JS8Call-improved
Replies: 32 comments
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@jsherer @Joe-K0OG what do you think about this? The 11m band is not defined in Bands.cpp, although it could be. This frequency is channel 25 in the US and people with ham radio gear are not permitted to transmit on it. Digital modes are not legal on FCC Part 15 CB radio gear in the U.S., only AM and FM, and either sideband of the AM, are allowed. So can we legally put this in the software being the software comes from a U.S.-based source? |
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For reference, these are the current regulations for 11m emissions in the U.S. https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-47/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-95/subpart-D/section-95.971 |
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While this is a valid use case, I do not think this should be included for the same reason 60m was not included originally (the rules aren’t uniform).
Strong opinion loosely held.
…On Dec 21, 2025 at 6:14 PM -0500, Chris Olson ***@***.***>, wrote:
Chris-AC9KH left a comment (JS8Call-improved/JS8Call-improved#108)
For reference, these are the current regulations for 11m emissions in the U.S.
https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-47/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-95/subpart-D/section-95.971
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I agree with Jordan @jsherer. Best to NOT include it due to U.S. restrictions, and U.S. origin of the software. It's best to not risk legal issues, and we do not want to encourage illegal U.S. usage, per the philosophy of adding the upcoming 60m frequency for the very purpose of encouraging its use. Otherwise, it is so easy to add a frequency that there is no compelling reason to add it to the list as a default. 73, |
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That's the consensus. Not legal or practical in the U.S. since it encourages illegal use of FCC Part 15 equipment. I'll leave this up for any further discussion for now. |
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What does need to be changed is the JS8 frequency on 160. The FT8 guys there are animals and they're running amplifiers at 1KW. The JS8 frequency is not far enough above FT8 and they always got the lower 1000Hz of the JS8 passband plastered. There's a reason why the JS8 stations in Sweden and Russia run 1845 instead of 1842. |
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There are more countries than just the US where js8 call is legal to use on the 11 mtr. The world is not just US :-) |
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Please read #108 (comment) again, and you will understand the rationale. 73, |
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Yes, if the international rules were changed to allow digital modes on 11m, then we could add it. But since it is (currently) not legal worldwide, we cannot do that. JS8Call is used in more ITU regions than just the EU. So since the 11m segment is legal in your region, simply add the desired frequency to the frequency list for your region. |
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I'm going to throw a monkey in the works as just a thought exercise. Discussion #100 deals with sourcing a GPS signal for timing and location data. If the gps comes from a local serial device, a code table could be used to add that region's allocation. To me, that sounds like more work, less gain, but could be an option. |
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@wmiler Wyatt, I use a Ruby script from https://gist.github.com/psfleming/b8b440d271404ce50fca0431befdb98a called setgrid2.rb on my Linux machine, modified to generate a 6-character grid square (now calling it setgrid6.rb), and to feed the grid to JS8Call. See Jason's (KM4ACK) video on this topic at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpzC7g-gY44 from 7 years ago. There may be better ways to do it this these days, but has worked for me all these years, and shows the value of the JS8Call API. 73, |
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How about two different modes, one for HAM and one for CB? A software switch would do the trick:
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It's not really necessary since you can have multiple configurations and swap between those easily.
…On Jan 4, 2026 at 5:25 PM -0500, tinux7 ***@***.***>, wrote:
tinux7 left a comment (JS8Call-improved/JS8Call-improved#108)
How about two different modes, one for HAM and one for CB? A software switch would do the trick:
• Transmit on CB frequencies with a HAM rig is in most (all?) countries illegal. With two modes, HAM ops can't go wrong easily.
• There are no CB radios that are capable of CAT, as far as I know. So the freq. affects only reporting when runnig CB mode.
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It would just avoid, that CB ops send a wrong frequency if reporting to pskreporter. Haven't noticed that, I must say though... I absolutely see your point about regulation of HAM bands. The ones who (illegaly?) use the 27 MHz band with a HAM rig and want easy CAT control can simply add a config. |
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I have read the part on CB regs many times. My best interpretation of the rules is that data is acceptable. Channel 23 was originally designated for data. Even remote control was permissible. Ibsew no reason why not to include the frequency. Or, perhaps make a CB mode to switch to in order to avoid legal issues if you are worried about it. I have done some extensive testing in my county. JS8 and CB offer an excellent comms capability for high terrain areas. The President Randy CB has VOX and. Mic jack which make it simple and idea for this setup. |
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There is nothing preventing the operator from adding the frequencies to the list that he wants to add. The software was designed to be flexible in that way. If the operator is too lazy to use the nice frequency table editor, that lazyness is on that operator, not on the developers. Indeed, "Our code allows all usage that is legal somewhere." It is as Jordan says, up to the user, not the developers. An additional point: The software is published in the United States of America, so we must indeed be careful to be sensitive to the rules of operation here, while allowing flexibility of operation for all jurisdictions. 73, |
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Indeed, the U.S. law states (CBRS is Citizen's Band Radio Service): § 95.971 CBRS emission types. (a) Permitted emission types. CBRS transmitter types must transmit AM voice emission type A3E or SSB voice emission types J3E, R3E or H3E, and may also transmit FM voice emission type F3E. (b) SSB requirements. Each CBRS transmitter type that transmits emission type J3E, R3E, or H3E must be capable of transmitting only the upper sideband with suppressed, reduced or full carrier, respectively, but may additionally be capable of transmitting only the lower sideband, with suppressed, reduced or full carrier, respectively. If you operate in an area where it's legal to use 11m for data modes, then add the frequency to the list. Otherwise, it's not legal in the U.S. and since the software is published and distributed from the U.S. we're not going to put it in there. This issue should be closed because the software allows you to put whatever 11m frequency you want to use in the frequency list. But since it is not going to be hardwired into the code, and is already labeled won't fix, it's a dead issue. |
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Yes, I've already experimented with adjusting the frequencies in my own custom compilation of the software. However, the real issue is that the frequency allocation can't be placed under the official ITU amateur radio bands — it would need to live in a completely separate branch (like ISM, CB, or whatever fits). If that were done, it would actually work fine. From a regulatory standpoint, I don't see any real problems here. After all, even in Brazil licensed amateur radio operators are permitted to run up to 25 W on CB frequencies. Moreover, the core principle of personal responsibility applies equally to CB users and hams alike. The argument that the FCC might somehow have issues if JS8Call included pre-programmed CB frequencies is pretty far-fetched. Even in the US, where digital transmissions on CB are generally not allowed for transmitting, there's nothing stopping anyone from receiving on those frequencies. 73! |
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Do you think the USA law situation is such that this would be any appreciable additional risk to the project? 
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I'm not sure the original poster realizes he can simply edit the frequency table to add whatever frequency he wishes: 
This is a moot issue, please close it. 73, |
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I have that PR almost ready. Just wanted to format my code change to comply with our |
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Joe asked:
I have often caught myself asking questions that were answered in the original text with which the issue was started.
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For me, this is, again, a question of being a good neighbor. Adding the CB frequency would signal to our CB neighbors that we acknowledge they exist, and we welcome their use of our software. It is just the normal civil decency of saying "good morning" turned code. |
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Yes, it's not a uniform rule. Therefore we can't include it. The CB users in the countries that use it are welcome to add whatever frequency they use to the list. Edit: it was also the reason we could not include 60m before. There was no uniform rule. Even though JS8 was technically legal on one of the 60m channels, the regulations required that there be only one transmission on a channel at a time, and any emissions must be centered on the channel center frequency. In the U.S. it is adjacent to military air-to-air frequencies and they can use it any time they so choose, so ham radio operators have to silence their stations immediately if government users appear on the channel. We used to use 60m channel 3 for JS8, being very careful to set the offset to 5358.5 kHz. It worked great for keyboard-to-keyboard QSO. But then the wsjt-x-improved guys, who are from Europe, slapped FT8 on that center channel and there went the neighborhood. |
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If 60 m FT8-users have been unfriendly to us, I do not perceive that as a reason for us to be unfriendly to 11 m CB users.
You seem to suggest what I summarized above as
I think that cannot be done. Would it be helpful if I started doing research about specific things JS8Call does out of the box that are illegal somewhere? I don't think that'd be all that helpful and would rather do more constructive things with my time. But if you think it would be pertinent... I think we should stick with what Jordan above said:
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Given that use of 60m is much higher risk (military, diplomatic, government) than 11m (no requirement to yield to protected primary services, etc.) and that 60m has now been included, I see no reason not to include 11m. Personally I would rather 60m was excluded for safety reasons, or that you need to select an appropriate licence type to enable 60m. Those with the licences and ability to use it can easily add 60m. The risk is greater that novices accidentally pick it from the list. |
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Perhaps a nice middle ground would be to add in the drop down list, right next to Custom Frequency, a quick link of "add to list" which takes you to the setting where people can add persistent custom frequencies. I don't mind adding my own frequencies. It would be nice to have a shortcut. |
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I find that particular suggestion not very practical. There may be some 200 different amateur radio license types world-wide. This is a wild guess only and may be badly inaccurate. But whatever the number really is: To maintain a list of license types vs. bands holders of that license may use? I strongly feel this is not something we should burn our time on. I'm with what Jordan said above:
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Not my top preference either. However if people did want to add functionality to help novices not make mistakes, you don't need to add every licence in the world to the software. Just like you don't need to include every conceivable band. You add licences for the top X most popular jurisdictions, then a custom other option. People can then input the frequencies that they are licensed to use. It makes them think once, "what can I legally use?". Then the software lets them use those frequencies. Much better in terms of legal and reputational risk that we force users to think about their licences than let them just dive in and give JS8 a bad reputation. |
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I converted this thread to the Discussions category to remove it from the Issues list. This is still open for discussion, but is not a thing we will "fix" in our code. |
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This is a rewrite from https://github.com/js8call/js8call/issues/8 because it got deleted with all other issues. https://github.com/orgs/JS8Call-improved/discussions/98
27.245 USB is one of the most used JS8Call frequencies. Currently it is missing in JSCall-improved. You can see its usage by choosing 11m band and JS8 in here: https://www.pskreporter.info/pskmap.html . Today it is for example the 3th most active used JS8 frequency.
There was this change a few hours ago: 385fb0d
Lets add 27.245 USB to the same list now instead of all the people having to research online for it.
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