New Zoe ZE50 and CanZE (iOS and Android) #588
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Nice. What command did you send? 7df (broadcast)? That is what the tool of the general mechanic did and he indeed pulled out the VIN but nothing more |
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First, to read the VIN,
For each address (26, 27, 51, 67, 68, 77, 95), I send an isotp request (xxx.2181) on can network with can protocol first and if vin is not read, same request with kwp2000 protocol.
Next step is to analyze ecus
For each address available (my vehicle database comes from ddt2000 files)
I first send start session can (1003)
Next I send 22F1A0 request
Next 22F18A
Next 22F194
And finally 22F195
So I get Diagversion, supplier, soft, etc
Next step is to find ecu or approximate ecu or a list of available ecu corresponding to data I get.
(I have build a database of ecu by analyzing and aggregating different ddt 2000 databases I found)
And finally, download xml ecu definition from my server and building internal database ecu -> request -> send & receive data items -> datas
Don’t know if I my explanations are limpidity :-)
Frédéric RICHARD
… Le 30 nov. 2019 à 16:39, yoh-there ***@***.***> a écrit :
Nice. What command did you send? 7df (broadcast)? That is what the tool of the general mechanic did and he indeed pulled out the VIN but nothing more
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Yes it makes sense :-) I am very curious if all the ECU's responded and if not, which one did. I am pretty sure there are no free frames on the Diagnostic bus and it looks like the MM bus has been removed. |
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What exactly do you mean with "for each address"? I don't understand as those (26, 27, ...) are not ECU CAN addresses. I would expect 765/745, 7bc/79c etcetera. |
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Each address can be mapped into rx and tx address.
I think I got this list on a vehicle.xml file in ddt2000 database.
I check this tomorrow if I have time.
Frédéric RICHARD
… Le 1 déc. 2019 à 15:31, yoh-there ***@***.***> a écrit :
What exactly do you mean with "for each address"? I don't understand as those (26, 27, ...) are not ECU CAN addresses. I would expect 765/745, 7bc/79c etcetera.
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Oh I see what you mean, I think you meant eculist.xml. The universal car diagnostic computer issues a broadcast. But I couldn't see which ECU responded with the VIN. Oh well, next time ;-) |
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There is no link between ecu list and vin
I use vin as primary key to store ecu information on my database
This is to avoid to rescan ecus after each install or reinstall.
Frédéric RICHARD
…> Le 1 déc. 2019 à 16:30, yoh-there ***@***.***> a écrit :
Oh I see what you mean, I think you meant eculist.xml.
The universal car diagnostic computer issues a broadcast. But I couldn't see which ECU responded with the VIN. Oh well, next time ;-)
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Vin is necessary to know witch vehicle CanZE is talking with ;-)
Frédéric RICHARD
… Le 1 déc. 2019 à 16:30, yoh-there ***@***.***> a écrit :
Oh I see what you mean, I think you meant eculist.xml.
The universal car diagnostic computer issues a broadcast. But I couldn't see which ECU responded with the VIN. Oh well, next time ;-)
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Someone in the German forum suggested the ZE50 uses 29 bit CAN addressing. If true I would be very surprised as I would not have suspected such a serious change. Then again, if it's true , the problem is probably simpler to solve than we thought, and my sniffer might just have been ignoring all the frames. Do you know more already Frédéric? |
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Happy new year !
At this time, no infos.
I will meet ZE50 user on Monday January 13.
Wait and see.
Regards,
Frédéric RICHARD
… Le 1 janv. 2020 à 11:48, yoh-there ***@***.***> a écrit :
Someone in the German forum suggested the ZE50 uses 29 bit CAN addressing. If true I would be very surprised as I would not have suspected such a serious change. Then again, if it's true , the problem is probably simpler to solve than we thought, and my sniffer might just have been ignoring all the frames. Do you know more already Frédéric?
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Same to you and the (new) family ;-) Cool (Monday). If you bring any sniffer material, remember the 29 bits stuff. My current sniffer (CanSee) does throw numbers other than standard 11 bits addressing away, so maybe I have been working with completely wrong assumptions all along. I will try to have a bit more confirmation before Monday and will post here if so. |
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Thanks.
At first time, i will do my Ecu scan procedure to load right ecu xml file.
Once done, I will analyze request, data items , data’s ... and I will try to add Z.E. 50 to my CanZE sid array.
Regards
Frédéric RICHARD
… Le 1 janv. 2020 à 13:40, yoh-there ***@***.***> a écrit :
Same to you and the (new) family ;-)
Cool (Monday). If you bring any sniffer material, remeber the 29 bits stuff. My current sniffer (CanSee) does throw numbers other than standard 11 bits addressing away, so maybe I have been working with completely wrong assumptions all along. I will try to have a bit more confirmation before Monday and will post here if so.
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Can you maybe send me the very very most recent xml's you could find please? Google does drive me nuts on this one. I would appreciate it. |
All new Renault, Dacia, Nissan on C1A electronics platform use 29 bit addresses for the drive control units. |
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Thanks @KarelSvo , good to know. The guy from the German forum suggested only the motor controller used extended addressing, the remainder standard. Mixing is allowed on the network level of course but ick! |
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The 11 <> 29 bits addressing is quite a bit more complicated. Many new or upgraded boxes, some 11 bits, some 29, some both. I will amend the massive spreadsheet (ECU tab) as soon as I can. |
yoh-there
changed the title
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First Beta is out, actually more alpha regarding the ZE50 stuff. The ECU tab in the spreadsheet is slowly being ammended, |
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There is something i can do to use a beta version of ios app on my ZE50? I could try and give you my feedback about. |
No IOS beta app yet? |
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Hi,
A new iOS beta app will be available soon
Regards
Frédéric RICHARD
… Le 24 févr. 2020 à 10:54, arqueox ***@***.***> a écrit :
First Beta is out, actually more alpha regarding the ZE50 stuff. The ECU tab in the spreadsheet is slowly being ammended,
No IOS beta app yet?
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Oh thnx! I’ll wait then |
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I can borrow this. I tried CanZE for Android using Samsung S8. Appversion 1.52beta4. Tried with Zoe R135 (ZE50) - Swedish car. I used two different ODBII dongles (first a bluetooth one I bought previously and after reading your recommendation I ordered Konweii and tried with that one. Hopefully debug logs can tell you something. I'm really looking forward to be able to see more detailed information about my Zoe :) |
Yes there is a python kivy app that can show such information ;) |
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Getting there. Seems like the braking system has changed significantly, so we might need to defer the torques, but there is progress. Getting info out is "cracked". Getting the same info presented consistently is a different game. |
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@yoh-there yes I did select ZE50. I had to checkout 8640b0f to be able to do it.
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Fair dinkum. But as you can see, it does actually successfully access the LBC, digging up temperatures. I think the heat maps actually both work, so the voltages graph here is just a definition problem in and a separate layout XML is probably the best way to go. I will drop my email address in your contact form. If you can reply I can send you some data that will I think will be of use. Thank you for the effort! |
Yes I did, but didn't get much info from CanZE, the only info is the accel pedal position. |
Since the APP contains original data from Renault, it is not officially offered. |
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@KarelSvo I am warning other readers against bad practices, it was not aimed at you, though I would appreciate you not posting links to unchecked apk's. It's fine to post them on your own github account and link to those posts from here. Let me know when you've done this please. Thank you for your warning re copyright. |
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@ik2wxx I think you should at least get the two right hand graphs @miguel-negrao showed, and, but I am going from memory here, the two heat maps. Car must be switched on. |
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@yoh-there I managed to make a CanSee dongle, get the app running in Android Studio and I'm currently in the car fiddling with things. |
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Great news! I would appreciate a direct contact (email or Signal). I could not leave mine on your website listed on your github profile, I can send you some extra info probably then. You are correct re. the filename. Assuming keeping the gateway open is enough for all ECU's, this should be the only thing you need to change / maintain. The very first field in a line, if listed, is the equivalent of the id's in the old ZOE's. This is used as a further meaningless key everywhere else in the code. I can't say which fields worked or not (sorry!), but I remember I had the least problems with the battery (the LBC). If I remember correctly the two heat-maps work. Out of personal interest my focus has always been on the consumption screen and and the Technical >> Charging screen, so there you will find most of the already working fields. You can also do a "shortcut" testing fields using the Experimental >> Research screen, it expects a file in the same format but in the file system for it's dynamic definitions. |
Yes I got access to those screen, but the only info I got is SOC (and it was different from the car dashboard). |
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Hi, |
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My advice would be to concentrate on the Technical >> Charging screen. Have a look at this post https://canze.fisch.lu/screen-for-researchers/ And this file https://github.com/fesch/CanZE/blob/master/app/src/main/assets/_FieldsZE50.csv The _Research.csv file is in exactly this format and you can start with a single field. Is it an idea if I open a google spreadsheet for the people who want to participate, loading it with _FieldsZE50.csv, and then add a few columns for confirmation, who did it, proposed changes etc? I cannot participate in the testing but I can push out beta's now and then. |
You have simply assigned the byte-data definitions from phase 1 with a 29 bit address from phase 2. an example |
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@KarelSvo First, you show a fundamental misunderstanding of the code. 29 bit addressing is fully implemented. The first field of the data definition, if used, is simply a key that is used to access it's definition further in the data. If it is not given, it is generated. While it looks like an 11 bit code, it could have been called "KarelsField31" for what I care. Maintaining old keys avoids a lot of recoding activities, obviously. Can I politely suggest a better understanding of the code if you want to go that route? Second, long, long ago, I have been transparent to Renault (referring to your earlier thin ice comment), been at their offices. Short version: the couldn't care less. But again, thanks for the warning. Finally, Pyren which you are pushing here is a mild knockoff of DDT4ALL. As you have forked it I assume you are familiar with it. I have also been transparent to Cedric, who is a very helpful guy, as well as going through his code. I know of all the XML definition files, know how to parse them, and I know some ECU's have fundamentally changed. A short look at for instance the definition of cell voltages would have shown how that translates. As requested earlier, please remove the direct link to the pyren APK download. This is not a dismissal of pyren: we respect the project, they have done fabulous work. We just don't appreciate random downloads to a sharing site without any trail of what has happened with the code. As always, we welcome questions, fair criticism and contributions. So far you haven't shown any inclination to share your knowledge in this project. Continuing this way, with the utmost respect, I don't think we have much to learn from you here. |
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I have made some progress and got some new valid measurements. As you said, it takes a lot of time to not only find the correct request but to also validate the returned values for actual use. |
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@FulminatingGhost Great! And even a broken clock is right twice a day ;-) So yes, there is often difference between two, if only because of timing differences. I have no preference, but when I choose, my priority is:
If you can share a google account name with me I can let you in on a work in as others are doing some testing too. If you don't want to share it here, leave a comment on the CanZE blog. Comments there are always moderated so if you start with "DO NOT PUBLISH PLEASE" , good chance I find it before it's approved. |
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@yoh-there You can contact me via xxxxx |
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Good point. The BCB has always been a b***h. On the old ZOEs it needed to be constantly kept in a diagnostic session, where the other ECUs don't care. It might work if you change the last field in the line for the BCB ECU in _EcusZE50.csv from 0 to 1. It does do the trick in the older models. I will add a new tab in the ZE50 sheet to indicate things like this. |
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There is progress, see https://canze.fisch.lu/new-1-53beta3/ |
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I had installed the 1.53 beta. Uninstalled it, dropped from the beta program, searched and installed 1.54. |
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Cheers - looks like it might have been the dongle as it stopped communicating. Having been sent a second by accident I swapped in that and I now get some readings - though once it disconnects that seems to be it - I see on reconnecting data flow lights on the dongle but get nothing in the app - I assume CanZE is not getting enough information before BT drops again so suspect I might be stuck until a more powerful dongle is found to work and be a reasonable price. Edit update - saw the Problems with KONWEI Dongle #4, took the original one out of the bin and applied the fix (who would have thought a loupe bought for fixing/tweaking fountain pen nibs would have been used in the automotive world ...) and - Bang! - works :) |
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Happy it works! |
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Hi, Did someone find ECU/Request/data to read Range Estimate ? source code refers to ecu at address 0x95 but DDT2000 database (Vehicle -> x10ph2) doesn't seems to have 0x95 addressed ECU ? I didn't find anything in LBC ? |
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No, we don't have the GOM yet in Ph2 |
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Hi, Can I have access to the testflight beta longer than 12 hours? In exchange I can create a hungarian translate for the app. Also I have an R135 Zoe (2020) with a Renault Can Clip and I dont fear to use it :) Let me know If you need something to check. Thanks, |
Access to Testflight is free. |
Hi Adam, Do you have a "real" CLIP tool? I got "Ali" hardware but the software was lousy. Reason I am asking we have not been able to figure out to get the current range estimate from the ZE50. Any chance you can confirm CLIP can pull that out of the car? If so, we can start a new topic/issue. |
Yes, thank you, but the only invite link I found is this: https://testflight.apple.com/join/gypjWAtk And this expires after 12h.
Well it's a chinese clone, but the better one and I also modified it's can bus so it don't show me the typical multiplexed network error. I use it almost everyday on a lot of twingo. But I haven't tried it on my ZE50 yet. I give it a try at the weekend. |
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Closing (stale) |
Hi, all
I could approach a new Z.E. 50 Zoe yesterday.
After adding the first 9 digits of the vin to my online vin decoder database, I could identify the new Zoe with the latest iOS beta.
As the car was only in the showroom, I couldn’t start it but it was possible to CanZE to identify at least one ecu.
I wish I can spend one hour next week to plug my dongle in a new Zoe and use CanZE to identify all ecu’s
If it work’s, I’ll publish the results ;-)
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