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BIPM review: hyphen shown as em-dash #128

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manuelfuenmayor opened this issue Jun 14, 2021 · 11 comments
Closed

BIPM review: hyphen shown as em-dash #128

manuelfuenmayor opened this issue Jun 14, 2021 · 11 comments
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@manuelfuenmayor
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In relation to #112

From BIPM:
issue13

Original:
issue13-2

@manuelfuenmayor manuelfuenmayor added the bug Something isn't working label Jun 14, 2021
@ronaldtse
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We just need to make sure to use whatever was in the original document that was cited. @manuel489 can you check?

@manuelfuenmayor
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In the markup, I used a hyphen:

... _Evaluation of measurement data - Guide to the expression of uncertainty in measurement_ ...

@ronaldtse
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ronaldtse commented Jun 14, 2021

Ok so this is a bug in either MN or PDF. However, the original document uses an em dash, so we should follow that: https://www.bipm.org/documents/20126/2071204/JCGM_100_2008_E.pdf/cb0ef43f-baa5-11cf-3f85-4dcd86f77bd6

image

@manuelfuenmayor
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I see... ok.

@manuelfuenmayor
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But still, hyphens do render as em-dashes. It seems deliberate.

@ronaldtse
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I think that has to be a bug, either in the XML or PDF. @Intelligent2013 can you check? Thanks.

@Intelligent2013 Intelligent2013 added this to TRIAGE in Alexander Dyuzhev via automation Jun 16, 2021
@Intelligent2013 Intelligent2013 moved this from TRIAGE to In progress in Alexander Dyuzhev Jun 16, 2021
@Intelligent2013
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@ronaldtse looks like there is a bug (or feature) in XML.

Source adoc:

_Evaluation of measurement data - Guide to the expression of uncertainty in measurement_

Hex: 20(space) 2D(hyphen-minus) 20(space)

MN xml:

<em>Evaluation of measurement data&#8201;&#8212;&#8201;Guide to the expression of uncertainty in measurement</em>

Hex: 2009(thin space) 2014(em dash) 2009(thin space)

I've removed spaces around 2D (just for experiment) and xml contains it 'as is'

<em>Evaluation of measurement data-Guide to the expression of uncertainty in measurement</em>

@Intelligent2013 Intelligent2013 moved this from In progress to Done in Alexander Dyuzhev Jun 16, 2021
@ronaldtse
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This seems to be a bug in MN XML generation. Ping @opoudjis

@ronaldtse ronaldtse added this to Needs triage in Nick Nicholas via automation Jun 17, 2021
@opoudjis opoudjis moved this from Needs triage to High priority in Nick Nicholas Jun 17, 2021
@opoudjis opoudjis moved this from High priority to Current in Nick Nicholas Jul 13, 2021
@opoudjis
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opoudjis commented Jul 13, 2021

It is a feature and not a bug in MN XML generation, and it is deliberate. " - " is not acceptable punctuation in any style guide of English (outside of the BBC's), and is emended to be treated identically to " -- " under Asciidoctor, which converts it to " — :". I refer you to e.g. https://www.grammarly.com/blog/hyphens-and-dashes/

This behaviour of "a - b" implemented in metanorma-utils, as part of the general realisation of smart formatting. It was done because we were fetching titles from ISO with a hyphen between title components, but it was clear that ISO's intended rendering was as em-dash, as can be seen perusing any ISO document. https://www.iso.org/standard/33952.html, as you can see from the site, is Sterilization of health care products — Radiation — Part 1: Requirements for development, validation and routine control of a sterilization process for medical devices , not Sterilization of health care products - Radiation - Part 1: Requirements for development, validation and routine control of a sterilization process for medical devices, even if that is what screenscraping was intermittently returning. JCGM documents are no different to ISO documents in that regard.

Realising "a -- b" as "a — b" is a canonical substitution in Asciidoctor, and realising "a - b" in the same way is consistent. To smarten quotation marks, but to leave hyphens as punctuation (!), defeats the purpose of smart quotes.

If you want to reproduce the punctuation of the original in contravention of ISO style and standard punctuation practice, you can, but that should not be default Metanorma behaviour. As documented in https://www.metanorma.org/author/ref/asciidoc-tips/, interpolate a zero-width joiner: Sterilization of health care products &#x200c;- Radiation &#x200c;- Part 1: Requirements for development, validation and routine control of a sterilization process for medical devices

https://www.metanorma.org/author/ref/asciidoc-tips/ documents the behaviour of " -- ", but does not document the parallel treatment of " - "; adding to documentation.

opoudjis added a commit to metanorma/metanorma.org that referenced this issue Jul 13, 2021
Nick Nicholas automation moved this from Current to Closed Jul 13, 2021
@ronaldtse
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I have consulted BIPM to confirm that this is a non-issue, will update.

@ronaldtse
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Confirmed with Michael Stock of BIPM:

I checked in a number of ‘style guides’ which of hypen, en dash or em dash is most adequate, and found that it is indeed the em dash, which is used on the title page of JCGM 100:2008 and which apparently you also have chosen.

Therefore no further action is needed.

ronaldtse pushed a commit to metanorma/metanorma.org that referenced this issue Jul 21, 2021
ronaldtse added a commit to metanorma/metanorma.org that referenced this issue Aug 4, 2021
* main: (46 commits)
  Update reviewer-notes.adoc
  Update reviewer-notes.adoc
  Minor updates to GHA
  Update collections documentation
  update
  index on collections manifest: metanorma/metanorma-standoc#440
  Update proxy post
  Fix HTTP proxy env var name
  Update blog about proxies
  #450 add documentation about proxies
  explanation of treatment of space-hyphen-space: metanorma/bipm-si-brochure#128
  Use phrase “Terms and definitions” instead of “Terms & Definitions”
  Update to documentation on concept noref, noital
  concept noital, noref refactor: metanorma/metanorma-standoc#468
  symbol concepts: metanorma/metanorma-standoc#488
  ISO update
  concept/@noref, @noital: metanorma/metanorma-standoc#468
  form classes: metanorma/metanorma-standoc#495
  Updated docs on PDF generation
  correct IETF doc on published-date not revdate being used: metanorma/metanorma-ietf#157
  ...
ronaldtse pushed a commit to metanorma/metanorma.org that referenced this issue Oct 5, 2021
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