Remove excess maps from the default installation #6
Comments
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Similarly to this if we decide on the '6-10' we should consider whether there are any modifications to LUA or BSP that should be made. |
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From the looks of my latest install, the currently shipped list is
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Another thing to say is that we can include small / niche maps like ff_dm but leave them off the default maplist. |
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Here's my first stab, let me know what people think Default install:
_TOTAL: 460 MB_ Additional map pack:
_TOTAL: 419 MB_ |
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Putting ff_well on that list alarms me a bit - since when has that ever worked in any capacity? I know it's a traditional map but it's one with a lot of problems. I think we could afford to lose a few more yet when I try and think about which should go I equally think of reasons they should stay! Except ff_well. I wish compiling HDR didn't double the map size - can see which ones that has affected. Besides the point here I guess. |
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I feel the following should be added to the map pack: I also feel the following should be added to the default install: The most played maps should be on the default install and the least in the map pack. Also, we should change the prefix of maps. ff_ is too generic. It should be ctf_, avd_, etc. This will really help new players select a map in public server votes. As a side note, if the prefix is changed we will need to talk to the main server operators and ask them to change the prefix on the custom maps before the steam version is launched. |
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Just a thought but are any of the community maps worthy of being on the default installation? If so we should get permission from the mapper on adding it. |
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Yeah, ff_well is not a competitive map, but it was traditionally a fun map for 18v18 CTF pub mess-around. I guess if there are fun CTF pub maps that also work in competitive setting they are better, though. |
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The problem with the FF version of well is it's way too cramped for the games movement. It's just a cluster fuck where you're always bumping into stuff. |
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I'd be happy including ff_hunted if we took out spies. I used to really enjoy it playing vs snipers, but it's not nearly as fun now you can get stabbed by an invisible player, or someone disguised as a teammate etc. |
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I'd be interested in more people's opinions on:
Out of curiosity, did we ever change cz2 so it's more fun with low player numbers? e.g. locking down points 1 and 5 or something. Also, is it still really slow whilst you're carrying a flag? |
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Hunted has a 1 spy limit if I remember right. We could make that slot only open up past a certain number of players, perhaps. I thought that the spy really improved things when we played it in the 2.1 beta, but I can see how it can ruin things with small numbers of players.
Also, ff_dm really needs an overhaul. |
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Now that you mention it, I did know that, about cz2. Whenever i've played hunted as spy, i've found it pretty easy to kill the civ, even against a good bodyguard team. After a few stabs the map quickly gets voted away. The best hunted games I've had are when bodyguard teams are slowly taken out one by one until the civ is left alone and then he gets killed as he nears the finish. With the spy it encourages an "all or nothing" playstyle which doesn't lend itself to good feedback loops and can get demoralising quite quickly. The worst hunted games are the ones where out of nowhere suddenly the civ is dead. Also, having to shoot your teammates all the time isn't fun. The other thing about the spy is it makes low player number games feel much more empty. If the spy is playing "stealth mode". If we didn't remove the spy altogether I guess I would vote for the spy slot opening up at higher player numbers, that would definitely help. |
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Have added up/down arrows for potentially what should be promoted/demoted |
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I like it with the changes (arrows) that you have. |
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Same. Also I agree we shouldn't push out ffdm as it is and it's shameful we've left it this long lol. Perhaps that's an easy one for the community to do?? Competition and vote for inclusion in steam release? Just got to look decent and function! |
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In my opinion, ff_dm should be way more than a simple arena; it should be a showcase of what Lua is capable of. Automated mulch matches, smart spawning, multiple arenas, configurable DM modes per-arena, etc. It should be an all-in-one DM experience, not a tiny square box. The fact that exo's mulch_dm port is 10x better than ff_dm is rather ridiculous. |
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Have opened a separate issue to revamp ff_dm -> #13 It seems like we should still include it though for now, it's good at what it's for, without a replacement? |
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I've removed some maps, I've not delete the following yet: ff_well, ff_bases, ff_palermo, ff_push Default install:
_TOTAL SAVING: 232 MB_ |
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What else needs doing here? |
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I think dropping push and re-adding cornfield might be a good thing. |
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From Mike's 25th October post above I would... Drop:
Probably drop:
Unless new players really prefer them over CTF/AvD (I'm not in a position to know), drop:
A few maps you like, ideally covering a couple of gamemodes, is all it takes to get into a multiplayer game. Clearly maps you don't like may stop you from hanging around long enough to ever experience the maps you might have liked, or will just put you off the game if you do hang around long enough to know you like X/Y/Z but have to wait ages to play them. I would therefore start minimalist (it's always easy to add more maps later) with the maps that are most likely to be enjoyed by everyone (even if that means putting some of the more subjective personal favourite "marmite" maps to one side for now). Even with the fairly severe cutting suggestions I made above imo there are more than enough maps included for anyone who's ever likely to get into FF to do so (6 CTF, 5 AvD, 1 training, 1 dm) whilst keeping to a minimum the expected number of "marmite" maps. I'm also strongly in favour of renaming maps so the gamemode is clear from the name (e.g. "ctf_2fort"). |
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We did enough here to close for now |
We probably have a bunch of maps that we'd really rather people didn't play by default, and it bloats the installation a lot.
Most games release with 6-10 maps so players aren't overwhelmed, and they can focus players towards the really good maps for a good initial play experience.
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