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Meeting Minutes of 15 September 2023

📅 Date: 15 September 2023

👤 Participants

  • Ege Korkan
  • Cristiano Aguzzi
  • Kaz Ashimura
  • Robert Winkler
  • Sebastian Kaebisch
  • Mahda Noura
  • Kunihiko Toumura
  • Michael McCool
  • Robert Winkler
  • Hiroki Endo
  • Tomoaki Mizushima
  • Minyong Li
  • Andrei Ciortea
  • Kudzai Manditereza
  • Hiroshi Ota
  • Yoshitomo Sakuma
  • Salvatore Catardi

✍️ Scribe: Ege and Cris

💻 Intro Slides: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1lX4l2pUdsSQ0PV7WtWLFt60hnOwk3JOpl2IC6V5Zxq8/edit?usp=sharing

💻 WoT Intro Slides: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/10USa8y243TLeFP1vA-NjQEpP2OJcUydyJGMjcMbOu1w/edit?usp=sharing

📜 Agenda

  • 11:30 - 11:45 Introductions of Participants
  • 11:45 - 12:15 Introducing WoT CG
  • 12:15 - 13:00 Joint Discussion with WoT WG on Binding Contributions

Agenda Topic

Cristiano Aguzzi: we will explain the work of the CG

CG WG Distinction

Cristiano Aguzzi: CG is open to all whereas WG requires a W3C membership

Cristiano Aguzzi: Also cg does outreach but WG writes recs and notes. So they are different in the work as well.

Group Updates

Cristiano Aguzzi: we are active on the web. Ege will paste the links

Cristiano Aguzzi: we also have a video prepared that teases the tutorial series

Cristiano Aguzzi: plays the video at https://www.w3.org/2023/09/TPAC/group-updates.html#wot

Michael McCool: how is the process

Ege Korkan: we have a workflow. A storyline is submitted that explains what the tutorial will be about

Ege Korkan: Then, a slideset is created and reviewed. From that, the video is created together with the voiceover and also reviewed using the PR text.

Ege Korkan: You can see PRs that show it.

Michael McCool: which languages?

Cristiano Aguzzi: English but we can extend to other languages.

Ege Korkan: but only the text/subtitle

Michael McCool: someone can review the translation

Michael McCool: we can incorporate a real application video.

ka: we should be clear with the distinction between the IG marketing TF

Michael McCool: maybe we can put a CG logo next to the WoT logo

Ege Korkan: the tutorial series will be published on CG YouTube

Michael McCool: also we should run it by the marketing team of w3c

Kazuyuki Ashimura: we can put it in some form on the main page

Cristiano Aguzzi: we need to be careful about changing the logo since there are rules about it.

Cristiano Aguzzi: we can involve Coralie

Tutorial Series

Cristiano Aguzzi: it is to onboard newcomers. We even explain what is JSON.

Cristiano Aguzzi: we have content for 13, videos for 4

Cristiano Aguzzi: there is an initial version of the website at https://incandescent-praline-942129.netlify.app/

Michael McCool: is it possible to get it as a PDF?

Numbers

Cristiano Aguzzi: here are the numbers

Cristiano Aguzzi: Participants: 261

Cristiano Aguzzi: Discord: 81

Cristiano Aguzzi: YouTube Channel: 26

Cristiano Aguzzi: also companies joined

Sebastian Kaebisch: I would like to compliment you. We see what is happening outside. It is also transparent.

Introduction to WoT CG

Ege Korkan: this section is more about revising what CG does in general.

Ege Korkan: WoT CG is 10 years old

Ege Korkan: it was created 10 years ago by Dave

Ege Korkan: we renewed last year in August, and we were in the 2022 TPAC.

Ege showing timeline

Ege Korkan: it is an interesting time. We see WoT adopted in the industry

Ege Korkan: currently our mission is community support and outreach.

Ege Korkan: community support -> We host office hours and tutorials

Ege Korkan: outreach is about event organization and chat platform

Future

Ege Korkan: we keep was is working

Ege Korkan: better integration with WG

Ege Korkan: during TPAC we got ideas for interactions

Ege Korkan: other CGs propose ideas to WGs

Ege Korkan: there must be existing mechanisms to take inspiration from.

Bindings contributions

Ege Korkan: WG probably cannot write bindings on its own, meaning we need to branch out and get more bindings from outsiders.

Ege Korkan: I think bindings contributions should be connected to use cases

Michael McCool: right opc-ua could be an example. I think CG can support it. The WG should establish the document format of the binding document.

Ege Korkan: submission to the registry can be done by other parties

Michael McCool: CG can support people in writing bindings, and guiding them.

Ege Korkan: there could be cases where the binding community is dead and the CG would still be able to write the binding himself.

Michael McCool: patents might get us into trouble, we have to be careful

Ege Korkan: for BACnet, it should be fine as long as it is established that the BACnet is a trademark of ASHRAE

Ege Korkan: we can take inspiration from codecs, they might be property codecs.

Kazuyuki Ashimura: I agree with McCool. As the CG and WG, we should clarify which information needs to be published by whom. Liaisons should be officially handled by the WG. Generating binding from the CG is OK. However, the document structure and content should be better specified.

Michael McCool: if a 3rd party writes a binding for a particular protocol might be fine, but we have to look into it.

Use case contributions

Ege Korkan: there might be similar processes involved there. CG could contribute there too. We will be able to talk about these points in this afternoon's session.

Contributions from CGs

Ege Korkan: currently in the charter we say that we are not writing specifications documents. So if we want to allow CG to write bindings we have to re-charter

Michael McCool: it depends on WG, but bindings could be a technical report.

Ege Korkan: is it an informative specification?

Michael McCool: we can make them informative, but I hope it does not invalidate the point of having a binding.

Ege Korkan: registry is always informative

Kazuyuki Ashimura: CG can create CG reports, and they can be used as bases for Thing description bindings.

Ege Korkan: the core mechanism should be on the WG.

Cristiano Aguzzi: I second the feeling of having bindings normative

Michael McCool: CG could create informative bindings and WG can take them and make them normative.

Liaisons

Ege Korkan: CG can have liaisons, but are only related to CG. They are not related to W3C.

Ege Korkan: we have a document that describes possible liaisons. We could discuss them today

Ege showing a proposal

Kazuyuki Ashimura: right, that's why we should decide the levels of interactions.

Ege Korkan: should it be more specific than this?

Kazuyuki Ashimura: yes, but this is a good starting point

Michael McCool: it is a good place to make the relationship official, we could have a list of specific things. There we can clarify the CLAs of bindings created by the CG

Kazuyuki Ashimura: we can move the liaisons doc into the WoT.

Ege Korkan: in the case we go with external org the CG has to manage themself. We can start by liaisons between W3C groups.

Ege Korkan: which one of the liaison proposals would you like more?

Michael McCool: I would say that we need to make a list not a simple sentence.

Cristiano Aguzzi: we should also take into account feature incubation as other groups are doing.

Open discussion on the possible points of the list

Ege Korkan: if we are fine I can send an e-mail about the list to both groups.

Michael McCool: it is fine for somebody in the CG to come up with an idea or a feature. We need to find a way to enforce patent policy

Michael McCool: but we can put in the list feature proposals and then later on define the process.

Cristiano Aguzzi: would we work on the liaison process?

Michael McCool: kaz should decide

Kazuyuki Ashimura: let's put clarifications on each bullet point.

Michael McCool: add definitions.

Ege Korkan: good enough, the PR should be reviewed

Michael McCool: is it WG/IG or WG?

Ege Korkan: is it possible to have a liaison with both WG/IG?

Kazuyuki Ashimura: given that we usually treat WG/IG as a joint entity it would be ok. But please remember that the members of WG and IG are different and have different interests.

Sebastian Kaebisch: we also have to look into other groups.

Cristiano Aguzzi: we should watch Solid CG/WG they have a strong relationship.

Ege Korkan: in the WebAssembly the CG is very strong

Michael McCool: in RDF* is similar the CG produces a complete spec and the WG simply finalized it

Wrap up

Ege Korkan: thank you for time.

adjourned

☑️ Resolutions

None

❗ Action Items

None

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