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Current situation of Tox #1379

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rr44 opened this Issue Jul 5, 2015 · 343 comments

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

It has come to my attention @stqism stole thousands of dollars that were donated to the Tox Foundation™ so he could pay for his college tuition.
Is that really the truth? What does @stqism has to say to defend himself and shed some light what kind of foundation the "Tox Foundation" really is and how its leaders behave? I heard accusations from @stqism that @irungentoo behaved with nepotism at the GSoC program, besides other heavy stuff. It would be cool to have this cleaned up.

Also, this question goes to you, @irungentoo
Many developers quit because of @stqism
The head of PR, loved by the community, @Proplex quit because he _told you_ about @stqism and how shady he was in dealing with money, but you ignored until he left the project after 2 years of huge contributions. The same thing happened a few months later with @Astonex which is told by him here: https://markwinter.me/my-time-tox/ Other quit long before, mostly due to the way you @irungentoo and your friend @stqism dealt with money and other leadership matters, the list includes besides many other people: @mannol @Martijnvdc @ollieh @FullName @notadecent @mahkoh and even @stal888 is considering quitting after all this mess.
Why did you leave so many good people quit before finally kicking @stqism? This makes it look like you were in his shady business together with him. Please, EXPLAIN the situation clearly so we understand what really happened. Everyone is confused and you enforcing censorship instead of clarifying the situation doesn't help at all. Be honest to people that donated you money and supported the project in any way. It would be good to hear @stqism and the other devs take on all this.

I know this is the repository for programming the core of tox, but this issue is huge and can't be ignored for any longer. Just don't delete it as happened in the past. This needs proper explanation.

Thank you for your time and for understanding.
Let's have a good discussion,
Your friend,
Adrian

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mahkoh commented Jul 5, 2015

Other quit long before, mostly due to the way you @irungentoo and your friend @stqism dealt with money and other leadership matters, the list includes besides many other people: [...] @mahkoh

Nonsense, tbh.

http://boards.4chan.org/g/thread/48852266

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

@mahkoh why did you quit if not because of that?
That's the first step to clear all confusion! Everybody must tell their side of the story and explain the situation so we don't get lost in a sea of rumours that can't be trusted. We need more people like you to stand up and explain what's going on.

Especially the former 3 leaders of Tox: @stqism @irungentoo @Proplex
@Proplex left, according to what I read, because @stqism was dealing with money in shady ways and because @irungentoo was reading his personal emails and tried to steal his VPN account.
Then @stqism was kicked out because he stole thousands of dollars from the foundation.

Is this information true?

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optimumtact commented Jul 5, 2015

This isn't really an appropriate place to discuss this

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hexafluoride commented Jul 5, 2015

@optimumtact I'd like some light on this matter too.

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

It's the place with most visibility.
This whole situation really needs an explanation to the community and most people of the community access this repository, so it is a good place (although it isn't perfect). Please don't enforce censorship, @irungentoo
Just make things clear and let us all of the community discuss the situation with you.

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stal888 commented Jul 5, 2015

fantastic

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

@stal888
What's fantastic? That this issue was finally brought up for discussion, as it should long ago? Good to have your support.
What's your take on it, as a Tox developer?

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stal888 commented Jul 5, 2015

@rr44 I would like you to come and neehpost with us in IRC

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

I don't do IRC, sorry. Also, this is the place with most visibility for the community to discuss what matters. Could we go on?

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stal888 commented Jul 5, 2015

@rr44 no, sorry

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mannol commented Jul 5, 2015

sorry

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urras commented Jul 5, 2015

@rr44 I'm waiting for @irungentoo to make a statement on this matter too. However, in the past we're had issues with someone creating Github accounts for the sole purpose of slandering this project, which is why I'm concerned with your Github history. I do apologize if this seems a bit ridiculous, but you have to understand that in the past we've been spammed by a single user who appears to be incredibly motivated to cause damage to this project. I really hate to ask this of you, but I really would appreciate it if you showed up in one of our IRC channels, just so we know that you're not someone who's trying to cause intentional damage, even if you "don't do IRC".

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

You can see I have had this account for 2.5 years, so I'm surely not that person that creates many accounts. Also, why would it even matter since this is such a huge concern from the entire community?
I'm really sorry if this isn't what's going on, but it appears to me you guys are trying to change focus with all this off-topic talk about IRC, etc.

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irungentoo commented Jul 5, 2015

Yes @stqism stole 3K USD from the foundation, I trusted him and it turned out to be a mistake. We all hope that he will repent and give the money back.

I think everyone (Including myself) has learnt from this and we will make sure that something like this won't ever happen again.

The rest of your post is almost entirely blatant lies, how dare you use this issue to push your own shit across.

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

@irungentoo then explain some things for us:

  1. Why did you let @Proplex @Astonex and other developers quit after all they've done? They left because they thought @stqism was acting in a shady way with donations and you wouldn't listen, right?
  2. You were supposed to be a part of Tox Foundation and stq told everyone you were, but apparently this wasnt the case and stq was the only board member. Why did you cover this up?
  3. @stqism accused you of nepotism in last year's GSoC. Is that also a lie he made to make you look bad? The community doesn't know what to believe.
  4. People have been warning against stqism for almost 2 years and yet you let him do what he wanted, always giving more power. Why? Why didn't you ask for more transparency on the way money was handled? It took the need for theft to happen before you considered it an important matter? Why everyone knew about stqism shady business but you didn't somehow?
  5. Why isn't there a proper explanation for the users that donated such as myself, but instead you try to cover this issue up?
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Zer0-One commented Jul 5, 2015

@rr44 regarding point 5, we ARE trying to put up an explanation, but we keep having shitty infrastructure trouble. We'll post something once we're done scrambling to put certain pieces back together.

IMO, having this conversation here and now is counter-productive. We'll address all of your concerns, even your ridiculous notion that there is a "cover-up" going on, when we're ready and able.

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

Well, I'm not only interested in Tox explanation.
We should also hear the other side of the story from @Proplex @stqism @Astonex and all others.
As they don't have fancy sites like http://tox.im that everyone access, this place is a good medium for a raw discussion on this matter.
This is what's needed, a debate. A fruitful discussion.
Let's wait for irungentoo to addresses the 5 points I exposed so we can keep on going.

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urras commented Jul 5, 2015

@rr44 I'm not trying to change the focus of this discussion at all. You're original post is partially right, nonetheless. Stqism stole a lot of money, lots of really great people have left the project (though many of them just stopped contributing, which happens a lot in open source projects), and we've had a ton of internal conflict regarding everything that's happened. But I'm still not convinced you are who you say you are.

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optimumtact commented Jul 5, 2015

Most of them have moved on and are not likely to comeback to discuss what happened.
Astonex has documented their thoughts on their blog https://markwinter.me/ but most of the others have not publicly commented and will not likely do so

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stal888 commented Jul 5, 2015

users that donated such as myself

I'm sorry for your loss.

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

Our loss, @stal888
What I donated went to the Tox Foundation and the embezzlement that happened is a loss for the entire community.

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stal888 commented Jul 5, 2015

@rr44 It's ok, we can rebuild tox to be stronger.

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

How?

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stal888 commented Jul 5, 2015

By making Tox proprietary. If Tox isn't a community project, then nobody can criticize us

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ProMcTagonist commented Jul 5, 2015

stal has been deployed, everyone bail

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rr44 commented Jul 5, 2015

But then we can't know if Tox is secure. We need the source code (and independent security audits of course).

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optimumtact commented Jul 5, 2015

They're just saying these things to get a rise out of you, just ignore them

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CandyGumdrop commented Jul 5, 2015

stq was the heart and soul of Tox. Tox has been killed.

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stqism commented Jul 6, 2015

@rr44

@stqism accused you of nepotism in last year's GSoC. Is that also a lie he made to make you look bad? The community doesn't know what to believe.

Not at all, I was more or less forced in to choosing irungentoo's brother for GSoC.

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stal888 commented Jul 6, 2015

@stqism Tell me more about drakefish and @irungentoo

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zetok commented Jul 13, 2015

@two-dogs um, if it's not clear already, this issue isn't a place of serious discussion.. but I'll bite your question anyway.

http://download.opensuse.org/repositories/home:/ecsos:/tox/openSUSE_Tumbleweed/ <-- i use it, works fine, since we are asking where does it come from, please tell me my source for tox client is not evil, and yes, it was meant as a serious question.

You should ask that question the person who maintains that repo… today is the first time that I've heard about this repo.

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zetok commented Jul 13, 2015

@installgen2 it's a Caturday, right?
z5miokk

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CloverField commented Jul 13, 2015

Caturday was two days ago man.
On Jul 13, 2015 8:26 AM, "zetok" notifications@github.com wrote:

@installgen2 https://github.com/installgen2 it's a Caturday, right?
[image: z5miokk]
https://cloud.githubusercontent.com/assets/3148759/8649314/29f792ee-2961-11e5-9acb-4665f2a90c27.jpg


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#1379 (comment)
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zetok commented Jul 13, 2015

@CloverField b-b-but isn't every day a Caturday?

tumblr_lx94fhkfgk1r2rj8po1_1280

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CloverField commented Jul 13, 2015

I dono its been a while since I tried to remember the meme rules.
On Jul 13, 2015 8:38 AM, "zetok" notifications@github.com wrote:

@CloverField https://github.com/CloverField b-b-but isn't every day a
Caturday?

[image: tumblr_lx94fhkfgk1r2rj8po1_1280]
https://cloud.githubusercontent.com/assets/3148759/8649667/3f7714a2-2964-11e5-9662-e56af3f806fb.jpg


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#1379 (comment)
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JX7P commented Jul 13, 2015

@installgen2 Surely this is a very high quality meme. Even such conoisseurs of the finest memes as @hexafluoride will bow in respek.

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suhr commented Jul 13, 2015

One more pic in this ITT thread.

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ijustwanttodie commented Jul 13, 2015

benis

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CloverField commented Jul 13, 2015

That is one of my favorite maymays.
On Jul 13, 2015 11:11 AM, "ijustwanttodie" notifications@github.com wrote:

benis


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#1379 (comment)
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ijustwanttodie commented Jul 13, 2015

Nauran xD kuin paholainen onnettomuus :DDDD

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CloverField commented Jul 13, 2015

This is the best library I've seen I a while.
On Jul 13, 2015 12:11 PM, "ijustwanttodie" notifications@github.com wrote:

Nauran xD kuin paholainen onnettomuus :DDDD

https://camo.githubusercontent.com/09253c178eaa040b24c0ca438305d79fe6536cef/68747470733a2f2f692e696d6775722e636f6d2f6f694b6c412e706e67


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#1379 (comment)
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stal888 commented Jul 13, 2015

It is a pity that it is in javascript.

Please rewrite it in str8c and we can look into integrating it in toxcore.

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ijustwanttodie commented Jul 13, 2015

@CloverField Mitä vittua sinä vain vittu sanovat minusta, senkin narttu? Otan tiedät olen valmistunut alkuun minun luokan Navy Seals, ja olen ollut mukana lukuisissa salassa ratsioita Al-Qaidan, ja minulla on yli 300 vahvistanut tappaa. Olen koulutettu gorilla sodankäyntiin ja olen ylhäältä ampuja koko Yhdysvaltain asevoimien. Olet minulle mitään, vaan vain yksi tavoite. Minä pyyhin sinut vittuun tarkasti jollaista ei ole koskaan ennen nähty maan päällä, merkitse minun vitun sanoja. Luulet saada pois sanomalla, että paskaa minulle Internetin? Mieti uudelleen, kusipää. Tälläkin Olen yhteyttä salainen verkosto vakoojia ympäri USA ja IP on jäljittää juuri nyt joten parempi valmistautua myrsky, mato. Myrsky tuhoaa säälittävä pikku juttu soittaa elämääsi. Olet vitun kuollut, poika. En voi olla missä tahansa, milloin tahansa, ja voin tappaa sinut yli seitsemänsataa tavoilla, ja se on vain paljain käsin. Ei vain olen laajasti koulutettu aseeton taistelussa, mutta minulla on pääsy koko arsenaali Yhdysvaltain merijalkaväki, ja aion käyttää sitä koko laajuudessaan pyyhkiä kurja perse päältä mantereella, senkin paska. Jos vain olet voinut tietää, mitä epäpyhää kosto teidän pikku "fiksu" kommentti oli noin kaataa päällesi, ehkä olisi ollut vitun kielen. Mutta et voisi, et ole, ja nyt maksat hintaa, sinulla jumalauta idiootti. Aion paskaa raivoa ympäri ja te hukkuu sitä. Olet vitun kuollut, penska.

muokata: :DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

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stal888 commented Jul 13, 2015

@ijustwanttodie Allahu ackbar brother

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wiiaam commented Jul 13, 2015

@installgen2 hi mika

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wiiaam commented Jul 13, 2015

@installgen2 sick memes going on here

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subliun commented Jul 13, 2015

@rr44 I made a word cloud of all the shitposting you've inspired. The brown symbolises symbolism.
word cloud

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ijustwanttodie commented Jul 13, 2015

@stal888 alalh ebin xD

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ijustwanttodie commented Jul 13, 2015

@installgen2 HOW ABOUT FUCK YOU :DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD

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stal888 commented Jul 13, 2015

benis

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irungentoo commented Jul 13, 2015

Continue all discussion/shitposting in: http://str8c.me/tox/pb/

@irungentoo irungentoo closed this Jul 13, 2015

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subliun commented Jul 13, 2015

can't stop me

@installgen2 please change th to rd. you're killing me

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stal888 commented Jul 13, 2015

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irungentoo commented Jul 13, 2015

don't make me lock this. New thread is here: http://str8c.me/tox/pb/

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stal888 commented Jul 13, 2015

@irungentoo You don't have the guts.

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stqism commented Jul 13, 2015

And I thought I was bad, you guys spammed me with 117 new notifications because of emails.

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fcore117 commented Jul 13, 2015

stqism, sell your laptop from picture so it is a first start to return money.

Repository owner locked and limited conversation to collaborators Jul 13, 2015

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irungentoo commented Jul 13, 2015

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