the challenges facing Bus &Eacute;ireann are relatively straightforward.  People are choosing other operators over Expressway.  Expressway's losses have now become a company-wide problem and action needs to be taken by the company to address that fact.  It can only do that in consultation with its employees.  I echo the call of the Minister for both parties to begin discussions as soon as possible.</p> <p> I am afraid that is the difficult truth behind the situation and the company must adjust the losses it is suffering in its commercial service.  It is not an issue of underfunding of PSO or school services.  Rather, this is a problem faced by Bus &Eacute;ireann commercial services, and is a problem it must help to resolve.  Fianna F&aacute;il's motion recognises that subsidies from the Government could run into legal challenges.</p> <p> The Government, through institutions such as the Labour Court and the Workplace Relations Commission, can assist in bringing the parties together, but we need them to indicate their willingness to agree.  The Government, through the NTA, can ensure rural Ireland's transport connectivity will be maintained in the event of any service configuration.  The Government, through its interdepartmental discussions, can examine adequate funding of the free travel scheme.  The Government can assure everyone of its commitment to our publicly funded public service networks.  This is evidenced this year by an 11% increase in the PSO programme.  The Government cannot direct companies to continue to lose money in a commercial environment.  The reality is that the Government cannot change the legal responsibilities of directors.</p> <p> People throughout the country should have proper services.  Those of us who live in the capital and larger cities across the country are sometimes blind to the fact that people in rural Ireland are at a significant disadvantage.  In my new position, I have frequently travelled on motorways, something I did not do before.  I am astounded by the level of motorways across the country.  The European Union provided most of the funding for them.  </p> <p> I am very proud to see the work that has been done in the country when I travel on a motorway.  They have connected towns and given people the freedom to move from one area to another.  Journeys that would have taken five or six hours have been halved.  I wish to pay that compliment because it is very important to do so.  We are always knocking each other in the House and there is a sense of negativity.  It is time to get rid of the negativity and work together as a Chamber rather than as individual groups.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.689" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="22:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100057#EEE00200"><p>Deputies Shane Cassels, Aindrias Moynihan, Kevin O'Keeffe and Robert Troy are sharing time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.690" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1218" speakername="Shane Cassells" time="22:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100057#EEE00300"><p>I met a number of Bus &Eacute;ireann drivers in my constituency office yesterday, who came to speak to me about the plans that are being put forward to decimate the service and which would have an impact on people in our constituency.  The Minister referred to Bus &Eacute;ireann introducing a new plan to help achieve profitability.  My fear is that some of the proposals are already being put in place without consensus being reached between unions and management.  As we speak, practices that are destructive to passengers are being implemented as management goes head to head with drivers.</p>  <p>  A driver I spoke to yesterday operates the crucial service between the airport, Kells, Navan and Ashbourne.  He telephoned the company to say he could not work because of a medical issue, but was conscious of his duty of care to the passengers he served who need to access the airport and DCU.  He was told not to worry and thanked for calling.  The company did not operate two of the services that day.  Commuters who wished to travel to the airport and students who needed to travel to DCU were left stranded on the side of the road.  Managers decided not to provide a replacement driver to cover the service.</p>  <p>  They are the kind of destructive head-to-head games that are already happening.  That is why we need to save the company from itself.  Passengers are the pawns in all of this.  There is a service across the State of which we can be proud.  It needs to be valued and supported.  The Minister spoke at length about rural Ireland and the need for connectivity to be maintained.  He is correct.  It is equally important for urban Ireland.  We are living in a more urbanised society.  The national framework plan will create more urbanisation.</p>  <p>  Before Christmas, the Minister addressed the lack of a rail line in my constituency.  The way things are going, we will have no bus service.  The smarter travel plan was announced ten years ago.  I appeal to the Minister to note that did not get enough people out of private cars and onto public transport.  We need a smarter policy in that respect and to help the service.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.691" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1284" speakername="Aindrias Moynihan" time="22:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100057#EEE00400"><p>Last December I raised concerns that local people had outlined to me about the No. 40 bus in Ballyvourney.  At the time, the Minister assured me that there were no planned changes, yet today, given the dire financial position of Bus &Eacute;ireann which has been outlined in recent days, concern is rapidly growing that there could be imminent cuts to the service.  Staff should not be scapegoated and rural communities cannot be made to suffer.</p>  <p>  Apart from the Expressway service, there is no other public transport available to people in Ballyvourney.  The No. 40 bus serves a large population west of Cork city all the way to the Atlantic.  People cannot do without it.  It provides direct access for a large cohort of people to Cork University Hospital, with a stop outside the gate.  The No. 51 bus from Cork to Limerick serves two major cities.  It is bad enough that there is no motorway between Cork and Limerick, but now there is a threat that the bus service will be cut.  T&aacute; s&eacute; f&iacute;or-th&aacute;bhachtach go gcoimeadfa&iacute; an c&oacute;ras seo i gcomhair bhus Uimh. 40 ag freastal ar mhuintir Bhaile Bhuirne.  N&iacute;l aon bhus eile n&oacute; c&oacute;ras eile ar f&aacute;il do mhuintir Bhaile Bhuirne.  Mar sin, t&aacute; t&aacute;bhacht breise ag baint leis.</p>  <p>  We acknowledge the difficult financial position Bus &Eacute;ireann is in and action is needed, but the company needs to work with staff.  It is also important to stress that older people should not be made to suffer in any way on account of the cuts.  Free travel is not free.  People who have worked hard over the years have paid into the system and should be able to avail of the service when they retire.</p>  <p>  Services are not being subsidised enough, in that only half of the free travel cost is paid for by the Department of Social Production.  It is an area which the Minister needs to examine.  He cannot be a passenger on this bus.  He needs to take an active role and support rural communities and the bus service.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.692" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1278" speakername="Kevin O'Keeffe" time="22:30:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100057#EEE00500"><p>The events of the past few weeks have been a hallmark of the Fine Gael-led Government in the past six years.  When an issue in the public eye issues develops into an all-out crisis it wants to avoid intervention at all costs in the deluded notion that the issue will somehow resolve itself.</p><p><i>10 o&amp;rsquo;clock</i></p> <p>Tonight, when we look across at the Government benches, we see that the Government had to get a Minister of State from the city to speak on behalf of Fine Gael's rural Deputies.  This shows the level of the Government's interest in supporting the rural transport service and, more importantly, the Expressway service.  This is the real world and the Minister's hands-off approach to the crisis has only allowed it to worsen and deepen public concern.  When the Minister states it is not in the interests of the taxpayer for him to intervene in a dispute involving a semi-State body that is funded partially by the taxpayer and in which the Government is a stakeholder, it raises serious questions about whether he or the Government has a serious interest in it.  I have realised the gravity of the situation.  Why does it take an Opposition party to table a Private Members' motion on every crisis before the Government will even have a discussion on it?  I have no doubt that it would have also been happy to let this one pass by if Fianna F&aacute;il, in particular, Deputy Robert Troy, had not tabled this Private Members' motion.</p> <p> That the Government is happy to allow cuts to be imposed unilaterally on workers, without round table discussions with unions, can be compared to the hard right-wing attitude in the United Kingdom in the 1980s when Mrs. Margaret Thatcher refused to engage with the coalminers.  Social partnership which was introduced by Fianna F&aacute;il and Charles Haughey in the 1980s was a mechanism that included consultation between workers, employers, unions and the Government.  Some of those on the Opposition benches may regard "social partnership" as a dirty phrase today, but at least it was a mechanism to engage with all stakeholders when issues such as this arose.  In that regard, I am sorry to see that some of the earlier speakers are not present.  Furthermore, we have a Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Employment who has made no comment on an issue, even though so many jobs are at stake.</p> <p> Last Thursday I was at a well attended public meeting in Youghal, a town that needs guaranteed connectivity with the cities.  The message given was that this was a social as well as a transport service.  I agree with my party that a review of the licensing system, in conjunction with the NTA, is necessary.  The NTA should ensure wider concerns about rural isolation and whether competition is sustainable on certain routes are included in decisions in granting or refusing bus licences to operators.  New entrants to the market have placed great strain on many Bus &Eacute;ireann services.  Strict regulations need to be put in place to ensure services will remain in place and to assess whether competition is viable on certain routes.</p> <p> I ask the Minister, Deputy Shane Ross, if the acting CEO of Bus &Eacute;ireann was handpicked by him and, if so, why?  Was it because he seemed to be singing from the same hymn book?  Last week Mr. Ray Hernan stated at the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Transport, Tourism and Sport, "I have been involved in only one reorganisation before, in my role as CEO and, previously, CFO with Arnotts."  He continued, "The essential piece of my plan was, 'you are getting no more money'."  The Minister seems to be singing the same hymn.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.694" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1250" speakername="Robert Troy" time="22:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100058#FFF00300"><p>I thank everyone for his or her contribution.  Deputy Kevin O'Keeffe is right: if it was not for Fianna F&aacute;il's Private Members' motion, we would not be discussing the issue.  The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Shane Ross, has been particularly mute on it.  If nothing else, the motion gave an opportunity to those with an interest in public transport to come and make a contribution.  Deputy Kevin O'Keeffe is right.  It is amazing that no one from the Government parties, with the exception of the Minister and the Minister of State, chose to come and speak about the issue.</p>  <p>  The Minister acknowledged the positive contribution which had been made by Se&aacute;n Lemass.  He was a great Taoiseach who set up the industrial relations mechanisms, in which we are not asking the Minister to get involved.  We are asking him to become involved before there is an industrial relations dispute and an all-out strike.  He said he was willing to talk, that the unions, management and the NTA were willing to talk and that, according to him, the NTA would not be found wanting.  Therefore, why not come together to see if an agreement can be ironed out?  If not, let us use the mechanisms of the Workplace Relations Commission, but let us come together first.  I do not subscribe to what those sitting to my right but who are on the far left said.  They want an all-out strike.  They want to see a situation where those who rely on public services would be discommoded and the workers have their wages reduced.  Paragraph 8.2 of the code of practice for the governance of State bodies requires a Minister to become involved before major changes are envisaged.  As major changes to Bus &Eacute;ireann are envisaged, the Minister is required to become involved.  His predecessor did not get involved.  He was warned about the financial position and challenges facing Bus &Eacute;ireann more than 12 months ago but nothing was done.  Now we have the calamitous situation where workers' rights have to be cut without looking at other efficiencies that could be achieved.</p>  <p>  I beg the Ceann Comhairle's indulgence.  The Minister said the NTA would not be found wanting.  He also said he had informed and briefed himself on how the NTA did its work.  How long does it take it to adjudicate on a licence application?  How long does it take it to state a service will be introduced?</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.695" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="22:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100058#FFF00600"><p>The Deputy is well over time.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.696" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1250" speakername="Robert Troy" time="22:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100058#FFF00700"><p>It takes 18 months.  I was working with it for 18 months on an application to provide a particular service between Mullingar and Dublin.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.697" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="22:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100058#FFF00800"><p>We must conclude.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.698" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1250" speakername="Robert Troy" time="22:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100058#FFF00900"><p>Is that responding to market demand?  I do not think it is.  I hope the Minister will start to drive this bus and ensure we can work together.  I want to work with him to ensure we will have an integrated and sustainable public transport service that all citizens deserve.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.699" nospeaker="true" time="22:40:00" ><p>Amendment put.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.700" speakerid="com.kildarestreet/member/1371" speakername="Se&aacute;n &Oacute; Feargha&iacute;l" time="22:40:00" url="http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/dail2017013100058#FFF01100"><p>In accordance with Standing Order 70(2), the division is postponed until the weekly division time on Thursday, 2 February 2017.</p></speech>
    <speech id="com.kildarestreet/dail/2017-01-31a.701" nospeaker="true" time="22:40:00" ><p>The D&aacute;il adjourned at at 10.05 p.m. until 10 a.m. on Wednesday, 1 February 2017.</p></speech>
</publicwhip>