Need way to expose content insertions and deletions #4

aleventhal · 2018-05-21T15:18:27Z

Content sometimes needs to indicate a content insertion/deletion (can be proposed change to content or has already occurred). In HTML this is indicated with the <ins> and <del> tags. Also, ARIA 1.2 plans to add roles for this. This will be very useful for online collaborative word processors and editors, such as Google Docs.

Mick Curran suggested that this be a text attribute. For example: diff:del and diff:ins. It could also be a role.

I suggest going with Mick's recommendation unless there's a counter proposal.

jcsteh · 2018-05-22T02:41:00Z

I agree with this being a text attribute. I'd suggest different naming, though; perhaps revision:insertion/revision:deletion or change:insertion/change:deletion. Note that we may eventually want supplementary attributes such as revision-author and revision-date.

@asurkov, thoughts?

aleventhal · 2018-05-22T11:10:15Z

I'm fine with revisition:insertion|deletion. Can we do that? We'll need to update the docs and file an issue for Firefox, right? I'll take care of asking Windows AT vendors to add support.

Here's the Chrome issue where I'm working on it: https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=843744

asurkov · 2018-05-22T17:01:41Z

Agreed, IA2 text attributes look nicely for text marked by HTML ins/del elements. However these elements have @cite and @datetime attributes, which may be of interest of AT as well.

We have 5 years old bug (https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=903187), where I mentioned, that Jamie twitted to go with object attributes, which means, to create accessible objects for elements. Also, new ARIA roles will fit better into ARIA concept, which traditionally requires to create accessible object for elements having @ROLE attribute (expect none/presentation roles for sure).

In short, I like text attributes conceptually, but it looks it is less flexible approach. At least, until we extend text attributes API to expose any value, like we did for object attributes.

aleventhal · 2018-05-22T17:54:24Z

Talked to @asurkov on IRC. We could also use IA2_ROLE_CONTENT_INSERTION and IA2_ROLE_CONTENT_DELETION with the following object attributes "cite" and "datetime". @jcsteh what do you think? Would we still need text attributes or would that be redundant?

jcsteh · 2018-05-22T23:59:06Z

@asurkov commented on May 23, 2018, 3:01 AM GMT+10:

However these elements have @cite and @datetime attributes, which may be of interest of AT as well.

Ug. I forgot about these. Still, we could just expose their values as text attributes too if we went with text attributes.

We have 5 years old bug (https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=903187), where I mentioned, that Jamie twitted to go with object attributes, which means, to create accessible objects for elements.

Oh. I'm not quite sure why my past self decided that. I guess it was in response to needing to deal with the cite attribute.

In short, I like text attributes conceptually, but it looks it is less flexible approach. At least, until we extend text attributes API to expose any value, like we did for object attributes.

I don't see a big issue with exposing cite and datetime as text attributes: revision-cite, revisoin-datetime. Am I missing something?

I'd like @michaelDCurran's thoughts here. I know we discussed text attributes last time we spoke about this, but we didn't think about the cite attribute, which allows you to specify a URL describing the change. (That said, does anyone even use this?) However, it also occurred to me that we'll probably want to support quick nav to annotations and that might be a bit tricky for text attributes. Note that we'd have that same problem for spelling errors, though.

@joanmarie, I'd also like your perspective on this regarding ATK, given that we generally try to keep IA2 and ATK in sync. In the past, you've expressed a preference for objects over text attributes for sup/sub. Does this preference also apply to ins/del? Does ATK have roles for these already?

aleventhal · 2018-05-23T00:06:53Z

Spelling/grammar are already handled via invalid:spelling|grammar text attribute.
@jcsteh I didn't see you address the idea of using a role. This is what Mac does. We can use object attributes for cite and datetime.

asurkov · 2018-05-23T16:40:03Z

Seems Mac set a precedence, and thus it's easier to expose accessible objects for ins/del elements for all platforms. @aleventhal suggested to expose both, which may be reasonable, if the consensus is we want to expose those via text attributes on IA2/ATK. I'm not sure whether we need specialized roles for the elements in this case or we can go with generic ones.

aleventhal · 2018-05-23T17:13:06Z

@asurkov , I actually prefer just the new roles and no text attributes. I'll check with Mick. I consider the @cite and @datetime to be red herrings, but they could be exposed as object attributes.

aleventhal · 2018-05-24T15:54:51Z

Mick said he's ok with the roles. I tried to fork so that I could create a pull request, but I'm not permitted. Here is my suggested added text to AccessibleRoles.idl:

/**

Content previously deleted or proposed to be deleted, e.g. in revision
history or a content view providing suggestions from reviewers.
*/
IA2_ROLE_CONTENT_DELETION,

/**

Content previously inserted or proposed to be inserted, e.g. in revision
history or a content view providing suggestions from reviewers.
*/
IA2_ROLE_CONTENT_INSERTION

asurkov · 2018-05-24T16:39:29Z

We should fix it. Let me contact to the group owner.

…

On Thu, May 24, 2018 at 11:54 AM, Aaron Leventhal ***@***.***> wrote: Mick said he's ok with the roles. I tried to fork so that I could create a pull request, but I'm not permitted. Here is my suggested added text to AccessibleRoles.idl: /** - Content previously deleted or proposed to be deleted, e.g. in revision - history or a content view providing suggestions from reviewers. */ IA2_ROLE_CONTENT_DELETION, /** - Content previously inserted or proposed to be inserted, e.g. in revision - history or a content view providing suggestions from reviewers. */ IA2_ROLE_CONTENT_INSERTION — You are receiving this because you were mentioned. Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub <#4 (comment)>, or mute the thread <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ABdnqWFVl_ajRTeAFQUJ1erVIuf1JRQlks5t1tfLgaJpZM4UHKLI> .

aleventhal · 2018-05-24T19:40:20Z

Mick was fine with the roles in the end, because of consistency with HTML/ARIA/Mac. Can someone add something like this to the IDL? I tried to fork in order to do a pull req but didn't have permissions.

/**

Content previously deleted or proposed to be deleted, e.g. in revision
history or a content view providing suggestions from reviewers.
*/
IA2_ROLE_CONTENT_DELETION,

/**

Content previously inserted or proposed to be inserted, e.g. in revision
history or a content view providing suggestions from reviewers.
*/
IA2_ROLE_CONTENT_INSERTION

asurkov · 2018-05-24T19:57:41Z

@aleventhal I sent a request to allow forking and also created a pull request for your change #5

In HTML via <ins>/<del>, and planned for ARIA 1.2, it is possible to mark insertions and deletions in a document. These need to be exposed to screen readers so that they can read revision changes or change suggestions from document reviewers. For now, ins/del are now mapped to internal roles, automation roles and OS X subroles. We are waiting for roles from IA2 for the new roles there. Here is the github issue: LinuxA11y/IAccessible2#4 TBR=spang@chromium.org Bug: 843744 Cq-Include-Trybots: master.tryserver.chromium.linux:closure_compilation Change-Id: I90e6d3140f6136a71e0d2f49b0b8d615485536bb Reviewed-on: https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/1067362 Commit-Queue: Aaron Leventhal <aleventhal@chromium.org> Reviewed-by: Dominic Mazzoni <dmazzoni@chromium.org> Reviewed-by: Steven Bennetts <stevenjb@chromium.org> Reviewed-by: David Tseng <dtseng@chromium.org> Cr-Commit-Position: refs/heads/master@{#561920}

jcsteh · 2018-07-26T06:59:35Z

#5 was merged and adds the roles. Closing.

jcsteh closed this as completed Jul 26, 2018

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Need way to expose content insertions and deletions #4

Need way to expose content insertions and deletions #4

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jcsteh commented Jul 26, 2018

Need way to expose content insertions and deletions #4

Need way to expose content insertions and deletions #4

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