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HttT: dialog tweaks and additions #4367

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merged 11 commits into from Oct 10, 2019

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@jostephd
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commented Sep 19, 2019

Originally from this forum post, although there's very little resemblance between the suggestions there and this PR.

Does the Timber! line work? I'm not sure. If it doesn't, I'll just delete that line so the flow is (thunderstick sound) (Konrad: What was that?) and then Delfador's line. Maybe have a dwarf say that it must be Lord Geldar's clan up ahead.

@jostephd jostephd requested a review from nemaara Sep 19, 2019
@jostephd jostephd self-assigned this Sep 19, 2019
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commented Sep 20, 2019

Timber is an anachronism, but I don't personally find too much issue with it (considering how the rest of HttT is written as well). That little tidbit at least adds some personality to Konrad, the only issue I might see with it is that since he was raised by elves, they probably wouldn't have felled many trees (though still some, since they use wood to some extent).

I'd suggest leaving the "Fair enough"s in there for a similar reason; they represent a difference in attitudes.

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commented Sep 20, 2019

I'm not sure about the 'timber' line either. If I understand correctly, Konrad was raised among elves. Even with Delfador to guide him I think he would have taken on some elvish culture - and I understand elves generally don't fell trees... so where would he have got the concept of the 'Timber!' warning cry from? I'd be inclined to replace it with what you suggested.

Aside from that I think this is fair - it pushes the dialogue towards a more formal tone which is what I understand the direction of the campaign is taking.

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commented Sep 20, 2019

Also, it seems odd to me to yell 'timber' after a loud bang. The bang typically happens when the tree hits the ground, at which point the danger is past.

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commented Sep 20, 2019

@AI0867 Yes, Konrad yells "Timber!" even though there are no trees in caves, and the explosion has already happened, and he's throwing away the element of surprise. It's a stupid thing to do. That's what he "feels a fool" about, on the following line. He is only 17, after all.

@nemaara @Wedge009 I figured that since he was raised in a forest he'll have learnt the "Timber!" warning, even if he didn't use it often. There are many skills one learns as a child but doesn't use every day (for example, speaking a foreign language).

Anyway, if "Timber!" sounds too unelflike, what would Konrad say? I'm assuming he never heard a thunderstick before in his life, and now he hears it for the first time, in a cave (so the explosion sound would echo).

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commented Sep 20, 2019

@nemaara I don't really like the "Fair enough" lines. They are repetitive; Kalenz wouldn't interject before Li'sar just to say "Fair enough"; Delfador wouldn't utter an ellipsis over Konrad making the difficult decision not to rescue the sergeant at all costs. How about changing those lines to a different expression of agreement? I think we can reuse Li'sar's line from Home of the North Elves (which is mutually exclusive with this scenario):

Konrad: _ "Our main goal remains to survive ourselves, but if we can spare the troops, we might try to rescue the sergeant stranded on the cliff. However, I make no promises."
Li'sar: _ "I understand, Konrad. I am no stranger to the burden of command. Onward!"

If that's too sudden, we can have Kalenz or Delfador endorse Konrad's decision before Li'sar's line.

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commented Sep 20, 2019

R.e. the fair enoughs, my point wasn't about needing an agreement from Li'sar or even having an endorsement of Konrad's decision, it was that they show a difference in attitudes from each of the characters (i.e. Kalenz is willing to embrace Konrad's decision, Li'sar is willing to accept it since she sees that it's reasonable, and Delfador is just displeased with everything). It would nice to be able to preserve that if you write new lines over them. If you don't want to leave them in, that's okay too (I was only initially making a suggestion).

About the "Timber", like I said I don't mind it, but if others disagree, you could just remove it.

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commented Sep 21, 2019

@nemaara Ah, thanks for clarifying. I'd like to remove or change those lines, but I'll see if I can retain some expression of the different attitudes there - though as I said, I don't think Delfador would be displeased.

About the timber, I guess I should replace it or change it, based on feedback so far.

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commented Sep 21, 2019

Yes, please.

And I presume you're going for something more detailed and/or less repetitive, but I just thought that 'very well' may substitute for 'fair enough'.

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commented Sep 23, 2019

Pushed alternative to the timber. Will think about S19c.

@jostephd jostephd force-pushed the jostephd:HttT-S15-thunderstick branch from 07cf38a to 84d16ba Sep 23, 2019
…line.

A Sylph wouldn't say that to Konrad.
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commented Sep 26, 2019

Okay to merge? Any further feedback?

jostephd and others added 3 commits Sep 27, 2019
Co-Authored-By: nemaara <nemaara@users.noreply.github.com>
Co-Authored-By: nemaara <nemaara@users.noreply.github.com>
$unit could be a female Footpad.
@jostephd jostephd force-pushed the jostephd:HttT-S15-thunderstick branch from 979dadb to 795865f Sep 30, 2019
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I'm in favour of merging this.

# po: The unit is saying that a battle between the player's allies and enemies is not far, but still under the shroud. Translate freely.
male_message=_ "It’s not far now, my lords."
# po: The unit is saying that a battle between the player's allies and enemies is not far, but still under the shroud. Translate freely.
female_message=_ "female^It’s not far now, my lords."

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stevecotton Oct 7, 2019

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This is likely to come from a unit that has never been in these tunnels before, yet the phrase "it's not far now" implies some familiarity. I suggest either dropping this [else], or having the unit say that the sound definitely came from in front of them.

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jostephd Oct 8, 2019

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As the comment says, the [else] has a purpose: to draw the player's attention to the part of the map where he's about to discover the allies. The line is a bit tricky to write because it can be triggered by units going either through the north of the map, or through the south ("Guest Quarters"). How about, say, a simple We’ll proceed carefully, my lords? Or perhaps We must hurry to assist them, my lords, if we want to steer the player to saving Geldar? Any other ideas?

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Wedge009 Oct 8, 2019

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Oh I see, reading it again now it sounds like the non-dwarf speaker could be judging distance on the basis of how loud the thunderstick sound was. Regardless, the latter (hurry to assist) sounds like a good option.

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commented Oct 7, 2019

I'm comfortable with the current state, aside from the subtle inconsistency that steve pointed out.

@jostephd jostephd merged commit 94c0f61 into wesnoth:master Oct 10, 2019
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