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Brand Name Selection #1

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waynebeaton opened this Issue Nov 15, 2017 · 458 comments

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waynebeaton commented Nov 15, 2017

We need a new brand name for the set of specifications that will be created by the new community process. This brand name will also become a certification mark in the industry for compatible, independent implementations. The open source projects that fall under the Eclipse EE4J top level project will be one such implementation. In short, we need a new name to replace “Java EE”. Much like the OpenJDK project implements the Java SE Platform specification, the EE4J projects will provide implementations of a set of specifications that we today call Java EE: we need a brand name for this set of specifications.

With this in mind, we are initiating a community process to select the brand name. This process will be managed by the EE4J Project Management Committee (“PMC”) with assistance from the Eclipse Management Organization (“EMO”). The name that is selected by this process must pass legal and other trademark searches to ensure that the names are available for use. As a result, it is possible that the favoured selection will not be the ultimate choice. The final decision will be made by the EMO Executive Director (“EMO(ED)”) in consultation with the PMC.

The process is described in greater detail below.

Nominations

Names can be nominated by anyone in the community via this GitHub Issue record.

Nominations will be open from November 15 until November 30, 2017 (UPDATED; note that the date had been incorrectly specified as November, 2018)

Naming Guidelines

All suggested names must conform to the following:

Any suggested names which fail to meet the above criteria will be rejected.

Name Selection Process

The process will be executed as follows:

  1. Members of the community will be invited to enter their nominations into the specified channel;
  2. At the end of the nomination period, the names suggested by the community will be reviewed by the PMC to identify those which meet the criteria specified in the by the naming guidelines (depending on response, the PMC may decide to further reduce the list to a manageable size);
  3. The PMC will then initiate a community vote using the CIVS system (which will produce an overall ranking of the choices); and
  4. The results of the vote will be delivered to the EMO(ED) who will engage in the required legal and other trademark searches to ensure that the names are available for use, and consult with the PMC to make the final decision.

Since we have no idea what sort of community response to expect, it is difficult to time box anything other than the initial nomination process. But this will be an open and transparent process, and we invite the community to engage in all aspects of it. There is a great deal of legal, marketing, and community thought that goes into selecting an industry brand, so it’s important that we get this right. This may take a little time.

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kwsutter Nov 15, 2017

Just to get the party started, I will suggest the following... Use "EE4J" for both the top-level project and the brand name.

kwsutter commented Nov 15, 2017

Just to get the party started, I will suggest the following... Use "EE4J" for both the top-level project and the brand name.

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kwsutter Nov 15, 2017

Another candidate would be to follow the open standards naming convention and create the "Open EE" brand.

kwsutter commented Nov 15, 2017

Another candidate would be to follow the open standards naming convention and create the "Open EE" brand.

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Daniel-Dos Nov 15, 2017

I think it would be nice EJE - Eclipse Java Enterprise, so it's close to the old Java EE name .

Daniel-Dos commented Nov 15, 2017

I think it would be nice EJE - Eclipse Java Enterprise, so it's close to the old Java EE name .

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michaelranaldo Nov 15, 2017

As it contains more APIs, MacroProfile

michaelranaldo commented Nov 15, 2017

As it contains more APIs, MacroProfile

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Cousjava Nov 15, 2017

My personal thought is just EEJ, which also is JEE backwards. It could stand for Enterprise Extensions for Java, Eclipse Enterprise Java, or Eclipse Extensions for Java which is my preference.

Cousjava commented Nov 15, 2017

My personal thought is just EEJ, which also is JEE backwards. It could stand for Enterprise Extensions for Java, Eclipse Enterprise Java, or Eclipse Extensions for Java which is my preference.

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@kwsutter +1 for Open EE. Would EE still mean Enterprise Edition, Eclipse Enterprise, or do you have something else in mind?

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ggam commented Nov 15, 2017

@kwsutter +1 for Open EE. Would EE still mean Enterprise Edition, Eclipse Enterprise, or do you have something else in mind?

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pedanticdev Nov 15, 2017

@kwsutter +1 for Open Enterprise Extensions for the Java Platform.

pedanticdev commented Nov 15, 2017

@kwsutter +1 for Open Enterprise Extensions for the Java Platform.

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m-reza-rahman Nov 15, 2017

  • Eclipse Java Open Extensions (Eclipse JOE) - Joe is a nice pun on Java.
  • Eclipse Java Open Enterprise (Eclipse JOE).
  • Eclipse for the Java Open Enterprise (Eclipse JOE).
  • Eclipse Open Extensions for Java (Eclipse OEJ or OE4J).
  • Eclipse Enterprise Extensions for Java (EEEJ or Eclipse EEJ) - basically a way to drop the 4, some in the community think it is too gimmicky.
  • Eclipse Extensions for the Java Open Enterprise (Eclipse EJOE).

m-reza-rahman commented Nov 15, 2017

  • Eclipse Java Open Extensions (Eclipse JOE) - Joe is a nice pun on Java.
  • Eclipse Java Open Enterprise (Eclipse JOE).
  • Eclipse for the Java Open Enterprise (Eclipse JOE).
  • Eclipse Open Extensions for Java (Eclipse OEJ or OE4J).
  • Eclipse Enterprise Extensions for Java (EEEJ or Eclipse EEJ) - basically a way to drop the 4, some in the community think it is too gimmicky.
  • Eclipse Extensions for the Java Open Enterprise (Eclipse EJOE).
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machi1990 Nov 15, 2017

@kwsutter +1 Open EE. Another alternative could be - Open JEE for Open Java Enterprise Edition.

machi1990 commented Nov 15, 2017

@kwsutter +1 Open EE. Another alternative could be - Open JEE for Open Java Enterprise Edition.

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I also proposed Open EE before, so definitely +1 to @kwsutter for Open EE

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arjantijms commented Nov 15, 2017

I also proposed Open EE before, so definitely +1 to @kwsutter for Open EE

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lprimak Nov 15, 2017

+1 for Eclipse Java Open Extensions (Eclipse JOE)

lprimak commented Nov 15, 2017

+1 for Eclipse Java Open Extensions (Eclipse JOE)

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If it was feasible I'd prefer OpenJEE over just OpenEE (no Java in it, so it could mean anything, .NET, Angular, and I don't think that's the idea) but I have doubts the term "Java Enterprise Edition" is acceptable because that is exactly what Oracle wants to protect. Maybe OpenEEJ could work.
IBM recently created OpenJ9 Of course it had long branding and use of the "J9" part (lost track of what the "9" stood for, but it existed long before Java 9) but something that feels along those lines could be beneficial.

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keilw commented Nov 15, 2017

If it was feasible I'd prefer OpenJEE over just OpenEE (no Java in it, so it could mean anything, .NET, Angular, and I don't think that's the idea) but I have doubts the term "Java Enterprise Edition" is acceptable because that is exactly what Oracle wants to protect. Maybe OpenEEJ could work.
IBM recently created OpenJ9 Of course it had long branding and use of the "J9" part (lost track of what the "9" stood for, but it existed long before Java 9) but something that feels along those lines could be beneficial.

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cealsair Nov 15, 2017

-1 Open EE. In Spanish, it sounds like a part of the human anatomy.

cealsair commented Nov 15, 2017

-1 Open EE. In Spanish, it sounds like a part of the human anatomy.

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tracymiranda Nov 15, 2017

Cappuccino - a smoother, frothier cup of Java ☕😊

tracymiranda commented Nov 15, 2017

Cappuccino - a smoother, frothier cup of Java ☕😊

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fsteeg Nov 15, 2017

First thing that came to mind was Enterprise Java (EJ).

We'd have Enterprise Java specs, Enterprise Java certifications, and Enterprise Java experts.

fsteeg commented Nov 15, 2017

First thing that came to mind was Enterprise Java (EJ).

We'd have Enterprise Java specs, Enterprise Java certifications, and Enterprise Java experts.

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Of course Eclipse IoT already has a project "Kura" which in Serbian or Croatian also sounds like a part of the male anatomy.

-1 for "JOE", as Wayne mentioned, the name must not start with "Java".

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keilw commented Nov 15, 2017

Of course Eclipse IoT already has a project "Kura" which in Serbian or Croatian also sounds like a part of the male anatomy.

-1 for "JOE", as Wayne mentioned, the name must not start with "Java".

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-1 Open EE. In Spanish, it sounds like a part of the human anatomy.

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-1 Open EE. In Spanish, it sounds like a part of the human anatomy.

There's always a meaning in some language ;) The well known term "DOM" for example has a not so clever meaning in Dutch... Probably best to focus on English and only refrain from it if it's really, really bad in some well known language.

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arjantijms commented Nov 15, 2017

-1 Open EE. In Spanish, it sounds like a part of the human anatomy.

@cealsair

-1 Open EE. In Spanish, it sounds like a part of the human anatomy.

There's always a meaning in some language ;) The well known term "DOM" for example has a not so clever meaning in Dutch... Probably best to focus on English and only refrain from it if it's really, really bad in some well known language.

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pedanticdev Nov 15, 2017

-1 for anything with the name Eclipse as part because of the history of the Eclipse IDE. Personally, the IDE invokes loads of pain and frustration. I'm equally certain there are others like me who feel the same way about the name Eclipse and what it invokes.

I also side with just Enterprise Java. Simple and still conveys the needed meaning.

pedanticdev commented Nov 15, 2017

-1 for anything with the name Eclipse as part because of the history of the Eclipse IDE. Personally, the IDE invokes loads of pain and frustration. I'm equally certain there are others like me who feel the same way about the name Eclipse and what it invokes.

I also side with just Enterprise Java. Simple and still conveys the needed meaning.

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smsilva Nov 15, 2017

Eclipse OpenJEE (Eclipse Open Java Enterprise Edition)

smsilva commented Nov 15, 2017

Eclipse OpenJEE (Eclipse Open Java Enterprise Edition)

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Perhaps the name should highlight that we're primarily working on SERVER APIs?

Even though technically everything these days can be used for whatever, we can't hide the fact that Java EE is mostly used for server applications.

As alternative to Open EE, perhaps something like

  • Open Server
  • Open Server API
  • Open Server APIs
  • ...
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arjantijms commented Nov 15, 2017

Perhaps the name should highlight that we're primarily working on SERVER APIs?

Even though technically everything these days can be used for whatever, we can't hide the fact that Java EE is mostly used for server applications.

As alternative to Open EE, perhaps something like

  • Open Server
  • Open Server API
  • Open Server APIs
  • ...
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michaelranaldo Nov 15, 2017

+1 for Open Server API, nice to decouple from a more corporate angle but keep the infrastructure lilt

michaelranaldo commented Nov 15, 2017

+1 for Open Server API, nice to decouple from a more corporate angle but keep the infrastructure lilt

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IndraneelCS Nov 15, 2017

+1 to use EE4J for both the top-level project and the brand name.

IndraneelCS commented Nov 15, 2017

+1 to use EE4J for both the top-level project and the brand name.

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wesleyegberto Nov 15, 2017

+1 to Eclipse MacroProfile
We hope someday the specs from MicroProfile and current Java EE will come from the same place, so using Macro (or anything like that) would be nice to show that it contains all specs.

wesleyegberto commented Nov 15, 2017

+1 to Eclipse MacroProfile
We hope someday the specs from MicroProfile and current Java EE will come from the same place, so using Macro (or anything like that) would be nice to show that it contains all specs.

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Cousjava Nov 15, 2017

I actually it would be good to drop the word Enterprise from it, as that makes it appear the it can only be used by large corporations, like IBM or Oracle, when in fact it can be used by small teams or individuals as well.

Cousjava commented Nov 15, 2017

I actually it would be good to drop the word Enterprise from it, as that makes it appear the it can only be used by large corporations, like IBM or Oracle, when in fact it can be used by small teams or individuals as well.

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Persi Nov 15, 2017

Open EE4J seems pretty obvious to me. We got no probably trademarked terms in it and everybody knows what's meant.

Persi commented Nov 15, 2017

Open EE4J seems pretty obvious to me. We got no probably trademarked terms in it and everybody knows what's meant.

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manikmagar Nov 15, 2017

@keilw I had the exact same thing in mind 'OpenJEE' but then I thought that might just end up being referred as JEE again.

manikmagar commented Nov 15, 2017

@keilw I had the exact same thing in mind 'OpenJEE' but then I thought that might just end up being referred as JEE again.

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Daniel-Dos Nov 15, 2017

Open EE4J seems pretty obvious to me. We got no probably trademarked terms in it and everybody knows what's meant.

What spoils even is this 4 in the name, is much more accepted in my opinion OpenEEJ or Open EE .

Daniel-Dos commented Nov 15, 2017

Open EE4J seems pretty obvious to me. We got no probably trademarked terms in it and everybody knows what's meant.

What spoils even is this 4 in the name, is much more accepted in my opinion OpenEEJ or Open EE .

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ivargrimstad Nov 15, 2017

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Eclipse Enterprise, shortened to EE
(thanks David Blevins)

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ivargrimstad commented Nov 15, 2017

Eclipse Enterprise, shortened to EE
(thanks David Blevins)

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Simply "EE" would be fine for me. "EE certified" is familiar.

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dblevins commented Nov 15, 2017

Simply "EE" would be fine for me. "EE certified" is familiar.

This was referenced Nov 30, 2017

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Based on a cursory review, it seems to me that we stopped receiving any new name suggestions days ago. I think that the community managed to parse past my error correctly (and/or the discussion has lost momentum). I do not intend to extend the deadline. I'll close this issue in about 40 minutes.

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waynebeaton commented Nov 30, 2017

Based on a cursory review, it seems to me that we stopped receiving any new name suggestions days ago. I think that the community managed to parse past my error correctly (and/or the discussion has lost momentum). I do not intend to extend the deadline. I'll close this issue in about 40 minutes.

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MrinalKanti Nov 30, 2017

How about Eclipse Nebula

Quoting from the Nebula entry in Wikipedia:

Nebulae are often star-forming regions, such as in the "Pillars of Creation" in the Eagle Nebula. In these regions the formations of gas, dust, and other materials "clump" together to form denser regions, which attract further matter, and eventually will become dense enough to form stars.

Edit: Seems Eclipse Nebula already exists. Sorry should have checked that f

MrinalKanti commented Nov 30, 2017

How about Eclipse Nebula

Quoting from the Nebula entry in Wikipedia:

Nebulae are often star-forming regions, such as in the "Pillars of Creation" in the Eagle Nebula. In these regions the formations of gas, dust, and other materials "clump" together to form denser regions, which attract further matter, and eventually will become dense enough to form stars.

Edit: Seems Eclipse Nebula already exists. Sorry should have checked that f

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zak-thompson Nov 30, 2017

Been searching for awhile, the short end date caught me off guard.

Here's a list of what I've got so far (sticking to the one word theme):
Gallus
Epoch
Annex
Moka
Cortado

+1 for cappuccino, OpenEE/OpenJEE and EEJ
-1 for anything with eclipse in the name

zak-thompson commented Nov 30, 2017

Been searching for awhile, the short end date caught me off guard.

Here's a list of what I've got so far (sticking to the one word theme):
Gallus
Epoch
Annex
Moka
Cortado

+1 for cappuccino, OpenEE/OpenJEE and EEJ
-1 for anything with eclipse in the name

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zak-thompson Nov 30, 2017

What about just Nebula, dropping the Eclipse? I'd support that

Sorry about the adding/removing comments, was posting from wrong account

zak-thompson commented Nov 30, 2017

What about just Nebula, dropping the Eclipse? I'd support that

Sorry about the adding/removing comments, was posting from wrong account

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FYI, we already have a project named (Eclipse) Nebula.

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waynebeaton commented Nov 30, 2017

FYI, we already have a project named (Eclipse) Nebula.

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MrinalKanti Nov 30, 2017

Just realized that when I googled. Otherwise, would have been a good fit IMO.

MrinalKanti commented Nov 30, 2017

Just realized that when I googled. Otherwise, would have been a good fit IMO.

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I declare this part of the process complete! Thank you very much to everybody who participated.

As I stated earlier, we'll begin the next phase of this process shortly.

The PMC will send updates to the ee4j-community mailing list to keep the general community informed of progress.

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waynebeaton commented Nov 30, 2017

I declare this part of the process complete! Thank you very much to everybody who participated.

As I stated earlier, we'll begin the next phase of this process shortly.

The PMC will send updates to the ee4j-community mailing list to keep the general community informed of progress.

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EzrealStar Dec 3, 2017

HeroJ
sounds great~

EzrealStar commented Dec 3, 2017

HeroJ
sounds great~

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jamieb22 commented Dec 10, 2017

JavaSpec

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m-reza-rahman Dec 16, 2017

As promised, here is the open discussion on the Java EE Guardians community open letter on Java EE naming and packaging: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/javaee-guardians/ze_OFfwqFVs/9wRI7LFSAgAJ. You are cordially invited to chime in.

m-reza-rahman commented Dec 16, 2017

As promised, here is the open discussion on the Java EE Guardians community open letter on Java EE naming and packaging: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/javaee-guardians/ze_OFfwqFVs/9wRI7LFSAgAJ. You are cordially invited to chime in.

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Folks, we've initiated phase 2. More information in Issue #9.

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waynebeaton commented Feb 7, 2018

Folks, we've initiated phase 2. More information in Issue #9.

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sreedrao Feb 8, 2018

I think it should bee EZ(Eclipse-JEE) Storm

sreedrao commented Feb 8, 2018

I think it should bee EZ(Eclipse-JEE) Storm

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@sreedrao I'm afraid you waste your and everybody else's time, there are just 2 options on the table, see #9 now. Please vote if you want or abstain, should you like neither of them.

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keilw commented Feb 8, 2018

@sreedrao I'm afraid you waste your and everybody else's time, there are just 2 options on the table, see #9 now. Please vote if you want or abstain, should you like neither of them.

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michaelmpschubert Feb 8, 2018

EE4J new name idea/proposal -> KAWI EE
Why?
Kawi „native to Java“
Kawi (from Sanskrit: कवि "kavi" lit. "poet") is a literary and prose language on the islands of Java (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawi_language)
…name given to the writing system originating in Java… (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawi_script)
KAWI EE - The Enterprise Edition!

KAWI "kawi" might also be a perfect name for new classpath entries; better than "jakartaee" or "enterpriseprofile"

michaelmpschubert commented Feb 8, 2018

EE4J new name idea/proposal -> KAWI EE
Why?
Kawi „native to Java“
Kawi (from Sanskrit: कवि "kavi" lit. "poet") is a literary and prose language on the islands of Java (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawi_language)
…name given to the writing system originating in Java… (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kawi_script)
KAWI EE - The Enterprise Edition!

KAWI "kawi" might also be a perfect name for new classpath entries; better than "jakartaee" or "enterpriseprofile"

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dmatej Feb 8, 2018

This issue is already CLOSED.

dmatej commented Feb 8, 2018

This issue is already CLOSED.

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michaelmpschubert commented Feb 8, 2018

reopen IT

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What for, take the survey if you care.

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keilw commented Feb 8, 2018

What for, take the survey if you care.

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webelcomau Feb 10, 2018

I know it did not get up as an option for the final vote between Jakarta EE and Enterprise Profile, but I quite liked Open EE from @kwsutter.

Oracle, you are just being plain petty not letting Java be used. People ARE going to keep calling it (Enterprise) Java anyway for years to come, except for most recruiters who still ask for "J2EE developers" decades too late, and seem to get upset when you correct them and explain what Java EE is/was.

What I did NOT want, and thankfully is not happening, is for the top-level specifications to have the word eclipse in them. Thankfully, common sense has prevailed, and the acronym EE4J will now I understand only be used for the Eclipse-specific implementation of the specs. Good.

It is not an Eclipse project, it has a special status and special history, and the arguments that have been offered that the top-level project name has to include the word Eclipse because all other Eclipse projects do is typical Eclipse bullying. Yes, I said bullying.

My answer to the Eclipse naming convention argument ? Don't use that naming convention. You don't have to apply it, it's not a holy rule, unless you think Eclipse eclipses everything.

To the Eclipse Foundation: be nice. Java has a special status, and has devoted fans of non-Eclipse Java technologies such as NetBeans IDE, and Apache/Jakarta. Be nice. Respect the Java world outside Eclipse.

webelcomau commented Feb 10, 2018

I know it did not get up as an option for the final vote between Jakarta EE and Enterprise Profile, but I quite liked Open EE from @kwsutter.

Oracle, you are just being plain petty not letting Java be used. People ARE going to keep calling it (Enterprise) Java anyway for years to come, except for most recruiters who still ask for "J2EE developers" decades too late, and seem to get upset when you correct them and explain what Java EE is/was.

What I did NOT want, and thankfully is not happening, is for the top-level specifications to have the word eclipse in them. Thankfully, common sense has prevailed, and the acronym EE4J will now I understand only be used for the Eclipse-specific implementation of the specs. Good.

It is not an Eclipse project, it has a special status and special history, and the arguments that have been offered that the top-level project name has to include the word Eclipse because all other Eclipse projects do is typical Eclipse bullying. Yes, I said bullying.

My answer to the Eclipse naming convention argument ? Don't use that naming convention. You don't have to apply it, it's not a holy rule, unless you think Eclipse eclipses everything.

To the Eclipse Foundation: be nice. Java has a special status, and has devoted fans of non-Eclipse Java technologies such as NetBeans IDE, and Apache/Jakarta. Be nice. Respect the Java world outside Eclipse.

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webelcomau Feb 10, 2018

Vote til Feb 23 between Jakarta EE (likely to be known as JEE), and Enterprise Profile:

'The Eclipse Foundation has now opened a public poll to select a new name for Java EE'

Updated Java Guardians petition and discussion here, with some good general links.

webelcomau commented Feb 10, 2018

Vote til Feb 23 between Jakarta EE (likely to be known as JEE), and Enterprise Profile:

'The Eclipse Foundation has now opened a public poll to select a new name for Java EE'

Updated Java Guardians petition and discussion here, with some good general links.

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iamdvr Feb 10, 2018

Open Java EE (Open Java Enterprise Edition) seems good... it can also shortened to Open JEE ..

As this is not umberilla development project and is intended to publish to world for imlemeting it, no need to keep(don't keep) Eclipse prefix.

+1 to @kwsutter and @machi1990

iamdvr commented Feb 10, 2018

Open Java EE (Open Java Enterprise Edition) seems good... it can also shortened to Open JEE ..

As this is not umberilla development project and is intended to publish to world for imlemeting it, no need to keep(don't keep) Eclipse prefix.

+1 to @kwsutter and @machi1990

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eldermoraes commented Feb 10, 2018

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candycandy37374747 Feb 10, 2018

Yeah I liked the Jakarta EE name (JEE), in case Java EE name is not allowed.
But If Apache foundation can donate the Jakarta (tm) generously then why Oracle can not donate Java EE name and "javax" package ?
Even web community is free to use the JavaScript word :(

candycandy37374747 commented Feb 10, 2018

Yeah I liked the Jakarta EE name (JEE), in case Java EE name is not allowed.
But If Apache foundation can donate the Jakarta (tm) generously then why Oracle can not donate Java EE name and "javax" package ?
Even web community is free to use the JavaScript word :(

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keilw Feb 11, 2018

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@candycandy37374747 Because Jakarta is dead to Apache. It was archived in 2011, around the same time Oracle purchased Sun btw. And unlike Apache no longer offering any support or certification for Jakarta since then, Oracle still does for Java EE.

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keilw commented Feb 11, 2018

@candycandy37374747 Because Jakarta is dead to Apache. It was archived in 2011, around the same time Oracle purchased Sun btw. And unlike Apache no longer offering any support or certification for Jakarta since then, Oracle still does for Java EE.

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warrenmnocos Feb 12, 2018

Java CE - Java Cloud Edition

I suggest Java Cloud Edition (Java CE). It follows the same naming pattern of Java SE, and the late Java EE. It stresses "Cloud", where I believe enterprise Java is heading. Microservices is the thing for today, for the future, and for enterprise Java.

warrenmnocos commented Feb 12, 2018

Java CE - Java Cloud Edition

I suggest Java Cloud Edition (Java CE). It follows the same naming pattern of Java SE, and the late Java EE. It stresses "Cloud", where I believe enterprise Java is heading. Microservices is the thing for today, for the future, and for enterprise Java.

@eclipse-ee4j eclipse-ee4j locked as resolved and limited conversation to collaborators Feb 12, 2018

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Folks, I've locked this issue. We've moved past the point in the process where we can accept new name ideas. Please bring futher discussion to the ee4j-community mailing list.

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waynebeaton commented Feb 12, 2018

Folks, I've locked this issue. We've moved past the point in the process where we can accept new name ideas. Please bring futher discussion to the ee4j-community mailing list.

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