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Tutorial S2: When a second Shaman is recruited, say that the healing doesn't stack #4418

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commented Oct 1, 2019

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@stevecotton stevecotton force-pushed the stevecotton:tutorial_two_shamans branch from db5daf1 to 448a4ca Oct 2, 2019
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I like the overall idea of explaining mechanics and strategy of multiple healers, but have some proposed changes to the flow.

speaker=$unit.id
# po: both speaker and $other_healer are elvish shamans.
# If there are allied sides then this isn't accurate, but at this stage of the tutorial allied sides haven't been introduced yet.
message= _ "Both Shaman $other_healer.name and I can heal other units. However, each unit can only receive healing from one healer — even if we’re both next to a unit then that unit will still only heal 4 hitpoints per turn."

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@jostephd

jostephd Oct 2, 2019

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This uses a variable name in a translated string, which https://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=11445 says not to. Is that a problem? It might be fine since it's in the nominative case?

Maybe change heal to be healed. I realize it's correct as it is, but making the change will prevent players from incorrectly reading heal as a transitive verb there, as though a unit that's adjacent to a shaman can heal other units.

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@stevecotton

stevecotton Oct 2, 2019

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Good point. I wonder what about # po: There's no need to use $other_healer.name in the translated string, leave it out if that makes the translation better? I've posted that question to the forums.

Will make the change to be healed.

[message]
speaker=$unit.id
# This line could be said by the other healer, but there's only one shaman portrait available, and it would be confusing to have dialog between two units with identical portraits.
message= _ "If either of us advances to become a Druid, then a unit next to both of us will receive the Druid’s advanced healing. A unit in a village will receive healing from the village, neither a Shaman nor a Druid can improve on that."

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@jostephd

jostephd Oct 2, 2019

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The second thing that this line says - that villages, shamans, and druids don't stack - how about saying it as soon as the first shaman is recruited? Village healing had already been introduced by that point. That'll simplify this dialog. (By that point rest healing has also been introduced, and it does stack with other forms of healing, but I'm not sure it's worth pointing that out. Too much detail and the player won't see the forest for the trees - no pun intended.)

The fact that Druids have advanced healing is mentioned in a drive by, as though it's just reminding the player of something they already know. Maybe move it to front and center? It's also repeated in Galdrad's line just below. Maybe combine the two mentions of "Druids have advanced healing", the one in this line and the one in the next line? I don't have a concrete proposal but I can try to come up with on if you like.

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stevecotton Oct 2, 2019

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When the first shaman is recruited, there's already 3 [message]s, I don't think any more information can fit in that event.

I agree completely with your second paragraph.

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@jostephd

jostephd Oct 3, 2019

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When the first shaman is recruited, there's already 3 [message]s, I don't think any more information can fit in that event.

Agreed. And it doesn't seem to fit in S1, either:

message= _ "There are two villages within your reach. Visiting villages is a good idea, and ending your turn on one will heal you. To a village!"

message= _ "Yes, if a unit doesn’t do anything for a turn, it will slowly heal."

Still, trying to cram too much information into a single line here won't do, either. I think it'll be best to first write down what all the points we want to make are ("multiple healers/villages don't stack", "multiple healers can be used in separate areas of the battle", etc) and then see how many of them we can make. We may have to leave one out of this conversation and find a place for it later in the scenario.

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@jostephd

jostephd Oct 3, 2019

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We can speak about healers/villages/stacking here:

[event]
name=turn 6
[fire_event]
name=check_income
[/fire_event]
{TALK_ABOUT_LOC 11,14 ( _ "Remember to retreat your wounded units to villages. Healers can only heal 4 hitpoints at a time, while villages can heal 8 (the maximum healing for any unit).")}
[/event]

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@jostephd

jostephd Oct 3, 2019

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Suggestion:

Remember to retreat your wounded units to villages. Villages heal units faster than Elvish Shamans do: a unit in a village will be healed 8 hitpoints per turn, whereas a unit next to a Shaman will only be healed 4 points per turn.

Different sources of healing are not combined. If a unit starts its turn next to multiple healers, or on a village and next to a healer, it will still be healed only once.

There are two exceptions to this rule. First, if a unit doesn't do anything for a turn, it will heal 2 hitpoints in addition to any healing it may receive from villages or healers, for a total of up to 10 hitpoints per turn. The other exception involves allies — a topic which we will introduce later.

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@stevecotton

stevecotton Oct 3, 2019

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I think it'll be best to first write down what all the points we want to make are

  • "multiple healers/villages don't stack"
  • "multiple healers can be used in separate areas of the battle"
  • druids heal more than shamans
  • although they don't stack, the best one is used
  • healers don't regen, but a pair of healers can heal each other
  • rest healing does stack
  • if you have a choice of which one to move, it's better to move the healer to the injured unit so that the injured unit rest-heals
  • ... but if the unit is on the front line it probably needs to retreat

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@jostephd

jostephd Oct 3, 2019

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  • If you have two different healers, you can move one healer from a unit and put another one next to the unit, and it'll still enjoy rest healing
  • Healers heal all units next to them, not just one
  • Healers are important to keep alive, especially those that can advance to stronger healers

I don't think we'll be able to work all these details into the scenario. We should introduce the mechanic and outline how it's usually used, but we may have to defer some of the details or specific circumstances to tutorial S3 (#4399).

On the other hand, we have several places to fit dialog in:

  • turn 6 dialog about retreating
  • recruiting the first Shaman
  • recruiting the second Shaman
  • first time Shaman/village healing happens

We can continue chatting on IRC if you prefer.

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stevecotton Oct 3, 2019

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Just realised that healing is well documented in the help's Gameplay section, so we can say where to look for more detail.

[/message]
[message]
speaker=$unit.id
# This line could be said by the other healer, but there's only one shaman portrait available, and it would be confusing to have dialog between two units with identical portraits.

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@jostephd

jostephd Oct 2, 2019

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You might be able to use [message]caption=, or put $other_unit's portrait on the right, or both. Or cheat and use the Elvish Lady portrait.

[/message]
[message]
speaker=$other_healer.id
message= _ "When $unit.name becomes a Druid, a unit next to both of us will still only receive one Druid’s healing. A unit in a village will receive healing from the village, neither a Shaman nor a Druid can improve on that."

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@jostephd

jostephd Oct 2, 2019

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Again, the first sentence here duplicates the information in the previous line. I think we could merge them, and say just once: a unit is healed by only one healer per turn. If a unit is adjacent to multiple healers, the most powerful one of them heals the unit.

(Also, there's a comma splice, but I'll put off discussing that level of detail until the flow of the dialog is settled.)

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@stevecotton

stevecotton Oct 3, 2019

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I'm in favour of splitting it with the first message being (current situation) and the second one being (after the next level-up).

I'm moving to having both lines said by the recruited unit, even in the case that $other_healer is already a druid with a different portrait. The idea was that the higher-level one would give a cheery "you'll gain experience" message to the new recruit, but in my attempts to rewrite it that doesn't feel useful any more.

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@jostephd

jostephd Oct 3, 2019

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It might be hard to work such a cherry message in there, given that we have a self-imposed quota of at most three lines of dialog, and four or five different things to teach :)

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