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Dev meeting 2017 08 01

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Svante Richter edited this page Aug 1, 2017 · 7 revisions

Agenda

e.g.

  • Status on drop bear invasion (@YourGitHubID)

Actionable Items

Outcomes

Log

ping @bob @carson @gawainlynch @jkazimir @ross @sahassar


sahassar [7:29 PM] 
pong


bob 
[7:29 PM] 
Pong!


ross [7:30 PM] 
pong


gawainlynch [7:30 PM] 
OK … Texas ninja is around … let's move on


carson [7:31 PM] 
o/


gawainlynch [7:31 PM] 
Can someone underp the helpful :koala: and send #6872 in


boltissueball [7:31 PM] 
#6872 [open] [3.4][Tests] Setcontent https://github.com/bolt/bolt/pull/6872


bob 
[7:31 PM] 
on it


gawainlynch [7:31 PM] 
First order of business… Tentative date for 3.2 EoL August 24


bob 
[7:32 PM] 
I'm fine with that..


carson [7:32 PM] 
I…dang


jkazimir [7:32 PM] 
poing


gawainlynch [7:32 PM] 
Things seem to be going well, and I heard from Jared today that he'd updated a site and was pleasantly surprised with how well it went


bob 
[7:33 PM] 
And, in case some horrible security issue pops up **knocks on wood**, we can _still_ decide to fix that, if we want to.


gawainlynch [7:33 PM] 
@carson If you need something on that work, let me know I'll send more in … the bug left there was kinda ugly


bob 
[7:33 PM] 
Hey jkazimir :slightly_smiling_face:


jkazimir [7:33 PM] 
Hi bob! :slightly_smiling_face:


ross [7:33 PM] 
the main thing that will come up is extensions that still use the /extend mount point... not sure if there's any more of those that need PRs to patch


carson [7:33 PM] 
I would just remove the tag. The method is internal and we know to remove it when the time comes


gawainlynch [7:34 PM] 
Tag?


ross [7:34 PM] 
there aren't too many issues upgrading out of the box 3.2 -> 3.3 that aren't extension related


gawainlynch [7:35 PM] 
Yeah, the common one seems to be autoloader derps … but again, it is expert territory and every time it has been something like a plural or typo


jkazimir [7:35 PM] 
That’s why it was easy… My local extension were along the lines of `extends Application` and a bunch of service providers :slightly_smiling_face:


gawainlynch [7:36 PM] 
Yeah, I have to say that you coming in from left field with that upgrade to smoothly really gave me confidence on this


jkazimir [7:36 PM] 
Looks straightforward nonetheless though, just a matter of loading


bob 
[7:36 PM] 
Last week or two, we've been urging everybody who's having issues with "local extensions" to just bump to 3.3 and use "bundled", and it's so much less hassle for them usually


gawainlynch [7:37 PM] 
OK, well if everyone is comfortable, lets communicate 24 August and we can always handle deviation on an as-needed basis


bob 
[7:37 PM] 
Sure thing


jkazimir [7:37 PM] 
Nice, yea, and like I said this morning, even took the time to workaround my image cache gripe :slightly_smiling_face:


bob 
[7:37 PM] 
We should make the banner on docs stand out more, though.


[7:37] 
People miss it too often.


gawainlynch [7:38 PM] 
bites the :princess: tongue on that one :wink:


gawainlynch [7:38 PM] 
Next … 3.4.0 beta and #6412


boltissueball [7:38 PM] 
#6412 [open] [Tracker] Bolt 3.4 Release Blocking Issues https://github.com/bolt/bolt/issues/6412  — assigned to GawainLynch


bob 
[7:38 PM] 
Why?


gawainlynch [7:39 PM] 
Haha … well I was wanting to remove that stuff entirely as I thought people would do what they've done and keep coming back with local extension questions


bob 
[7:39 PM] 
No, people often truly don't realize they're reading Bolt 2.2 docs.


gawainlynch [7:39 PM] 
Which leans toward my point


sahassar [7:40 PM] 
On the other hand we don't want to MDN it and take up half the screen


bob 
[7:40 PM] 
so, we shouldn't remove that banner, just make it stand out more.


[7:40] 
there's a middle ground, i'm sure.


ross [7:41 PM] 
quarter of the screen


gawainlynch [7:41 PM] 
Not remove the banner, enhance it yes … my point (that I'm not trying to push BTW) was removing the docs


bob 
[7:41 PM] 
thirdly, the "old version" one is not the same as the "don't use this one"


carson [7:41 PM] 
Fixed banner :slightly_smiling_face:


bob 
[7:41 PM] 
uploaded this image: Screen Shot 2017-08-01 at 19.38.12.png
Add Comment



bob 
[7:41 PM] 
vs:


bob 
[7:41 PM] 
uploaded this image: Screen Shot 2017-08-01 at 19.41.21.png
Add Comment



gawainlynch [7:41 PM] 
I think something like Ross' suggestion on my Slack badge PR sounds good :wink:

carson [7:41 PM] 
Err I mean fixed CSS banner

bob 
[7:42 PM] 
@carson Nope: "sticky" bars get into the blind spot _way_ faster

sahassar [7:42 PM] 
LGTM

carson [7:42 PM] 
Only half serious, I’m fine with whatever

gawainlynch [7:42 PM] 
BTW, what I was referring to was that red banner … people *are* missing it

bob 
[7:43 PM] 
Anyhow, i'll make a proposal, come 24th, to make it stand out a bit more.

gawainlynch [7:43 PM] 
…and by "remove" I was talking about things like local extension docs

[7:43] 
for 3.2 vs 3.3 the red banner WFM

sahassar [7:43 PM] 
If they are still missing it lets make it fixed and only go away when clicked that you dismissed it. but red should be enough for now

bob 
[7:44 PM] 
@sahassar Yeah, was thinking something similar.. Having people click a "Yes, I know this is outdated" button.

gawainlynch [7:44 PM] 
Maybe a little less friendly wording on some of it, like "NOT SUPPORTED! DON'T EVEN ASK IN SLACK/IRC"

sahassar [7:45 PM] 
gawainlynch: If they aren't reading it they aren't reading it...

gawainlynch [7:45 PM] 
(again, stuff like local ext.)

[7:45] 
75% of the page ought to do it, @sahassar :wink: (edited)

bob 
[7:45 PM] 
right, let's move on.

gawainlynch [7:45 PM] 
WRT to beta … most pending stuff is in the process of landing … We haven't heard from Aaron about his work, Eduardo is going to try to see if he can wrap his tomorrow

bob 
[7:46 PM] 
Sounds good!

gawainlynch [7:46 PM] 
Ross' work landed today :champagne:

[7:46] 
I need some help though

bob 
[7:46 PM] 
It's already a nice list, i must say.

gawainlynch [7:48 PM] 
Having Bob out of the picture over the time we're supposed to finalise a release is landing a lot more on me than I have time for :slightly_smiling_face:

[7:49] 
Specifically I could do with some visual help if we know willing ~victims~ volunteers

bob 
[7:49 PM] 
I'll be back on the 21st, i can get back to business afterwards.

sahassar [7:49 PM] 
I'll pitch in :slightly_smiling_face:

gawainlynch [7:50 PM] 
@bob: We need to release a stable not long after that … We agreed on this time frame months ago

[7:50] 
@sahassar: That'd be fantastic … Mainly it is the visuals for get.bolt.cm and the installer/deploy work (edited)

bob 
[7:50 PM] 
yes, i know, just giving context

gawainlynch [7:51 PM] 
@bob: same :wink:

[7:51] 
Also, if we can start migrating the test sites that we commonly use to start kicking 3.4 hard

sahassar [7:51 PM] 
gawainlynch: Rightio, lets get me up to speed after the meeting

gawainlynch [7:51 PM] 
I know the record editor & it's JS needs work

[7:52] 
There is still some work stabilising the new setcontent stuff that Ross could do with bug reports on (edited)

[7:52] 
@sahassar: Can I do the brief on that post-sleep :slightly_smiling_face:

[7:53] 
Mainly what we need to collectively focus on is a rinse-and-repeat of what we've just done for 3.3

sahassar [7:53 PM] 
gawainlynch: Of course, I'll be on a beach with 4g by then, so that'll be perfect :slightly_smiling_face: (edited)

bob 
[7:54 PM] 
Oh nice, where're you going?

gawainlynch [7:54 PM] 
If there are vanity sites, etc, that can afford breakage in the name of issue generation, that will help me at least start attacking bugs … I suck at finding them :slightly_smiling_face:

sahassar [7:54 PM] 
my summer place, so just a few hours away

bob 
[7:55 PM] 
Nice!

gawainlynch [7:55 PM] 
OK, I think we can keep this rolling … any ~suckers~ willing volunteers we can find to break their sites … send them my way :slightly_smiling_face:

gawainlynch [7:56 PM] 
really hopes the strike-though works in copy/pasta to the wiki

bob 
[7:56 PM] 
@gawainlynch You should ping Peter, Nestor and Xiao.

sahassar [7:56 PM] 
I'll check with intendit

gawainlynch [7:56 PM] 
@bob: Good thinking!

bob 
[7:56 PM] 
I know Peter will want to help out, and my colleagues mught have some free time as well.

gawainlynch [7:57 PM] 
I'm only pushing hard on this for two reasons; 1) this needs to happen soon; 2) we need to move on with 4.0-dev :slightly_smiling_face:

[7:57] 
3) 3.5 work relative to 2)

[7:57] 
(OK, that's three)

bob 
[7:57 PM] 
Also, it'll be good to have a 3.4 out soon after 3.3

gawainlynch [7:58 PM] 
Yeah, there is a tonne in 3.4 already

bob 
[7:58 PM] 
To let people see that the 3.2 -> 3.3 cycle is not what we're aiming for.

gawainlynch [7:58 PM] 
^ this

[7:58] 
So … speaking of 3.5 work … Config changes (@sahassar) see https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hAITaszfxn5rOFifhYdUDM1ySo2Xiiu7ZI7IhNePh1M

sahassar [7:59 PM] 
Right, so we have been talking for a while about some config changes

bob 
[7:59 PM] 
I've heard whisper that @xiao might want to help out on making that indexing thing happen.

[7:59] 
(for 3.5 that is)

gawainlynch [8:00 PM] 
He's got a willing :ear: and set of :raised_hands: here, Bob

bob 
[8:01 PM] 
@gawainlynch That's what I've talked to him about.. If he has time to work on it, coordinate it with you

sahassar [8:01 PM] 
The main ones are: 
1) trying to consolidate similar options
2) make it more consistent (snakecase all the things)
3) make it clear what are options for a second/third party lib (here using the options_ prefix)

bob 
[8:01 PM] 
:snake:

gawainlynch [8:02 PM] 
Also worth noting that the approximate schedule for now to 3.4 and maybe part of 3.5 will be my last run of free time/sick leave … so make the most of my highly available time

[8:03] 
@sahassar: Yeah, I am still not sure on where you and I landed some of point 3

[8:03] 
e.g. the database options as a good example

[8:03] 
(and it was my ~idea~ suggestion) (edited)

[8:03] 
I don't have a good further idea FWIW

carson [8:04 PM] 
Can we make the db options match upstream?

sahassar [8:04 PM] 
gawainlynch: Yeah, I think it'll be good to say "everything in this key is passed to this SP"

gawainlynch [8:04 PM] 
@carson: That is part of it

carson [8:04 PM] 
Cool


sahassar [8:05 PM] 
carson: The point is that everything in the dbal_options is just a dbal option, not a bolt thing

gawainlynch [8:05 PM] 
Some base keys have Bolt options, and some have options passed to the SP

sahassar [8:06 PM] 
We make that clear in some way (I chose $name_options, but am open to other options) and then pass that in as is

carson [8:06 PM] 
Not all DI keys are options arrays though

gawainlynch [8:06 PM] 
Yeah, welcome to where it gets hard

[8:07] 
My desire though is not to have Bolt values and SP values mixed … as some SP services will throw a nanah if there are extra values

sahassar [8:08 PM] 
The point of this is basically to have to bolt values be under a logical key (debug_show_loggedoff vs. debug/show_loggedoff) and to differentiate what is passed into a SP

carson [8:09 PM] 
@sahassar wait what?

sahassar [8:11 PM] 
carson: Well, it's two issues, 1: we have some odd keys we should move (debug_show_loggedoff should be grouped with the rest of the debug settings and called show_loggedoff)

bob 
[8:13 PM] 
(quick note: I'm keeping an eye on the channel, but also need to start packing stuff :wink: )

sahassar [8:14 PM] 
2: When I use `extensions/composer/minimum-stability` I'm not sure that is a bolt setting or a third party setting. I want all the third party settings to be called $name_options or something like that to make it more clear

[8:14] 
like `extensions/composer_options/minimum-stability`

[8:14] 
Does that make sense?

carson [8:15 PM] 
Yes and no

sahassar [8:16 PM] 
May I ask what the no part is?

carson [8:18 PM] 
I guess what I would rather see is the config options more closely map to their DI keys

[8:19] 
`db.options` for example

[8:19] 
Well converted to yaml object obv

[8:19] 
I think it should be pretty clear at that point what is something 3rd party and what is for bolt

sahassar [8:20 PM] 
Doesn't that make it unclear what is a bolt option and what isn't? For example `auth_mode` is a swiftmailer option, but `senderName` isn't. They are both under the same array in the config, and one is snakecase and one is camelcase

gawainlynch [8:20 PM] 
If someone knows what DI is, and what the key for a services is … Not arguing down, just can see that biting us quickly

gawainlynch [8:21 PM] 
also doesn't currently have a better idea

ross [8:21 PM] 
yes, config.yml is Bolt's user interface, we should name them for readability first... then map to whatever the services need

carson [8:22 PM] 
Well I guess in my mind one should be under swiftmailer group and bolt’s should be under something different

ross [8:22 PM] 
plus we may swap out dbal for something else so we shouldn't hard code that into our requirements

carson [8:22 PM] 
Ross and I both just went in opposite directions lol

gawainlynch [8:23 PM] 
Both with valid points though

sahassar [8:23 PM] 
carson: That's my point, put the swiftmailer config under it's own key, right?

carson [8:23 PM] 
@sahassar yes

ross [8:23 PM] 
we may decide that dbal do it right @carson and adopt that as our settings...

[8:23] 
but some may do it wrong and we may want to improve it

sahassar [8:24 PM] 
And do the same for composer, dbal and anything else that we pass a config into.

carson [8:24 PM] 
@ross I hear you and that’s a good point

sahassar [8:24 PM] 
If we change from dbal won't the config for slaves etc. have to change anyway?

carson [8:25 PM] 
Yeah I mean it gets pretty hairy pretty quick. I say we either pass directly though or implement a mapping for each service when we add it

[8:26] 
But I guess we won’t always know at that point if we need to change something

gawainlynch [8:26 PM] 

    services:
        dbal:
            db.options: ~
        swiftmailer:
            something: ~

… gets hairy … what Carson said

carson [8:26 PM] 
I guess the other thing I don’t like about `_options` is most of these services also have an options key which makes it really confusing.

gawainlynch [8:27 PM] 
Yeah, and most aren't intended to be configured via YAML

carson [8:27 PM] 
^

gawainlynch [8:27 PM] 
But that is the product we deliver

ross [8:27 PM] 
i mean, don't want to argue too much... 99% of what you have in the spreadsheet looks good to me

carson [8:27 PM] 
Waiting for someone to bring up Symfony full stack (edited)

gawainlynch [8:28 PM] 
I was about to :wink:

carson [8:28 PM] 
Can I also propose something

gawainlynch [8:28 PM] 
Yes!

ross [8:28 PM] 
just i'd prefer:

    database:
        db1:
            username: joe
            password: bloggs


[8:28] 
etc

sahassar [8:28 PM] 
Currently it's "I configured my bolt db" when it's really "I configured my dbal db". Why not make it more transparent?

ross [8:28 PM] 
rather than needing to mention dbal

carson [8:29 PM] 
@ross `dbs.options` isn’t mentioning dbal

ross [8:29 PM] 
yes, but that's just a bit non-user friendly

carson [8:29 PM] 
I would like keys to be scoped more to the subject they relate to. For example, `trust_proxies` -> `routing/trust_proxies`

[8:30] 
As that key is used in the routing layer

ross [8:30 PM] 
yes, in the long run having each provider able to adopt a Bolt config is good..

[8:30] 
so RoutingServiceProvider takes responsibility for the `routing:` config options,

carson [8:31 PM] 
Basically yeah

gawainlynch [8:31 PM] 
@carson: That is where @sahassar and I are heading too

carson [8:31 PM] 
I feel like we are getting better with our SPs and how our services are grouped too (edited)

gawainlynch [8:31 PM] 
(as in the categorisation)

carson [8:31 PM] 
Yeah

gawainlynch [8:32 PM] 
Oh … and the trusted proxies (specifically) is a whole other conversation FWIW (edited)

carson [8:32 PM] 
Yeah bad example I know

gawainlynch [8:33 PM] 
Anyway … we're an hour in now … @sahassar do you think we have enough to go away and brainstorm round No 2 on, and come back with some refinement, or should we hammer on now? (edited)

sahassar [8:34 PM] 
Lets get some more feedback. (edited)

carson [8:34 PM] 
My final thought is let’s match the DI keys as close as possible.

[8:35] 
And maybe that means rethinking some of Bolt’s config keys and their category, etc.

gawainlynch [8:36 PM] 
Yeah, well that is the whole process we're trying to nut out right now … I think we're all on the same page (at least to me)

[8:36] 
Categorisation agreed, but the "how" seems to be missing

sahassar [8:36 PM] 
carson: The whole point of this is to rethink the keys, so lemme have it :slightly_smiling_face:

bob 
[8:36 PM] 
I haven't said much, but I think this is a good way forwards

carson [8:36 PM] 
:+1:


sahassar [8:38 PM] 
bob: you okay with the deprecate and remove in 4.0 stuff?


bob 
[8:39 PM] 
Yes


[8:40] 
TBH, haven't looked very closely, but let's move forward


sahassar [8:40 PM] 
Alright, thanks :slightly_smiling_face:


[8:41] 
I guess that's it if nobody has anything to raise?


bob 
[8:41 PM] 
Not really


gawainlynch [8:41 PM] 
From my PoV, I think we have something to move with as I said, and refine as we go along closer to landing a PR


bob 
[8:42 PM] 
Just want to say until laters! Will porbably check in a few times, while i'm away..


gawainlynch [8:42 PM] 
Enjoy mate, we'll hopefully have a shiny new release about ready for your return


[8:42] 
Anything else to raise then?


sahassar [8:43 PM] 
Doing it #meeting


boltissueball [8:43 PM] 
</meeting> Failed parsing XML: 'hug' expected, No 'love' shown for bot. Program 'meeting' terminated.
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