SoF Proofread Pass and Campaign Prose edits

[max-torch]

This is a proofread pass. But this also has edits that are more than just minor edits which try to improve the campaign text. wmlxgettext was used to review all the text.

[max-torch]

Second draft is up. Please see if changes are agreeable.

[CelticMinstrel]

This seems to be saying a completely different thing… is it a consistency error or something?

[max-torch]

he mentions "we will be able to break out eventually" at a point where nothing about having something to break out of has yet been mentioned in dialog, which seems awkward. So I had to change the dialog to talk about planning to stay in the caves first, then talk about breaking out.

[max-torch]

and my new line sounds like Durstorn is describing a plan, which is what he is in fact being asked. It feels like a better-sounding response to

And how do you plan on doing that? There are elves swarming these hills, trying to kill us.

than the former line.

Main argument is that it sounds like a better response than the original line to the question.

[max-torch]

Original:

"And how do you plan on doing that? There are elves swarming these hills, trying to kill us."

"You are right... well, we will be able to break out eventually, and while we’re here, we’ll be able to finally make the sceptre."

Modified:

"And how do you plan on doing that? There are elves swarming these hills, trying to kill us."

"You are right... well, we can close up these caves and make the sceptre in here. I’m sure we’ll eventually come up with a plan for breaking out of here when we’re done."

When you look at it like this it's not a completely different thing. The main addition in the response is the added proposal of closing the gates.

[CelticMinstrel]

The original has the implication of being already closed in, while the modified version implies they're intentionally closing themselves in.

[max-torch]

How does this sound:

Er, yes I know... well, what if we buy ourselves some time? We can close the gates to keep the elves out until we have a good plan. We can even make the sceptre while we're here.

[nemaara]

Durstorn should sound more demanding/directive to me. So something more like "Aye. So close the gates and stay them elves outside. Meanwhiles ye runecrafter ken craft tha sceptre and I'll think me a plan ta get out o' here."

You can make it more in plain english of course, the idea is just to make him sound like he's in charge. Durstorn ain't diplomatic, I think.

(Also you have two comments left below to address too haha).

[max-torch]

Regarding the scottish english, ill review durstorn's lines again to see if it would be more consistent to make this more scottish sounding or more plain sounding.

[max-torch]

I reviewed Durstorn's lines and can confirm that he talks in plain English, not in Scottish English.
Is this line good @nemaara :

"Yes, I'm aware! Just close the gates and keep those elves out! We'll think of something. As long as a dwarf is in a cave, he can come up with a plan. And since the Shorbear's rune workshops are in here, you and your runecrafters might as well make the Sceptre now."

[nemaara]

I'm aware! Close the gates and keep them out! It should be easy to come up with a plan to outwit them later. Meanwhile, since the Shorbear's rune workshops are in here, you and your runecrafters might as well make that Sceptre now.

[max-torch]

I just marked a few conversations as resolved. Only one more open conversation that I am asking to be looked at.

[Wedge009]

I've finished my replay of the campaign and I have a couple of additional suggestions that aren't already covered in the PR (again, I can make my changes separately if that's preferred, but am trying to avoid additional work to resolve potential conflicts here):

1. In the final scenario, the orc leader exclaims 'piece of crap'. I suppose one could argue this is for comical effect, but aside from being vulgar (however mild) I find it too modern-sounding. @doofus-01 changed the line from 'piece of magical garbage' to its current phrasing in SoF S9 - some cleanup to the final scenario #5215.
   

   wesnoth/data/campaigns/Sceptre_of_Fire/scenarios/9_Caverns_of_Flame.cfg

   Line 465 in b8400b5

   message= _ "Nothing!? Even this magical piece of crap lets me down!"

   
   Perhaps 'piece of junk' is sufficient?

2. In the epilogue, Alanin clearly establishes that the sceptre being discussed is the Sceptre of Fire, thus I suggest all other instances of the word 'sceptre' should be similarly capitalised. Only need to do it for this scenario - the only other instance of lower-case sceptre that I could find (when referring specifically to the Sceptre of Fire and not a generic sceptre) is UtBS S7a, and I intend to change this shortly.

[max-torch]

I can make my changes separately if that's preferred, but am trying to avoid additional work to resolve potential conflicts here:

I highly appreciate the merge conflict avoidance etiquette. Im okay with owning the tasks that you mention. @Wedge009 You went ahead with the capitalization of sceptre of fire in some of your commits, I suppose I'll just give one extra review of the capitalization before making another draft just for quality assurance.

I have a feeling we could do better than 'piece of junk' illl try to cross reference other speech in mainline for ideas and what would be orcish.

[Wedge009]

Thanks, I'm pretty sure we can do better than 'piece of crap'.

I only capitalised Sceptre of Fire in UtBS, as I mentioned above. Clearly separate from this SoF-focused PR. So the SoF Epilogue still needs to be updated.

[doofus-01]

I wrote the "magical piece of garbage", but later thought that sounded too posh for an angry orc. "Crap" was a mild vulgarity that seemed appropriate for character and intensity, and I think it's better than "junk", but this also seems really minor, so whatever others want is fine with me.

[max-torch]

Perhaps 'piece of junk' is sufficient?

I changed it to "piece of troll dung". I suppose even a troll's dung becomes hard like a rock.

2. In the epilogue, Alanin clearly establishes that the sceptre being discussed is the Sceptre of Fire, thus I suggest all other instances of the word 'sceptre' should be similarly capitalised. Only need to do it for this scenario - the only other instance of lower-case sceptre that I could find (when referring specifically to the Sceptre of Fire and not a generic sceptre) is UtBS S7a, and I intend to change this shortly.

I did a search for all instances of the word "sceptre/Sceptre" in the dialog. I shall refer to "sceptre" as lowercase and "Sceptre" as title case. Most of the usage of the word is in the lowercase. And a lot of those contexts seem to make sense to use the lowercase - it's because the word is being used in the general sense, e.g. 'Make a sceptre'. Less cases where it seems the title case is the appropriate context to use. It's another matter that I'd rather not involve in this PR, so I won't touch it here. If there is a merge conflict I'll just make the necessary adjustments. I did make a few capitalization changes, but this PR will not be a complete capitalization pass.

It is like with object oriented programming:
sceptre: class
Sceptre: object instance of class

[Wedge009]

Troll's dung sounds fitting to me.

Regarding the Sceptre of Fire, I recall I was only referring specifically to the epilogue. Of course general uses of the word 'sceptre' in the wider campaign should be left as lower-case, but I consider these to be referring to the actual Sceptre of Fire and therefore should be capitalised:

wesnoth/data/campaigns/Sceptre_of_Fire/scenarios/Epilogue.cfg

Line 150 in 338c3f7

message= _ "Why were you returning without the sceptre, then?"

wesnoth/data/campaigns/Sceptre_of_Fire/scenarios/Epilogue.cfg

Line 154 in 338c3f7

message= _ "We had been besieged by elves, in a dwarvish castle that was not Rugnur’s. Rugnur sent me back, with the message that the sceptre was near completion, but he and all the rest of the dwarves went into the caves south of the Arkan-thoria, and were immediately followed by hundreds of elves."

wesnoth/data/campaigns/Sceptre_of_Fire/scenarios/Epilogue.cfg

Line 158 in 338c3f7

message= _ "If the sceptre was not completed in your sight, what makes you so sure it exists?"

wesnoth/data/campaigns/Sceptre_of_Fire/scenarios/Epilogue.cfg

Line 218 in 338c3f7

message= _ "Those are the plans for the sceptre, or at least an earlier version."

wesnoth/data/campaigns/Sceptre_of_Fire/scenarios/Epilogue.cfg

Line 246 in 338c3f7

message= _ "The sceptre would not be found until many generations after Haldric II, in the time of Asheviere the Dark Queen. During that time, it remained in the caves of the Northlands, occasionally moved around by orcs who never understood its true power."

In my opinion these aren't talking about general sceptres or the Sceptre of Fire before it's been made. The king and Alanin are specifically referring to the Sceptre of Fire, and most certainly the narrator is too (last quote).

[CelticMinstrel]

It is like with object oriented programming:
sceptre: class
Sceptre: object instance of class

Not really… in fact I think the reverse convention is more common (class is capitalized, instance is lowercase).

[Wedge009]

I was thinking the same thing, at least in C++ contexts, but then I looked at Wesnoth's code and saw at least some class names are lower-case.

It's not really directly related to this discussion anyway.

[max-torch]

It is like with object oriented programming:
sceptre: class
Sceptre: object instance of class

Not really… in fact I think the reverse convention is more common (class is capitalized, instance is lowercase).

What I meant was that in the usage in the campaign, the lowercase 'sceptre' refers to the general class of sceptre, while the titlecase 'Sceptre' refers to the instance of a sceptre known as 'The Sceptre of Fire'.

Yes, the convention is reversed in typical coding OOP.

[max-torch]

Can I ask if this PR has blockers? I feel like it's okay now.

[knyghtmare]

Can I ask if this PR has blockers? I feel like it's okay now.

Depends on the dev who was requested for review.

[Wedge009]

Can I ask if this PR has blockers? I feel like it's okay now.

You can ask. :p Assuming the question was asked, it looks like Durstorn's line about escaping the cave is resolved now. There's just the capitalisation of Sceptre of Fire to go, but if you don't want to do it, I'll take care of it separately.

[max-torch]

Can I ask if this PR has blockers? I feel like it's okay now.

You can ask. :p Assuming the question was asked, it looks like Durstorn's line about escaping the cave is resolved now. There's just the capitalisation of Sceptre of Fire to go, but if you don't want to do it, I'll take care of it separately.

I'm officially requesting capitalisation pass of Sceptre of Fire to be handled by another person.

[stevecotton]

Change "And if" to "If"?

I know the PR is already merged, but it's a handy place to add more comments for whatever will happen next. This isn't the only sentence in this campaign to start with "And", other existing ones might need a review too.

[max-torch]

If the original author put the word "and" here, I say keep it. It's not too hard to believe that in oral speech someone would put "and" in that place while he is talking.
If this text represented only written text, sure it makes sense to really strike out the "and".

[stevecotton]

"Well... Maybe you can ask the Shorbear clan? They have good tools... chisels made of a metal that could only be worked with the heat of a volcanic forge. I don’t know how much of that legend is true, but their work is well known among us gem crafters."

Too late for the current PR, but it seems a good place to discuss possible future PRs. I'm thinking we could replace the unobtainable mineral with foreshadowing.